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  1. #1
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    Default Home inspection hidden camera

    I think we need a few sting operations in Ontario to catch the associations which are suppose to be policing their members but have failed miserably in culling those who misrepresent their credentials.

    The public has no protection from unscrupulous associations.

    Home inspection hidden camera | Global News Video

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  2. #2
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    Default Re: Home inspection hidden camera

    Quote Originally Posted by Raymond Wand View Post
    I think we need a few sting operations in Ontario to catch the associations which are suppose to be policing their members but have failed miserably in culling those who misrepresent their credentials.

    The public has no protection from unscrupulous associations.

    Home inspection hidden camera | Global News Video
    What is your recommendation?You have been around a long time? what have you done to to cull those who misrepresent their credentials.


  3. #3
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    Default Re: Home inspection hidden camera

    Its being worked on by the government, its called licencing.

    Also in BC the government publishes convictions on its Consumer Website of inspectors who have had a hearing and resultant action.

    RECO is set up the same way. Realtors are given a hearing and the results published on RECO's website.


  4. #4
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    Default Re: Home inspection hidden camera

    Mr Wand,licening in BC did not help a couple,who bought a home did it?
    so why do you think it makes any difference here or any were
    No one can control how an inspector runs their business,no matter how many laws or controls are in place,need I remind you of your own situation,probablly not.
    Any way,unless some one other than u or I come up with a new suggestion or solution,nothing will change.


  5. #5
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    Default Re: Home inspection hidden camera

    No one can control how an inspector runs their business,no matter how many laws or controls are in place, need I remind you of your own situation,probablly not.
    Really?

    So you support inspectors who misrepresent themselves as evidenced in the Global News piece?


  6. #6
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    Default Re: Home inspection hidden camera

    I never said that,but you like to twist things to suit your cause,so if you say it ,that must be true.
    I will not post any more on this subject,as you have all the answers
    best wishes


  7. #7
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    Default Re: Home inspection hidden camera

    Great! I didn't think you would be able to explain, given your hypocrisy.


  8. #8
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    Default Re: Home inspection hidden camera

    Heck, if they aren't bothering to get licensed, they probably don't bother to join any association.

    I just did a TV interview (to run sometime in May) about the licensing effort here. There is no profession, trade, or occupation where licensing has eliminated the bad characters. Licensing is an aspirin for the public to feel good about hiring a professional without doing one single thing to make sure that "professional" is actually qualified. The TV reporter raised her eyebrows when I said that, so I asked her if licensing, lots of hard schooling and a really hard license test had made every doctor great. She said, "Oh, yeah, I see what you mean".

    The cure for this has not changed even where licensing exists. The consumer should educate himself/herself about the individual professional that they are considering hiring. Of course, I have been as guilty as anyone about hiring professionals without vetting them. They were all licensed and most were pretty good, and a few weren't. My track record is better with the ones I bothered to vet.

    The funny thing about the video is that we have no idea if the unlicensed HIs were any good. All we know for sure is that they were unlicensed.

    If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Home inspection hidden camera

    This news article is not about those who are licenced this is about those who will practice home inspections outside of the enacting legislation due to ignorance, or just out-right-fraud.


  10. #10
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    Default Re: Home inspection hidden camera

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Wood View Post
    Then check this one out Lon referred by the Real Estate Agent.
    Again the 8 out of 10 trick.
    Global TV Home Inspection Hidden Camera Report Part 2 of 3 - Video Dailymotion
    We could get into some very lengthy essays on this topic. Good, even great, inspectors can miss things. However, how in the world anyone can inspect a house of any size in one hour is beyond me. I spent four hours in a modest home yesterday. (Three hours is more normal)

    As for the inspector referred by the agent, we need to know more about their relationship before making a conclusion. Great agents always refer home inspectors that they believe will do a great inspection.

    And regardless, licensing doesn't prevent crummy inspectors from passing a test and hanging their license shingle.

    And finally, Nick Gromicko has built an amazing business, but he often takes shots from the hip when he should spend another second to take aim. His rebuke to the reporter sure didn't play well in the story. His drunk driver analogy is not the one that I would have chosen to make his point, but his point is still true.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Raymond Wand View Post
    This news article is not about those who are licenced this is about those who will practice home inspections outside of the enacting legislation due to ignorance, or just out-right-fraud.
    Yes, but are the associations at fault. Do we have any evidence that these guys belonged to any associations?

    If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Home inspection hidden camera

    Lon

    I don't know if these two particular individuals belong to any association. However I do know that we have had a few home inspectors claim to be P.Eng. and who belong to a home inspector association(s).

    I also know there have been inspectors promoting they are members of an association when they are not. And I would be suspicious that some of these reprobates could very likely belong to associations, but either haven't pass the muster or dropped out of the associations when licencing came about.

    Having said that in Ontario we have a long way to go in protecting the consumer because a few associations have tendency to talk the talk but don't walk the walk when it comes to consumer protection as its home inspectors overseeing themselves with no outside oversight.

    I only know of one case where an association took action in Ontario with a former member of an association who continued to use designations legally protected by an act of provincial parliament. And even then that association when notified of the breach and misuse of its logos and designation did not want to act. The association only became involved when the discipline chair laid a private complaint before a justice of the peace. Only then did the association commit financial resources and its lawyer to prosecuting.

    Unfortunately the same scenario is playing out in Ontario and its very evident the association is not interested in pursuing the offending parties because they have no money to do so.


  12. #12
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    Default Re: Home inspection hidden camera

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Wood View Post
    Lon that is certainly true however I would caution the Real Estate Agent of such an action. It should be the Clients job to search for the best Inspector which is easy to do. Again it is the one with the most current Education background along with years of experience added to this a good name in town.
    To have a Real Estate Agent refer an Inspector is just plain stupid because the Client has no Idea what type of Agent they are.
    You could be a smooth talker with a stunning personality added special advertizing and be a slime bag all at the same time.
    Like I have said before I have my Group but I don't tell Clients ever who to use. However if they are on my LinkedIn list they are better than the others in IMO.
    A few weeks ago, I attended a class taught by one of the top real estate attorneys in Colorado. His authorship is all over our real estate contract and laws. He used to say that agents should never refer any expert, lender, etc to anyone. But if an agent did, then they should use the "rule of three". Always give out at least three names.

    BUT, at this class, he is modifying his recommendation (I might add, changing it toward my argument). He said that clients are paying real estate agents a pile of money to do more than open the front door of a house. Clients have expectations of getting expert opinion and advice from an agent. And one of those reasonable expectations is to receive quality referrals based on the agent's experience and knowledge. Agents who practice CYA by never referring any expert to their clients, could run into trouble if a client said, "What the hell did you do for me after you opened the door? You left me to try to find a good lender, a good inspector, a good title company, a good surveyor, etc when I know nothing about these things and ended up with a crummy inspector."

    Your point about a bad character agent is valid, but an agent who leaves a client to his/her own devices to find qualified experts, could find themselves doing some explaining about why they didn't offer guidance to them. My advice to Joe and Sue Client is to take the advice from your agent, friends, etc, and do some homework before deciding, but then my advice to those folks, is to do that homework before selecting the real estate agent, too.

    The world will always be a "buyer beware" world.

    If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Home inspection hidden camera

    Quote Originally Posted by Raymond Wand View Post
    Lon
    I only know of one case where an association took action in Ontario with a former member of an association who continued to use designations legally protected by an act of provincial parliament. And even then that association when notified of the breach and misuse of its logos and designation did not want to act. The association only became involved when the discipline chair laid a private complaint before a justice of the peace. Only then did the association commit financial resources and its lawyer to prosecuting.

    Unfortunately the same scenario is playing out in Ontario and its very evident the association is not interested in pursuing the offending parties because they have no money to do so.
    Last month, our chapter president caught a guy advertising that he was a NAHI member (I think he was advertising membership in all three associations). Anyway, our chapter president sent him a "cease and desist" but of course, if the guy is a crummy inspector, we can't do anything more to him. That'll take a court when he gets sued by some wronged customer.

    For any association or licensing board to do "stings" or other enforcement, they need more money and that means higher fees and if there is one thing that HIs hate.......it's higher fees.

    If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Home inspection hidden camera

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Wood View Post
    To have a Real Estate Agent refer an Inspector is just plain stupid because the Client has no Idea what type of Agent they are.
    You could be a smooth talker with a stunning personality added special advertizing and be a slime bag all at the same time.
    I always have my clients attend the entire inspection. During this time I always talk with them, find out what they do for a living, how they found me, how they found their agent. What I've noticed through the years is this:

    Those clients who found their agent through personal referrals...friends, family members, co-workers etc typically are referred to me by the agent for the inspection.

    Those clients who found their agent by internet searches, walking into or calling an office and being assigned an agent, or meeting an agent during an open house generally find me through an internet search.

    I see more questionable ethics by agents in the second group than in the personal referral group. Just my experience.

    What I tell people is this; If you'd trust your agents to babysit your kids overnight, then trust them with their referrals.

    MinnesotaHomeInspectors.com
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  15. #15
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    Default Re: Home inspection hidden camera

    Quote Originally Posted by Lon Henderson View Post
    Last month, our chapter president caught a guy advertising that he was a NAHI member (I think he was advertising membership in all three associations). Anyway, our chapter president sent him a "cease and desist" but of course, if the guy is a crummy inspector, we can't do anything more to him. That'll take a court when he gets sued by some wronged customer.

    For any association or licensing board to do "stings" or other enforcement, they need more money and that means higher fees and if there is one thing that HIs hate.......it's higher fees.
    So, your "chapter president" caught a guy.

    And what pray tell does your chapter president feel he has authority over who for what.

    Licensing boards may pull authority over something like that but your "chapter president"?

    Just saying.

    There are some good things brought on by licensing. We may not like it here much but most don't mind and do believe there is some very good that comes out of it.

    To have your chapter president call anyone for anything???? It might as well have been my mother calling that passed away many years ago. Has no weight.


  16. #16
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    Default Re: Home inspection hidden camera

    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Menelly View Post
    So, your "chapter president" caught a guy.

    And what pray tell does your chapter president feel he has authority over who for what.


    To have your chapter president call anyone for anything???? It might as well have been my mother calling that passed away many years ago. Has no weight.
    Maybe..........the association might be able to sue the guy for misrepresenting himself, but I don't know if even that could stop him under current Colorado law.

    As it turned out, the guy dropped the NAHI designation from his advertising.

    As for your mother, I can't know what she could have done, but I'm pretty sure the guy would have bailed from this business, this city and probably the state if my mother had gotten after him.

    If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.

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