As someone just joining the business and trying to decide on joing an association (or not) I have come to this conclusion - <Inter>NACHI seems to be more of a "marketing" and sales organization> I haven't quite figured out what they're selling ***snif, snif, I smell snake oil***, but it costs $289 and then a bunch of stuff is free.
The other two, from what I've seen here, (Not seeing the other message boards is kind of a negative to not know the types of people or leadership an org has), really don't like NACHI.

Can a member of each ORG answer this -
How is the leadership at a national level decided? Appointed, Elected or Birthright?
How often are the leaders (Pres, VP, Treas) changed?

Also, I'm leaning against <inter>NACHI for alot of reasons, but one that others may find interesting is here
Real Estate Agents | Move In Certified

I wont ruin all of the details, but here are a couple things I found interesting about having <inter>NACHI do a seller inspection...
This was in the "agents" section (emphaisis is mine)

Something about recommening certified <inter?>NACHI inspectors instead of "being at the mercy of buyer's choices in inspectors".
God forbid the sellers >>edit: buyers<<get to choose their own inspector

Sellers "assisting" inspectors during the inspections.
Gee, i hope they at least took <inter>NACHI's on-line exam first. Or perhaps they can explain how the double tap is ok because its been that way for 15 years, no need to report it...thank for the assistance

And if it does end up in your report....
"Sellers can have inspectors correct any misstatements in the reports before they are generated."
Hell, why don't they just have the sellers do the inspection AND the report, take the 15 mins for an online exam and pay NACHI rather than an inspector?

Don't get me wrong, I think sellers inspections are a GREAT idea, I just don't need the homeowners "help" with an inspection or report.
Note that this was in the page aimed at getting Agents bouhgt-in.

Just my five bucks-
Jimmy

Jimmy,

For a first-time poster you sure know how to stir things up.

__________________
"Baseball is like church. Many attend but few understand." Leo Durocher
Bruce Breedlove
www.avaloninspection.com

Bruce, you took the words right out of my mouth....

What the hell, I'll play along for a bit....

My best advice is to research them all and decide what you like the best. If you're in a state with good organizations there is a good chance you'll get more bang for your buck (both spent from your pocket and spent in time) hanging around there.

fwiw..... my company has been around my area for a long time and used to have pretty strong ties with one you mention above. At the end of the year out of more than 1,000 inspections I could count on one hand the number of inspections that came from the national association. Since I severed ties a few years ago we haven't noticed it a bit.

As best I can tell, especially from reading this board lately, the only thing a national association gives you is an alliance with a bunch of war mongering clowns. I sure don't see what any of this has to do with home inspections.

Best of luck in your decision...... it's a great industry and great way to make a living.

My thoughts as well. You aren't any relation to Scott P. are you?

In my opinion, they are all nothing more than marketing tools. You can go to all of their meetings and conferences and learn things, but you need not be a member. The choice is up to you. However, it appears as though you have already ruled out one org.

__________________
Eric Van De Ven Magnum Inspections Inc. (954) 340-6615
www.magnuminspections.com
I still get paid to be suspicious when I got nothing to be suspicious about!

I'll bite.
ASHI - Elected once a year.

[quote=Matt Fellman;16525]
As best I can tell, especially from reading this board lately, the only thing a national association gives you is an alliance with a bunch of war mongering clowns. I sure don't see what any of this has to do with home inspections.
[quote]

That's my point exactly! I don't know if I want to attach my name to any ORG at this point. I am trying to get some info about NAHI and ASHI, since the public part of NACHI's board has turned me off from joining them. I am concerned about the "war" between NACHI/NAHI.

I also wonder if ther is REAL value in joiing ANY org, if you can still attend meetings/functions/seminars. Perhaps I'll atend some functions from each before joining.

Thanks for the replys. I'm not sure if "A fist time poster stiring the pot" is a compliment or not, but I'll take it as one.

Jim, it all depends on your area and what or who has the largest presence. You need to look at the local chapters and what they do or don't do. Go to a chapter meeting or two before you decide. The chapters are the backbone of any HI orginization.

If you want to see some of what ASHI does go to the ASHI Reporters website and look at the back issues, August 2007 | ASHI Reporter

A ton of information can be found as well as an inside view into ASHI.

__________________
Scott Patterson
Spring Hill, TN
http://www.traceinspections.com

When I started in October 2001, I joined CREIA (California), ASHI, AAHI, NAHI, SPREI, HIF, and FREA. My purpose in joining them was to get access to their member message boards, member newsletters, etc., so that I could determine what they could do for me as a newbie home inspector (albeit with 25 years of experience in all aspects of real estate in 7 states) and what I could do for them. I did not know about NACHI at that time.

After the first year, I determined that none of them were interested in helping newbie inspectors succeed, which is kind of odd because if those newbies don't succeed, then there goes their membership fees. None of them were interested in volunteers, especially newbie volunteers, helping out, which also is kind of strange for trade associations. Consequently, I quit all of them.

After six months of being trade association-less, I found the NACHI bashing here at inspectionnews.com and, being one to try it before bashing it, I tried it. I joined on March 23, 2003, and have been a member every since. They not only are interested in the success of newbies, but they do everything they can to help those newbies succeed. Not only that, but they were only too happy to have volunteers help, and they weren't picky about where those volunteers helped. My expertise is marketing, so I will freely admit that I fit in well at NACHI.

In six years, I have had 13 people ask me if I were a member of CREIA or ASHI. I booked all 13 because I know marketing and how to sell myself, my company, and my services. I'm currently working on all sorts of new benefits to help NACHI members succeed.

One difference I definitely noted between the CREIA, ASHI, and NACHI message boards is that if I posted a question, CREIA took forever to reply, if at all. ASHI only took a couple of days to reply, if at all. NACHI had dozens of replies within a couple of days. I don't know whether or not it was because the first two had no interest in helping a newbie.

So now I'm able to tell my Clients that since I don't know everything there is to know about real estate, if something puzzles me, I can take a picture, post it on the NACHI Message Board, and have answers within minutes. Newbies over at NACHI get the same respect. I don't know if CREIA and ASHI have changed in the five years since I left, but my conversations at the San Diego CREIA/ASHI dinner meetings indicate that it has not.

If a prospective Client inquires now, I simply tell them that CREIA has about 1,200 members, ASHI has, well, who knows? It seems it's a closely guarded secret, but current estimates range from 3,200 to 6,400. NACHI's membership isn't secret, but at any one monent it seems to range between 8,000 and 10,000 (there's a membership cap of 10,000) based on whose dropped out in the slow market, who is late on paying dues, etc.

Nonetheless, what one puts into an organization typically will reflect what one gets out of an organization. Unfortunately, some organizations don't want any input, especially input that might upset the old timers' status quo. Notwithstanding that, the best way to determine what an organization has to offer, and what one can contribute, is to join it. Contrary to what ASHI and CREIA might want, there is no branding in this industry. I live in an area where there are a lot of CREIA and ASHI inspectors, but in the five years since I left those two, my business seems to be more a direct result of my marketing than inclusion on any list of CREIA or ASHI (or NACHI) inspectors.

__________________
www.russel-ray.com
www.marketing-and-business.com
www.MyWiseOldGrandmother.com

Good post Russell

My advice is to join at least one association, the most important thing is the message board due to the education. If anyone thinks they already know enough they are delusional. Nachi's board has a lot for free but the members only has more technical posts than you might think.

Nachi is not all new inspectors anymore, tons of information that I have not seen on other message boards.

To that end, I might suggest that you also do as much digging as possible to find information and help previously offered by Russel Ray to newer (and veteran) inspectors with regards to marketing. (this may only be available on teh NACHI member's only section).

I am an interNACHI member, but have found their "benefits" to be more hype and BS than anything useful. The more I learned about the business of Home Inspections, the less impressed I have become by interNACHI's list of benefits, and am particularly dubious of those they have placed in unelected leadership positions. The shining exception has been the advice and info offered by RR.

I have implemented and tinkered with dozens of his ideas and suggestions, and if I ever get time or get fully organized (can't quite ever seem to get the time to flly catch up), I have dozens of others that I would love to try or toy with.

More than anything else in the industry, from newbie to 4 year verteran witha sucessful business, RR's marketing wisdom and other advice has been the major element I credit with my success. I have drive and creativity, and a pretty good background for this, but RR put me on the fast track to success and helped me get the most out of my abilities.

If he had his own association, I would join it (and have - check out his Marketing forum). He is the sole remaining reason I am an interNACHI member.

Russell:

Scott is right at least to a very large degree. The local groups make all the difference. In the Dallas/Fort Worth area the pickings are slim indeed. The local ASHI group consists of a small rag-tag dictatorship led by a well-meaning but clueless oldtimer (hi, Jim). There is no NAHI group of which I am aware. The NACHI group appears, from their emails to me, to be large and active. I've never attended so I'm only guessing. A bit of the lone wolf's blood in me, you know.

However, though I belong to all three of these national organizations, I have never to my knowledge received an inspection lead from the NACHI website. Plenty from ASHI and NAHI, but none from InterNewbie.

As for CREIA and FREA, unless you're in California or longing to buy insurance, I'd take a pass. There are a plethora of others out there. Some who dance with agents and some who won't. Some have gotta' be engineers and some don't.

Therein lies the rub. Too many cooks in this kitchen have spoiled the soup.

If I were just starting out and could only afford to belong to one group, I do believe I would join InterNewbie (NACHI).

Aaron

Sorry I posted that last replay to the wrong guy . .

While I'm at it though I might correct that statement a bit. Though I have never received a known lead from NACHI, I just can't turn off the tap that is sending the calls coming from the Certified Master Inspector program . . .
they just keep rolling in.

Aaron

Hey, Aaron.

I didn't disagree with Scott. In fact, I think I agreed by stating that the best way to find out about an organization is to join it. In some cases there are no local chapters. That could be an influencing factor. In my case, one of the problems that I had with CREIA and ASHI is that I desperately wanted to volunteer, for two reasons:

(1) I simply like to volunteer. I've been a volunteer all my life--Circle K in high school, Alpha Phi Omega National Service Fraternity at Texas A&M University, SPCA volunteer (especially enjoy rescuing pets and wildlife after wildfires), Red Cross, Muscular Dystrophy Association, Special Olympics, American Heart Association, and many more.

(2) In analyzing the continuing education credits (CEC), I determined that I could get some of those credits by volunteering at events. As a newbie trying to create a viable and profitable business, and with the ASHI convention being in Orlando, or New Orleans, or some other three-time-zones-away-location, I could not afford to have to get CECs at the end of the year by basically shutting down my company for a three-day convention with two days travel time to and fro. And with the liability that I have in California (4 years direct, 18 months discovery, 5½ years absolute total), I was about to go off and leave my employees on their own; I proof every document or communication that goes out of this office. Consequently, I wanted the convention to be a desired event rather than a have-to event. That was impossible unless one volunteered or was elected an officer. A newbie elected officer? As my wise ol' grandmother said, "Yeah, right." However, since I was never called on to volunteer, the conventions became a "have to go" event in order to get all my CEC's for the year. I could not accept that. Shutting down a business for five days was unacceptable; still is.

The final straw, though, was when RE/MAX had their state convention here in San Diego in January 2002. I volunteered to work the CREIA/ASHI booth all three days, particularly during hours that typically are difficult to fill, i.e., early morning and late evening. Nada. No call to arms. No nothing. Then, at the February 2002 CREIA/ASHI dinner meeting, the two presidents got up and spent 30 minutes chastising us because "the same people volunteer time and time again." Huh? That was the end for me. I had spent seven months volunteering, never to be called but then to be chastised. I never went to another CREIA/ASHI dinner meeting until April 2003, and I do go fairly regularly now so that I can keep track of how many of my competitors are exiting the industry.

NACHI allowed me to spend my days and weekends running my business, and my midnight hours (about 90% of my NACHI posts are done between the hours of midnight and 6:00 a.m.) posting helpful information for other NACHI members. Granted, many people here at inspectionnews.com don't like the fact that NACHI verily is an Internet organization. That, of course, is what attracted me to it because, after my first year, I had already determined that there is no branding in this industry, contrary to what CREIA and ASHI might say or want. I have one office that "only uses CREIA inspectors." Well, that's their official position, anyway. All seven of the Realtors use me for pre-listing inspections and buyer inspections. I even do WALK inspections, MAINTENANCE inspections, and WARRANTY inspections for their Clients. They are by far the most customer-service-oriented business I've ever had the pleasure of working with.

Anyway, yes, indeed, the best way to determine whether or not one fits in with an organization is to join it. Of course, that means spending money on membership dues, CECs, etc., and many home inspectors, especially newbies, don't have all that money available.

__________________
www.russel-ray.com
www.marketing-and-business.com
www.MyWiseOldGrandmother.com

Certainly not, since I'm still over there, as are Joe Hagarty and many, many others. Of course, I've moved on from being a mere "home inspector" to having greater flexibility as a "property consultant."

__________________
www.russel-ray.com
www.marketing-and-business.com
www.MyWiseOldGrandmother.com

Jimmy,

NACHI members do not elect the directors. They elect a members advisory board and the board does listen to them. There are a lot of good reasons why this type of business model can have it's advantages over members electing the board.

I won't get into all of them but one is that often in organizations, factions can (and do) tip the direction of the organization for the wrong reasons. Members often don't even know what the guy that they are electing is going to do.

Just an observation but as a NACHI member I have learned how much real hatred there is among certain members of ASHI and NAHI (and others) directed towards NACHI and it's members.

An elected board at NAHI decided to contract with an outside company that apparently takes over 2/3 of the membership dues to pay 4 staff members, one of which (the ED) is part owner of that outside firm. This could now turn out to be a formula for disaster since it could jeopardize their non-profit status. That same elected board decided to spend it's members money to pursue a lawsuit against NACHI based on little to no evidence to back up their claims. That is just one example.

Now, if you take the hatred that some other organizations members have and the desire they have to do harm to NACHI and its members, just guess what would happen if NACHI members elected its board. Since most organizations are run by a few and the majority of members in an organization do not usually vote, it would take too long for some of the some people to join, lay low and then take the organization apart from within.

Whether you believe it or not, I think you get my point. All the debate over exams and experience and education still boils down to the fact that none of the members of any one of the 3 organizations are more likely to perform a bad inspection or make mistakes than the other. Statistics will bear that out.

As to the seller inspection program, nobody is suggesting that the inspector do less of an inspection because the seller says they never had a problem. There are plenty of times with a buyers inspection that it is recommended that the buyer consult the seller regarding the history of some issue or another. During a seller inspection it would make perfect sense to get (and verify) that information for the purposes of a more complete report.

It would be a good thing for inspectors for agents to buy into the seller (or pre-listing) inspection concept. Done right it could save everyone a lot of grief and limit the damages when an inspector is in error.

Obviously you are going to sell the best points to each party to encourage pre-listing inspections. This is not an invitation for anyone to manipulate the inspection in anyone's favor.

I say that if someone can afford to be a member of both ASHI and NACHI go for it. In licensed states it may not be worthwhile to join ASHI but that depends on other factors as well. NACHI has a lot of member benefits. NACHI is big on marketing, benefits and education. Some benefits are useless and some are worth more than the annual dues. They try to keep the education affordable as there are enough people out there looking to cash in on inspectors. As with any organization, you also get what you put into it.

One guy might not find enough useful benefits while another will find enough to pay for his dues many times over. I recommend a good look at ASHI and NACHI and see what will give you the most bang for the buck since credentials are less and less a factor to the public.

I won't recommend NAHI. It appears that there business practices are questionable. There are less than 1800 members nationwide (as of last month) so unless you happen to be in a state with big numbers there may not be much for you on the ground.

Good luck on your choices.

__________________
David Nice
http://www.nationalcertified.com
National Certified Inspection Services, Inc.Wauwatosa, WI

MoveInCertified.com now reads on the sellers page:

"The seller can choose a certified NACHI inspector to inspect the home properly
before the buyer's inspector arrives."

Good catch. Some of us thought that needed corrected as well.

I like NACHI because of all the educational benefits, internet presence, powerful
message board information and chat, and I receive about 6-10 leads a month from
NACHI search engines. It pays for itself every month.

I too like CMI. How could you tell?

To Aron Miller:

NACHI.TV is coming to Dallas to film free commercials for everyone
that wants one. Please respond by Sunday night if you want to be
included. Just thought you might want to know.

John McKenna, CMI
President - Master Inspector Certification Board
Home - Certified Master Inspector
Certified Master Inspector Forum CMI (Powered by Invision Power Board)
Professional Inspector & Approved Trainer (TREC #4565)
Certified Building Science Thermographer (#33493)
Texas Home Inspector, Thermal Imaging Inspection, Conroe, Bryan, Lufkin, Athens