Mold testing newbee

[Matt Fletcher]

Anyone out there an experienced mold tester? I just started doing air sampling and would like to consult with someone on levels. As you know, what is considered "high" levels is fuzzy math at best.

[Nick Ostrowski]

Uh oh......

[Rick Cantrell]

Anyone out there an experienced mold tester? I just started doing air sampling and would like to consult with someone on levels. As you know, what is considered "high" levels is fuzzy math at best.
Colimine (sp) will likely be willing to give you some pointers.
He is very knowledgeable on such matters.

[Caoimhín P. Connell]

Hello Matt –

(Rick thanks for the addition of yet another new spelling of my name… I collect them!)

Matt, air sampling for mould is utterly useless, and the “results� are entirely meaningless, and completely uninterpretable, and virtually every State, and virtually every pertinent regulatory agency, scientific and medical organization recommends against such sampling.

Your own State Department of Health says:

Having someone test your house for mold costs a lot of money and is not really useful.

And expensive? You betcha it’s expensive, the last project I did (late 2012) where I was hired to assess a structure for mould and perform scientifically valid air sampling came to a little under $13,000.00 At the end, of that assessment, the sampling did not provide any information over and above that I had already determined by a visual inspection.

Again, your State Health Department wisely and correctly tells Michigan citizens:

You can probably find the mold just using your eyes and your nose.

I would say that 99.9% of North Americans with at least a fifth grade education can perform an adequate assessment for moulds in their house.

The idea that some moulds are worse than others is just junk science. Again - your own State Department of Health:

While stories about “toxic mold� have been on TV a lot, black mold is not worse than any other mold you may find in your house.

A legitimate mould expert will virtually never collect a sample for mould.

For your reading enjoyment:

Mould Testing: Is it beneficial or 'snake oil?' (http://forensic-applications.com/moulds/sampling.html)

and

Indoor Fungal Concentrations (http://www.forensic-applications.com/moulds/mvue.html)

and

Are Screening Samples for Mould Valid? (http://www.forensic-applications.com/moulds/screening.html)


Cheers!

CaoimhÃ*n P. Connell
Forensic Industrial Hygienist
Forensic Applications Consulting Technologies, Inc. - Home (http://www.forensic-applications.com)

(The opinions expressed here are exclusively my personal opinions and do not necessarily reflect my professional opinion, opinion of my employer, agency, peers, or committees. The above post is for information only and does not reflect professional advice and is not intended to supercede the professional advice of others.)

AMDG

[Mike Lamb]

Anyone out there an experienced mold tester? I just started doing air sampling and would like to consult with someone on levels. As you know, what is considered "high" levels is fuzzy math at best.

Matt,

If you read or research credible medical authorities you would know that mold testing isn't likely to help anybody. The public's fear of mold and lust for mold testing is media driven and also perpetuated by unethical mold testing schools of which there is a very long list.

So good luck to you.

This is from the Center for Disease Control and Prevention:

CDC - Indoor Environmental Quality: Dampness and Mold in Buildings - NIOSH Workplace Safety and Health Topic (http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/topics/indoorenv/mold.html#4)

CDC does not recommend routine sampling for molds. Generally, it is not necessary to identify the species of mold growing in a building. Measurements of mold in air are not reliable or representative. If mold is seen or smelled, there is a potential health risk; therefore, no matter what type of mold is present, you should arrange for its removal. Furthermore, sampling for mold can be expensive, and standards for judging what is and what is not an acceptable or tolerable quantity of mold have not been established.

[jonathanclark]

Anyone out there an experienced mold tester? I just started doing air sampling and would like to consult with someone on levels. As you know, what is considered "high" levels is fuzzy math at best.

Where ever you are supposed to live or if you owns any building,you should not forget these terms until you lives there.

Mould inspection (http://www.healthyenvironmental.ca/services/mould-inspection/)

Air quality testing

Asbestos inspection

Add these terms into your life and make sure about it happens once in two months .it will help your building to stay strong for ever..




http://vlink.yellowpages.ca/services/player/bcpid66035054001?bckey=AQ~~,AAAADtlZARk~,O0tIffiuw 8MZl55EUBGTYeIXSaHVKnGj&bctid=1931880664001

[Raymond Wand]

I suggest inspectors stop spreading fear and ignorance on mould testing and remediation.

Canada Mortgage and Housing suggests the following.

Moisture and Mold | CMHC (http://www.cmhc-schl.gc.ca/en/co/maho/yohoyohe/momo/)
Mold | CMHC (http://www.cmhc-schl.gc.ca/en/co/maho/yohoyohe/momo/moaiprre/moaiprre_002.cfm)

[Caoimhín P. Connell]

Good morning-

I have read the “Healthy Household� web site referenced by the above poster (identified as Jonathan Clark).

With all respect, it is clear that although “Healthy Household� pretends to be knowledgeable in moulds and offers mould “testing� services, but they are exactly the kind of mould “experts� that have created such a problem by offering garbage-based information and useless services to their clients.

The “Healthy Household� web site contains a load of absolute rubbish that indicates they know nothing about moulds, and they therefore know nothing about the assessment of the same.

With all due respect, the company “Healthy Household� is a rip-off organization who peddles a service when in fact, they are grossly incompetent in that field of practice. It is such a good example of junk-science, I have saved the site and will use it in my lectures.

Cheers!

CaoimhÃ*n P. Connell
Forensic Industrial Hygienist
Forensic Applications Consulting Technologies, Inc. - Home (http://www.forensic-applications.com)

(The opinions expressed here are exclusively my personal opinions and do not necessarily reflect my professional opinion, opinion of my employer, agency, peers, or committees. The above post is for information only and does not reflect professional advice and is not intended to supercede the professional advice of others.)

AMDG

[Matt Fletcher]

Well folks, several cities in Michigan, including Harrison Twp now REQUIRE a mold test for buildings that have been tagged by the city as unoccupied. The city will not give the owner a c of o until the air test with spore count is done. So I do the test.

So, when I test a building and find the black mold spore count in the hundreds per liter of air, none of you think that is not an issue? Nothing to be concerned about...all media hype and hocus pocus, rip off nonsense contrived to take advantage of people? That's funny to me but you are welcome to your opinions.

[Caoimhín P. Connell]

Hello Matt-


Well folks, several cities in Michigan, including Harrison Twp now REQUIRE a mold test for buildings that have been tagged by the city as unoccupied. The city will not give the owner a c of o until the air test with spore count is done. So I do the test.

I was unable to find any such requirements in the available Harrison Twp documentation. Do you have a citation for this requirement?




So, when I test a building and find the black mold spore count in the hundreds per liter of air, none of you think that is not an issue?

I suppose you are being facetious, however, I’ll bite. Are you telling us that you get a lab report that is reporting “black mold�? That would be fun!

Hundreds of spores per liter of air? For a start, you have no idea how many spores per liter of air is in you sample, since you have never made that determination. All you have done is collect a spore trap and then you fool yourself into thinking that the number on the laboratory report is real – so, here’s a fun experiment. Ell the laboratory you want the slides back, and then send those slides to a second, and a third and a fourth laboratory. Guess what? You will get back WILDLY different reports each time… Think of the money you can make by selectively picking and choosing which report you are going to use to demonstrate whatever you want!

Hundreds? Seriously? I would not necessarily think it’s an issue at THOUSANDS of spore/m3 of air. During the latter part of the summer of 2007, the prestigious International Union of Toxicology held an International Congress of Toxicology meeting in Montreal, Canada. During that congress, the authors of one of the papers presented (1) reported that by merely dropping a single mouldy lemon into the trash, the resulting human exposure to Penicillium was 286,755 spores/m3. So, you’re trying to tell us that you think that if a mouldy lemon is discarded in an house, we should evacuate the house?

Consider for a moment that US employees working at lumber mills (2) are daily exposed to mould spore concentrations in the millions of spores/m3, ranging from 1,000,000 spores/m3 to 100,000,000 spores/m3 daily, without any known adverse health effects from these exposures. Shepherds in outdoor sheep paddocks (3) are exposed to mold spores in excess of 300,000 spores/m3 – is it your position that shepherds need to be in SCBAs? Human exposures on normal, healthy farms can be millions of times greater than those you are trying to alarm us over - In fact, one medical study reported daily exposures as high as 1,200,000,000 spores/m3 (that is one point two billion spores per cubic meter of air) (4). In that paper, the author(s) point out that these farms were selected by the Respiratory Division, National Institute of Occupational Health, (Sweden) precisely because there were no reported illnesses from those exposures at those locations.

However, even those extremely elevated concentrations are not the highest found in the literature; other authors (5) reported finding even higher spore counts in excess of 10,000,000,000 spores/m3 (that’s ten billion spores per cubic meter of air) on farms.

Good clean outdoor air in Michigan this time of year will run into the THOUSANDS of spores/m3… should we prohibit people in Michigan from venturing outdoors?

So it’s scary “black mould� eh? OK…I have studies that show that even at 16,000 spores/m3 of Stachybotrys there are no known health effects. For example, Brasel (6) studied residences that had been heavily damaged by flood waters, and in which there were huge fungal blooms of mold throughout the homes (up to 500 square feet of mural mold growth on the walls). They confirmed that Stachybotrys concentrations were in the order of 16,000 spores/m3. Yet, even in these heavily contaminated houses, the daily dose of mycotoxins (expressed as total trichothecenes) was 8.9E-10 below the LC50 reported by Wannemacher (7) (that is (89,000,000,000 times less than the LC50) and 5.9E-6 below (5,900,000 times below) the LOAEL reported the by the European Commission Health & Consumer Protection Directorate-General.(8) That is, where trichothecenes were measured even in extremely contaminated properties, the daily dose from the mycotoxin was 168,000 times lower than the dose needed to induce an adverse physiological effect in the animal model used in the study. The American Academy of Allergy and Immunology identifies Levels of Concern for moulds and says that 6,500 to 13,000 is “moderate� and anticipates that some individuals that are sensitive to these moulds may experience symptoms.


Nothing to be concerned about...all media hype and hocus pocus, rip off nonsense contrived to take advantage of people? That's funny to me but you are welcome to your opinions.

Yeppers – and that is the opinion of the US Institutes of Medicine, the World Health Organization, the US Centers for Disease Control, the US National Institutes of Safety and Health (just to mention a few)…. But what would THEY know compared to Matt Fletcher, a self identified “Mold Newbie� who goes onto the internet looking for help in interpreting results from complete strangers?

References follow….

Cheers!

CaoimhÃ*n P. Connell
Forensic Industrial Hygienist
Forensic Applications Consulting Technologies, Inc. - Home (http://www.forensic-applications.com)

(The opinions expressed here are exclusively my personal opinions and do not necessarily reflect my professional opinion, opinion of my employer, agency, peers, or committees. The above post is for information only and does not reflect professional advice and is not intended to supercede the professional advice of others.)

AMDG

1 Chan CY, Robbins CR, Fallah P, Hardin BD, Kelman BJ, Risk From Inhaled Mycotoxins From Mold-Infested Produce, IUTOX ICT—Montreal, Canada (July 15-19, 2007) Abstract #PT6.105

2 Gots RE, M.D., Ph.D. (International Center For Toxicology And Medicine), The Medical Aspects Of Mold Litigation, presented to the ASTM International Johnson Conference, University Of Vermont, July 13, 2009.

3 Smith JD, Crawley WE, Lees FT, Seasonal variation in spore numbers of Pithomyces chartarum in 1960 and 1961 in the Waikato, New Zealand Journal of Agricultural Research, 4:5-6, 538-551 (1961)

4 Malmberg P, Rask-Andersen A, Rosenhall L, Exposure to Microorganisms Associated With Allergic Alveolitis and Febrile Reactions to Mold Dust in Farmers, Chest No. 103 Vol. 4 (1202-1209) April 1993

5 Karlsson K, Malmberg P, Characterization of exposure to molds and actinomycetes in agricultural dusts by scanning electron microscopy, fluorescence microscopy and the culture method; Scand J Work Environ Health 1989;15:353-359

6 Brasel TL, Martin JM, Carriker CG, Wilson SC, and Straus DC; Detection of Airborne Stachybotrys chartarum Macrocyclic Trichothecene Mycotoxins in the Indoor Environment (Applied And Environmental Microbiology, Nov. 2005, p. 7376–7388)

7 Wannemacher RW, Wiener, SL, Chapter 34, TRICHOTHECENE MYCOTOXINS; in Medical Aspects of Chemical and Biological Warfare, Textbook of Military Medicine Published by the Office of The Surgeon General Department of the Army, Zajtchuk R, Editor in Chief, Bethesda, Maryland, 1997

8 European Commission Health & Consumer Protection Directorate-General Opinion of the Scientific Committee on Food on Fusarium toxins. Part 6: Group evaluation of T-2 toxin, HT-2 toxin, nivalenol and deoxynivalenol (SCF/CS/CNTM/MYC/27 Final 27 February 2002)

[Matt Fletcher]

1. I have done two mold inspections for people with homes in Harrison Twp Michigan who said the city required the mold test. One said it was because the city inspector happen to show up when the basement had flooded. The other said it was because the house was unoccupied for several months. You are welcome to call the township to veryify if you think I would bother to lie about it....LOL Let me know what they tell you.

2. YES, I do recieve a lab report from IMS labs stating the presence of black mold, AKA Stachybotrys. The reports break out all the species of mold in the sample. Yer kidding me right? You have never even seen a report on an air sample and you are running around the web telling people they are cluless about mold? The samples are examined by a mycologist and each type of mold in the sample is identified by the hyphal fragents they see. Fungal growth has branches, like a tree does. You can likely tell a Maple tree frm a Willow tree....right? Well a Mycologist can tell one mold from another by looking at it under a microscope.

3. Dr. Mark Banner, PhD happens to live in my area. I have met him, seen his presentations on mold, and consulted with him on a couple of samples I have taken. He disagrees with all of your "mold is okay" references. Mark worked for several large food companies making sure their food production facilities were as bacteria and mold free as possible. Mark is retired and now does residential mold testing like I do. We all know that mold is a natural part of the environment but at high levels it can hurt you unless you believe all reported illnesses from mold are made up. Salt is a natural part of the environment and your diet, but too much will hurt you...same with sugar, vitamins or any other substance.

PS....is this you? If so, I think I we are done here.
CaoimhÃ*n P. Connell ~ My Very Own Internet Troll | CONTEMPT OF COURT (http://contemptofcourtfor.me/garbage-science/caoimhin-p-connell-my-personal-internet-troll/)

Quote:
"Mr. Caohmin Connell, who has followed me around the Internet for years posting false and libelous statements of me and others. Mr. Connell just can’t get over the fact that it is not science for one to apply math to a single rodent study and profess to have proven no one is sick from the toxic components of microbial contaminants found in water damaged buildings.Below is his webpage. If you notice, it is missing any information of where Mr. Connell received any college degree in any subject. http://www.forensic-applications.com/about_us (http://www.forensic-applications.com/about_us)
Lacking in higher education and ability to discuss subjects of science without showing his low emotional IQ, Mr. Connell choses to attack by attributing false finding of those who expose his uncooth manner and unscientific, uneducated positions. "

[Rick Cantrell]

I have found it true that many "Certified" mold inspectors tend to exaggerate their qualifications sometimes to the point of misrepresentation.
On your (Matt Fletcher/ Macomb county home inspectors) web site (Detroit, Grosse Pointe Home Inspection (http://www.miproperty.com/) ) you say that in addition to being a "Certified mold inspector & remediator", you are also are certified in lead inspection. You even provided a copy of the certification (http://www.miproperty.com/images/leadcert.jpg).
However the "Certificate" you provided is not for a lead inspector. This is an online study that takes all of 30 minutes to complete, at the end there are three (3) questions to answer. US Department of Housing and Urban Development - HUD - Visual Assessment Training (http://www.hud.gov/offices/lead/training/visualassessment/h00101.htm)
Yet you say you are certified in lead inspection. Are you deliberately misleading people into thinking you have more skills and training than you actually have. So why should we have any confidence that you are genuine and sincere where mold is concerned.
People that have put their trust in you expect your certifications to mean you can be trusted.
You are either extremely naive, or worse (I won't say).
In fact you should be reported for falsely representing yourself as a lead inspector.

[Matt Fletcher]

http://www.miproperty.com/images/leadcert.jpg

His is my certificate. Which reads, Matt Fletcher has successuflly completed the US Department of Housing and Urban Development Office of Healthy Homes and Lead Hazard Contorl's Visual assessment Course pursant to 24 code of federal regualtions part 35."

Please come again pal....what am a a liar about?????


I am sorry if the US Department of Housing and Urban Development course isn't up to your standards. Perhapes you should school them on the proper training techniques of lead assessment.
And there are more than 3 questions at the end of the course.....now YOU are lying, exagerating not me.

Why don't you go report me yourself.

You obviously think you are smarter than be because you attended a 1 day class and received an additional certification that I did not. I'm sorry if you have an inferiority complex and feel the need to sling **** at a fellow inspector. It was nice chewing your ass on the phone.

Quote: "Welcome to the HUD Lead Based Paint Visual Assessment Training Course!Here's how this training works: Each slide follows a specific sequence. The arrows at the bottom should be used to go forward or back. At the end of the training, there is a short test. Upon successful completion of the online training you will have the opportunity to print a certificate of completion."


Notice how it calls it a "certificate"

I have a Masters Degree in Teaching and a certificate for Vocational Education. What are your qualifications to say this is not a certificate?

[Rick Cantrell]

I had hardly pressed the enter key when I got a phone call.
Yes, Matt did call me on the phone. It was,,,well,,, one sided rants and threats.
He did assure me that he has much more education than I have. Why I needed to know that, and what difference it makes, I'm not sure. However, he did use words I don't use and rarely hear, so I guess his education has paid off.

I expect his website to be more accurate in describing his qualifications.

I suppose I won't be getting any "Likes" from him.

Oh, if I stop posting here, someone should check his travel arrangements.

[Rick Cantrell]

3. Dr. Mark Banner, PhD happens to live in my area. I have met him, seen his presentations on mold, and consulted with him on a couple of samples I have taken. He disagrees with all of your "mold is okay" references.

Is this the same person that lectures for the mold company you get your testing at?
Lecturers for Mold Training, Mold Classes, Mold Courses and Mold Seminars (http://www.moldpro.org/lecturers.html)
or is this him
https://mjbmold.com/

[Rick Cantrell]

I have found it true that many "Certified" mold inspectors tend to exaggerate their qualifications sometimes to the point of misrepresentation.
On your (Matt Fletcher/ Macomb county home inspectors) web site (Detroit, Grosse Pointe Home Inspection (http://www.miproperty.com/) ) you say that in addition to being a "Certified mold inspector & remediator", you are also are certified in lead inspection. You even provided a copy of the certification (http://www.miproperty.com/images/leadcert.jpg).
However the "Certificate" you provided is not for a lead inspector. This is an online study that takes all of 30 minutes to complete, at the end there are three (3) questions to answer. US Department of Housing and Urban Development - HUD - Visual Assessment Training (http://www.hud.gov/offices/lead/training/visualassessment/h00101.htm)
Yet you say you are certified in lead inspection. Are you deliberately misleading people into thinking you have more skills and training than you actually have. So why should we have any confidence that you are genuine and sincere where mold is concerned.
People that have put their trust in you expect your certifications to mean you can be trusted.
You are either extremely naive, or worse (I won't say).
In fact you should be reported for falsely representing yourself as a lead inspector.


http://www.miproperty.com/images/leadcert.jpg

His is my certificate. Which reads, Matt Fletcher has successuflly completed the US Department of Housing and Urban Development Office of Healthy Homes and Lead Hazard Contorl's Visual assessment Course pursant to 24 code of federal regualtions part 35."

Please come again pal....what am a a liar about?????


I am sorry if the US Department of Housing and Urban Development course isn't up to your standards. Perhapes you should school them on the proper training techniques of lead assessment.
And there are more than 3 questions at the end of the course.....now YOU are lying, exagerating not me.

Why don't you go report me yourself since you are the self appointed Internet crackpot certification regulator.

You obviously think you are smarter than be because you attended a 1 day class and received an additional certification that I did not. I'm sorry if you have an inferiority complex and feel the need to sling **** at a fellow inspector. It was nice chewing your ass on the phone.


I had hardly pressed the enter key when I got a phone call.
Yes, Matt did call me on the phone. It was,,,well,,, one sided rants and threats.
He did assure me that he has much more education than I have. Why I needed to know that, and what difference it makes, I'm not sure. However, he did use words I don't use and rarely hear, so I guess his education has paid off.

I expect his website to be more accurate in describing his qualifications.

I suppose I won't be getting any "Likes" from him.

Oh, if I stop posting here, someone should check his travel arrangements.


Is this the same person that lectures for the mold company you get your testing at?
Lecturers for Mold Training, Mold Classes, Mold Courses and Mold Seminars (http://www.moldpro.org/lecturers.html)
or is this him
https://mjbmold.com/

Posted for reference

[Matt Fletcher]

Rick Cantrell,

This is your last warning to remove the slanderous statements you made concerning me misleading customers and making threats.

I will sue you in Macomb County Circuit Court for the maximum amount allowed....$100,000. if you do not retract these false statements.

912 42nd St, Columbus, GA 31904

[Rick Cantrell]

Why don't you go report me yourself

Matt I just may take your advice
Report an Environmental Violation | Enforcement | US EPA (http://www.epa.gov/tips/)


Come to think of it, a few emails to lawyers and the newspapers in your area may be just as good.
I wonder just how many of your past "Customers" might be interested.

Not bad for a
"Dumb *** backwoods M***** F****** POS Hillbilly"

[Matt Fletcher]

Quote: "Welcome to the HUD Lead Based Paint Visual Assessment Training Course!Here's how this training works: Each slide follows a specific sequence. The arrows at the bottom should be used to go forward or back. At the end of the training, there is a short test. Upon successful completion of the online training you will have the opportunity to print a certificate of completion."


Notice how it calls it a "certificate"

I have a Masters Degree in Teaching and a certificate for Vocational Education. What are your qualifications to say this is not a certificate?

I know you think I'm kidding, I will see you in court.

[Rick Cantrell]

Oh yeah, I saved a copy of your web site.
Just in case it somehow happens to change.
Image URL to share: http://site2pic.com/pics/www.miproperty.com7067.png
- - - Updated - - -



I have a Masters Degree in Teaching and a certificate for Vocational Education.


All that education and you still don't know the differences between a "Certified lead inspector" and what you have.

[Raymond Wand]

I have a Masters Degree in Teaching and a certificate for Vocational Education. What are your qualifications to say this is not a certificate?

What do you call a person who talks and talks and goes on and on long after everyones lost interest?

A teacher.

[Nick Ostrowski]

Wow!!!!!

This has go to be my favorite blurb from the entire thread......"the self appointed Internet crackpot certification regulator".

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA!!!!!!!!!!

I didn't say "uh oh" for no good reason. This has exceeded my wildest expectations. Jerry and HG never even went this far.

Please forgive my excitement. I haven't worked in three weeks while my shoulder rehabs. I find enjoyment in odd things right now.

[Raymond Wand]

Additional reading

Building Science Corporation (http://www.buildingscience.com)

For anyone questioning mould testing et ceteras do a search at the above link 'mold.'

Informative and unbiased articles.

[Rick Cantrell]

Wow!!!!!

This has go to be my favorite blurb from the entire thread......"the self appointed Internet crackpot certification regulator".

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA!!!!!!!!!!

I didn't say "uh oh" for no good reason. This has exceeded my wildest expectations. Jerry and HG never even went this far.

Please forgive my excitement. I haven't worked in three weeks while my shoulder rehabs. I find enjoyment in odd things right now.

Your just plain sick
a man is having his world shaken (not stirred)
and your getting enjoyment from it
sick, sick, sick,

[Rick Cantrell]

Wow!!!!!

This has go to be my favorite blurb from the entire thread......"the self appointed Internet crackpot certification regulator".

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA!!!!!!!!!!
.

That should be
Certified Master Self Appointed Internet Crackpot Certification Regulator

[Jerry Peck]

Rick Cantrell,

This is your last warning to remove the slanderous statements you made concerning me misleading customers and making threats.

I will sue you in Macomb County Circuit Court for the maximum amount allowed....$100,000. if you do not retract these false statements.

912 42nd St, Columbus, GA 31904

Matt Fletcher,

Your use of larger text only screams out your incompetence and implies that you think screaming louder somehow makes you right - it does not ... :hail:


... that any your threats to sue somebody for what they have posted here tells me that they hit a nerve ... big time ... and that usually means they are right on the mark. See, using larger text does nothing that smaller text does not do. (sigh)

Me thinks someone feels they got caught with their hand in the cookie jar and now they are trying to say they did not do it ... yet the crumbs all over their hands say differently. :crazy:

[Raymond Wand]

I love threats of libel. If I was paid $100 dollars every time I was threatened with a libel suit I would be rich along with the lawyers! ;)

Jerry your type is too small, could you write louder? :)

[Rick Cantrell]

Guys (and Gals)
Since Matt is going to sue me for $100.000.00
(and he's not kidding)
I'm going to need money for my defense.
Soooo, I know I can count on you
even as little as $300 will help
Matt posted the address
Anyhow, send money fast

Remember, together we can beat this
Thank you in advance for your support

[STEPHEN APPOLONIA]

Anyone out there an experienced mold tester? I just started doing air sampling and would like to consult with someone on levels. As you know, what is considered "high" levels is fuzzy math at best.

Matt
Keep up the GOOD WORK. Here on the Jersey Shore, we just went through a devestating storm I have been doing mold testing for 2 years now. In Jersey, it is out of control! It's here, it's real, and we are addressing it every day. Just got a call from a woman with high levels of Stachy who wound up with a tumor in her nose attributed to it. How come when im in a damp, mold infested home with the owner following me into the basement and he starts choking. I know the levels are high because i immediately get a headache! When i showed a client pictures of her mold infested crawl space in a 2 million dollar shore home, she now understands why her asmathic kids always had to wear air typy reprerators whenever she moved in for the summer. I've gor the pictures to prove it if you would like to see some.

Stay well and keep doing just what you are doing. This is my first time replying on this site, but i cant believe the bull i read in some of the responces.

- - - Updated - - -


Anyone out there an experienced mold tester? I just started doing air sampling and would like to consult with someone on levels. As you know, what is considered "high" levels is fuzzy math at best.

Matt
Keep up the GOOD WORK. Here on the Jersey Shore, we just went through a devestating storm I have been doing mold testing for 2 years now. In Jersey, it is out of control! It's here, it's real, and we are addressing it every day. Just got a call from a woman with high levels of Stachy who wound up with a tumor in her nose attributed to it. How come when im in a damp, mold infested home with the owner following me into the basement and he starts choking. I know the levels are high because i immediately get a headache! When i showed a client pictures of her mold infested crawl space in a 2 million dollar shore home, she now understands why her asmathic kids always had to wear air typy reprerators whenever she moved in for the summer. I've gor the pictures to prove it if you would like to see some.

Stay well and keep doing just what you are doing. This is my first time replying on this site, but i cant believe the bull i read in some of the responces.

- - - Updated - - -


Anyone out there an experienced mold tester? I just started doing air sampling and would like to consult with someone on levels. As you know, what is considered "high" levels is fuzzy math at best.

Matt
Keep up the GOOD WORK. Here on the Jersey Shore, we just went through a devestating storm I have been doing mold testing for 2 years now. In Jersey, it is out of control! It's here, it's real, and we are addressing it every day. Just got a call from a woman with high levels of Stachy who wound up with a tumor in her nose attributed to it. How come when im in a damp, mold infested home with the owner following me into the basement and he starts choking. I know the levels are high because i immediately get a headache! When i showed a client pictures of her mold infested crawl space in a 2 million dollar shore home, she now understands why her asmathic kids always had to wear air typy reprerators whenever she moved in for the summer. I've gor the pictures to prove it if you would like to see some.

Stay well and keep doing just what you are doing. This is my first time replying on this site, but i cant believe the bull i read in some of the responces.

[Dan Harris]

Matt
Keep up the GOOD WORK. Here on the Jersey Shore, we just went through a devestating storm I have been doing mold testing for 2 years now. In Jersey, it is out of control! It's here, it's real, and we are addressing it every day. Just got a call from a woman with high levels of Stachy who wound up with a tumor in her nose attributed to it. How come when im in a damp, mold infested home with the owner following me into the basement and he starts choking. I know the levels are high because i immediately get a headache! When i showed a client pictures of her mold infested crawl space in a 2 million dollar shore home, she now understands why her asmathic kids always had to wear air typy reprerators whenever she moved in for the summer. I've gor the pictures to prove it if you would like to see some.

Stay well and keep doing just what you are doing. This is my first time replying on this site, but i cant believe the bull i read in some of the responces.

Bull in some responces??
I don't recall anyone saying mold does not cause health problems, or state mold should not be removed.

What did you gain, or should I say what did the lady gain from paying you for testing for mold, after you determined the levels were high because you got a headache, and showed her pictures of mold in her mold infested crawlspace ??

[Raymond Wand]

Matt
Keep up the GOOD WORK. Here on the Jersey Shore, we just went through a devestating storm I have been doing mold testing for 2 years now. In Jersey, it is out of control! It's here, it's real, and we are addressing it every day. Just got a call from a woman with high levels of Stachy who wound up with a tumor in her nose attributed to it. How come when im in a damp, mold infested home with the owner following me into the basement and he starts choking. I know the levels are high because i immediately get a headache! When i showed a client pictures of her mold infested crawl space in a 2 million dollar shore home, she now understands why her asmathic kids always had to wear air typy reprerators whenever she moved in for the summer. I've gor the pictures to prove it if you would like to see some.

Stay well and keep doing just what you are doing. This is my first time replying on this site, but i cant believe the bull i read in some of the responces.

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Matt
Keep up the GOOD WORK. Here on the Jersey Shore, we just went through a devestating storm I have been doing mold testing for 2 years now. In Jersey, it is out of control! It's here, it's real, and we are addressing it every day. Just got a call from a woman with high levels of Stachy who wound up with a tumor in her nose attributed to it. How come when im in a damp, mold infested home with the owner following me into the basement and he starts choking. I know the levels are high because i immediately get a headache! When i showed a client pictures of her mold infested crawl space in a 2 million dollar shore home, she now understands why her asmathic kids always had to wear air typy reprerators whenever she moved in for the summer. I've gor the pictures to prove it if you would like to see some.

Stay well and keep doing just what you are doing. This is my first time replying on this site, but i cant believe the bull i read in some of the responces.

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Matt
Keep up the GOOD WORK. Here on the Jersey Shore, we just went through a devestating storm I have been doing mold testing for 2 years now. In Jersey, it is out of control! It's here, it's real, and we are addressing it every day. Just got a call from a woman with high levels of Stachy who wound up with a tumor in her nose attributed to it. How come when im in a damp, mold infested home with the owner following me into the basement and he starts choking. I know the levels are high because i immediately get a headache! When i showed a client pictures of her mold infested crawl space in a 2 million dollar shore home, she now understands why her asmathic kids always had to wear air typy reprerators whenever she moved in for the summer. I've gor the pictures to prove it if you would like to see some.

Stay well and keep doing just what you are doing. This is my first time replying on this site, but i cant believe the bull i read in some of the responces.

http://www.buildingscience.com/documents/reports/rr-0209-mold-testing
What Testing Cannot Answer
Mold testing procedures were not developed to determine whether a home is “safe� or “healthy� or “clean�. Presently no standards exist to determine “safe�, “healthy� or“clean�. Indoor mold testing procedures were developed toidentify the locations where mold is growing or where it hasgrown – the mold “reservoir� locations or mold “amplification� sites.

Part of the problem is that no one knows what typical conditions are for homes, offices and schools – there is no “baseline� for comparison. Research is going on to answer this question. One day we will know, but we don’t know nowand it will be many years before we know the answer to this question.

The other part of the problem is that there is no “dose-response� curve for mold and humans. We just don’t know how much exposure to which molds and for how long leads to problems. It’s even more difficult when you realize that no two people are alike. Research is also going on to answer this question and one day we will also have the answer to this question. This question is far more difficult than the previous question and it will likely take much longer to answer.Common sense tells us that “too much� mold for “too long� is a problem for most people. Prudent avoidance is the best course of action at present.

Mold testing is not necessary to quantify “too much�.Too much mold in a home is obvious. If you see mold and you smell mold – you have mold – and if you see it and you smell it you probably have too much of it.
Remember, mold needs water. No water, no mold. Infact it is more basic than that. No water problem, no mold problem. Find the water problem and you will find the mold.

If a home has mold and the water problem that led tomold is obvious it is pointless to test for mold. The mold testing will not tell you anything that you don’t already know you have to do which is to clean up the mold and fix the water problem that led to the mold.

Mold testing is expensive. Any money spent on moldtesting will not be available for cleaning up the mold and fixing the water problem that led to the mold. Also, the samples can take days or weeks to be analyzed – time that is lost that could better be spent cleaning up the mold and fixing the water problem. No recognized authoritative public agency recommends mold testing to guide the clean-up or to direct correction of the water problem.

Mold testing – especially air testing - is often inaccurate. Air samples at best give a “snapshot� of the air in one location at one time – air samples are not representative of air conditions over time unless many air samples are taken over along period of time. Air sampling typically overestimates or underestimates the amount of mold in the air on average throughout the day.

[Raymond Wand]

Any relation?

The Deadline: Third Appolonia finally indicted after two other bros were sentenced for roles in Operation Bid Rig (http://thedeadlinenj.blogspot.ca/2008/01/appolonia-brothers-sentenced-for-roles.html)


Stephen Appolonia, 54, of Colts Neck, received a prison sentence of 28 months and a $10,000 fine. He was given the same March 3 surrender date as Matthew.

[Rick Cantrell]

Matt
Keep up the GOOD WORK. Here on the Jersey Shore, we just went through a devestating storm I have been doing mold testing for 2 years now. In Jersey, it is out of control! It's here, it's real, and we are addressing it every day. Just got a call from a woman with high levels of Stachy who wound up with a tumor in her nose attributed to it. How come when im in a damp, mold infested home with the owner following me into the basement and he starts choking. I know the levels are high because i immediately get a headache! When i showed a client pictures of her mold infested crawl space in a 2 million dollar shore home, she now understands why her asmathic kids always had to wear air typy reprerators whenever she moved in for the summer. I've gor the pictures to prove it if you would like to see some.

Stay well and keep doing just what you are doing. This is my first time replying on this site, but i cant believe the bull i read in some of the responces.


Hi Stephen
Glad you posted

I don't think anyone is saying (or has ever said) that high levels of mold are acceptable.
And most would agree that high levels can sometimes cause respiratory problems in some people.
The higher the level the more likely someone will be affected.

What most believe is that testing for mold has no value for the purchaser of the test.
You said your self, you could see the mold, you could smell the mold.
There is no need to do any testing.
Is there a need for remediation? Yes, always. But many times remediation to is just clean up the mold. Of course, it's understood that the source of water must first be found, and corrected.
But even remediation rarely needs more than just a through cleaning.

Testing for mold is just not needed.
You can see it, smell it, and see the evidence of moisture without ever having to test for mold.

Some even think that those that do test for mold are,,,well,,, less than completely ethical.
Some (myself included) think that those that test for mold are more likely just naive.
They want to believe the school that trained them.

But when these same people (mold testers) are given material that is in conflict with their training, then they read it to make an informed decision.
Labs have their own schools. The schools certify the testers. The testers send the labs money.
The lab has every reason to promote mold testing.
The EPA and probably every government agency does not recommend mold testing.
Of course the EPA does not sell mold test, they have no reason to recommend something that is not needed.

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Damn Raymond your good.
Listen, I have a rental application I want you to look at.:D

[Nick Ostrowski]

I tell people that if you can see the mold, the only thing testing will do at this point is tell you what the clinical identification of the mold is (ie - aspergillum, stachy botrus, etc.). You already know you don't want it in the house so you should therefore just remove it and correct the moisture issue causing it. Some people still want the mold test anyway. It's their choice and it's their money and I'm not going to try and talk them out of it. Some people just want peace-of-mind and it they get that by paying for a mold test, so be it.

[Jeff Langhorn]

After mold remediation is there a required follow up mold test? I would be interested in
seeing the compared results.
Jeff

[Caoimhín P. Connell]

Hi Jeff -


After mold remediation is there a required follow up mold test?

Nope -

Here is a quote from the NIOSH document titled "Preventing Occupational Respiratory Disease from Exposures caused by Dampness in Office Buildings, Schools, and Other Nonindustrial Buildings, March 30, 2011"

Building consultants often recommend and perform “clearance� air sampling after remediation work has been completed in an attempt to demonstrate that the building is safe for occupants. However, NIOSH does not recommend this practice, as there is no scientific basis for the use of air sampling for this purpose.



I would be interested in seeing the compared results.

The "results" cannot be compared with anything... even themselves. The "results" would be meaningless. Thus the foundation of the statement by NIOSH.

Cheers!
CaoimhÃ*n P. Connell
Forensic Industrial Hygienist
Forensic Applications Consulting Technologies, Inc. - Home (http://www.forensic-applications.com)

(The opinions expressed here are exclusively my personal opinions and do not necessarily reflect my professional opinion, opinion of my employer, agency, peers, or professional affiliates. The above post is for information only and does not reflect professional advice and is not intended to supercede the professional advice of others.)

AMDG

[Stuart Brooks]

GREAT Thread! It made my day.
"Mold Is Gold" I quit mold testing three years ago. I didn't do much before then. I spend more time then and now trying to explain to people why general air sampling for mold is a waste of their money. They could just send me a few hundred bucks and get as much information. I'm just a poor business person. I can't take people's money for nothing.;)