When you inspect an attic and there is no floor in the attic. How do you inspect it ? Or do you put in your report that you could not inspect the attic becuase there was no flooring? Or do you take the chance and walk through the insulation and hope you walk on the joists ? The reason I am asking is becasue I did an inspection about a month ago and the homeowner called and said if found some wires that should have been written up because they were not in a junction box. But what if you do not see those wires ? The attached picture is the attic and the owner said if found the wires back in the attic where the insulation is.

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If I can see the ceiling joist and I can maintain a 3-point contact at all times, I will walk an attic with no walk boards. If it is covered with insulation and I do not have a clue as to what I might be stepping on, I will not risk it. Safety first!

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Scott Patterson
Spring Hill, TN
http://www.traceinspections.com

Just depends on the inspector. The important thing is to be up front with the client, especially in the report. If you could not, or did not, or would not inspect anything, document what you didn't inspect and why.
Some inspectors will, as a matter of pride, even, get to every corner of every attic that is physically possible to reach. I know inspectors that will, when they reach those corners, leave a business card.
Others will take one look from the access and say "no way I'm going in there" and document it. Same thing with some crawl spaces, some roofs, etc.
By the way, was there a fire? Kinda looks like it.

Lynn,

No need for flooring in the attic except to any mechanical equipment.

I do myself attempt to walk across the rafters if I can see them. I might move some insulation around with my foot to find the rafter to step upon to get to something in an attic.

The main thing to remember is to document not only what you see but also the things you cannot see. For example, I have a statement that says everything below the attic insulation is inaccessible to the inspector and is not covered by the inspection. Possible defects could be present.

If you don't have such comments as what is hidden, you should consider to help protect you in such incidents.

JMHO

Rick

If I could get through without having to borrow though insulation like a mole, I would walk as much as possible, being very careful when I stepped.

I guess I was one of the 'lucky' ones - never stepped through in 16 years of inspecting, or even during the preceding years of my life contracting.

Sure does look like a fire was in your photo.

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Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
EastWestData (www.EastWestData.com )

If I can physically get into the attic I will walk the trusses or joists, even when they are covered with insulation. I'm not leaving it to chance, either. I gauge where each truss bottom chord (or joist) is based on where the other truss components (or the rafters) are. When I can't see the bottom chord (or joist) I carefully feel my way along with my feet or sometimes move the insulation over slightly when there is any doubt about what I am about to step on.

When there are 2X4 trusses they will almost aways be covered with insulation (except above unconditioned areas, e.g., garages). I can't see how one can properly inspect an attic without actually walking through the attic.

I agree with the others - it looks like there has been an attic fire. Did you also point out the cut rafters at the entrance to the the other attic and the structural repairs (added 2X4 vertical members)?

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"Baseball is like church. Many attend but few understand." Leo Durocher
Bruce Breedlove
www.avaloninspection.com

Just looking at that picture, I can smell that smoke.

Rick

No question about the fire...

I walk across ceiling joists everytime I can (must have 3 points of contact).

Now, the one that is a real ass-whoppin is crawling across the ceiing joists on your knees and hands because of the lack of head height clearances.

Here is my boiler at the top of the attic section so the client reads it first:

"The entire attic was not accessible to safely traverse due to the absence of or lack of decking (or foot boards), low head height clearances that prohibited safe access and the presence of mechanical equipment with ducted areas. In addition the the possibility of causing damage to the structure, the possibility exists of causing personal injury to myself if I were to traverse these areas where the ceiling joists were not visible.

(optional added comment) Also, the attic is being used to store personal items by the seller that prohibit full access or visibility."

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"If con is the opposite of pro, is Congress the opposite of progress?"
Richard Rushing, HCRI
Duncanville, Tx.

I am with Sott P. on this one. Safety first, always. If I cannot see where my foot will rest I don't walk joists. An inspector friend of mine in the Dallas area spoke with a man at Home Depot in passing one day and the guy's son-in-law had been a home inspector. He was electrocuted to death when he was in an attic and walking across joists covered in insulation. He never saw the bare splice he put his ankle against that was lying on top of the joists he could not see because of the insulation. It gave me a new perspective on attic inspections.

Each inspector is different and has their own methods. Unlike J.P. I have stepped through a ceiling on an inspection and when I was contracting prior to becoming an inspector. It can be dangerous and can be expensive to repair. (Not to mention the injury to your pride.)

If I can see the joists and feel that I can safely walk them (three point as stated before) then I will sometimes do it. Every house is different.

Disclaim with explanation anything you cannot inspect thoroughly. I do not take chances with my safety. You cannot inspect thouroughly at all if you are in a wheelchair or worse!

Eric

Safety first is #1 !!

I've been very fortunate in my almost 20 years of construction and inspection to have not fallen through an attic space - yet! I am focused on keeping that trend.

I also walk all areas that I can as safely as I can. With limited head-room the hand/knee crawl is tough. Trying to view before stepping to avoid "errant electrical" connections is always a priority, but can be difficult.

Agreed with others on the image about a fire at some time in the past. Almost looks like the scene of a "Halloween" spook house.

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Cheers - Nolan E. Kienitz, PMP
Dallas Home Inspector
www.NolansInspections.com

My favorite attics are the 60's-70's Fox and Jacobs, Centennial, et al. You don't have to worry about a service floor because the furnace and A/C are on the floor in the garage. The trusses are enough fun in most houses. In these you enter through a hole in the garage ceiling and then crawl on your hands and knees for the first 15-20 ft. through the tiny hole they left in the roof decking. Of course all of the wiring in the house is in the exact same area so that your knees are on the cables as you dodge the roofing nails overhead. Add to this the cobwebs, asbestos insulation and 40 years of insecticide treatments an it makes for a real treat!

Aaron

Aaron,

I know them all to well. Every call that I get to The Colony, I just know what I'm in for.

Don't forget getting hung up in all the cable / satellite tv wiring strung up everywhere in the attic. Makes it fun.

Rick

Aaron, Rick--

Those first 15-20 feet in the attic is pretty much a belly crawl.

RR

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"If con is the opposite of pro, is Congress the opposite of progress?"
Richard Rushing, HCRI
Duncanville, Tx.

Richard:

It's hell on the belly and even tougher on the knees of the expanding-waist dockers . . .

Aaron

I'm with others... do what you can but be sure to document, document and document what you did and didn't do.

If/when I do go through I agree with the poster about the kicking the insulation before stepping. I'm always looking for that bare wood rafter/truss-cord top. It's amazing how often you clear some insulation and are right on top of a mechanical line of some type.

Particularly with all the new flexible lines (gas, plumbing, etc) it's easy to squish or break something.

Aaron, RR & Rick,

I hate/have to admit I've been caught wearing some of those 'expanding-waist dockers'.
Dang 'maturity' thing it seems.

And I've had a 'hand-full' of those F-J homes to do recently. Get that deja-vu feeling quite often.

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Cheers - Nolan E. Kienitz, PMP
Dallas Home Inspector
www.NolansInspections.com

I walk down the "rat-run" whenever possible and am almost always careful.

OOPS!

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What is the circumference of a moose?

I don't. I've had a few almost fail when stepped on, I've felt them crack or flex w-a-y-t-o-o much and quickly stepped off.

I'm a 'bottom truss chord' or 'ceiling joist' man myself.

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Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
EastWestData (www.EastWestData.com )

"I'm a 'bottom truss chord' or 'ceiling joist' man myself. "

Is that the same as an ass or breast man?

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Dave