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  1. #1
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    Default Association Accreditations

    There are several accreditation programs available from associations and private enterprises. Each claims that their "certification" is worthwhile and difficult to accomplish therefore has meaning and will draw clients.

    I operate in a licensed state. In over 5 years only one potential client has ever asked if I belong to any associations. Never have they asked if I hold any specific certifications. Occasionally they may ask why they should choose me over other potential inspectors. Theoretically these certifications can be used to differentiate me.

    There is a state wide home inspector association in North Carolina. Currently the only requirement is to pay your dues. There is a fraction that would like to develop a tiered membership where in members who complete a series of tasks are granted a designation that they and the association can market to say that these members have met a higher standard and are more worthy.

    Just curious of those holding association certifications like CMI, ACI, RHI, or similar saw an increase in customers as a result of their holding the various certifications.

    If you were developing a certification or stratified membership for an association, what do you think would be worthwhile achievements to be included?

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    Last edited by Bruce Ramsey; 07-26-2011 at 07:21 AM.
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  2. #2
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Each claims that their "certification" is worthwhile and difficult to accomplish therefore has meaning and will draw clients.
    Those are not the reasons that the CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR professional designation "draws clients."

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    If you were developing a certification or stratified membership for an association, what do you think would be worthwhile achievements to be included?
    Whatever the requirements, they should be verified. Non-proctored testing and affidavits by the inspector don't mean anything.

    MinnesotaHomeInspectors.com
    Minnesota Home Inspectors LLC
    ASHI #242887 mnradontesting.com

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Read post #2.

    Consumers don't research qualifications in depth. They certainly don't demand to know what percentage of the pre-licensing or continuing education courses required to earn a particular professional designation included exams that were proctored. Besides, proctoring doesn't verify competence or make an exam more difficult, it only verifies identity. Consumer choice of inspector is made in under 20 seconds, often in less than 5 seconds.

    Again, qualification research is not the reason that the CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR professional designation "draws clients."

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Who knows if the alphabet soup that folks use behind their names attracts business. Like Bruce, I work in a licensed environment and I have found that folks call me or find me most of the time via a past client referral or from my website. I can attribute about 10-15 inspections a year that come directly from the ASHI website.

    ASHI's highest membership level is the ACI (ASHI Certified Inspector). ASHI is the only home inspector organization that has had their certification process verified and approved by a third party organization. No other home inspector organization has been able to accomplish this; I belive one other has attempted but was unable to accomplish it. It took ASHI about 3 years to acquire approval of their certification process through the NCCA.

    Most if not all professional certifications are self serving and are only recognized within that organization or profession.

    Scott Patterson, ACI
    Spring Hill, TN
    www.traceinspections.com

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Most if not all professional certifications are self serving and are only recognized within that organization or profession.
    Scott is right!

    No consumer takes the time or energy to research to find out how many years it took the association the inspector belongs to, to go through some approval process created by some other organization. You only get 5 - 20 seconds.

    Again, qualification research is not the reason that the CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR professional designation "draws clients."

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Try this for an exercise.

    Imagine that you grab your ladders and flashlights and a few extra changes of clothes and climb into to a silver space ship and fly to a new planet. This new planet is much like earth only the consumers decide what inspector to use very quickly, within seconds. They don't do much research. Which one do you think will work on this strange new planet?
    • I am a member of a society that took 3 years to go through some approval process from some other organization that used to certify wedding planners and so now I'm a registered candidate that took a proctored exam from the national achievement institute of council-sanctioned associates, bla bla bla.
    or
    • I'm a CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR.
    ?

    You tell me which one sells you in the 5 seconds the consumer invests in the decision.

    BTW, your silver space ship didn't reach a new planet. It just went up into space, turned around, and landed back on earth. Right or wrong, earth is where you have to make a living.

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    The name can be as flowery as you want, but without verifying who the person is and verifying their credentials it's meaningless. I'm not talking about a name to dupe the uneducated public, I'm talking about having an association and designation which stands out from the rest. Something its members can be proud of and which the educated public will have confidence in. Not a marketing tool

    MinnesotaHomeInspectors.com
    Minnesota Home Inspectors LLC
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR is both (criminal background check, documented proof of 3 years in business, 1,000 inspections/continuing education hours). It is the highest professional designation an inspector can earn and it is a marketing tool that works like nothing else (consumers who know nothing about our industry instantly recognize it as the best of the best).

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    In NC a CMI designation will not allow you to do an inspection so what good is it? Same as having a car with no drivers license...pretty uesless.


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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisa Endza View Post
    (consumers who know nothing about our industry instantly recognize it as the best of the best).
    Exactly, people who know nothing about our industry. Those who know the industry; inspectors, real estate professionals and the educated consumers know the truth.

    If you read what Bruce originally wrote, they already have a State Association and would like to develop a tiered membership. He didn't ask what association to join and I'm sure they're not interested in popping $1,000 each for a self title which only impresses people "who know nothing about our industry".

    Notice how nobody who holds a CMI designation has responded?

    Bruce, this year it looks like I'll get about 50 inspections for being an ASHI Certified Inspector. I don't use it behind my name because nobody outside the profession knows what it means anyway. I do use the logo on my website and have many first time buyers who've attended a class call me because I'm an ACI. Apparently people instructing first time buyers seminars are telling them to find an ACI.

    MinnesotaHomeInspectors.com
    Minnesota Home Inspectors LLC
    ASHI #242887 mnradontesting.com

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisa Endza View Post
    CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR is both (criminal background check, documented proof of 3 years in business, 1,000 inspections/continuing education hours). It is the highest professional designation an inspector can earn and it is a marketing tool that works like nothing else (consumers who know nothing about our industry instantly recognize it as the best of the best).
    The proposed requirements for the tiered membership exceed the CMI requirements. 5 yr min in business, 1000 inspections, min. 20 hrs CE annually, reports reviewed annually to ensure compliance with licensing requirements, community service, and association service. Candidates must re-apply annually due to ongoing CE, report review, and service. Since we are licensed, all home inspectors have already gone through a background check and must report annually to the licensing board if they have any misdemeanors or felonies. A proctored exam is required to get a state HI license.

    CMIs do not meet the minimum requirements for the proposed designation. Nor do ACI or RHI or any other designation we have found in the industry.

    Please do not comment on which alphabet soup is best. Don't care since we are creating a NEW designation. I asked if anyone is seeing any business as a result of having the alphabet soup. I don't care which if any association you may belong to. I just want to know if anyone saw a rise in business because you have ANY designation. Thank you.

    "The Code is not a peak to reach but a foundation to build from."

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    I'd also suggest a liability and E&O requirement if your state doesn't already require it.

    MinnesotaHomeInspectors.com
    Minnesota Home Inspectors LLC
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Rowe View Post
    I'd also suggest a liability and E&O requirement if your state doesn't already require it.
    The state requires one or the other but not both. If liability only, then you gotta have assets of $17k

    Last edited by Bruce Ramsey; 07-26-2011 at 04:38 PM.
    "The Code is not a peak to reach but a foundation to build from."

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Rowe View Post
    The name can be as flowery as you want, but without verifying who the person is and verifying their credentials it's meaningless.
    That what Lisa is saying: that "Certified Master Inspector" has no meaning and the consuming public DOES NOT CARE ENOUGH TO CHECK ON IT - You could call yourself "Certified Doctoral Inspector", "CDI", "Inspector PhD", "I PhD", "Certified Inspector PhD", "CI PhD", "Certified Inspector PhD", "CI PhD" - all of the forgoing are copyrighted by Jerry Peck, 2011 and earlier ... whenever it was I posted those the last time ...

    I'm not talking about a name to dupe the uneducated public,
    YOU aren't, but LISA is ...

    ... and Lisa has a point - the public, by and large, does not care enough to check out the credentials ... they are just looking for something which "sounds good" and "looks good".

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    "... and Lisa has a point - the public, by and large, does not care enough to check out the credentials ... they are just looking for something which "sounds good" and "looks good"."

    Thats it exactly

    ' correct a wise man and you gain a friend... correct a fool and he'll bloody your nose'.

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisa Endza View Post
    CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR is both (criminal background check, documented proof of 3 years in business, 1,000 inspections/continuing education hours). It is the highest professional designation an inspector can earn and it is a marketing tool that works like nothing else (consumers who know nothing about our industry instantly recognize it as the best of the best).
    1,000 inspections huh...? Still a newbie IMO.

    The MAZZA INSPECTION GROUP
    www.mazzainspections.com
    Level III Thermo-picture-taker-er...er

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Confused, James writes:
    In NC a CMI designation will not allow you to do an inspection so what good is it? Same as having a car with no drivers license...pretty uesless.
    It sells inspections for licensed inspectors who are CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTORS. How is that "useless?" Read Jerry's posts. The public doesn't research anything. CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR sounds good to their ears. That's all that matters to your bank account.

    Jerry writes:
    ... and Lisa has a point - the public, by and large, does not care enough to check out the credentials ... they are just looking for something which "sounds good" and "looks good".
    Now if someone starts posting some nonsense about CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR's requirements being too low or too high, or that we should raise the 1,000 to 2,000 or that we should require insurance, or anything else about the actual requirements, I'm going to scream. I have no idea if the requirements to be a CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR are too easy or too difficult or too little or too much and I don't care to know. All I know is that the professional designation sells inspection jobs, for reasons Jerry explained.

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Accreditation has to be more than drawing clients. It is my personal opinion that nachi is marketing, marketing, marketing. Not much meat on the table but lots and lots of marketing. Who needs the marketing from nachi? Other than nachi in order to stay in business, mostly those just starting. Then there are some more experienced inspectors who apparently just think it may look good to belong to an organization but either can't meet or don't wish to bother with real verifiable requirements of other organizations. Of course, there are the 30-minute wonder boys who want to draw in as many suckers as they can in a day.

    Note to Liza: I know you have a job to do but until you go into the home inspection business, actually inspect, report, and run the business, please leave your senseless rants about home inspector qualifications and certifications at the office. I don't believe anyone with any credibility, as a home inspector, who regularly visits this site considers a "marketing director" to have any qualifications to make credible claims regarding the subject nor will they miraculously see the nachi light and become converts.

    The above statements are expressed solely as my opinion and in all probability will conflict with someone else's.
    Stu, Fredericksburg VA

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisa Endza View Post
    Confused, James writes: It sells inspections for licensed inspectors who are CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTORS. How is that "useless?" Read Jerry's posts. The public doesn't research anything. CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR sounds good to their ears. That's all that matters to your bank account.

    Jerry writes:
    Now if someone starts posting some nonsense about CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR's requirements being too low or too high, or that we should raise the 1,000 to 2,000 or that we should require insurance, or anything else about the actual requirements, I'm going to scream. I have no idea if the requirements to be a CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR are too easy or too difficult or too little or too much and I don't care to know. All I know is that the professional designation sells inspection jobs, for reasons Jerry explained.
    I am not confused at all. Since no one will check anyway I can add any three letters after my name and accomplish the same thing. I think I will add the letters CMHI after my name and save the cost of your association membership.


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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Since no one will check anyway I can add any three letters after my name and accomplish the same thing. I think I will add the letters CMHI after my name
    You could. But there are several reasons you might want to get the real thing. CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR (written out) is much better than a few alphabet soup letters. Ask anyone outside of our industry. You'll see. Another reason not to make up qualifications is that if you ever get sued, the plaintiff's attorney is going to ask you what those letters mean and ask you how you earned them. There are many other reasons as well.

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Lisa you mention in your last post about the importance of "how you earn them". Let me mention from my own personal experience, I was magically bestowed that much touted title of "CMI". Yes and I at least know of another, and yet another.

    Let me also state this was gifted without ANY FORMAL PAPER WORK from me to validate or authenticate my background, let alone a criminal check, or sworn affidavit from a notary.

    In fact it was questioned a number of times right on the NACHI forum. So you see the forum even provided more evidence that questions the value of the CMI.

    It was a nice gift, however, it was one that I gladly relinquished. So I see the CMI as having many different levels of let's call it "credibility" in the home inspection industry.

    Perhaps some of the naysayers of the CMI have made some valid points about its (CMI referenced) questionable rigor and defendability. Or is it just a credential one can purchase, or automatically bestow upon an inspector.

    Take another example how within a matter of weeks the 14 CMI's in the Province of Alberta has grown to 35, which raises more questions and suspect concerns.

    On another note it also raises the question about why certain education providers have been favoured over those that have applied many times.

    You see the question once again comes back to marketability of credentials and the reality of how rigorous some really are, versus the apperance of actual rigor and authenticity required to achieve that "credential".

    Just my humble opinion and personal experience!
    I simply believe in earning my credentials.

    Regards, Claude


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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    It's all about the $$$$$$$$$$$
    I dont know why Lisa bothers defending this program.
    IMO, all associations are a joke. I've never booked an inspection just from an association in which I belonged. In the real world of HI, and when compaired to other forms of "qualifications", they mean little. At least here they dont.

    The MAZZA INSPECTION GROUP
    www.mazzainspections.com
    Level III Thermo-picture-taker-er...er

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Marc, all joking aside and I don't mean to offend you, but you are totally out of your mind. I think you might want to rethink your position after a review of this.

    Walk into the light.

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    On another note it also raises the question about why certain education providers have been favoured over those that have applied many times.
    Claude, I don't know why InterNACHI enjoys over 700 government approvals and accreditations. But I can guess.

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisa Endza View Post
    Marc, all joking aside and I don't mean to offend you, but you are totally out of your mind. I think you might want to rethink your position after a review of this.

    Walk into the light.
    What the heck is that? A list of discounts? See, you are such a Nachi Kool-aid drinker you cant get past the fact that someone disagrees with the Nachi way of life.
    I live inspections every day. Never in all my years have I EVER got an inspection from any association. NOT EVEN YOURS. Its all about the money.

    The MAZZA INSPECTION GROUP
    www.mazzainspections.com
    Level III Thermo-picture-taker-er...er

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    It isn't a list of "discounts." It is all the things that you absolutely need to get rich in the inspection business. You are either a businessman or you are not. If you just like doing inspections for fun, disregard my comments.

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisa Endza View Post
    It isn't a list of "discounts." It is all the things that you absolutely need to get rich in the inspection business. You are either a businessman or you are not. If you just like doing inspections for fun, disregard my comments.
    So you are implying that if you dont do those things on that list of discounts you wont be sucessful, of "rich" as you put it? Anyway...
    How do you explain my success or the success of so many in here who do not subscribe to the Nachi propaganda?

    The MAZZA INSPECTION GROUP
    www.mazzainspections.com
    Level III Thermo-picture-taker-er...er

  29. #29
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Thank goodess there is only one CMI guru within 50 miles of me. I was scared there for a minute!


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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Marc, if you are not a businessman, the absurd value proposition offered will be of no use to you whatsoever and it wouldn't make you any more money each year. You'd be wasting your $365 by joining InterNACHI.

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Apparently, business is slow at nachi headquarters.
    People, just ignore Lisa. Every time you punch back at her, it just makes her day. Make her sit in her cubicle by herself and give her nothing to do.

    The above statements are expressed solely as my opinion and in all probability will conflict with someone else's.
    Stu, Fredericksburg VA

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    GUYS ... YOU ARE NOT PAYING ATTENTION ...

    Lisa ... er ... Nick ... is selling MARKETING, and it has NOTHING TO DO WITH 'NACHI' or 'InNACHI' or whatever name it is currently, it has EVERYTHING TO DO WITH being a "Certified Master Inspector" - whether you are a 'master' inspector or not - THEY SAID YOU WERE.

    To keep it simple, try this exercise:
    - Home inspector John Doe advertises his business and says he is a member of ABCD, WZXZ, and MNOP inspection associations and has performed over 10,000 inspections.
    - Home inspector Billy Bob advertises his business and says he is a "Certified Master Inspector", and then in small print says he belongs to HIJK inspection association and that he has "earned" this designation by performing "over a thousand inspections".

    WHO do you think John Q., and Mary Jane, Public will call FIRST?

    A betting man would say they will call the "Certified Master Inspector" FIRST - THEY ARE HIS TO LOSE, only then do then call inspector John Doe.

    You guys keep talking about inspections and knowledge and qualifications, and experience and ... Lisa keeps saying "I have no idea if the requirements to be a CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR are too easy or too difficult or too little or too much and I don't care to know." - Lisa does not know, nor does she care, about knowledge and qualifications and experience and ... Lisa is talking about MARKETING ... MARKETING ... as though it was nothing more than the difference between Coke and Pepsi.

    Think about it before you reply.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Excellent post Jerry. Thanks for helping me explain it.

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisa Endza View Post
    Excellent post Jerry. Thanks for helping me explain it.
    The fallacy of that marketing that aspect is that, during good times, there will be many inspectors who only work with referral customers, and those referral customers will have NOTHING to do with anyone relying on a lame "Certified Master Inspector" gimmick.

    The people who would call those so-called 'master inspectors' would have crapped their panties when they heard how long I would be at a house and what I would charge, so them not calling me to start with simply ended up not wasting my time, and I was never at a lack for inspections to be done on my time and schedule.

    In times like these, though, with so many fewer people buying houses, and with so few inspectors who get enough referrals to survive and prosper on, that marketing is what may make the difference between staying in business and finding something else to do or going part time.

    I am in NO WAY saying that Lisa is correct in her actions, or that her ... Nick's ... marketing is the way to go, I am just simply explaining *why it works* for so many in this market.

    That marketing is simply treating all inspectors as being either Pepsi or Coke ... sooo ... which are you? Pepsi or Coke? (If you are partaking in that marketing scheme.)

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisa Endza View Post
    CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR is both (criminal background check, documented proof of 3 years in business, 1,000 inspections/continuing education hours). It is the highest professional designation an inspector can earn and it is a marketing tool that works like nothing else (consumers who know nothing about our industry instantly recognize it as the best of the best).
    I come back to this great site, almost three months later only to still the same marketing crap by a convicted person for de- frauding the public,[ by the state of Pa] still selling more crap and encourging honest inspectors to mislead and decieve the public on this site.

    Is it only me or does anybody else notice a boy named Lisa posts back to back post on this site and the nacho rag at the same time.
    Or I am let out of the loop and nobody told me nick and lisa live together and post on this site and the nacho rag within 2-3 min. often at 10-11- PM or sometimes 12 and 3AM
    .
    For what is worth nickos buy your on-line master certificiation DOES NOT require anyone to do 1,000 inspections.
    Truth is some one could do 0 inspections, pay nick $1000 and simply by fill out a form stating they tried to be a home inspector for three years and did 1000 hr continued nicko aproved CE, and bammo your a nicko approved certifed master home insp.

    Last edited by Dan Harris; 07-29-2011 at 08:21 PM.
    Phoenix AZ Resale Home, Mobile Home, New Home Warranty Inspections. ASHI Certified Inspector #206929 Arizona Certified Inspector # 38440
    www.inspectaz.com

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Even if that was true, and it isn't, how would that change the marketing power of being a CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR?

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisa Endza View Post
    Even if that was true, and it isn't, how would that change the marketing power of being a CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR?
    Honesty and integrity have to count for something in the business world.

    The above statements are expressed solely as my opinion and in all probability will conflict with someone else's.
    Stu, Fredericksburg VA

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR is "honestly" the highest professional designation one can earn in the inspection profession. Be honest with your clients and tell them you aren't a CMI. LOL!

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Lisa

    If you were to say that being a CMI or a member of iNACHI is a good business decision, because of the marketing, then you make a good point. However when you say that CMI are more qualified, have higher standards, well then, it would be laughable if it were not insulting.
    Why would anyone marketing their service be insulting to their market group?

    ' correct a wise man and you gain a friend... correct a fool and he'll bloody your nose'.

  40. #40
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisa Endza View Post
    CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR is "honestly" the highest professional designation one can earn in the inspection profession.
    Now that is a joke ... you WERE joking ... weren't you?

    That may be one of 'the most successful marketing ploys for home inspectors', BUT ...

    ... that IS NOT even remotely close to the highest "professional designation" ...

    I was explaining the marketing aspect of what you ... er ... Nick is doing, but that in NO WAY indicates any mark or level of "professionalism" or any "professional designation".

    YOU may think that is equivalent to the Queen's ceremony where she Knights someone, but YOU are only in a play and when the play is done you will watch Nick remove the costume where he was playing 'the Queen' and all those inspectors who thought they were 'Knighted' end up with a fancy title with no actual meaning.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  41. #41
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Jerry, the part of your forum post that listed the associations that have more difficult requirements than CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR is not appearing in your post for some reason. I'll ask Brian to look into the issue. But in the meantime, could you list them again for us?

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

  42. #42
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisa Endza View Post
    Jerry, the part of your forum post that listed the associations that have more difficult requirements than CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR is not appearing in your post for some reason. I'll ask Brian to look into the issue. But in the meantime, could you list them again for us?
    It's just marketing isn't it? That's what you stated previously. Heck, there's been snake oil marketing for centuries. Honesty, integrity, truth in advertising, professionalism have nothing to do with, Right? Fill out a form, pay Nick, get your certification. Makes it all right. I'll say this, Nick owes you a big bonus for blind loyalty.

    The above statements are expressed solely as my opinion and in all probability will conflict with someone else's.
    Stu, Fredericksburg VA

  43. #43
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Wrong. I said the reason to become a CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR is for marketing purposes only. If you are doing it because you hope that overnight, all the consumers in the world are going to change and tomorrow morning they are going to start researching actual qualifications before they choose an inspector, you are dreaming.

    Jerry can correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that is what he is saying in essence as well.

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

  44. #44
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisa Endza View Post
    Wrong. I said the reason to become a CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR is for marketing purposes only. If you are doing it because you hope that overnight, all the consumers in the world are going to change and tomorrow morning they are going to start researching actual qualifications before they choose an inspector, you are dreaming.

    Jerry can correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that is what he is saying in essence as well.
    One could claim to be have PhD in home inspection too. I really don't care. I have enough business to keep me as busy as I want to be and often more. Did I use marketing? Yes - through advertising, my website, and SEO. I didn't get into the business to "get rich". Anyone who does in the current housing market is not firing on all cylinders. You can make all the claims you want but reality is what it is. There is no open road to instant riches if you are honest. It takes hard work and dedication. An inspector can have all the titles and initials after their name they want but if they are totally useless "take the money and run" screw ups they won't last long anyway. If they paid nachi, Nick made his money and paid your salary. THAT is the bottom line here.

    The above statements are expressed solely as my opinion and in all probability will conflict with someone else's.
    Stu, Fredericksburg VA

  45. #45
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    You are incorrect again. I don't work for them and never have. I wish InterNACHI had something like CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR. From a marketing standpoint, it is a wrecking machine.

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

  46. #46
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisa Endza View Post
    Wrong. I said the reason to become a CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR is for marketing purposes only. If you are doing it because you hope that overnight, all the consumers in the world are going to change and tomorrow morning they are going to start researching actual qualifications before they choose an inspector, you are dreaming.

    Jerry can correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that is what he is saying in essence as well.
    As stated, I am correcting you ... that is NOT what you have been stating or bragging about or agreeing with me when I've been pointing out that it is all just "marketing".

    Lisa, you really do need to think when you read and post here and before and after agreeing with people and what they have been saying.

    I repeat: The above IS NOT what you have been saying. You have been saying that it is all marketing, and when I so clearly explained it was all just marketing - you said the I was right and told the others that it was just marketing.

    Your ... er ... Nick's ... CMI is JUST MARKETING - that is all it is.

    No one can blame you (as in the plural you and Nick) from trying to advance your marketing program, and no one can blame the others for recognizing snake oil when they see it.

    Here is a famous quote:
    You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time. Abraham Lincoln, (attributed)
    16th president of US (1809 - 1865)
    You (the plural use) fit that quote with: "You can fool some of the people all of the time, ... ", which is why you have your followers, and the rest of the quote is why some people came and left "... and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time."

    Nick had offers of help to actually make his association into one which actually meant something, but instead he stuck with his marketing approach - so be it - and that is what he now has.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  47. #47
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Nick had offers of help to actually make his association into one which actually meant something, but instead he stuck with his marketing approach - so be it - and that is what he now has.
    Countless government agencies and inspector licensing boards that have awarded InterNACHI over 700 approvals and accreditations for InterNACHI's free, online inspection courses disagree with you.

    Can you name an inspection association that has been awarded more approvals/accreditations?

    Jerry, even your own state of Florida's DBPR, DOFS, and CILB approved us, and it wasn't for our marketing programs.

    Last edited by Lisa Endza; 07-30-2011 at 05:30 PM.
    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

  48. #48
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisa Endza View Post
    Countless government agencies and inspector licensing boards that have awarded InterNACHI over 700 approvals and accreditations for InterNACHI's free, online inspection courses disagree with you.

    Can you name an inspection association that has been awarded more approvals/accreditations?

    Jerry, even your own state of Florida's DBPR, DOFS, and CILB approved us, and it wasn't for our marketing programs.

    Not much else to say in this discussion than repeat this - you have proven it true:

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    Here is a famous quote:
    You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time. Abraham Lincoln, (attributed)
    16th president of US (1809 - 1865)
    You (the plural use) fit that quote with: "You can fool some of the people all of the time, ... ", which is why you have your followers, and the rest of the quote is why some people came and left "... and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time."


    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  49. #49
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    "Please don't feed the animals!" We said PLEASE.


  50. #50
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisa Endza View Post
    Countless government agencies and inspector licensing boards that have awarded InterNACHI over 700 approvals and accreditations for InterNACHI's free, online inspection courses disagree with you.

    Can you name an inspection association that has been awarded more approvals/accreditations?

    Jerry, even your own state of Florida's DBPR, DOFS, and CILB approved us, and it wasn't for our marketing programs.
    Funny you should bring this up..

    Over the past few weeks, ASHI has been doing a marketing study and it seems that over the past 10 years ASHI National has had over 3,000 individual CE programs approved by the various states for CE. Then we have the individual chapters who have almost double that number, so I would say that Inachi is not the only organization providing CE for their members.

    Scott Patterson, ACI
    Spring Hill, TN
    www.traceinspections.com

  51. #51
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Well if you're counting merely hosting, I suppose the Marriot Hotel chain has us all beat.

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

  52. #52
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    (There is a fraction that would like to develop a tiered membership where in members who complete a series of tasks are granted a designation that they and the association can market to say that these members have met a higher standard and are more worthy.)

    That is a crock and is self serving for those who are on the board and have allot of free time on there hands to acquire all that is asked and those who have no work. It is hard enough for those of us who work 12 to 16 hrs aday to keep up with the associations let alone adding more meaningless task to acquire a meaningless name.

    Anyone with enough free time on there hands can achieve the proposed goals. Those of us who have a life and work long days may not but the lesser gets a certificate of achievement in a bullshit, worthless, snake oil, deceive the public name.

    NCLHIA should focus on how to benefit all not just a few of the members. If it goes through I am sure many will leave and I will be one of them.

    Mike Schulz License 393
    Affordable Home Inspections
    www.houseinspections.com

  53. #53
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Patterson View Post
    Who knows if the alphabet soup that folks use behind their names attracts business. Like Bruce, I work in a licensed environment and I have found that folks call me or find me most of the time via a past client referral or from my website. I can attribute about 10-15 inspections a year that come directly from the ASHI website.

    ASHI's highest membership level is the ACI (ASHI Certified Inspector). ASHI is the only home inspector organization that has had their certification process verified and approved by a third party organization. No other home inspector organization has been able to accomplish this; I belive one other has attempted but was unable to accomplish it. It took ASHI about 3 years to acquire approval of their certification process through the NCCA.

    Most if not all professional certifications are self serving and are only recognized within that organization or profession.
    A couple of Canadian organizations, including the NHICC and CAHPI Atlantic, have also applied for review and accreditation from NCCA. I believe that third-party approval and accreditation provides validity to an organization and their credential. Anything less, as you say, Scott, is merely self-serving and not actually worth the paper they are written on.

    I'm also not sure if the NCCA carries as much weight in Canada because after all, it is American. There are a couple Canadian accrediting agencies but their requirements are very lofty and expensive.

    I'm sure that when the NHICC receives its approval, (and it is very close) the critics will downplay its importance because it is American.

    Bill Mullen

    Bill Mullen


  54. #54
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Lisa

    You continually go in circles.

    Nick Gromicko has repeatedly stated that CMI is nothing but a marketing tool. He has given the title away numerous times with no conditions attached, no background checks, no affidavits! That is false marketing and fraudulent, and deceptive.

    Even Nick gave himself a CMI and we know he is not even a seasoned inspector regardless what you are told to say and we can't take Nicks word for it as he has a credibility problem!

    You offer no stats to back up any claims whatsoever! This is a repetitive theme with you as Nachi spokesperson. And contrary to your oft stated mantra that you know nothing about CMI or how it works, if that is the case why are you defending it?

    The accreditation is a false credential. A one time fee where the money is shared amongst the cronies on the BOD.

    Some of the so-called schools listed on the CMI site are not even active.

    And as I have repeated numerous times no one in Canada has had their affidavits verified, nor have police background checks been completed.

    Who is being deceptive and marketing falsities, you along with your boss, thats who!

    Even your own members question the CMI designation, that is very telling.

    I am warning everyone I can in my area to avoid anyone with CMI, let alone a Nachi member where anyone can obtain an online accreditation.

    You're a paid employee, and are paid to defend the organization at all costs. This leads me to wonder about your own scruples.

    Last edited by Raymond Wand; 07-17-2012 at 05:51 AM.

  55. #55
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Quote Originally Posted by Raymond Wand View Post
    Lisa

    You continually go in circles.

    Nick Gromicko has repeatedly stated that CMI is nothing but a marketing tool. He has given the title away numerous times with no conditions attached, no background checks, no affidavits! That is false marketing and fraudulent, and deceptive.

    Even Nick gave himself a CMI and we know he is not even a seasoned inspector regardless what you are told to say and we can't take Nicks word for it as he has a credibility problem!

    You offer no stats to back up any claims whatsoever! This is a repetitive theme with you as Nachi spokesperson. And contrary to your oft stated mantra that you know nothing about CMI or how it works, if that is the case why are you defending it?

    The accreditation is a false credential. A one time fee where the money is shared amongst the cronies on the BOD.

    Some of the so-called schools listed on the CMI site are not even active.

    And as I have repeated numerous times no one in Canada has had their affidavits verified, nor have police background checks been completed.

    Who is being deceptive and marketing falsities, you along with your boss, thats who!

    Even your own members question the CMI designation, that is very telling.

    I am warning everyone I can in my area to avoid anyone with CMI, let alone a Nachi member where anyone can obtain an online accreditation.

    You're a paid employee, and are paid to defend the organization at all costs. This leads me to wonder about your own scruples.
    She would do well in Washington, D.C.

    The above statements are expressed solely as my opinion and in all probability will conflict with someone else's.
    Stu, Fredericksburg VA

  56. #56
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Ray. The most recent Province to adopt licensing, Alberta, grandfathered all CMIs. Nick has been going back and forth to Ontario to assure CMIs are grandfathered again in Ontario when Ontario adopts licensing next year.

    I know, it hurts.

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

  57. #57
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Lisa

    I have contacts in government and licencing is not being introduced. There is chance of an election in Ontario due to the poor performance and questionable spending by the current government.

    CMI is a false credential and I am pleased to see you engaging as spokesperson for your boss who could care less about public protection and more interested in lining his and his goons pockets.

    But then again you like your leader have no credibility, like so many in your half arse outfit you are being duped.


  58. #58
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    There is chance of an election in Ontario due to the poor performance and questionable spending by the current government.
    Cry about CMI being used for grandfathering, cry about InterNACHI which now has approvals and operations all over the world, cry about your government.

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

  59. #59
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Lisa

    And you have no scruples presenting falsities about licencing in the hopes of gaining CMI's to jump on board and pay a meaningless $1000.

    Don't preach to me about your ethics, Nicks, the ESOP and all the other baloney Nick and you are good at spreading.

    At the very least buy a manure spreader less your jaw gets tired.


  60. #60
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    I can imagine how you are going to be crying when all the CMIs in Ontario are grandfathered like they were in Alberta, and you have to go to school.

    InterNACHI, 65 countries, 235,000 page website, 905,000 post message board, 1,200 government approvals.

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

  61. #61
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    More baloney. Stats mean nothing much like CMI.

    Per chance is Nick paying you per word regardless if its truthful or not?

    Thanks for nothing.


  62. #62
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    More baloney. Stats mean nothing
    That's why I chose to post four verifiable stats.

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

  63. #63
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    There you go again Lisa ... your verifiable stats are not verifiable, they are compiled by your employer, not an independent third body. Your message is tiresome and holds no validity other than you thinking it does.

    Secondly a message board, website and educational approvals are meaningless and do not relate to a meaningless title. And to top it off then Nick tries to pass off that a trademark registry as an endorsement which is more bull.

    Heck even your own senior members on your fabled message board think CMI is a joke, you had better go punish them for having the balls to speak up and tell the truth.

    Nice try skirting the facts from fiction.




  64. #64
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisa Endza View Post
    I can imagine how you are going to be crying when all the CMIs in Ontario are grandfathered like they were in Alberta, and you have to go to school.

    InterNACHI, 65 countries, 235,000 page website, 905,000 post message board, 1,200 government approvals.
    Raymond is so right when he denounces the CMI credential. Sure enough the CMI people were grandfathered in Alberta, but this was in a climate where the government did not want to put anyone out of business, and the poor bureaucrats were confronted by a person from Colorado who could convince them black was white. More interesting is that within two months the number of CMI's in Alberta miraculously jumped from 14 when licensing was announced to 68. All it took was $ 1,000 from each, so Nick cleared a cool $ 50,000 +. Two of these 'Masters' previously had applied to another approved organization (and were advised about their shortcomings) and their applications showed they had been in business for less than one year and one had fewer than 50 inspections under his belt........Nonetheless, the NACHI machine immediately annointed them both Certified Masters. (Ka-Ching !!!)

    What the Canadian industry needs is an independent organization to offer a strong, common standard and make sure people have to meet the standards. I'm not thinking about any group now doing certifications. I'm thinking about a third party, such as AAAC or the Standards Council of Canada. That would take it out of the hands of individuals who stand to profit from the process and would place the industry in a much more credible position.
    However, too many people inthe industry would object for this to ever become a reality.

    Last edited by Bill Mullen; 07-17-2012 at 01:37 PM.

  65. #65
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    Default Re: Association Accreditations

    That sounds reasonable Bill. There is one little problem with your thinking though. You are grandfathering regulation, licensing legislation, Trademark awards, and 1,200 government approvals too late.

    It's an InterNACHI world, and you're living in it.

    Ontario is next.

    Lisa Endza
    Director of Communication
    InterNACHI

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