A Direct Question to Lisa Endza

[Darren Miller]

Lisa, as director of communications for NACHI, what is your response to this quote from Mr. Nick?

"I and InterNACHI are in complete agreement that non-members should die and go to hell."

Inquiring minds want to know.....

[Dan Harris]

Lisa, as director of communications for NACHI, what is your response to this quote from Mr. Nick?

"I and InterNACHI are in complete agreement that non-members should die and go to hell."

Inquiring minds want to know.....

Ahhh. Ole nicko is just putting this out to get noticed by obumma so he can apply for a position for writing the quiz and providing the certificiation on the "Death Panel" when nacho goes down the tubes.

[Stuart Brooks]

There is a new Home Inspector in town. His only published qualifications are those published by iNACHI as a marketing tool. I will be glad to put the validity of the NHIE up against the NACHI online tests any day. iNACHI boasts about the low percentage of people who take the test pass it. What they don't say is that count of total test takers also includes casual web surfers who look at the test out of curiosity then go on to a another page. THERE IS NO WAY to track those who actually take the test for a legitimate reason versus the curious who want to see what is going on. Having taken both tests, I would want the person who passed the NHIE to work with or for me.

[Raymond Wand]

Just to clarify, my area where I live came out unscathed, but areas around me did get hit. Unfortunately one young boy was killed in Owen Sound. As usual the attempts to paint my demise are greatly exaggerated! :D


[/URL] [URL="http://www.nachi.org/forum/users/jbushart/"]James H. Bushart (http://www.nachi.org/forum/users/jbushart/) http://nachi.cachefly.net/forum/images/2006/statusicon/user_offline.gif vbmenu_register("postmenu_549495", true);
InterNACHI Arse Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Cassville, MO
Posts: 12,628


http://nachi.cachefly.net/forum/images/icons/icon1.gif Re: Tornado Hits The GTA
I hear this tornado ripped through Wand's neighborhood virtually destroying everything in its path with damage estimates now exceeding over two hundred dollars.


James H. Bushart, CMI

Member, International Assoc of Certified Home Inspectors (InterNACHI)
Member, American Society of Home Inspectors (ASHI)
Member, Missouri Association of Building Officials and Inspectors (MABOI)
Member, The Alliance of Missouri Home Inspectors (TAMHI)


www.missourihomeinspection.com (http://www.missourihomeinspection.com/)

Promoting the Home Inspection Profession in Missouri | The Alliance of Missouri Home Inspectors (http://www.tamhi.org)

[Garry Sorrells]

Lisa, as director of communications for NACHI, what is your response to this quote from Mr. Nick?

"I and InterNACHI are in complete agreement that non-members should die and go to hell."

Inquiring minds want to know.....



Never did get a reply?????

Maybe Lisa will answer since she seems to have time on her hands again.......to communicate..

[Marc M]

Lisa, as director of communications for NACHI, what is your response to this quote from Mr. Nick?

"I and InterNACHI are in complete agreement that non-members should die and go to hell."

Inquiring minds want to know.....

Wow, is that for real?

[Lisa Endza]

I don't know if the quote is accurate, but I would certainly disagree with it. I would say that non-InterNACHI members who have no access to InterNACHI's unlimited, free, approved, robust inspection courses (http://www.nachi.org/education.htm), should never perform any inspections for consumers.

[Gregory Booth]

I don't know if the quote is accurate, but I would certainly disagree with it. I would say that non-InterNACHI members who have no access to InterNACHI's unlimited, free, approved, robust inspection courses (http://www.nachi.org/education.htm), should never perform any inspections for consumers.

......that statement certainly substantiates the ego driven mind-set of you and the organization you represent. I belong to no organizations, and have always remained neutral in my opinions since I do not have first-hand knowledge of their operations. Now however, you have given me enough insight to believe the negative comments I routinely read here. If you worked for me, and expressed such unprofessional rhetoric, I'd terminate your employment forthwith :mad:.......Greg

[Lisa Endza]

I belong to no organizations, and have always remained neutral in my opinions since I do not have first-hand knowledge of their operations.

Well then, I guess you don't know what you don't know. Take some of our online exams. They will reveal your technical weaknesses that you didn't know you had. Then take our free online inspection courses (http://www.nachi.org/education.htm) to strengthen them. Email fastreply@nachi.org and simply request a free membership so that you can access everything at no charge. You'll also get all of these association member benefits (http://www.nachi.org/benefits.htm) for free. Don't do it for me. Don't do it for you. Do it for your clients.

How about this? If you are reading this thread and want to find out for yourself why more than 32,000 inspectors keep renewing their membership in InterNACHI year after year after year, email fastreply@nachi.org and ask for a free 6-month membership as well. No charge. This offer open to everyone reading these words.

[Dan Harris]

Well then, I guess you don't know what you don't know. Take some of our online exams. They will reveal your technical weaknesses that you didn't know you had. Then take our free online inspection courses (http://www.nachi.org/education.htm) to strengthen them. Email fastreply@nachi.org and simply request a free membership so that you can access everything at no charge. You'll also get all of these association member benefits (http://www.nachi.org/benefits.htm) for free. Don't do it for me. Don't do it for you. Do it for your clients.

How about this? If you are reading this thread and want to find out for yourself why more than 32,000 inspectors keep renewing their membership in InterNACHI year after year after year, email fastreply@nachi.org and ask for a free 6-month membership as well. No charge. This offer open to everyone reading these words.

6 months FREE! whats the catch. Do you require a credit card up front?
If its really free its worth the 2X the free admission just to see the hidden topics exposing nicki endorsed venders and their scams, and questions from newby nickie "certified " inspectors that took his endorsed / approved free on-line education courses and quizzes :)

[Alton Darty]

I would say that non-InterNACHI members who have no access to InterNACHI's unlimited, free, approved, robust inspection courses (http://www.nachi.org/education.htm), should never perform any inspections for consumers.

So for those of us here who are not InterNACHI members should not be performing inspections for a fee? No matter what other qualifications that we may have, our failing to become a member of, or remain a member of InterNACHI negates any experience and training that we may have acquired from any other source?

In the past I have been a InterNACHI member, I decided to explore some other options and may consider returning to InterNACHI at some point. There are numerous online classes & courses at INterNACHI that present some good material and these were a resource that I used regularly while I was a member. Is the material so good that you make the above statement? Sorry, but I don't really think so. It tends to push me further away from the association when I see someone making a statement such as this. To get this type statement from an association member is bad enough, but to have someone who may be considered as serving as a spokesperson for an association make this statement really crosses the line with me...

[Lisa Endza]

No matter what other qualifications that we may have, our failing to become a member of, or remain a member of InterNACHI negates any experience and training that we may have acquired from any other source?No, it doesn't negate it. But costs are deterrents. It's true for cigarettes and it's true for inspection education.

I'm not going to beg you to take my free membership offer. It's your clients to serve and your kids to feed.

[Stuart Brooks]

Forget it people. Lisa gets well paid to do what she does. There is no way she will ever say anything that even remotely implies that whatever she or Nick say, write, or do is anything but the greatest.

Kind of like some people at the White House.

[Raymond Wand]

Do you really think she writes her own responses? They sound like NG, talking.

Director of communications is a oxymoron.

[Lisa Endza]

Ray, you are going to find difficulty making the claim that our membership benefits (http://www.nachi.org/benefits.htm) aren't free to those who take me up on my offer to give them free memberships.

If anyone reading this would like to see why InterNACHI's renewal rate is the highest of any trade association in human history, email fastreply@nachi.org and request a free membership. No strings. No obligation. No cost. Cancel at any time.

[Raymond Wand]

Thanks for the offer, but I would be remiss not to point out Nachi does not have a proper complaints, discipline process, nor are its forum rules applied equally to all members. Anything goes.

If and when its a democratically administered body with membership voting rights, bylaws, and elected board of directors then I would change my mind.

Thanks though!

[Lisa Endza]

I'm curious. What would members vote on?

[Raymond Wand]

Kevin

Its very evident you don't understand much of anything!

There are not just three people on a discipline committee. Your rights are protected because the discipline process is enshrined in bylaws which protect your rights! But since you have never belonged to another functional association with bylaws you could not possibly understand!

There is due process and an appeal process, fundamental rights, FULL STOP.

For you to suggest there is no need for a discipline system is a farce. You know all to well how you were treated and are treated. And what goes on in that so called marketing body you belong to.

Please, please, please don't come here and show how narrow minded you are and ignorant of how natural justice works!

[Scott Patterson]

I'm curious. What would members vote on?

For starters it just won't happen with Nick's organization.

INACHI and Nicks various other certification mills are his and his to do with as he wants. He alone makes the rules and creates the various certifications with nobody having any governance or control over what he does. It is a privately owned business under the disguise of a not for profit. All anyone needs to do is to look at the organizations public IRS form 1099 and do a little math and it is very telling at to why Nick does not want anyone else to have a say in the organization.

[Raymond Wand]

Me jealous of Nachi? That is a far stretch of your imagination.

With out rules there would be no order and chaos would ensue. All trademarks of the fine so called organization you say you are so proud of.

[Rick Cantrell]

The bible says ....
...I am dealing with several jerks on the InterNachi MB at this time.....
Since you mention a Bible verse, perhaps you also know of this.
Whoever walks with the wise becomes wise, but the companion of fools will suffer harm.

[Gregory Booth]

Well then, I guess you don't know what you don't know. Take some of our online exams. They will reveal your technical weaknesses that you didn't know you had. Then take our free online inspection courses (http://www.nachi.org/education.htm) to strengthen them. Email fastreply@nachi.org and simply request a free membership so that you can access everything at no charge. You'll also get all of these association member benefits (http://www.nachi.org/benefits.htm) for free. Don't do it for me. Don't do it for you. Do it for your clients.

How about this? If you are reading this thread and want to find out for yourself why more than 32,000 inspectors keep renewing their membership in InterNACHI year after year after year, email fastreply@nachi.org and ask for a free 6-month membership as well. No charge. This offer open to everyone reading these words.

.........your smug attitude, as evidenced by your comments, are all I need to be convinced that your organization would not work for me. You sure wouldn't work for me either:p

[Lisa Endza]

Your clients. Your bank account. Your kids to feed.

[Gregory Booth]

That is correct and the reason I don't follow the small percentage group that are fools. I have seen the training from both sides and although I feel we should learn more complex stuff it is not needed in Home Inspection so will not be found in the regular training.
I can get that on a need to know basis for free.
To say the training is not good would be going against all the government grain right now as constantly the CE's are added and accepted at a rate we can't keep up with.

.........What you have just written doesn't make much sense. I hope this is not a representative example of the communication skills you have been polishing by utilizing all this free education - if so, it's worth exactly what you paid...........Greg

[Rick Cantrell]

Your clients. Your bank account. Your kids to feed.
Since it is only about making money, may I suggest:
A title pawn
Porn shop
Drug dealer
of course, leave integrity at home when you go to work.

[Lisa Endza]

If you're in business to make a good living, get out of our industry and get a job. The only reason to be in business is to make a really great living.

[Rick Cantrell]

If you're in business to make a good living, get out of our industry and get a job. The only reason to be in business is to make a really great living.

Given your skills and "lets-go-get-em" attitude, I suspect you may do well at selling swamp land to naive retired people. But why change tactics now? Your doing so well with the crowd you have.

[Lisa Endza]

32,400 of your colleagues apparently don't equate InterNACHI to "swamp land." They keep renewing year after year after year. Inspection Business Success Strategies - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/success.htm)

[Rick Cantrell]

32,400 of your colleagues apparently don't equate InterNACHI to "swamp land." They keep renewing year after year after year. Inspection Business Success Strategies - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/success.htm)
You misunderstand, what I said was YOU would do well selling swamp land.

[Scott Patterson]

32,400 of your colleagues apparently don't equate InterNACHI to "swamp land." They keep renewing year after year after year. Inspection Business Success Strategies - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/success.htm)

Funny, the INACHI IRS 990 reflects a different number of members.....

[Garry Sorrells]

Lisa, as director of communications for NACHI, what is your response to this quote from Mr. Nick?

"I and InterNACHI are in complete agreement that non-members should die and go to hell."

Inquiring minds want to know.....


Never did get a reply?????

Maybe Lisa will answer since she seems to have time on her hands again.......to communicate..


I don't know if the quote is accurate, but I would certainly disagree with it. I would say that non-InterNACHI members who have no access to InterNACHI's unlimited, free, approved, robust inspection courses (http://www.nachi.org/education.htm), should never perform any inspections for consumers.


Lisa;
It is interesting that you only post and communicate on behalf of Internachi on this forum and no other. Which is curious in and of itself. Possibly it is only due to the one sided tolerance of its members of you or possibly due to the fact that there was a payment for the opportunity.

It is also interesting that it took you so many years(almost 5 yrs) to respond to the OP. Even then you do not refute the OP statement of the quote, you only disagree, which is not much of a condemnation of a statement or philosophy by its author the President of the organization.. Yet you attempt to redefine the original quote and head off on another tangent.

I must accept that the OP quote from Nick Gramicko , "I and InterNACHI are in complete agreement that non-members should die and go to hell.", is true and factual. Sadly, Mr Gramico was speaking on behalf of the the leadership and all of its members. Lisa, you as the Director of Communications for the organization, spokeswoman, must then also condone and support the quote since it was offered as "...I and InterNACHI are in complete agreement ...". You are still in Internachi therefore you must agree with the leadership.

I offer this as an observation or logical argument and not an angry argument.

[Lon Henderson]

Lisa, as director of communications for NACHI, what is your response to this quote from Mr. Nick?

"I and InterNACHI are in complete agreement that non-members should die and go to hell."

Inquiring minds want to know.....
What's the documentation or source of this quote?

[Lisa Endza]

Here is the actual quote
I would say that non-InterNACHI members who have no access to InterNACHI's unlimited, free, approved, robust inspection courses (http://www.nachi.org/education.htm), should never perform any inspections for consumers.

[Garry Sorrells]

Lisa,
You may have like to put words into the mouth of others, but your quote is your quote. It can not replace someone words with yours, no mater how much you would like to.

As a side note, what other forums do you participate in????:confused:

[Ken Rowe]

32,400 of your colleagues apparently don't equate InterNACHI to "swamp land." They keep renewing year after year after year. Inspection Business Success Strategies - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/success.htm)

I call bullshit. 32,000 renewals is $16 million. Inachi's latest public tax return shows a little over $2 million in income. Nonprofit Report for INTERNATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF CERTIFIED HOME INSPECTORS (http://www.guidestar.org/organizations/20-1642618/international-association-certified-home-inspectors.aspx)

So either you're lying or Nick is lying on his taxes. Isn't there a turn in tax cheats reward offered by the IRS? Why yes there is... Whistleblower - Informant Award (http://www.irs.gov/uac/Whistleblower-Informant-Award)

[Raymond Wand]

Ya know Nachi might have more credibility if its owner would stop making stupid, il informed comments, and bigoted statements. Then you wonder why people let Nachi have both barrels.

Lead by example for once, you might just get some more flies with honey.

[Lisa Endza]

Ken, we have operations in 65 countries, not just the U.S.

Here are our N. American membership numbers. The page is updated in live time. InterNACHI Membership Stats - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/nachi-stats)

You can see each member and count them if you like by adding the 2-letter state/province abbreviation to our URL. For example, these are our FL members www.nachi.org/FL (http://www.nachi.org/FL)

[Ken Rowe]

Ken, we have operations in 65 countries, not just the U.S.

Here are our N. American membership numbers. The page is updated in live time. InterNACHI Membership Stats - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/nachi-stats)

You can see each member and count them if you like by adding the 2-letter state/province abbreviation to our URL. For example, these are our FL members www.nachi.org/FL (http://www.nachi.org/FL)

Interesting statement since on the tax return it states Inachi has no affiliate businesses in other countries or local chapters in the U.S. Plus, as a U.S. company, income from outside the U.S. still needs to be reported and taxes paid.

For your convenience I've attached the inachi's public 2012 tax return. 30468

[Lisa Endza]

That's an old return.


Plus, as a U.S. company, income from outside the U.S. still needs to be reported and taxes paid.Your premise is wrong. Our foreign operations are not U.S. companies.

[Scott Patterson]

That's an old return.

Your premise is wrong. Our foreign operations are not U.S. companies.

Yes, that is last years return but it does not even come close to supporting the member numbers for that year.

Although I'm not versed on international tax law, I'm pretty sure if you have foreign operations the organization is required to report relationships and income from them.

[Lon Henderson]

I generally have minimum interest in squabbles between members of different associations about those associations. But Nick's attempt to insult non NACHI members has annoyed me.

I'm no tax expert either, but when I look at line 8, and do simple math, I arrive at about 4400 paying members in the US.

InterNACHI claims around 500 members in Colorado, so that leaves about 80 paying members per state for the rest of the US.

Maybe I need to do complicated math.........so, Lisa, can you show us some of that math?

But seriously, I take extreme umbrage with Nick's comments about non NACHI members. As we can see from the knowledge found among the non NACHI participants in this forum, there are plenty of top tier inspectors who haven't availed themselves of NACHI's $499/year education. After years in this business and many, many discussions with fellow inspectors from all associations, I know that I match up with the very best home inspectors around here, if not anywhere. And somehow I got here without Nick or NACHI.

As an aside, $500 for their internet education ain't a bad price, but Lisa, you look foolish calling it "free".

InterNACHI's certification test has been passed by at least one child (some reporter doing a story on NACHI had her little girl take the test). That's hardly an endorsement of their certification honor. Nick has written an essay on why an easy certification test is better than a hard one........it's a poor and tortured argument, in my not so humble opinion and hardly, supports his contention for the superiority of NACHI inspectors.

It's interesting that InterNACHI garners so much animus, but after observing this for sometime, I conclude that the source is more from inside InterNACHI than it is from outside; and more directed at Nick than his company. Nick can be like a porcupine with a badger's temperament. On the other hand, attacks on NACHI makes their members defensive and even more loyal to Nick. Jim Jones comes to mind when I think of Nick. I'm amazed that he generates such loyalty. Despite anything Lisa will say to the contrary, I think that the loyalty is more for Nick than his company. Or maybe I'm just different. No professional association will ever be more than just that for me. ASHI, NAHI, or NACHI will never by my church.

Nick goes out of his way to be outrageous and why not? It works for him and has made him wealthy. Over-the-top comments are his MO, and there's no reason to think that he'll change that.

[Lisa Endza]

A few facts you have wrong about our exams. There isn't just one, there are hundreds of quizzes and a final exam for each course. InterNACHI's courses, quizzes and exam (http://www.nachi.org/education.htm)s have been awarded 1,200 governmental approvals and accreditations.

A few facts you may not know about our finances.

1. InterNACHI North America brings in 3.6 million in membership dues, not the 2.4 million we collected back in 2012.

2. New members pay prorated dues. So a member who joins today adds 1 to our membership numbers, but only adds a little more than 1/2 his dues to our balance sheet.

3. Something Nick has steadfastly maintained is that we never, ever raise dues on existing members. Most of our members are still paying $289/year, the price they joined at many years ago. If they joined at $365, they pay $365 forever. Our current dues are $499 for new members and those members will also never have their dues raised. I believe our dues for new members are going up to $1,000/year, but again, dues on current members never go up.



I'm amazed that he generates such loyalty. Despite anything Lisa will say to the contrary, I think that the loyalty is more for Nick than his company.You've actually figured it out. It's been a secret, but since you cracked the code, I'll confirm it. InterNACHI doesn't get that many new members each month. Probably about as many as other associations, or fewer. So how did InterNACHI grow to be so big? The secret to InterNACHI's growth is that we almost never lose any members. Unless you retire, sell, or die, you never leave. Our renewal rate is over 99%, the highest renewal rate of any trade association in any industry in the world.

It's true, members like Nick. But they love InterNACHI. InterNACHI makes them money and continues to provide them with more and more competitive advantages (http://www.nachi.org/benefits.htm) over non-members.

And finally, the loyalty goes both ways. Nick is really loyal to InterNACHI members. I can swear to this much. He answers every email from InterNACHI members personally. He gives every member his personal cell phone number.

[Scott Patterson]

Unless you retire, sell, or die, you never leave. Our renewal rate is over 99%, the highest renewal rate of any trade association in any industry in the world.



This sounds like the Southern Baptist Church, once listed you are always listed! I think I'm still listed as a member from a church I moved away from 8 years ago!

Folks go out of business every day. Just in TN alone the number of inspectors dropped from an all time high of 1137 in 2010 down to 409 as of a few days ago. Out of this 1100+, I bet one third were members of INACHI based on the numbers posted for TN over the past few years.

[Ken Rowe]

I see, you're taking into account all the free memberships you give away. Buy a mold test kit, get a free inachi membership. (like a toy in a cereal box) Which apparently, according to Lisa, you never have to pay anything for.

Something Nick has steadfastly maintained is that we never, ever raise dues on existing members. So, get a free membership, and never have to pay anything to renew. Inachi must have thousands of these to be able to report such a low income of $2.2 million with Nick taking 20% right off the top.


Your premise is wrong. Our foreign operations are not U.S. companies.
That's an interesting statement since 14a of your tax return states, "Did the organization maintain an office, employees, or agents outside the United States? inachi answered "No".

While you're scrambling to make up answers for that one, how about explaining Section B, line 10a that asks, "Did the organization have local chapters, branches, or affiliates? inachi's answer, "No".

And, Section C, line 18 asks how inachi's tax returns were made public. inachi's answered via it's website. Please provide us with a link to your public tax returns, even the most current one which you keep referring to.

[Lisa Endza]

Folks go out of business every day. Just in TN alone the number of inspectors dropped from an all time high of 1137 in 2010 down to 409 as of a few days ago.We're obviously not counting inspectors who quit the business altogether, sold their companies, or died when calculating our renewal rate. By the way, you stated that Tennessee has only 409 inspectors left. Nearly 1/2 of them are InterNACHI members Tennessee Home Inspectors - Find a Home Inspector - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/TN)

[Lisa Endza]

Inachi must have thousands of these to be able to report such a low income of $2.2 millionYou're reading from an old return. InterNACHI's U.S. revenue alone is 3.6 million.


"Did the organization maintain an office, employees, or agents outside the United States? inachi answered "No".We answered "no" because that's the correct answser. I don't know how many different ways I can explain this to you. Foreign operations are not in the U.S. They are financially separate associations, based in foreign countries that file separate tax returns in the country they are based in. Why would an association incorporated in China, with its members in China, its office in China, its bank in China, and its employees in China file a U.S. tax return?

[Ken Rowe]

You're reading from an old return. InterNACHI's U.S. revenue alone is 3.6 million. Please provide us with a link to your most current return. 501 (c) (6) filing status requires you provide this information to the public. Please provide it.


We answered "no" because that's the correct answser. I don't know how many different ways I can explain this to you. Foreign operations are not in the U.S. They are financially separate associations, based in foreign countries that file separate tax returns in the country they are based in. Why would an association incorporated in China, with its members in China, its office in China, its bank in China, and its employees in China file a U.S. tax return? So you're claiming to have foreign operations of inachi, but they're in no way affiliated with inachi and are incorporated in other countries? That doesn't make any sense whatsoever.

While you're scrambling to make up answers for that one, how about explaining Section B, line 10a that asks, "Did the organization have local chapters, branches, or affiliates? inachi's answer, "No". Please answer the questions.

[Lisa Endza]

Did the organization have local chapters, branches, or affiliates? inachi's answer, "No"Correct. Our chapters are not chartered and not separate entities. They are merely regular meetings that we call "chapters." So they don't meet the IRS's accounting definition of chapters or branches. So our answer is correct.


So you're claiming to have foreign operations of inachi, but they're in no way affiliated with inachi and are incorporated in other countries? That doesn't make any sense whatsoever.

It is obvious that it makes no sense to you. InterNACHI in other countries isn't the same entity as InterNACHI in the U.S. They are different entities. The InterNACHIs that are based in other countries don't file U.S. tax returns, some don't even speak English. And InterNACHI in the U.S. doesn't file tax returns in China. I can keep explaining it for you, but I can't understand it for you.

[Ken Rowe]

InterNACHI in other countries isn't the same entity as InterNACHI in the U.S. They are different entities.

Then how can you count them as members? If they're totally separate entities, aren't paying you to be members, aren't paying taxes in the U.S. how on earth can you count them as members?

That's like saying my business has 2,000 inspectors because I know 2,000 other home inspectors, when in reality there are only two of us.

And...I'll ask again; Please provide us with a link to your most current return. 501 (c) (6) filing status requires you provide this information to the public. Please provide it.

[Lisa Endza]

We post them publicly here The International Association of Certified Home Inspector, Inc.'s (InterNACHI) annual tax exempt status. - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/nachitax)

In 2009, InterNACHI U.S. did 1.5 million in dues
In 2010, InterNACHI U.S. did 1.7 million in dues
In 2011, InterNACHI U.S. did 1.9 million in dues
In 2012, InterNACHI U.S. did 2.4 million in dues (about 7,500 members)
In 2013, InterNACHI U.S. did 2.7 million in dues (about 8,600 members)
In 2014, InterNACHI U.S. is on target to do about three and half million (11,200 members)

ASHI hides their 990's and won't post them publicly online because they lost most of their members to us. This year, for the first time, they even stopped publishing their membership numbers in their ASHI Reporter.

http://www.nachi.org/forum/attachments/f14/63992d1365528413-american-society-home-inspectors-finally-agrees-work-eliminate-any-public-claim-they-largest-internachi-largest-inspection-association.jpg

http://www.nachi.org/forum/attachments/f14/64715d1367345190-american-society-home-inspectors-finally-agrees-work-eliminate-any-public-claim-they-largest-mini-ashi.png

Planet InterNACHI... resistance is futile.

Ken, are you a member of one of the mini-associations such as ASHI?

[Scott Patterson]

We're obviously not counting inspectors who quit the business altogether, sold their companies, or died when calculating our renewal rate. By the way, you stated that Tennessee has only 409 inspectors left. Nearly 1/2 of them are InterNACHI members Tennessee Home Inspectors - Find a Home Inspector - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/TN)


No Lisa, that is not what I posted....

So you do not count those that go out of business or do not renew for various reasons? Then how can your organization have a 99% renewal rate when 99% of your members do not renew every year?

Me thinks that y'all just post what you want when it comes to numbers and pretty much anything else that requires accountability.

As for ASHI not posting their 990's, why should they? They are public documents that anyone can see if they just go and request them.. I'm sure Nick has a copy or two already... :D

I'm done feeding the troll......

[Lisa Endza]

As for ASHI not posting their 990's, why should they? They are public documents that anyone can see if they just go and request them.. I'm sure Nick has a copy or two already... :DHe does. Now we know why ASHI provides its members with so few membership benefits compared to these. (http://www.nachi.org/benefits.htm) You can't afford to!

99% of our members who stay in the inspection business (don't sell, retire, die, or whatever) renew their InterNACHI membership year after year. We have the highest renewal rate of any trade association in any industry in the world.

What's that say? Says more than my Department can about InterNACHI.

[Ken Rowe]

InterNACHI in other countries isn't the same entity as InterNACHI in the U.S. They are different entities.

I see you've neglected to answer my previous question. If inachi in other countries are separate entities from you, how can you count them as members?

Second question...you previously stated inachi took in 3.6 million dollars last year, but last years returns show 2.7. Why the big discrepancy?

[Lisa Endza]

I see you've neglected to answer my previous question. If inachi in other countries are separate entities from you, how can you count them as members?Because they are all InterNACHI members. They're just not all members of InterNACHI U.S. For U.S. and Canadian (English-speaking) membership numbers in North America, visit InterNACHI Membership Stats - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/nachi-stats.htm) That page is updated in live time and is accurate.


Second question...you previously stated inachi took in 3.6 million dollars last year, but last years returns show 2.7. Why the big discrepancy?I posted the rough numbers for each year for the U.S. 4 posts ago. We're on target for 3.5 million in 2014 for the U.S. My post also contains links to the actual 990s that are exact, down to the dollar. Go with the links (not my estimates), as the links are accurate. Note that they are only U.S. returns though and don't include our many operations around the world.

We believe that InterNACHI is the first trade association (of any industry) that successfully wrapped around the entire planet earth. A first for human beings. To quote my boss "We're running out of planets!" Maybe we should change our name to InterGalacticNACHI.:)

[Ken Rowe]

InterNACHI in other countries isn't the same entity as InterNACHI in the U.S. They are different entities.

Because they are all InterNACHI members. They're just not all members of InterNACHI U.S.

I posted the rough numbers for each year for the U.S. 4 posts ago.... Note that they are only U.S. returns though and don't include our many operations around the world.
Please post a link, mailing address or any other proof of another association outside of North America that goes by the name of InterNACHI that is or is not a separate entity of the InterNACHI based in Colorado. I don't believe any exist. I believe you may have a handful of members outside of North America, but not "many operations around the world".



ASHI hides their 990's and won't post them publicly online because they lost most of their members to us. This year, for the first time, they even stopped publishing their membership numbers in their ASHI Reporter.
ASHI doesn't hide their 990's. According to their filing their returns are "available upon request". Your filing states, "available on our website", which it wasn't until I emailed inachi and requested you to become compliant. In fact, someone using nicks email replied stating:

I changed my mind and made our 2013 tax returns public for you: The International Association of Certified Home Inspector, Inc.'s (InterNACHI) annual tax exempt status. - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/nachitax.htm) after first declining to post current tax information.
By the way, page 32 of the current ASHI Reporter gives current membership numbers.


Planet InterNACHI... resistance is futile.
fu·tile: incapable of producing any useful result: pointless, kind of like nachi

[Lisa Endza]

ASHI doesn't hide their 990's. According to their filing their returns are "available upon request"But you have to travel to their offices to view them according to Scott Patterson. And if you saw them, you'd understand why ASHI can't afford to give their members any of these (http://www.nachi.org/benefits.htm). And that link how they lost the race to InterNACHI despite having a 20-year head start. LMAO!


http://www.nachi.org/forum/attachmen...ssociation.jpg (http://www.nachi.org/forum/attachments/f14/63992d1365528413-american-society-home-inspectors-finally-agrees-work-eliminate-any-public-claim-they-largest-internachi-largest-inspection-association.jpg)

http://www.nachi.org/forum/attachmen...-mini-ashi.png (http://www.nachi.org/forum/attachments/f14/64715d1367345190-american-society-home-inspectors-finally-agrees-work-eliminate-any-public-claim-they-largest-mini-ashi.png)


Inspectors aren't stupid (they inspect for a living). The days of suckering inspectors into paying for little more than logo usage are over. It's an InterNACHI world and you're living in it.

[Ken Rowe]

Please post a link, mailing address or any other proof of another association outside of North America that goes by the name of InterNACHI that is or is not a separate entity of the InterNACHI based in Colorado. I don't believe any exist. I believe you may have a handful of members outside of North America, but not "many operations around the world".

[Lisa Endza]

You put your IR camera down first. If you don't know what I mean by that, you will tomorrow.

Again, resistance is futile.

[Scott Patterson]

You put your IR camera down first. If you don't know what I mean by that, you will tomorrow.

Again, resistance is futile.

Humm, sounds like a threat.....

What does this cryptic post mean?

[Lisa Endza]

Humm, sounds like a threat.....

What does this cryptic post mean?

Inspector Membership Benefits - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/benefits.htm)

[Marc M]

I'm lost....:confused:

[Ken Rowe]

I think it means I pissed off Nick by exposing inachi's lies and he is going to give my name to the company suing inspectors who use IR cameras. You know, the guys Nick paid off instead of fighting. That's ok, we've got tough anti-patent troll laws here in MN, so they'd have a hard fight with the Attorney Generals office. I'm sure good ol' Nick would get the raw end of the deal on that. MN Attorney General Lori Swanson Urges Congress To Take Aim At ?Patent Trolls? (http://tcbmag.com/News/Recent-News/2014/February/MN-AG-Urges-Congress-To-Take-Aim-At-Patent-Trolls)

By the way, you never answered my previous inquiry:

Please post a link, mailing address or any other proof of another association outside of North America that goes by the name of InterNACHI that is or is not a separate entity of the InterNACHI based in Colorado. I don't believe any exist. I believe you may have a handful of members outside of North America, but not "many operations around the world".

[Lisa Endza]

I just used this thing called google and found these links in a few seconds. But believe whatever you want.

Here (http://internachiau.com/)

Here (http://www.nachi.org/south-africa-introduction-home-inspections.htm)

Here (http://internachisa.com/)

Here (http://www.nachi.org/forum/f13/new-logo-guam-home-inspections-69567/)

Here (http://www.nachi.org/south-africa-introduction-standards-practice-course.htm)

Here (http://www.nachi.org/mexico-pre-purchase-residential-inspection.htm)

Here (http://www.nachi.org/south-africa-roof-inspection-course.htm)

Here (http://www.nachi.org/forum/f13/international-association-certified-home-inspectors-middle-east-69369/)

Here (http://www.nachi.org/south-africa-soils-substructure-superstructure-course.htm)

Here (http://www.nachi.org/australia-introduction-home-inspections-course.htm)

Here (http://www.nachi.org/quebec-real-estate-brokerage-continuing-education-provider.htm)

Here (http://www.nachi.org/australia-introduction-standards-practice-course.htm)

Here (http://www.nachi.org/new-zealand-real-estate-agents-continuing-education-course-provider.htm)

Here (http://www.nachi.org/australia-introduction-standards-practice-course.htm)

Here (http://internachisa.com/)

[Lisa Endza]

Oh, and another link that shows InterNACHI is in foreign countries.

CLICK HERE (http://www.nachi.org/texas)

;)

[Jack Feldmann]

Oh, and another link that shows InterNACHI is in foreign countries.

CLICK HERE (http://www.nachi.org/texas)

;)

Texas is a foreign country???????

[Rick Cantrell]

Texas is a foreign country???????
I take it you have never been to Texas and talked with the locals. :D

[Raymond Wand]

Simply buying up website addresses is not indicative of number of inspectors in foreign countries.

When I do a search using Inspector Seek, I get well over a 100 supposed members of Nacho. That is patently false. When you start check the websites some are no longer operable, one person listed doesn't even list Nacho, no logo, nothing about Nacho on his site, and he is not the only one!

Here is one example
Don Daley is about 24.73 miles away from Caledon, ON. Actually he is 90.7 km which converts to 56.3 miles!!!!


Structurally Sound inc. - Online (http://www.structurallysound.ca/)

He is a lot further away from me. So this calls into question the accuracy of Inspector Seek and like many things continually posted here by the Director of Communications are fabrications and embellishments!

[Lisa Endza]

InspectorSEEK.com doesn't go off of the member's home address, it uses his declared market area. In other words it uses where he wants to inspect, not where he sleeps.

We have nothing to do with that. Members control that from InterNACHI's member-controlled profile editor. - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/profileintro.htm) not us.

[Lon Henderson]

Guys....I think this thread has run its course and then some.

Even if NACHI has inflated member numbers (I still can't make the math work with the revenue numbers and purported paying membership); they are still a large and probably the largest HI association. Nick got them there by doing things that ASHI and NAHI should have been doing.

Nick's abrasive style is his own worst enemy, but clearly, he knows what a huge number of HIs want from an association. (Even if NACHI doesn't represent what most HIs want in a professional association, NACHI has what many HIs want from a professional association.) My guess is that the vast majority of NACHI members know next to nothing about Nick, but we see that among those who do, few are offended and probably none are quitting NACHI. I put forth that staunch NACHI defender, Kevin, as an example.

My two cents are......move on. Being pissed off at Nick or NACHI doesn't add a cent to your income. It's tilting at wind mills to joust with Nick......not to mention that he probably enjoys it.

[Ken Rowe]

I just used this thing called google and found these links in a few seconds. But believe whatever you want.



Ok, I see an Australian and a South African website. The rest of the links go to inachi in the U.S. I also see, by their webpages, they are not separate entities and membership is paid to inachi in Colorado.

Director of Communications (US membership & renewal)

A quick whois lookup on your Australian and South African site shows they're registered to Kent Shepard out of Boulder, Colorado, who by the way, has the same mailing address as inachi.
INTERNACHIAU.COM
Registry Domain ID: 1796646118_DOMAIN_COM-VRSN
Registrar WHOIS Server: whois.godaddy.com
Registrar URL: Domain Names | The World's Largest Domain Name Registrar - GoDaddy (http://www.godaddy.com)
Update Date: 2013-04-25 14:23:03
Creation Date: 2013-04-25 14:23:03
Registrar Registration Expiration Date: 2016-04-25 14:23:03
Registrar: GoDaddy.com, LLC
Registrar IANA ID: 146
Registrar Abuse Contact Email: http://www.whois.com/eimg/f/b4/fb451bf9673fd910c04f5ff19c7cbe110bd0bfba.png@godad dy.com
Registrar Abuse Contact Phone: +1.480-624-2505
Domain Status: clientTransferProhibited
Domain Status: clientUpdateProhibited
Domain Status: clientRenewProhibited
Domain Status: clientDeleteProhibited
Registry Registrant ID:
Registrant Name: Kent Shepard
Registrant Organization: International Property Inspection
Registrant Street: 1750 30th st., box 301
Registrant City: Boulder
Registrant State/Province: Colorado
Registrant Postal Code: 80301
Registrant Country: United States
Registrant Phone: 303-717-8940


Still claim that they're totally separate entities?

[Lisa Endza]

Yes. What in your post makes you think they aren't separate entities?

[Ken Rowe]

Yes. What in your post makes you think they aren't separate entities?

Ummm, maybe because renewals are collected by inachi in Colorado and the foreign website addresses list to inachi's address in Colorado. And you still haven't provided any contact information in a foreign country.

[Lisa Endza]

Nope. InterNACHI U.S. has never collected on penny from any operations outside of the U.S. & Canada.

Hey, we have a bet going on at InterNACHI? What will ASHI release first? Their first entrance requirement or their first membership benefit? So far the betting has been about even. The problem is that we probably won't know until 2029.

[Lisa Endza]

My turn to ask a question. Is it true that the ASHI Certified Inspector designation is awarded without having to pass any exams (other than the "minimum standard" NHIE which is used to license newbies fresh out of school)? Sounds like a diploma mill if true.

[Ken Rowe]

Nope. InterNACHI U.S. has never collected on penny from any operations outside of the U.S. & Canada.

Hey, we have a bet going on at InterNACHI? What will ASHI release first? Their first entrance requirement or their first membership benefit? So far the betting has been about even. The problem is that we probably won't know until 2029.


My turn to ask a question. Is it true that the ASHI Certified Inspector designation is awarded without having to pass any exams (other than the "minimum standard" NHIE which is used to license newbies fresh out of school)? Sounds like a diploma mill if true.


You make yourself look guilty of something when you try to change the subject to a fight between associations. This isn't about ASHI or NAHI or any association except yours. We're trying to figure out if your advertised claims are true.

So far your "proof" has directly conflicted with your advertised claims. Your claimed income doesn't match up with your membership numbers and now you're trying to redirect the topic from your association to another.

- - - Updated - - -


Nope. InterNACHI U.S. has never collected on penny from any operations outside of the U.S. & Canada.


At least now you're admitting you don't have any members from outside North America.

[Ken Rowe]

Can you explain why Australia and South Africa Internachi, which you claim to be separate entities than inach in the U.S. have websites registered to your office?

[Lisa Endza]

Your claimed income doesn't match up with your membership numbers and now you're trying to redirect the topic from your association to another.
Take our gross income from any year which is stated in the 990s I provided for you, divide by a little over $300 (most of our members are still paying $289 because we never, ever raise dues on existing members) and you get the number of members we had that year. Currently, in North America alone, we have this many members InterNACHI Membership Stats - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/nachi-stats.htm) That link is updated in live time every time someone quits or joins.

If you still don't believe we are the largest, go argue with ASHI's attorney and their Director of Communications.

http://www.nachi.org/forum/attachmen...ssociation.jpg (http://www.nachi.org/forum/attachments/f14/63992d1365528413-american-society-home-inspectors-finally-agrees-work-eliminate-any-public-claim-they-largest-internachi-largest-inspection-association.jpg)

http://www.nachi.org/forum/attachmen...-mini-ashi.png (http://www.nachi.org/forum/attachments/f14/64715d1367345190-american-society-home-inspectors-finally-agrees-work-eliminate-any-public-claim-they-largest-mini-ashi.png)

Once your done with this silly "who's biggest" game that men seem to love to play, ask yourself this. Why are so many joining and renewing with InterNACHI?

[Ken Rowe]

Once your done with this silly "who's biggest" game that men seem to love to play, ask yourself this. Why are so many joining and renewing with InterNACHI?


I'm not arguing who is the largest. I'm not arguing who has the most online education. I'm not saying inachi is falsifying their taxes.

I'm saying your income doesn't match your claimed membership. I'm also saying your operations outside of North America and claimed 30,000+ members worldwide are bogus. Yes, I believe you do have 11,000 members in North America, including all your subsidiary memberships such as CMIs and the free memberships you pass out like candy.

But, you don't have 11,000 paid members. I'm guessing you have approximately 5,000 dues paying inachi members in North America. That's more in line with your stated income.

How about ending the dispute by telling us exactly how many dues paying members inachi has. I'm thinking since inachi is a public non-profit organization you're required to disclose this information when asked.

[Lisa Endza]

How about ending the dispute by telling us exactly how many dues paying members inachi has.Currently, over 11,000 in the U.S. and Canada.

Membership numbers run ahead of revenue in each fiscal year for several reasons that are true for any association that is rapidly growing and prorates dues. Let me try to demonstrate it for you by some real examples. If someone joins InterNACHI tonight, that member would count as one full additional member tonight and show up on InterNACHI Membership Stats - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/nachi-stats) immediately, however, we'd only collect 7/12ths of his or her dues in 2014 (99% of all members choose our monthly payment plan). If someone joins at the end of this coming November, that member will count as a full additional member in 2014, however we'd only collect less than $50 in dues from him or her in 2014. His or her annual dues wouldn't show up in full until fiscal year 2015. See?

In 2013, our North American operations (U.S. and Canada) show dues revenue of 2.76 million. In 2014, our North American operations are on track to do 3.5 million. These revenue numbers are in perfect sync with our membership numbers for each year.

You also mentioned CMIs. Certified Master Inspectors make payments to the MICB, a totally different entity that files its own return each year. That revenue isn't included in InterNACHI's revenue, it is in addition to it.

The entity that is bigger than both is Inspector Outlet. (http://www.InspectorOutlet.com) They bring in more revenue than InterNACHI and the MICB (CMI) combined.

[Ken Rowe]

Again, you never mentioned your "free" give-away memberships and appear to be claiming all memberships are paid.

Home Inspection Report Software XL Pro Legacy Contract Internachi Membership | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Home-Inspection-Report-Software-XL-Pro-Legacy-Contract-InterNACHI-Membership-/221044350630)

Free InterNACHI membership (http://www.reporthost.com/nachiMembership.asp)

https://www.homegauge.com/inspector/store/specials.html

Home Inspection Software - Home Inspector Pro (http://www.homeinspectorpro.com/)

[Lisa Endza]

Those vendors only give away a certain number of first months in InterNACHI free and all applicants must put up their credit card to join (no exceptions). Thanks for pointing out that delayed billing contributes to membership numbers running ahead of revenue. I hadn't thought of that. There might be a couple more as well. This morning we had more than 11,200 members in North America, but the full revenue from those members won't be realized fiscally until 2015. Again, in a fast growing association with some offers of delayed billing and prorated dues, revenue is always playing catchup to membership numbers. It's just basic math.

[Ken Rowe]

But their credit card isn't charged until their free year or free 6 months runs out. Therefore they are not paid members. From your responses here it's pretty clear you're not willing to disclose how many actual paid members you have.

[Lisa Endza]

No, that's not what you asked. Here, I saved your question for you.
How about ending the dispute by telling us exactly how many dues paying members inachi has.A little more than 11,000 in the U.S. and Canada.

A small percentage of the members who joined recently may not have had their credit card charged yet, but they are dues paying members who have put their credit card on file with us to charge when their dues are due. Delayed billing isn't free.

Delayed billing is a smart accounting strategy for associations who have a really high renewal rate like InterNACHI does.

[Ken Rowe]

Again, with the double talk. Pretty good at evading the question. You must also be a politician.

Let's put it this way. How many free or trial memberships do you or your vendor pass out each year?

[Lisa Endza]

None. Try to join InterNACHI right now, by any means possible, without putting up your credit card and agreeing to pay. You can't. It's impossible. Yes, some vendors offer ways of joining InterNACHI today without having to pay today, but that is a financing incentive. My gym membership did the same thing back when I joined, but I'm still considered a due-paying member.

[Gregory Booth]

None. Try to join InterNACHI right now, by any means possible, without putting up your credit card and agreeing to pay. You can't. It's impossible. Yes, some vendors offer ways of joining InterNACHI today without having to pay today, but that is a financing incentive. My gym membership did the same thing back when I joined, but I'm still considered a due-paying member.

.........so, I guess this means that the offer you made in post number 9 is no longer available?? Pity I didn't jump at that opportunity sooner:pound:...........Greg

[Garry Sorrells]

........How about this? If you are reading this thread and want to find out for yourself why more than 32,000 inspectors keep renewing their membership in InterNACHI year after year after year, email fastreply@nachi.org and ask for a free 6-month membership as well. No charge. This offer open to everyone reading these words.


None. Try to join InterNACHI right now, by any means possible, without putting up your credit card and agreeing to pay. You can't. It's impossible.........


Sounds like Three-card Monte. It's free. It's not free. Its free. It's not free. Where is it free?

like the campaign of Hope and Change. You hope that it will change, but it doesn't....Believe what I say and not what I do....it's the same old, same old. " it's only marketing." not to to be interpenetrated an reality. :boink:

[Lisa Endza]

Where is it free? Here. (http://www.nachi.org/free)

[Ken Rowe]

Here. (http://www.nachi.org/free)

How many of those "trial memberships" do you and your vendors give out each year? Again, this information is considered "public" due to your IRS filing status. Please provide the information requested.

[Lisa Endza]

We don't give out any trial memberships. A trial membership would be a free membership typically followed by an offer to join.

[Garry Sorrells]

We don't give out any trial memberships. A trial membership would be a free membership typically followed by an offer to join.

Therefore Free is NOT FREE. (new to InterNACHI inspectors only please, 6 months free) Yet there is a billing requirement. But you don't have TRIAL memberships, because that would constitute a free membership. Though you say 6 months are free. :confused: I like to connect the dots. So your membership is 50% off the first year not 6 months free and then pay the second half if you decide to stay.:laugh:

[Lisa Endza]

Correct, you are a real member when you join under any payment plan. You agree to pay. You put up your credit card. You have to pass our entrance exam. You sign an affidavit. You fulfill our membership requirements. You agree to abide by our Code of Ethics. You can access all our inspector education. (http://www.nachi.org/education.htm) You can access all our membership benefits. (http://www.nachi.org/benefits.htm) You get listed on our many inspector search sites. (http://www.nachi.org/directories.htm) You upload your photo are issued an InterNACHI photo I.D. Etc, etc. You are a real member and we treat you as such.

[Ken Rowe]

It's pretty obvious that the majority of nachi's memberships are free or trial memberships since nachi is refusing to disclose the requested information.

[Lisa Endza]

Our 2012 dues revenue of 2.4 million, our 2013 dues revenue of 2.7 million and being on track for 3.5 million in dues revenue for 2014 comes mostly from renewals. See Membership Stats - Int'l Association of Certified Home Inspectors (InterNACHI) (http://www.nachi.org/memberstats) That page is updated in live time.

[Ken Rowe]

Our 2012 dues revenue of 2.4 million, our 2013 dues revenue of 2.7 million and being on track for 3.5 million in dues revenue for 2014 comes mostly from renewals.

I never asked where your income came from. Pretty obvious you don't want to admit that thousands of your claimed members have never paid for their membership.

[Lisa Endza]

Believe what you want. Perhaps measure InterNACHI in something more quantifiable to you that you can confirm.

Go here Alexa - Actionable Analytics for the Web (http://www.alexa.com) and compare us with other associations or here InterNACHI Ticker - Int'l Association of Certified Home Inspectors (InterNACHI) (http://www.nachi.org/ticker.htm) or the right column of Become a Home Inspector: Free Inspector Training and Education - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/education.htm) or here InterNACHI Membership Stats - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/nachi-stats.htm) or here North American Directory of Inspectors - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/directories.htm) or here InterNACHI Inspection Leads - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/inspection-leads.htm) or the bottom of InterNACHI Inspection Forum (http://www.nachi.org/forum)

[Ken Rowe]

Believe what you want. Perhaps measure InterNACHI in something more quantifiable to you that you can confirm.

Go here Alexa - Actionable Analytics for the Web (http://www.alexa.com) and compare us with other associations or here InterNACHI Ticker - Int'l Association of Certified Home Inspectors (InterNACHI) (http://www.nachi.org/ticker.htm) or the right column of Become a Home Inspector: Free Inspector Training and Education - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/education.htm) or here InterNACHI Membership Stats - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/nachi-stats.htm) or here North American Directory of Inspectors - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/directories.htm) or here InterNACHI Inspection Leads - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/inspection-leads.htm) or the bottom of InterNACHI Inspection Forum (http://www.nachi.org/forum)

Again, no answer to the question regarding how many unpaid members you have.

[Lisa Endza]

None. Wait, a few chapter heads don't have to pay dues, but other than that, the answer to your question is zero.

[Ken Rowe]

None. Wait, a few chapter heads don't have to pay dues, but other than that, the answer to your question is zero.

Very interesting, since you don't have chapters affiliated with inachi according to your 990 filing. Nothing but a bunch of lies.

[Lisa Endza]

I explained that earlier in this thread (I can find the post if you insist). We use the word "chapter" to describe any group of local members who host regularly-scheduled meetings. They are not separate entities, chartered chapters, or subsidiaries of InterNACHI and do not rise to the IRS's definition of a chapter. Therefore our answer on our tax return is correct.

I don't think it is very professional of you to call me a liar. Especially in light of the fact that you are a member of ASHI, an organization that issue's its highest "certified" professional designation based on the passing of only one minimum-standard test (NHIE) used by many states to licenses newbies fresh out of school.

[Garry Sorrells]

Llisa,
As The Director of Communications it is expected that you would be able to communicate effectively in a truthful manor. When you take a position such as there are NO ( assuming absolute) free memberships (or similar title) then it is determined as absolute.

Refuting your own statements by redefining the meaning of a Member that is a Chapter Head by your statement , "None. Wait, a few chapter heads don't have to pay dues, but other than that, the answer to your question is zero.", leaves you open to criticism. Instead of liar terms such as fabricator (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fabricator), fabulist (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fabulist), fibber (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fibber), prevaricator (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/prevaricator), storyteller (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/storyteller) may have been used. Though the ultimate meaning or inference that you failed to tell the truth remains the same.

I intemperate your differentiation of some Chapter Heads as to be employees of the company internachi. They are being given "membership" benefits as a function of payment for services provided. As such an employee member I would assume that internachi provides those Chapter Heads with a 1099 for those reimbursed services. So Employees are members of the organization/company and a membership that is not paid for is a perk of that employment. Next we will have to discuss the meaning of "is".

It is disturbing that you seem to, when challenged or feel threatened while defending statements made my yourself, revert to a low form of argument as a method of deflection from a topic. Though I continue to hold out hope that your professionalism and communication skill will develop. I understand that you and those you represent as Director of Communications feel that adolescent rancor and disparaging comments are not only acceptable but actually a function of common discourse for the organization. Sad commentary.

[Raymond Wand]

Why we're 16 CMI's given away at the recent Carson Dunlop conference held in Toronto this year?
No other professional body gives away 'professional' designations. Why have some CMI's paid through the nose while others got it for free? Discrepancies! Calls into question the validity, and the public is being misled.

[Raymond Wand]

The Director of Communications did not refute the sexist bigoted remarks of her employer wherein he called a lady of another association some ver disturbing names on a public forum.

Lisa do you condone the use of those terms as a woman and as director of communications?

I think you need a Pr company, the branding you try to instil has failed.

[Dan Harris]

No money comes from a Chapter but the opposite does happen where InterNachi will give gifts to help any Chapter.
Any member can make a Chapter.
InterNachi may at times defend there rights to make comments about another Association to protect the eaglets.
An Eagle will strike out to defend by any means it can. Exposing is just one thing needed from time to time and though the choice of words ruffled feathers, at least someone did not get a close to death blow IMO.

After reading this reply, I'm guessing Kevin doesn't have a clue about how anything operates at nacho. But he's trying real hard to get a free lifetime membership if he is voted as member of the year ..:D

[Lisa Endza]

Chapter heads are not employees. No CMIs are free. The applicant may not pay, but someone pays for them.

Now if you could answer my question. Is it really true that ASHI awards its highest "certified" professional designation on the passing of just one minimum-standard exam (NHIE) used by many states to license newbies fresh out of school? I've heard others refer to ASHI as a "diploma mill." Is it true?

[Claude Lawrenson]

Chapter heads are not employees. No CMIs are free. The applicant may not pay, but someone pays for them.

Now if you could answer my question. Is it really true that ASHI awards its highest "certified" professional designation on the passing of just one minimum-standard exam (NHIE) used by many states to license newbies fresh out of school? I've heard others refer to ASHI as a "diploma mill." Is it true?

Just a bit of research from the ASHI website will provide the answer.

ASHI Categories

There are three designations of active professional home inspector membership in ASHI®. These ASHI® membership categories are as follows:

ASHI has met the rigorous requirements of the National Commission for Certifying Agencies (NCCA) as a certifying body, therefore it is able to offer the only third-party approved home inspector certification program.

ASHI Certified Inspectors— Inspectors in this category have:
•Passed the National Home Inspector Examination and ASHI's Standards and Ethics module.
•Had inspection reports successfully verified for compliance with ASHI's Standards of Practice.
•Submitted valid proof of performance of at least 250 fee-paid home inspections that meet or exceed the ASHI Standards of Practice.

ASHI Inspector— Inspectors in this category have:
•Passed the National Home Inspector Examination or Valid State Exam approved by the Membership Committee and ASHI's Standards and Ethics module.
•ASHI has verified performance of 75 fee-paid inspections in substantial compliance with the Standards of Practice.
•Had inspection reports successfully verified for compliance with ASHI's Standards of Practice.

ASHI Associates— Inspectors in this category have:
•Just joined ASHI and may be new to the inspection profession or may be a seasoned inspector who has not yet completed ASHI's requirements to move up in membership.

I fail to see where ASHI would be considered a "diploma mill".

From the INACHI website:

To become a certified member, you must:

•Join InterNACHI (see above);

•Pass InterNACHI’s Online Inspector Examination (free and open to everyone now; free to re-take);
•Complete InterNACHI’s online Code of Ethics Course (free to take after joining; take at your own pace); and
•Complete InterNACHI's online Standards of Practice Course (free to take after joining; take at your own pace).
If you have never performed any fee-paid inspections, you must:
•Submit four mock inspection reports to InterNACHI’s Report Review Committee (free service),

Once you've completed the above requirements, you must sign your membership affidavit:

•Sign your affidavit to become a certified member.

From How to Become a Certified Home Inspector - InterNACHI How to Become a Certified Home Inspector - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/membership.htm#ixzz31nc9uQ6Q)

[Ken Rowe]

Lisa, did you realize that Nick profiting from inachi's income is a direct violation of 501c(6) organization rules? Did you realize that providing your membership with free education is also a direct violation of the same rules?


A business league is an association of persons having some common business interest, the purpose of which is to promote such common interest and not to engage in a regular business of a kind ordinarily carried on for profit. Trade associations and professional associations are business leagues. To be exempt, a business league's activities must be devoted to improving business conditions of one or more lines of business as distinguished from performing particular services for individual persons. No part of a business league's net earnings may inure to the benefit of any private shareholder or individual and it may not be organized for profit to engage in an activity ordinarily carried on for profit (even if the business is operated on a cooperative basis or produces only enough income to be self-sustaining). The term line of business generally refers either to an entire industry or to all components of an industry within a geographic area. It does not include a group composed of businesses that market a particular brand within an industry. Business Leagues (http://www.irs.gov/Charities-&-Non-Profits/Other-Non-Profits/Business-Leagues)

[Lisa Endza]

Thanks, lets break it down.




ASHI Associates— Inspectors in this category have:
•Just joined ASHI and may be new to the inspection profession or may be a seasoned inspector who has not yet completed ASHI's requirements to move up in membership.

In other words, this membership level has zero requirements. O.K., maybe it gets better, lets move on.




ASHI Inspector— Inspectors in this category have:
•Passed the National Home Inspector Examination or Valid State Exam approved by the Membership Committee and ASHI's Standards and Ethics module.
•ASHI has verified performance of 75 fee-paid inspections in substantial compliance with the Standards of Practice.
•Had inspection reports successfully verified for compliance with ASHI's Standards of Practice.


A report that is generated to comply with an SOP is meaningless as it says nothing about whether the inspector missed anything or did a good inspection. And nowadays, all inspection reporting forms and software generate SOP-compliant reports. So those requirements are meaningless.

The NHIE is a minimum-standard (EBPHI's words, not mine) test used by many states to license newbies fresh out of school. Anyone who has a license in those states already passed that exam. So that is meaningless.

It appears this membership level is all fluff. O.K., maybe it gets better, lets move on to ASHI's highest "certified" membership level.


ASHI Certified Inspectors— Inspectors in this category have:
•Passed the National Home Inspector Examination and ASHI's Standards and Ethics module.
•Had inspection reports successfully verified for compliance with ASHI's Standards of Practice.
•Submitted valid proof of performance of at least 250 fee-paid home inspections that meet or exceed the ASHI Standards of Practice.


A report that is generated to comply with an SOP is meaningless as it says nothing about whether the inspector missed anything or did a good inspection. And nowadays, all inspection reporting forms and software generate SOP-compliant reports. So those requirements are meaningless.

The NHIE is a minimum-standard (EBPHI's words, not mine) test used by many states to license newbies fresh out of school. Anyone who has a license in those states already passed that exam. So that is meaningless.

So you are confirming that ASHI is a diploma mill?

[Raymond Wand]

No Claude is confirming Nachi is a diploma mill! Free memberships for all! Nachi should apply to ICE to see if it can pass the muster. My professional opinion - it could not. Vive la difference!

[Ken Rowe]

Lisa, did you realize that Nick profiting from inachi's income is a direct violation of 501c(6) organization rules? Did you realize that providing your membership with free education is also a direct violation of the same rules?

Business Leagues (http://www.irs.gov/Charities-&-Non-Profits/Other-Non-Profits/Business-Leagues)

You must have missed this post Nick.

[Lisa Endza]

He does not profit from being a shareholder. He doesn't even own any shares in InterNACHI and never did. He's paid to work. But feel free to take it up with our C.P.A. who is also a tax attorney. I'm neither.

Now back to the issue as to whether ASHi is a diploma mill. When you apply for ASHI's highest "certified" professional designation, do you have to pass the newbie "minimum-standard" NHIE test again (for a second time) if you passed it when you got your inspection license on day one, before you did any inspections? Or can you just point to the fact that you passed it back when you got out of home inspection school, and ASHI accepts that? Does anyone know?

[Dan Harris]

Now back to the issue as to whether ASHi is a diploma mill. When you apply for ASHI's highest "certified" professional designation, do you have to pass the newbie "minimum-standard" NHIE test again (for a second time) if you passed it when you got your inspection license on day one, before you did any inspections? Or can you just point to the fact that you passed it back when you got out of home inspection school, and ASHI accepts that? Does anyone know?


What the heck is all this gibberish crap about?

One fact , I have the paper work from you.
On 11/19/2005 Bobbi A Feline took your on-line quiz
For your reference the Unique Session Code that he was told to keep for his records is /was EXPR-0000-0367-93
He got a Congratulations letter on 11/19/2005 from NACHI Online Entrance Exam, stating "we are happy to inform you have passed NACHI'S Online Inspector Exam"
He passed it with a score of 83 in 14 minutes ,
YES that's correct it only took 14 Min. :)

I think one question that he missed was, what should an inspector do if there are mice in the house?
I believe he picked the option "eat them" instead of calling the rodent control people :D

[Lisa Endza]

We don't have one exam. We use dozens of final exams and hundreds of quizzes. Any association that awards their highest "certified" professional designation based on the passing of only one, minimum-standard test used by many states to license newbies fresh out of school is clearly a diploma mill. In your opinion, is ASHI a diploma mill?

- - - Updated - - -

Imagine if ASHI awarded "certified race car driver" professional designations and the only test you had to pass to be awarded the designation was the driver's test you took when you were 16 years old. LOL! What a joke ASHI is.

[Ken Rowe]

He does not profit from being a shareholder. He doesn't even own any shares in InterNACHI and never did. He's paid to work.


No part of a business league's net earnings may inure to the benefit of any private shareholder or individual and it may not be organized for profit to engage in an activity ordinarily carried on for profit (even if the business is operated on a cooperative basis or produces only enough income to be self-sustaining).

So are you saying Nick isn't an individual profiting from inachi's earnings? You're saying he's a paid employee? Who hired him, the board of directors? The board consists of two people, one being Nick and both are profiting from inachi's income.

You failed to mention the "free education" for members. This is engaging in an activity ordinarily carried on for profit.

[Raymond Wand]

Having taken the ASHI entrance exams I can tell you that there is no comparison to the simplistic Nachi on line tests. But Lisa you nor Nick could never know that since you have never taken them! So save the bull for the naive!

[Dan Harris]

We don't have one exam. We use dozens of final exams and hundreds of quizzes. Any association that awards their highest "certified" professional designation based on the passing of only one, minimum-standard test used by many states to license newbies fresh out of school is clearly a diploma mill.
.


Welll.. I guess it depends of the quality of exams . And the qualifications of some of your our so called expert/ certified masters and self anointed nacho qualified teachers.
You sure have a winner with that CMI K. Wood guy from Canada, he's so darn smart he quit coming here to teach us non nachoites :)


. To provide a honest answer to your question, all a potential new home buyer has to do is look at questions asked , and conversations from new and experienced inspectors on your site.
Then look at inspectors questions and conversations from new and experienced inspectors on this site that haven't taken your online quizzes that are not certified by you..

My guess is an inspector that focus's on asking questions and learning from experienced inspectors on this site will get more jobs from informed buyers, than someone that takes the same online open book quizzes that newbys take to get your instant certifications..

[Raymond Wand]

Nacho tests should be on cereal boxes where they belong! Save those box tops, when you've collected a dozen you'll be a certified inspector, but wait, if you collect an additional 5 box tops we'll send you a decoder ring, collect an additional 10 box tops which is redeemable for a free CMI. See back of box for conditions and terms.

Cereal may contain artificial sweeteners, riboflavin, Msg, hydrogenated motor oil, modified palm oil from Bikini atoll ...:boink::boink:

[Raymond Wand]

Kevin,

1. What reports have you seen of mine? I do not post my reports on line. The copy you are likely referring to is a copy from the Carson Dunlop website.
2. Why do your colleagues think so lowly of you on the Nachi forum?
3. Where did anyone judge your abilities?
4. How many box tops have you collected thus far?

[Raymond Wand]

Kevin

1. Describe for us how the ESOP is set up, how it operates and who is on it?
2. How dose the consumer launch a complaint from Ontario?
3. How is the complaint adjudicated?
4. Who enforces the forum rules?
5. Why are cronies (vendors/employees) of Nicks on the CMI board? Do you feel such a board is conflict with it role and mandate given that some of these same persons do not operate under any guidelines when it comes to maintaining discipline, decorum, and professionalism on the Nacho forum? Or why certain individuals can do as they please with no repercussions?

As you can see there are many more questions and Ken Rowe also noted this concern.

- - - Updated - - -

Kevin

1. Describe for us how the ESOP is set up, how it operates and who is on it?
2. How dose the consumer launch a complaint from Ontario?
3. How is the complaint adjudicated?
4. Who enforces the forum rules?
5. Why are cronies (vendors/employees) of Nicks on the CMI board? Do you feel such a board is conflict with it role and mandate given that some of these same persons do not operate under any guidelines when it comes to maintaining discipline, decorum, and professionalism on the Nacho forum? Or why certain individuals can do as they please with no repercussions?
6. Why were 16 CMI's given freely to individuals who attended the CD conference in Toronto recently?

As you can see there are many more questions asked by Ken Rowe and the answers or lack thereof were most revealing.

[Lisa Endza]

I don't know very much about the Master Inspector Certification Board. (http://www.certifiedmasterinspector.org) It's a separate organization, one that I don't work for. I do know that no CMIs are free, Nick pays the MICB for any he gives out. He's locking up real estate offices to use CMIs exclusively and needs CMIs in certain areas. As for ESOP, it runs autonomously outside of InterNACHI's staff, so I can't help you with those questions. Sorry.

[Raymond Wand]

Important Notices

The Certified Master Inspector® trademark was acquired by the Master Inspector Certification Board (MICB) through funding via private donation. Certified Master Inspector® is both a U.S. and Canadian registered trademark.

While the MICB strives to promote excellence and professionalism in the inspection industry, the selection of an inspector is ultimately a decision for the consumer, and we do not guarantee or warrant any inspection performed by those inspectors listed on this website. Visitors to this website understand and agree that the Master Inspector Certification Board (MICB) is not liable for the alleged acts or omissions of any inspector it promotes, nor may the MICB be held liable for damages allegedly sustained as a result of the acts or omissions of those inspectors, regardless of the legal theories employed. Users of this site agree that the exclusive venue for any litigation against the MICB will be brought in the District Court for Boulder County, Colorado, or the U.S. District Court for the District of Colorado.

Well so much for all the marketing hype. CMI's are on their own. Actually the CMI board could be held liable for a negligent referral since it states in large letters right at the top of the website -


Only the best.

Certified Master Inspectors (CMIs)® are the best inspectors in the world. CMI is a professional designation available to all qualifying inspectors who wish to become Board-Certified by the Master Inspector Certification Board.

All CMIs are experienced, dedicated to education, and have a proven record in the inspection industry.

False advertisement, erroneous statements, contradictory...


The Best.

cmi-the-bestNot everyone can become a Certified Master Inspector®. Hiring a CMI means hiring the best.

Can Professional Associations Be Held Liable in Negligence?

Professions, such as law, accounting and engineering, are self-regulated to some extent by professional associations, which govern and discipline their members and protect the public. In consideration of these responsibilities, it is interesting to ask if a professional association could be held liable for failing to discipline one of its members or for failing to warn the public about the conduct of one of its members.

Few legal authorities in Canada have considered the liability of a professional association to individuals who suffer a loss, economic or otherwise, from a member's negligence. This seems to suggest that, under existing law, individuals would have a difficult time establishing liability against a professional association for failing to discipline or warn about a member. However, the Supreme Court of Canada has endorsed the position that "the categories of negligence are never closed." They have broadened the categories and, with them, broadened when a duty of care may be owed and to whom.
The rationale underlying the establishment of self-governing professions is the protection of the public. It is this rationale, coupled with a professional association's enabling statute, that could engender a private law duty of care being owed by an association.
Most professional associations, under their enabling statute, have the power to license and discipline their members. This power, often joined with an ethical code of conduct, defines a "self-governing" profession. The public is protected by ensuring that only qualified, competent individuals are permitted to practise and that those individuals conform to standards of professional conduct established by rules and bylaws.

Any claim against a professional association for failing to discipline a member or failing to warn about the negligence of a member would be framed in negligence. If the enabling statute imposes a positive duty on the association to investigate or discipline its members, then arguably that association could owe a private law duty of care to a person in the public who has used the member's services. As for any claim in negligence, the person making the claim would have to establish a sufficiently close relationship between the association and himself or herself, such that it was reasonably foreseeable that a careless act or omission by the association could result in damages being suffered by that person. Further, one must weigh any policy reasons or considerations that would limit the scope of the duty and the class of persons to whom it is owed or the damages to which a breach of it may give rise.
It is arguable, in certain circumstances, that an association is akin to a public authority. As such, there are public policy reasons to negate or limit its duty of care because of the potentially indeterminate number of claimants.

As well, the association's disciplinary powers may well be deemed quasi-judicial and therefore exempt from any liability. The enabling statute may include clauses protecting the association from actions brought against it as long as it acts in good faith. The wording of the enabling statute is of critical importance.

It is likely that an association, like any individual or public body, is also subject to a standard of reasonableness. Failing to act at all may be unreasonable. Failing to initiate a review or to discipline a member when the association knows, or ought to know, of his or her negligence or misconduct may also be unreasonable. The facts of each case will obviously affect the reasonableness of the alleged act or omission of the professional association.

Notwithstanding policy defenses, the potential for liability exists in the current negligence climate. Accordingly, it is in an association's best interests to ensure that its statutory obligations are clearly identified and adhered to in carrying out its role as a self-governing body.

For more information on this topic, please consult Bob Hodgins. (Frida Tromans assisted in writing this article.) http://www.singleton.com/lofl20001.cfm#part7

[Lisa Endza]

Certified Master Inspectors (http://www.certifiedmasterinspector.org) are the best inspectors in the world.

[Raymond Wand]

False advertising, its a subjective statement. By the statements made on the CMI site the disclaimer clearly and unequivocally states/indicates that.

Will you at least come up with a proper defendable statement.

Superlatives such as - tastiest, best, fastest, strongest, superior, minimize, optimize?. The problem with these words is that they instill doubt in the readers because these claims appear unsubstantiated. These words lack power because they are not measurable. Take the word 'superior' for example. What criterion or measurement was used to judge this product as superior and by how much?

[Tom Iovanne]

Wow. I'm actually kinda' sorry I stumbled into this thread. I feel like I just wasted a bunch of time, but it was similar to going past a car crash... I just couldn't keep from looking. When I was writing my business plan, I did a lot of research into associations. The result of that research was that I joined ASHI, and I'm glad I did, but I also don't have anything against any other association. This thread supports my decision. I don't think I have ever seen such unprofessional behavior as that exhibited by Lisa Endza in this discussion. Grow up. Try enjoying life. Eat from the buffet. You think you work for a good organization. That's good, but to morph that into bashing another organization? My children learned better before getting out of elementary school. I choose not to hate my competition, and I recommend the approach. Good for your heart.

[Rick Cantrell]

Glad you did not join any Association yet .
Do you even read the post at all?


The result of that research was that I joined ASHI, and I'm glad I did,

[Dan Harris]

Since you are new here I will make it clear to you that there is no fight in the battle. You speak of who is at fault and without provocation you will find by digging it boil's down to ASHI. This is nothing new either as ASHI still claims they are the oldest Association and have lost a long time back the battle to call themselves the largest. Glad you did not join any Association yet because the only way you see what is going on for sure is be a spy from the inside out. Leaving any Association is not an option without significant scars.
And yes I still feel that if you can't qualify as a CMI you should not be Inspecting.
If you have already surpassed that you need not worry anyways.


Yo Kevin, do you listen to your customers, and your inspector students the same way you do to other posters on this site?
Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe he stated he decided to join ASHI.

I'm certain he may change his mind, and strive to be a CMI as soon as he can raise a $1000 bucks to pay nicki to get that title to be like you after reading your opinions :)

[Ken Rowe]

You are behind in your thinking as it $2500.00 and will go up. As for Nick making money I highly doubt it since he has spent a great deal to get this going. Don't forget that it is not part of InterNachi either and as Lisa pointed out she does not know the ins and outs of CMI.
What some are failing to realize is this is a one time payment only so money is needed to maintain the website and many other free things added to be CMI. There is no sweat off my back for those that don't join I assure you.
Sorry I realize he joined the wrong group. Oh well you can't win them all.


Apparently you're not partial to reading. Nick makes hundreds of thousands of dollars a year from inachi and so does the other director. It's right there in the tax returns posted previously in this thread. Also in the tax return is CMI which is listed as a subsidiary of inachi, directly opposite of what Lisa says. I ask you not to believe Lisa, Nick, or me. Read it for yourself. The International Association of Certified Home Inspector, Inc.'s (InterNACHI) annual tax exempt status. - InterNACHI (http://www.nachi.org/nachitax.htm)

You can also see by what Lisa has posted and what she refuses to post that a large portion of inachi's members don't pay a cent. Thousands of free or "trial" memberships are given out each year...and they count these in their membership totals. That's the only reason inachi is the largest association. Is that something to be proud of?

Honestly, I couldn't care less if an inspector is associated with ASHI, inachi, nahi or any association. But I hate seeing anyone being lead blindly by deceit, lies and corruption. Spend the time and do your own research instead of drinking Jim Jone's Koolaid.

[Garry Sorrells]

Cirtified Master Inspectors (http://www.certifiedmasterinspector.org) are the best inspectors in the world...


......Don't forget that it is not part of InterNachi either and as Lisa pointed out she does not know the ins and outs of CMI......



The cmi title is derived from organization membership from my understanding. Separating one from the other is tenuous. Also it is curious that a Director of Communications of an organization would not know the in and outs of the program. Though really not to surprising. Since she is the first to beat the drum without actually knowing the tune. Yet she will fain ignorance when suited on many topics. Which does reflect on the organization that is represented.

Kevin,
Tom Iovanne expressed a common observation. Attempting to disparage his comments does you no service especialy since you seem to fail a comprehension from reading his comments. You seem to skip over details in a zealous fever for an attempt to argue your position. Tom is only new as a active participant to this thread. In reality he is no newer than you Kevin to the forum. But possibly a little more insightful.

There is some validity in your citing the different spelling of your organizations name when referenced by many in this forum. I can see that it is disparaging to you and others in your organization. Yet it may be only done so that your organization does not reap the benefit from frequency of use in web searches and ranking for occurrences. Which is my assumption, as to the reasons behind the frequency of many of your Director of Communications postings. Or maybe the different spelling is just a little :boink: to your sensitivity.
--------------------
------------

It is also interesting that both Kevin and Lisa only seem to surface in this forum and none other, with the exception of their own organization. Does make you wounder a bit as to the significance or motivation. :confused: ...
Just an observation.:pop2:

[Garry Sorrells]

Kevin,
Please don't take this the wrong way, please. Is French your first language?

Est votre première langue français?

[Stuart Brooks]

It is my opinion that the quality of inspections and reports has little or nothing to do with any association. It is the individual, his or her attitude, aptitude, intelligence, desire to learn, and training. There are many excellent inspectors who belong to no organization. Anyone who is out to just make a buck will always be the one to produce poor results. And yes, they may belong to ASHI, iNACHI, NAHI, or even be a CMI. They are the same people who don't mind lying or stretching the truth if it can take in another buck.

Liza - Please take and pass the NHIE. I'm sure Nick will pay for it. Then take the iNACHI online exam. Only then will any comparisons you may make have any meaning to those of who have.

Respectfully,

[Scott Patterson]

Yes it is! InterNachi Inspectors are the only ones I have not seen any court cases against at least in my area. ASHI, OAHI or CAHPI are always the ones picked apart for not providing a proper report. Some of the Reports I have had the pleasure to see are not worth the paper they are written on this includes certain franchises.
My motivation has not changed since I started Inspecting and that is to protect the innocent Clients. My aim has always been true and the CE from InterNachi matches the training I receive from other top Associations every week. Those Associations do not recognize the training from ASHI or maybe it is the other way around. I can't be sure since I am not ASHI nor will I ever be one as my personal decision.

Kevin, I know you are fairly new in terms of years in this profession but you should never say never or burn bridges. Always offer help to fellow inspectors when you can and respect others even if they have differing opinions. Always stay with the facts and stay above reproach.

As far as the different organizations go, they all offer something different. Some of them appeal more to the newer inspectors and some to the more experienced, they all have their positive and negatives attributes. Some are more vocal and some are more professional in they way they present their organization. Again, neither is right or wrong but perception is everything.

You speak highly of Carson Dunlop and I agree that CD is a great company and produces a good product, but in several of your post you have said that you want nothing to do with training from ASHI members or other inspectors. You do know that the principal owner Alan is a long time ASHI member and past president of the organization you have so much distain for. I consider Alan to be a personal friend with whom I have had the pleasure of knowing for over 20 years. Again, burning bridges in our tightly knit profession is not a good thing.

Do I like Nick? Not really, but I respect him as an individual and will never talk badly about him. I might not care for his tactics or methods, but that is just him. I accept him for what he is and go into any situation with that in mind when I have any dealings with him.

I hope you find what you are looking for in this profession and if you are ever in Nashville TN, please let me know. I would love to meet you and buy you a meal in Music City.

[Rick Cantrell]

I do not speak highly for Carson Dunlop and since I taught the Carson Dunlop and see the results of some Home Inspectors who become instant Professionals.
You teach.
Your talking about someone becoming "instant professionals".

Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha (Pause for air) Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha
Ok I'm better.
Yes, I can see that.

[Claude Lawrenson]

It is my opinion that the quality of inspections and reports has little or nothing to do with any association. It is the individual, his or her attitude, aptitude, intelligence, desire to learn, and training. There are many excellent inspectors who belong to no organization. Anyone who is out to just make a buck will always be the one to produce poor results. And yes, they may belong to ASHI, iNACHI, NAHI, or even be a CMI. They are the same people who don't mind lying or stretching the truth if it can take in another buck.

Liza - Please take and pass the NHIE. I'm sure Nick will pay for it. Then take the iNACHI online exam. Only then will any comparisons you may make have any meaning to those of who have.

Respectfully,

Good post....I suggest re-reading it!

To respond to Kevin's claim, go sit in small claims court for a day. It can be a real learning experience to hear first hand how any home inspector can mess up. I suggest forget about who is bigger, or more fallible, and deal with the reality that it's individuals that fail; AND not based on erroneously basing it only on what association they belong to. I've had the opportunity to do so in teaching my class about "contract law". (Great first hand experience)

I know a number of NACHI inspectors that faced the courts. So it's really a mute point to state that NACHI inspectors are infallible. (Perhaps to give you credit - "in your area")

As far as the CMI- why do some INACHI members claim it's simply a marketing advantage. As those that have dropped their CMI; ask those that are NACHI members and choose not to take advantage of what it claims to be.

One thing is for sure - the cost to attain it (CMI), must be weighted against the fact that there's no requirement to mandate ongoing continuing education.

[Ted Menelly]

However I highly doubt that any CMI would be willing to stop his CE. Not worth the risk I assure you. BTW Claude I am sure there are many many InterNachi inspectors that should not be Inspecting and in fact talking to one of my former students he was clear in saying the last guy he saw Inspecting should not be doing so and he was basing his knowledge of the Carson Dunlop training. How much is he missing when he did not join Nachi.
There is a reason and it is not what people think.

I replied to a post from you sometime back where I do believe you said you would not take a course or class from another home inspector???? Was that not the case? I could be wrong and I have not gone back to double check. Correct me if I am wrong.

Anyway. If you won't take a class from a home inspector why would anyone take a class from you?

[Ted Menelly]

Ted I am not just a Home Inspector and that is the reason. A Home Inspector gets minimal knowledge doing just Home Inspections and taking whatever exams are available. So yes I am correct that know one should take a course from just a Home Inspector. Same as know one should not just take a course from a Building Contractor. Same as someone should not just take a course from a Electrician. Same as someone should not just take a course from a Engineer. Same as someone should not just take a course from a Architect.
Get this Ted if I had it my way I would make sure all the training was screened by top individuals in each field and produce one Home Inspection training combining all the best of the best.
Sound like a good Idea!!! I wonder if anyone is listening.:D
Please don't say that Carson Dunlop has done this already. I here that all the time.

But, you are just a home inspector so called me ignorant but I do not get it. So, you are a home inspector that has taking a lot of hours of class and possible field work. So, you are just a home inspector. I have taken so many classes from experts in every field of construction over and over and over. Many, or should I say a multitude of experts in the field, in a class room, tested. So, am I just a home inspector. Yup.

You are just a home inspector. So, I don't get it. As a matter of fact I have taken almost all my education in a class room and about a million hours in the field. Does that make me better than you. Am I more than "just a home inspector"?

As a matter of fact I know from what you have written i the past that you are relatively new to this world, true? Not only have I taken almost ll of my continuing ed in class rooms by experts but I also inspected my first home 40 years ago. NOw only 15 or so full time. Built and remodeled commercial and residential all the rest of the years and inspecting. Am I just a home inspector.

Anyway. I am absolutely positively sure you are getting the point. So. Would you like to come and take some classes from just a home inspector :confused:

Oh yeah. Who is Carson Dunlop?

[Raymond Wand]

Ted,

You can get a CMI for free, you don't even have to beg for it! :D

[Raymond Wand]

Thanks for confirming that a free CMI is of little value if you can get it for free.

Can you get a P. Eng for free? NO!

Sorry you fail to see the significance, those that paid full fair should be given a refund because Nick has established the CMI's true worth is - $0 (zero).

[Garry Sorrells]

........................ No CMIs are free. The applicant may not pay, but someone pays for them............/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Raymond Wand;243576]Ted,

You can get a CMI for free, you don't even have to beg for it! :D


If Nick and the board feels like it, he sure can, along with all the benefits to being on the list.



So Lisa says you can not get a free CMI, but kevin says you can........go figure.... who to believe..... non of the above?????????????? Freee not freeeeeee, no way- yes way. It is amazing how little continuity there is in the voices of the organization that can not be mentioned...((( a little Harry Potter))))....:p It is amusing to read the bantor... kinda like a comic book where there is a sequel coming.

[Raymond Wand]

I know of one individual who was given a free CMI recently, he is a competitor in my area.

I also understand that as many as 16 CMI's were granted free at the recent CD conference in Toronto.

I also has it confirmed to me personally that CMI's could be had for $1000 each, well below the going rate of $2500. When asked about the GST which is 13% tax on the $1000 fee, my friend was told to take an additional 13% off the $1000 price.

- - - Updated - - -

BTW Liza has continually maintained she has no specific knowledge of the CMI since its not in her perview, however she was quick to point out it was not free - go figure.

[Ted Menelly]

"Oh yeah. Who is Carson Dunlop?"

Was comedic relief!

[Raymond Wand]

Home Inspection | Home Inspection Training | Home Inspection Report (http://www.carsondunlop.com/)

The oldest and most successful home inspection companies, report software and home inspection course providers in Canada, and successful state side too.