Missing joist hangers?

[mathew stouffer]

This house was built in 1998. There were no hangers any where, along the rim joist or any other attachments. Your thoughts.

[Markus Keller]

Joist hangers for what? The J's are sitting on walls.

[Nick Ostrowski]

What Markus said.

You only need joist hangers when there is no bearing support beneath the joists (ie - stairwell header frames). All your pics Matt show good bearing support on the underside of the joists.

[mathew stouffer]

Nick,
They are the wrong pics. What they had was end bearing along one side of the house which you see in the pics. However, in the crawl space they had bearing on one side and a large glue lam creating a cantilever about 2/3 the width of the crawl space. Joists on the other side of the cantilever had no end bearing or hangers. They were just butted against the rim.

[Corn Walker]

Nick,
They are the wrong pics. What they had was end bearing along one side of the house which you see in the pics. However, in the crawl space they had bearing on one side and a large glue lam creating a cantilever about 2/3 the width of the crawl space. Joists on the other side of the cantilever had no end bearing or hangers. They were just butted against the rim.

What is under that rim? Nothing? Do you have the right pics because I'm having a hard time imagining the situation.

[brian schmitt]

the only problem i see is a lack of underfloor insulation. don't see where hangers are required in the posted pictures.

[H.G. Watson, Sr.]

Matthew Stouffer (Mat),

This may sound a bit like I'm slapping you on the head.

Do you recall your thread last March wherein we discussed a damp (standing water) earthen based unconditioned, unfinished crawlspace where your photos displayed a host of problems with some TJIs and a rats nest of wiring (and other) problems? It was a long string where there was a lot of cross-talk "discussions" but we (you and I) discussed the specific issues shown in that crawl.

Did you review those linked documents regarding (in that case they were branded TJIs) the TJIs?

I am directing you to now, without delay head on over to the APA (Engineered Wood Association - formerly known as the american plywood association IIRC) site. Sign up/register if you already haven't previously (create a gmail e-mail account if you wish) as you will be asked to log-in and/or register now to download/view the free publications, and right now DOWNLOAD and save to your hardrive TWO documents, NOW, and then review them.

This is a link to the main page of the site:
APA - The Engineered Wood Association (http://www.apawood.com/)

Get to the Publications Link.
Under "Rim Board" or more specifically "Performance Rated Rim Boards" area of the library find a document entitled "Performance Rated Rim Boards"

You know what, save time, HERE IS A DIRECT LINK to that section:
Publications Featuring Rim Board ® | APA - The Engineered Wood Association (http://www.apawood.com/level_c.cfm?content=pub_rbd_libmain)

The First document on this page is "APA Performance Rated Rim Boards"
The PDF icon is to the right marked "free" and "531K. It is document number W345, is only 8 pages. SAVE IT TO YOUR HARDDRIVE, open it, and READ IT, see especially FIGURE ONE of the document.

Then you can identify some of the nailing issues shown in one of your photos (failure to miss the top flange of a PRI when wall plate above was set thus damaging flange, and incorrect toe nailing and attachment from rim board). Review the entire document so you will have a "clue" as to WHAT A PERFORMANCE RATED RIM BOARD IS. Note you did not display the markings as to the thickness of the upside down rim board is, but you will likely not feel so good about your original question, and slap yourself about what you have missed, what is present in your photographs, and more importantly, what you did not photograph or provide info on.

NEXT, download a second document from the "I-Joist" section of the publications library entitled "APA Performance Rated I-Joists" HERE IS A DIRECT LINK TO THAT SECTION: Publications Featuring I-Joists | APA - The Engineered Wood Association (http://www.apawood.com/level_c.cfm?content=pub_joi_libmain)

The second document on this page link is the one you want, it is number Z725, and in free PDF format at 2.2MB. DOWNLOAD THIS to your harddrive then open it locally and review the 25 pages contained therein (lots of pictures and diagrams). Again you will slap yourself about some of your questions, and hopefully start to question some of the things shown in your photos damaged top flange, etc.

You have asked some questions subsequent to your exposure to the documents linked to previously specific to the TJIs in your March photos that indicate that you have not reviewed, grasped or retained.

When you have more time I'd like to see you also download and review some of the basic framing guides also available on the site. I'd be happy to recommend a few to start with (for example D710 (53 pages): "I-Joist Construction Details - Performance Rated I-Joists in Floor and Roof Framing" which also includes details for cantilevers; and from the american wood council awc.org their document WCD1-300 to get a handle on the basics of wood frame construction, its an easy read with lots of diagrams and photos and a basic primer with good basic glossary).

Realizing that the tone of this posting is stern (intended) but not meant to be mean, the same questions/photo examples repeatedly (not necessarily THIS question, but others) over and over on the same or similar "issues" from the same person are getting tiresome & worrisome thinking there is some sort of failure to communicate/return to thread & read/retain information/keyword search prior posts/learning difficulty, etc. Is there something ELSE going on?

Finally, I have to ask this. What's up with the two Park City Stouffers (Matthew & Ryan)? Both posting styles the same, same issues/questions/photos, never "on" at the same time, but often one posting right after the other. Related persons in same town (sharing computer?) or same person - two posting identities?

[Nick Ostrowski]

Nick,
They are the wrong pics. What they had was end bearing along one side of the house which you see in the pics. However, in the crawl space they had bearing on one side and a large glue lam creating a cantilever about 2/3 the width of the crawl space. Joists on the other side of the cantilever had no end bearing or hangers. They were just butted against the rim.

Pics?

[H.G. Watson, Sr.]

Don't expect them. Took the "teach a hungry man to fish" rather than "feed a hungry man a fish" approach. Perhaps it worked.;)