Non threathening

[Darren Miller]

I can't WAIT to hear James's defense of this beauty...

Commercials (http://www.nachi.tv/users/kschaff/videos/14)

Darren

[Aaron Miller]

G-E-E-E-E-E-E-E-E-E-E-E-E-E-Z-U-S!

Aaron:mad:

[Raymond Wand]

... or what he has to say about this:

Court Enters Judgment after InterNACHI Violates Settlement Agreement (http://www.nahi.org/public/565.cfm)

Harvey are you there? :p

[Aaron Miller]

That's about Nick 'tantamount to bad faith' Gromicko. What a non-threatening kind of guy . . .

Aaron:D

[Raymond Wand]

Perhaps Harvey is actually out doing an inspection. Or he is out purchasing new restraint jackets for the ESOP committee for when things get out of hand like they did a few weeks back.

I know they were thinking about arming the ESOP committee members with Tasers, but that backfired when they read somewhere that they could use Cattle prods and get the same results at less than half the price for Tasers. :D

[Michael Larson]

You little boys having fun?

[Darren Miller]

Michael,

I don't know who you're calling 'little'...

I can tell you this, I'm not having any fun cleaning up all the puke after watching that clip...

ugh

[Raymond Wand]

Michael

Your not at NACHI now so you better watch what you say, there is no ESOP over here telling people what to think and do and say! :p

[Nick Ostrowski]

That was embarassing.

[Michael Larson]

I can't WAIT to hear James's defense of this beauty...

Commercials (http://www.nachi.tv/users/kschaff/videos/14)

DarrenWhat do you think there is to defend Darren?

Do you have a problem with advertising?

[Michael Larson]

Michael,

I don't know who you're calling 'little'...

I can tell you this, I'm not having any fun cleaning up all the puke after watching that clip...

ughYou "men" seem to delight in finding real and or imagined issues to bash others with.

[Rick Hurst]

Hearing that Nick talk reminds me of those old Saturday Night Live skits where they are at Ditka's talking about Da Bears.

[Nick Ostrowski]

Michael, if you have to ask what is wrong with that commerical.............OK, I'll try.

That farce of a commerical is so slanted toward kissing up to realtors it's nauseating. "non-threatening results"........"taking care of OUR client".

Who is Kenton working for Michael? The realtor or the buyer? Sounds like he's licking the realtors' boots to me.

[Michael Larson]

Michael, if you have to ask what is wrong with that commerical.............OK, I'll try.

That farce of a commerical is so slanted toward kissing up to realtors it's nauseating. "We'll issue a non-threatening report"........"taking care of OUR client".

Who is Kenton working for Michael? The realtor or the buyer? Sounds like he's licking the realtors' boots to me.I tell it like it is in my reports and hope you do as well.

I have no interest in sucking up to agents but there is also nothing gained from using overly intense reporting language.

Some inspectors seem to delight in blowing up deals. It's not why they have been hired.

Report what you find and let the client decide how it important it is to him and be available to answer any questions he has.

The agent will most always try and minimize any problems. Let him take the liability.

The houses conditions may kill the deal but the inspector should not be.

[Nick Ostrowski]

Michael, I agree with every point you just made. But why would an inspector go out of his way to state that he'll issue a non-threatening report? That means nothing to a buyer.

In stating that he'll issue a non-threatening report, does that mean he'll use non-threatening verbiage to describe a gas leak, or a circuit breaker with undersized wire, or a blocked chimney flue - all of which can possibly result in death if left unchecked?

We find and document many hazardous issues. Our clients need to know the ramifications of hazardous defects.......and we need to protect ourselves. The whole "non-threatening" statement is just not realistic and reeks of realtor boot-licking.

[Michael Larson]

Michael, I agree with every point you just made. But why would an inspector go out of his way to state that he'll issue a non-threatening report? That means nothing to a buyer.

In stating that he'll issue a non-threatening report, does that mean he'll use non-threatening verbiage to describe a gas leak, or a circuit breaker with undersized wire, or a blocked chimney flue - all of which can possibly result in death if left unchecked?

We find and document many hazardous issues. Our clients need to know the ramifications of hazardous defects.......and we need to protect ourselves. The whole "non-threatening" statement is just not realistic and reeks of realtor boot-licking.I think you overstate your case by accusing him of not properly reporting hazardous issues. Call the guy up and ask him.

I'll wager he reports hazardous conditions in much the same way as you and I would.

It's a commercial.
Do you want him to say, "Your Realtor will fear me after I inspect your home"

While we might find that funny, most everyone else wouldn't.

[Nick Ostrowski]

I never said he won't properly report a hazardous condition. I'm wondering how he's going to do it so it doesn't sound threatening. Because like he states in his commerical, he does issue non-threatening results.

[Raymond Wand]

Did you notice the not so subtle subliminal message in the ad? Watch the video again and keep your eye on the upper left corner of the video. What does the real estate sign say?
SOLD! What do you think that implies?

[Michael Larson]

I never said he won't properly report a hazardous condition. I'm wondering how he's going to do it so it doesn't sound threatening. Because like he states in his commerical, he does issue non-threatening results.OK
When I report serious, dangerous, hazardous concerns to clients they often ask me if the house is worth the price. My answer is always the same.
I can't decide that for you. I can only report what I find and give you a tool to determine if you want to go ahead with the purchase and at what price.

They almost always understand. I do encourage them to get quotes for repair or replacement services for more serious issues as an aide in their decision making process.

Every client is different. Some issues that would scare one client mean litlte or nothing to another.

[Michael Larson]

Did you notice the not so subtle subliminal message in the ad? Watch the video again and keep your eye on the upper left corner of the video. What does the real estate sign say?
SOLD! What do you think that implies?Raymond,

I guess to you it implies that he's working for the agent. To me it makes no difference.

The client will be the one that ultimately determines the value of the services provided.

[Raymond Wand]

Working for the agent? He better figure out who his client is if thats the case. :(

[Michael Larson]

Working for the agent? He better figure out who his client is if thats the case. :(Comprehension problems again?

I said "I guess to you it implies that he's working for the agent."

It doesn't to me. Simple huh?

[Raymond Wand]

I guess to you it implies that he's working for the agent. To me it makes no difference.

Yes I know it makes no difference to you! Therein lies the problem. :confused:

[Michael Larson]

I guess to you it implies that he's working for the agent. To me it makes no difference.

Yes I know it makes no difference to you! Therein lies the problem. :confused:I was not referring to his working for the agent as "making no difference" but to what the sign said(It was the subject of your post) Like I said reading comprehension issues again.

I as you work for my client and give a flip about the agent. He will either appreciate the job I an doing for my client or if he doesn't, I'd rather not work with him anyway because he is only concerned with his commission.

Let's not start Raymond. There is no need to get into a match.:(

[Ron Bibler]

HEY. HE HAS A VERY SOFT VOICE. YA THINK?

THATS NON THREATHENING AINT IT?:)

HE'S ALL SMILIES. ALL THE TIME.

[Michael Larson]

HEY. HE HAS A VERY SOFT VOICE. YA THINK?

THATS NON THREATHENING AINT IT?:)

HE'S ALL SMILIES. ALL THE TIME.Do you put on your soft and friendly voice when clients call or your crabby, I didn't get enough sleep voice?

Think about it guys. It's a commercial. Don't want to scare anyone away right off.

[Joseph P. Hagarty]

... or what he has to say about this:

Court Enters Judgment after InterNACHI Violates Settlement Agreement (http://www.nahi.org/public/565.cfm)

Harvey are you there? :p


They have obtained a judgement.
When they collect a payment, be sure to let us know....

NAHI members should be questioning the expenditure of their limited resources on fruitless & meaningless endeavors.

[Raymond Wand]

I am sure NAHI thought it money well spent.

cheers,

[mathew stouffer]

What a joke. That guy is dangling from the balls of the local agents.

[Jerry Peck]

You "men" seem to delight in finding real and or imagined issues to bash others with.

Michael,

Seems to little old me that is exactly what you have been doing whenever you stop by here ...

"finding real and or imagined issues to bash others with"

Maybe you should try contributing some actual knowledge and help?

Or would that strain you too much?

Sheesh!

[Michael Larson]

Michael,

Seems to little old me that is exactly what you have been doing whenever you stop by here ...

"finding real and or imagined issues to bash others with"

Maybe you should try contributing some actual knowledge and help?

Or would that strain you too much?

Sheesh!Jerry you must not be reading my posts.

I didn't start the association bashing on this thread. In fact I have not bashed any association.

Many here have extremely bad attitudes when it comes to certain associations.
Don't expect it to go unchallenged.

[Raymond Wand]

Michael

Don’t let reality intrude on a good story! :D

[Jerry Peck]

Many here have extremely bad attitudes when it comes to certain associations.
Don't expect it to go unchallenged.


Michael,

My point was, and still is, why bother to come here 'just to challenge' posts like that which you don't like.

Why not become a productive member of the board and come here and offer knowledge?

To hard for you, or ???

What's your reason?

[Michael Larson]

Michael,

My point was, and still is, why bother to come here 'just to challenge' posts like that which you don't like.

Why not become a productive member of the board and come here and offer knowledge?

To hard for you, or ???

What's your reason?No agenda Jerry.

I am helpful here but your seem convinced otherwise. So be it.

P.S.
I challenged posts with wrong or incomplete information. I think you do the same thing. There is room here is there not?

[Jerry Peck]

No agenda Jerry.

You seem to have - you basically only post to association related posts.


P.S.
I challenged posts with wrong or incomplete information. I think you do the same thing. There is room here is there not?

Sure there is room here, but why do you basically always only challenge association posts? Why not add technical knowledge?

THAT (association posts) is what your agenda appears to be.

Now, as I asked before "Why not become a productive member of the board and come here and offer knowledge?"

And your answer is ... ?

[Michael Larson]

You seem to have - you basically only post to association related posts.



Sure there is room here, but why do you basically always only challenge association posts? Why not add technical knowledge?

THAT (association posts) is what your agenda appears to be.

Now, as I asked before "Why not become a productive member of the board and come here and offer knowledge?"

And your answer is ... ?Jerry Jerry Jerry,

Your reality is as confused as some others here. Today I have posted mostly on his thread because someone thought it would be funny to pick on some guys commercial and indirectly the association that produced it.

There is nothing wrong with the commercial IMHO so I chose to defend it.

Some comments were just plain silly.

There was a decent interchange of opinions in any case.

Do you have a comment on the commercial that started this thread?

[Joseph P. Hagarty]

G-E-E-E-E-E-E-E-E-E-E-E-E-E-Z-U-S!

Aaron:mad:

I agree. The commercial is in poor taste.

[Raymond Wand]

The opening on this one was good, he had me for a minute.

Commercials (http://www.nachi.tv/users/sbogren/videos/9)

[Joseph P. Hagarty]

The opening on this one was good, he had me for a minute.

Commercials (http://www.nachi.tv/users/sbogren/videos/9)

usually does not take much to get your attention....:)

[Jerry Peck]

Do you have a comment on the commercial that started this thread?

Yes, and Joe said it pretty well.


I agree. The commercial is in poor taste.

[Michael Larson]

I wonder what a commercial Jerry did would look like.

Block one out for us Jerry.

What would you say?

[Raymond Wand]

Michael

I think you should do a vidcommercial, you could be dressed as a Tap dancer and dance around the issue of how NACHI accredits their members. :D :eek:

[Michael Larson]

Michael

I think you should do a vidcommercial, you could be dressed as a Tap dancer and dance around the issue of how NACHI accredits their members. :D :eek:See what I mean Jerry?

[Jerry Peck]

I wonder what a commercial Jerry did would look like.


Dull and boring.

Either that of have one where the house falls in on the agent when I lean my back against the house with my foot propped up against the siding to explain something to my client.

:D

Remember, when I was in business my yellow page ad, and my website, said "We are your best friend, their realtor's worst nightmare."

:cool:

[Rick Hurst]

Another name besides non-threatening that comes to mind is agents asking if you are a "non-alarmist".

Non-threatening, non-alarmist are realtor talk.

They have replaced some other words too.

Cost or price
Investment, amount

Down payment
Initial Investment, Initial amount

Monthly payment
Monthly investment, monthly amount

Buy
Own

Sell or sold
Get them involved, help them acquire

Deal
Opportunity, transaction

Objection
Area of concern

Problem
Challenge

Pitch
Presentation, demonstration


Size
Approve, endorse, okay, authorize

[Joseph P. Hagarty]

I wonder what a commercial Jerry did would look like.

Block one out for us Jerry.

What would you say?

When your services are sought after, one needs no advertisement.

What a great Business position to be in.
What a Goal to Attain.

[Ron Bibler]

HEY THIS DUDE IS A STAR. :cool: THE MAN IN THE VIDEO. :D

HE HIT THE SPOT TODAY. L.O.L.

GIVE HIM THAT. SHOOK ME!!! ALL NIGHT LONG.....:eek:

[Darren Miller]

Michael,

For a preview of what my commercial would look like, check-out the front page of my website New Jersey Home Inspection - About the House! (http://www.aboutthehouseinspections.com)

Now, let's get back to the situation at hand. Mr. James Bushart has publicy come out and took a hard stance about inspector/realtor relationships (congrat to him on that issue). I can be wrong here, but I believe that is the 'official' NACHI stance (and probably written into your COE). While marketing to realtors is not prohibited, 'ass-kissing' is. That commercial reeks of ass kissing.
The commercial is directed at realtors; 'our clients', 'non-threathing' etc. I know some inspectors believe they are part of a team that sells a house; the only team you should be part of is you and the buyer and the buyers attorney; everyone else is on the 'other team'.
If, and this is a big if, NACHI's COE committee has an ounce of courage, they would denounce the commercial, remove it from the website and prohibit it from being used. Let's see if Mr. Bushart has that kind of courage!

Michael, I'm not going to continue to argue with you over this poor excuse of advertising, if you can't comprehend the message it sends, then you agree with it and approve of the boot-licking, ass kissing message it sends.

[Aaron Miller]

Why, oh why, do you guys persist in picking on Michael? He's a defenseless, one-trick pony. There's no challenge there.

Let him do his little dance every chance he gets, which isn't often.

Aaron:rolleyes:

[Raymond Wand]

I think the problem is Michael likes to boot lick. Even better when he can lick the boots of James and the ESOP in case he ever needs that "Get out of Jail" card. :o

[Darren Miller]

Raymond,

With all due respect, I think you're going overboard with your personal attacks against Michael.

Brian asked everyone to stop the personal attacks; maybe you should re-think what you wrote.

[Raymond Wand]

Darren

Personal attack? I was trying to be humorous!

[Aaron Miller]

Darren:

OK, I'll be rethinking. But, just so we're clear here, should I be thinking the same thing about Michael over and over again? That sort of rethinking?

Actually, I would prefer not to think of Michael at all. Would that do just as well?

Aaron:D

[Raymond Wand]

Michael who? :D

[Michael Larson]

Good morning gentlemen,

I see it several on one. Well, malcontents often hang to together.

You're all making a fine display of professionalism and clearly displaying your contributions to the home inspection industry.

I do some inspections referred by Realtors but not many as a percentage.

When I do I prefer to be referred by buyers agents who are really looking out for their client and want an inspection that last more than 45 minutes.
You know the type. Walk around and take a check. They are a true disservice to our industry. I hope none of you practice in this manner.

As to the commercial that some think is in poor taste, I simply disagree.

I don't know the gentleman but suspect he has more integrity than you give him credit for. You all seem ready to hang him based solely on his commercial.

My suggestion to all of you is sit down and write your own commercial.
What would you say.
What would be you goal.
How would you deliver it.

Post it hear and we can all critique it.

[Joseph P. Hagarty]

As to the commercial that some think is in poor taste, I simply disagree.

I don't know the gentleman but suspect he has more integrity than you give him credit for. You all seem ready to hang him based solely on his commercial.



I did not suggest that the individual lacked integrity. The commercial is poor in that it may not accurately reflect the service or individual.

Many great products have often engaged in ineffective or poor advertisement campaigns.

[Michael Larson]

I did not suggest that the individual lacked integrity. The commercial is poor in that it may not accurately reflect the service or individual.

Many great products have often engaged in ineffective or poor advertisement campaigns.Joe, my comment was not directed solely at you.
Others certainly inferred his lack of integrity by accusing him of sucking up to the Realtors.

Again, It's a commercial not a biography.

[Raymond Wand]

This is what happens when you get rookies trying to do their own commercials.

Just how much is NACHI charging for these commercials?

[Michael Larson]

This is what happens when you get rookies trying to do their own commercials.

Just how much is NACHI charging for these commercials?It's a benefit of membership.
All you have to do is schedule it and show up in Colorado for the shoot.:)

[Raymond Wand]

If thats the case, they need to hire professionals to write, direct and produce the commercials. They certainly are rough fwiw.

[Aaron Miller]

To no one in particular:


How would you deliver it.


More artistically, of course.

http://images.search.yahoo.com/images/view?back=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.search.yahoo.com%2Fs earch%2Fimages%3Fp%3Dthe%2Bbird%2Bflip%26fr%3Dyfp-t-501%26ei%3Dutf-8%26js%3D1%26x%3Dwrt&w=375&h=500&imgurl=static.flickr.com%2F64%2F200633979_603c81f5 79.jpg&rurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.flickr.com%2Fphotos%2F470474 85%40N00%2F200633979%2F&size=150.7kB&name=Flipping%20the%20bird&p=the%20bird%20flip&type=JPG&oid=bf6e995011e69904&fusr=Lever&tit=Flipping%20the%20bird&hurl=http://www.flickr.com/photos/47047485@N00/&no=11&tt=1514



It's a benefit of membership.


Aaron:eek:

[Darren Miller]

When I do I prefer to be referred by buyers agents who are really looking out for their client and want an inspection that last more than 45 minutes.
You know the type. Walk around and take a check. They are a true disservice to our industry. I hope none of you practice in this manner.


Actually, I have been known to conduct 30 minute inspections.
When I get down off the roof and I ask MY client the roof needs to be replaced, will that kill the deal? and they say YES!; well, I just pack it in and go home.

This has happened several times in the last couple of years. Did I kill the deal? No, the house killed the deal, I was just the messenger.

[Michael Larson]

Actually, I have been known to conduct 30 minute inspections.
When I get down off the roof and I ask MY client the roof needs to be replaced, will that kill the deal? and they say YES!; well, I just pack it in and go home.

This has happened several times in the last couple of years. Did I kill the deal? No, the house killed the deal, I was just the messenger.Why should the need for a roof replacement "kill" any deal?

The very reason we are hired is to provided a tool our client to renegotiate the deal with the seller.

I was speaking more of the guys who claim to do a full inspection in 45 minutes. The Realtors love them and that's the problem.

[Jerry Peck]

Why should the need for a roof replacement "kill" any deal?

The very reason we are hired is to provided a tool our client to renegotiate the deal with the seller.


Because many times the buyer has negotiated everything they can get from the seller, and they know the seller will not, in many cases can not, come up with anymore money, thus, the only solutions available to the client are:

1) Pay for it themselves - many times they either will not be able to, or simply will not want to, pay for it themselves.

2) Kill the deal and let the seller take the dog back.

Been there with clients before myself.

[Michael Larson]

Because many times the buyer has negotiated everything they can get from the seller, and they know the seller will not, in many cases can not, come up with anymore money, thus, the only solutions available to the client are:

1) Pay for it themselves - many times they either will not be able to, or simply will not want to, pay for it themselves.

2) Kill the deal and let the seller take the dog back.

Been there with clients before myself.I've been there too.
But in the end it usually means the house was over priced for it's condition.
The seller's only hope if the deal is killed is to find a less informed sucker to buy his trash.
Blame the Realtor for agreeing to list the house at a price it isn't worth. To many of them don't care either.

[Jerry Peck]

But in the end it usually means the house was over priced for it's condition.
The seller's only hope if the deal is killed is to find a less informed sucker to buy his trash.
Blame the Realtor for agreeing to list the house at a price it isn't worth. To many of them don't care either.


Sometimes it's because the seller is already bringing money to the table to pay the mortgage off, and there is no more money for them to bring to the table.

"The seller's only hope if the deal is killed is to find a less informed sucker to buy his trash."

There is another option though, albeit tough for the seller - give the house back to the bank, let the bank take the bigger loss (not saying that having a house foreclosed on is not a 'big loss') and sell the house for less than the mortgage balance it ... called a "short sale". Some banks are doing that now.

[Michael Larson]

There is another option though, albeit tough for the seller - give the house back to the bank, let the bank take the bigger loss (not saying that having a house foreclosed on is not a 'big loss') and sell the house for less than the mortgage balance it ... called a "short sale". Some banks are doing that now.A lot of banks are accepting short sales at this time. Over half my current business is from either foreclosed or short sale properties.

[Darren Miller]

The seller's only hope if the deal is killed is to find a less informed sucker to buy his trash.


Or for the realtor to find a home inspector whose reports are ....

"NON THREATHENING"!

[Michael Larson]

Or for the realtor to find a home inspector whose reports are ....

"NON THREATHENING"!You make to much of the term " NON THREATENING"

It the roof leaks and the foundation has problems the bank still wouldn't approve the loan in this case.
And that's no matter how non threatening you write it up.:(

[Darren Miller]

Michael;

I don't know about where you live, but the 'bank' isn't going to know the roof leaks unless the inspection states something like

"the roof has cracked, missing shingles; the brittle shingles are starting to curl. The roof has exceeded it's life expectancy and should be replaced NOW! Obtain an accurate replacement quote from a licensed roofing contractor prior to expiration of inspection period."

A "non threathening", "non-alarmist", "realtor friendly" home inspector will not put anything like that in his/her report unless...
he stepped thru the roof while walking it. But no, we all know those type of inspectors don't carry ladders and disclaim the roof because they can't view it up close.

Michael, everyone one here knows the games non threathening inspectors play on their clients; 'if I disclaim it, I can't write anything bad and that will be my defense in court.'

AND speaking of court, the guy who made the commercial at the start of this tread; let one of his clients sue him (and pull out that commercial in court)...see how fast he loses his shirt.

Think of it this way; if you have to think about it being unethical, it probably is.

OK, I'm done

[Michael Larson]

Michael;

I don't know about where you live, but the 'bank' isn't going to know the roof leaks unless the inspection states something like

"the roof has cracked, missing shingles; the brittle shingles are starting to curl. The roof has exceeded it's life expectancy and should be replaced NOW! Obtain an accurate replacement quote from a licensed roofing contractor prior to expiration of inspection period."

A "non threathening", "non-alarmist", "realtor friendly" home inspector will not put anything like that in his/her report unless...
he stepped thru the roof while walking it. But no, we all know those type of inspectors don't carry ladders and disclaim the roof because they can't view it up close.

Michael, everyone one here knows the games non threathening inspectors play on their clients; 'if I disclaim it, I can't write anything bad and that will be my defense in court.'

AND speaking of court, the guy who made the commercial at the start of this tread; let one of his clients sue him (and pull out that commercial in court)...see how fast he loses his shirt.

Think of it this way; if you have to think about it being unethical, it probably is.

OK, I'm doneDarren, I understand your point quite well. I certainly wasn't advocating that the inspector should not write up the roof leaks or the foundation problems. (I know I am mixing two threads here but it's a good example)
Perhaps it a matter of the language we use in our reports. I have the duty to fully report the defects in a house to the client. Disclaiming an inspection item or referring it other professionals should only be done in a limited amount of situations. The Realtor's request is NOT one of them.

Non threatening doesn't have to mean a soft report. It's a matter of tone.