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06-01-2007, 08:30 AM
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Weep hole diameter
......
Last edited by Jeff Eastman : 12-19-2007 at 08:52 PM.
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06-01-2007, 09:49 AM
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Location: Chicago, IL
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Re: Weep hole diameter
Possible entryway for insects and vermin. But my main concerns would be: 1) Is that "masonry" extending below grade and parged with mortar? (In any case, insufficient clearance from grade?) Why someone "retrofitted" the weeps in the first place - I would assume there was likely to have been a water problem, or they would not have bothered - and what damage may have resulted. 3) Damage to the flashing (if any) / weather-resistant barrier (house-wrap) / sheathing behind the brick the weeps were installed.
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06-01-2007, 10:32 AM
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Re: Weep hole diameter
And... it these were indeed retro-fitted (a high possibility), that would mean that the hole (only) was installed and there is no flashing in the drain plane.
Rich
__________________
"If con is the opposite of pro, is Congress the opposite of progress?"
Richard Rushing, HCRI
Duncanville, Tx.
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06-01-2007, 11:39 AM
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Re: Weep hole diameter
Installing "weep-holes" after a masonry wall is built can often cause more problems than not. Hey Clyde, where's my drill? 
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06-01-2007, 12:08 PM
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Re: Weep hole diameter
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06-01-2007, 01:05 PM
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Location: Corpus Christi, TX
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Re: Weep hole diameter
Jeff,
Where did you get a maximum of 3/8ths? From 2006 IRC R703.6 Weepholes: Weepholes shall be provided in the outside wythe of masonry walls at a maximum spacing of 33 inches (838mm) on center. Weepholes shall not be less than 3/16inch (5mm) in diameter. Weepholes shall be located immediately above the flashing. , so if you have one, I'll appreciate knowing it.
It wouldn't be unusual for me to miss another reference.
In any event, I would be concerned with damage to the substrate and flashing (if present) in which case you've just made a direct path to the interior.
Were you able to identify the debris seen on the grass and foundation? Was that actually stone and mortar or was it shaved stone embedded into a thin layer of concrete over EPS. I know you were there and I'm looking at a picture. I'm just curious because of all the debris.
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The only reason some people get lost in thought is because it's unfamiliar territory.
- Paul Fix
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06-01-2007, 01:16 PM
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Re: Weep hole diameter
Thom,
I could be wrong (again) but, I think that is water driplets on the grass/ ground.
RR
__________________
"If con is the opposite of pro, is Congress the opposite of progress?"
Richard Rushing, HCRI
Duncanville, Tx.
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06-01-2007, 01:35 PM
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Re: Weep hole diameter
That's what I originally thought, but look on the foundation and inside the hole.
__________________
The only reason some people get lost in thought is because it's unfamiliar territory.
- Paul Fix
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06-01-2007, 01:38 PM
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Re: Weep hole diameter
Originally Posted by Warren Alderman
Nothing wrong with retrofitting weep holes, I recommend it all the time.... just make sure to recommend a qualified contractor do it.
Richard,
"No flashing in the drain plane"?
What do you exactly mean?
Well that recommendation is not very good if the wall is not flashed properly and the air space is full of mortar, or their is not air space. If they are not installed during the construction of the wall it is very doubtful that they will do any good if they are put in post construction.
Warren, all brick veneer walls should have through wall flashing.
I would not tell a client to have weeps installed post construction, simply because I have seen post construction weeps that do not work. You have to understand how the wall is constructed and then you will understand why they seldom work if they are installed post construction.
Last edited by Scott Patterson : 06-01-2007 at 01:47 PM.
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06-01-2007, 02:17 PM
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Re: Weep hole diameter
This is what I said two days ago on a 12 year old home that did not have any weep holes.
"I did not find any weep holes in the brick veneer walls. Weep holes are an important part of the brick veneer wall system. They help air to circulate through the walls and help moisture in the walls to dissipate. Weep holes need to be installed during the construction process for them to work properly.
I did not see any moisture problems with the home that I could link to the lack of the weep holes. This is not uncommon in the South but it does not mean that future moisture problem could arise due to the lack of the weep holes."
This is what I typically end up writing about the lack of weep holes. It changes from home to home but this is my common verbiage.
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06-01-2007, 02:36 PM
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Re: Weep hole diameter
Originally Posted by Jeff Eastman
So do you guys do what Dan suggest, just note the lack of weep holes or just not comment on it?
Jeff,
There is never a case I can think of where I would not comment on it. My canned comment is similar to Scott's and gets modified as necessary.
In most cases, even when they're present, you will not be able to tell if they are functioning. But you will have cases where you can definitely tell when they are not.
__________________
The only reason some people get lost in thought is because it's unfamiliar territory.
- Paul Fix
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06-01-2007, 02:51 PM
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Re: Weep hole diameter
Originally Posted by Jeff Eastman
Thanks , Scott! That rocks!
For new construction though, you tell builder to install if they don't put them in, right?
Even on new construction I do not tell them to put in weeps after the fact. The main reason is that I don't want to be held responsible if they do not work and I told them to install them.
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06-01-2007, 09:00 PM
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Location: Ormond Beach, Florida
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Re: Weep hole diameter
Originally Posted by Warren Alderman
Nothing wrong with retrofitting weep holes, I recommend it all the time.... just make sure to recommend a qualified contractor do it.
West Coast Jerry nailed it with "Installing "weep-holes" after a masonry wall is built can often cause more problems than not. Hey Clyde, where's my drill?"
You ever looked inside one of those holes?
Typically, they drill right through to the siding, past the weather resisting membrane and the paper, right through everything ... now EACH and EVERY hole is a "leak" right through that wall into the sheathing, which will just rot out.
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06-01-2007, 09:08 PM
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Re: Weep hole diameter
Originally Posted by Jeff Eastman
For new construction though, you tell builder to install if they don't put them in, right?
New or old, I said "No weep holes present. Weep holes are required and needed and should be properly installed."
That by-passes Scott's problem of "The main reason is that I don't want to be held responsible if they do not work and I told them to install them." because, *if done PROPERLY*, there will be no problem.
How to do it "properly"? It requires brick removal by a mason and is not cheap or easy. *IF* it is discovered that there is no through-wall flashing there, then the problem just explodes bigger.
Either way, no need to be concerned that they might come back to you, heck, if you were, you might as well quit doing home inspections, because they could come back to you for anything and everything following that scenario.
"Do it properly." It is that simple to state. (Not always that simple to do, though.)
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06-02-2007, 06:06 AM
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Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Georgetown, KY
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Re: Weep hole diameter
Proper weep holes are not present in the brick veneer. Flashing is supposed to be installed behind the brick to direct water to the weep holes. I can't tell if flashing has been installed in the required areas behind the brick veneer.
Even though some local jurisdictions require it, I seldom see proper weep holes in brick veneer in recent construction in this area. For more information on brick systems on the internet see: http://www.bia.org/html/frmset_thnt.htm Look at Technical Note #7 for weephole information.
Also see attachment " Weep Holes In Brick Veneer". Click the link on page three of the report.
Water does get behind brick veneer. It needs a way out so it doesn't sit in the wall rotting the structural wood until it evaporates.
Weep holes are openings in the brick mortar that provide drainage for water (usually in vapor forn) that has penetrated into the space between the brick and the wall sheathing. When installed, these are combined with flashing (a piece of sheet metal or other similar water resistant material) between the sheathing and bricks which lead the collected moisture out the weep holes.
There is no way to see into this space behind the brick without removing brick or opening the interior wall. Making a determination about moisture issues inside the wall is beyond the scope of this inspection.
The Brick Industry Association (the people who make the brick and design installation requirements for it) recommend "weep holes should be located above all doors and windows, below all window sills, and above the ground at the base of the wall." Generally accepted nationwide building practices also call for proper weep holes in brick construction. However, local generally accepted building practices usually lag behind nationally accepted practices and may not require weep holes.
Walls may be retrofitted with weep holes by drilling but this may lead to more problems as the driller usually drills straight through any flashing present giving moisture a straight shot to the structural wood. Without flashing to direct the water to the weep holes, retrofitting may be useless. Installing flashing would require removing a short span of bricks, installing flashing, putting the bricks back and doing it again and again until flashing is installed at all required locations.
You may also want to review the following resources about the need for flashing and weep holes in brick walls.
a. The Brick Industry Association web site at www.bia.org.
b. An article on The Journal of Light Construction web site www.jlconline.com.
The article is: Keeping water out of brick veneer, by Jerry Carrier. Great
explanations, great pictures. Costs $5 to download if you're not a
member.
c. The Building Science Corporation web site at
www.buildingscience.com/resources/walls/solar_driven_moisture_brick.htm
d. Construction books at your local library.
I recommend three courses of action:
1. Review the above resources to educate yourself about the need for
brick weep holes and flashing.
2. Consult the local building inspectors office for local requirements.
3. Contact some knowledgeable qualified brick or masonry contractors to
determine repair methods, estimate costs, and perform the necessary
repairs.
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06-02-2007, 08:02 AM
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Re: Weep hole diameter
Originally Posted by Erby Crofutt
I recommend three courses of action:
1. Review the above resources to educate yourself about the need for
brick weep holes and flashing.
2. Consult the local building inspectors office for local requirements.
3. Contact some knowledgeable qualified brick or masonry contractors to
determine repair methods, estimate costs, and perform the necessary
repairs.
Erby,
#2 could backfire and work against your client if the local officials think 'weep holes are not necessary'. I would skip that one (unless I already knew that the local officials and code did require weep holes, in which case I would simply state that).
Whether or not 'local officials' and/or 'local requirements' call for, or do not call for, weep holes, the BIA and basically anyone with any real knowledge of what needs to be done does say that weep holes are necessary.
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06-03-2007, 02:12 PM
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Location: Georgetown, KY
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Re: Weep hole diameter
Whether or not 'local officials' and/or 'local requirements' call for, or do not call for, weep holes, the BIA and basically anyone with any real knowledge of what needs to be done does say that weep holes are necessary.
Good Point. But in Kentucky, it is illegal for me to " indicating in writing in the initial home inspection report that any condition is not in compliance with any building code enforced under KRS Chapter 198B.”"
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Kentucky Revised Statutes (KRS) Chapter 198B.738
”Home inspectors are prohibited from indicating in writing in the initial home inspection report that any condition is not in compliance with any building code enforced under KRS Chapter 198B.”
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I'd have to reword it to something like
"While I can't tell you whether or not it is a code violation, ( see Kentucky Revised Statutes (KRS) Chapter 198B.738 ) the Brick Industry Association and basically anyone with any real knowledge of what needs to be done does say that weep holes are necessary."
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06-03-2007, 02:25 PM
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Re: Weep hole diameter
Originally Posted by Erby Crofutt
Good Point. But in Kentucky, it is illegal for me to " indicating in writing in the initial home inspection report that any condition is not in compliance with any building code enforced under KRS Chapter 198B.”"
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