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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
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    Florida
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    552

    Default Door Between House & Garage

    I am aware that a fire rated door is required between the house and garage. So, when looking over my new home I casually looked at the door stile expecting to see a tag. Didn't.

    As I understand it, there are three types of doors that could be used: A solid wood door not less than 1-3/8 inches thick. A solid or honeycomb core steel door not less than 1-3/8 inches thick. A 20-minute fire-rated door.

    My questions are:

    Should the door come with a tag on the stile nearest the door jam on the hinge side stating that it is a "fire-rated door' or a door used for this purpose, or at least a certificate stating the same be provided from the builder?

    Should the door be solid with no panels?

    If the door has panels, mutins, and stiles, due to the shaping of the panels near the edges, how can you tell if the edges of the panels (actually a good part of the door) maintains the 1-3/8" thick requirement? I think they do not.

    2018 ASHI InspectionWorld

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Columbus GA
    Posts
    3,746

    Default Re: Door Between House & Garage

    The requirement is:
    #1 A 20 minute rated door. This type will come with a sticker on the jamb that has the rating. No sticker, no rating.
    OR
    #2 A 1 3/8" solid wood door. That means solid wood 1 3/8" everywhere. Doors with panels would likely not meet this requirement.
    #3 A steel door. The steel door is not required to be 1 3/8" everywhere, it can have the panel look.
    Solid wood and steel doors do not need the rating sticker.

    Note. There are now fiberglass doors, these are not approved, unless they have the sticker, which is not likely.

    ' correct a wise man and you gain a friend... correct a fool and he'll bloody your nose'.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Wisconsin
    Posts
    274

    Default Re: Door Between House & Garage

    Check the top of the door as I have seen some tagged there as well, not really sure why. Also, double check the side as it might have been painted over. It might be real difficult to see if it has been painted.

    All doors around here (dwelling to garage) need the 20 minute rating tag.

    It's been a debate around here if the painter removes the tag to paint, then reattaches the tag, this voids the rating, because we do not know if the tag was taken off another door and applied to a non-rated door. They are supposed to protect the tag when they paint, but some paint right over it, which is another issue...



  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
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    Ormond Beach, Florida
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    26,243

    Default Re: Door Between House & Garage

    Quote Originally Posted by Rich Goeken View Post
    I am aware that a fire rated door is required between the house and garage. So, when looking over my new home I casually looked at the door stile expecting to see a tag. Didn't.

    As I understand it, there are three types of doors that could be used: A solid wood door not less than 1-3/8 inches thick. A solid or honeycomb core steel door not less than 1-3/8 inches thick. A 20-minute fire-rated door.

    My questions are:

    Should the door come with a tag on the stile nearest the door jam on the hinge side stating that it is a "fire-rated door' or a door used for this purpose, or at least a certificate stating the same be provided from the builder?

    Should the door be solid with no panels?

    If the door has panels, mutins, and stiles, due to the shaping of the panels near the edges, how can you tell if the edges of the panels (actually a good part of the door) maintains the 1-3/8" thick requirement? I think they do not.
    Rich,

    "I am aware that a fire rated door is required between the house and garage."

    Florida, like most of the rest of the country, does not require a 20-minute rated door (I checked and, indeed, Wisconsin does require a 20-minuter rated door as Mike said, however, most of the rest of the country does not require such a door).

    "A solid wood door not less than 1-3/8 inches thick. A solid or honeycomb core steel door not less than 1-3/8 inches thick. A 20-minute fire-rated door."

    Correct, any of those are permitted.

    - Should the door come with a tag on the stile nearest the door jam on the hinge side stating that it is a "fire-rated door' or a door used for this purpose, or at least a certificate stating the same be provided from the builder?
    - - If the door was a 20-minute rated door, the door would have a label attached to the hinge-side stile (edge) of the door and on the hinge-side jamb of the frame - the door is rated as an assembly which includes the door and the frame, including threshold and door hardware. If anything is changed the rating is lost. The label is not permitted to be removed or painted over.

    - Should the door be solid with no panels?
    - - The door should be solid with no recessed "raised" panels. The door may have "raised" panels applied to the surface of the door. I say 'no recessed raised panels' meaning any which take the thickness of the door to less than 1-3/8" thick.

    - If the door has panels, mutins, and stiles, due to the shaping of the panels near the edges, how can you tell if the edges of the panels (actually a good part of the door) maintains the 1-3/8" thick requirement? I think they do not."
    - - From each face of the door, measure in to the greatest recess, add the recess measurements from each face and deduct that from the thickness of the door. Most 1-3/4" thick 'raised panel' doors will only be 3/8" to 3/4" thick at the recesses as the recesses are typically 1/2" recessed in from the face of the door which makes 1/2" + 1/2" = 1" and 1-3/8" - 1" = 3/8" thick while 1-3/4" - 1" = 3/4" thick.

    I have not found one 'raised panel' door with the recesses which has yet met the minimum thickness of 1-3/8". That does not mean there are not any such doors which meet the minimum thickness, only that I have not yet seen one (wishful and positive thinking keeps me thinking that there must be at least one manufacturer who thought of that, but, alas, not so far).

    The 20-minute rated door will have self-closing hinges, the other doors are not required to be self-closing. All require a threshold and weatherstrip as that door is also an opening through the thermal envelope of the house and is required to meet the same weather-resistance/thermal-resistance of any other "exterior door".

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    552

    Default Re: Door Between House & Garage

    Thanks.
    It's about what I figured. No tag because it's a "solid" door. Door is not really solid because of the panels, so really doesn't meet the requirement for a solid door.


  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Fredericksburg, VA
    Posts
    885

    Default Re: Door Between House & Garage

    I love it. The label says, "DO NOT PAINT OR COVER", usually found after I scraped the paint off. I've gotten so when I do a pre-drywall inspection I check and take a picture of the label. When I come back for the final and find the label painted over, I put the pictures in the report and call it a deficiency - just to tick off the builder. Around here, the doors may have self-closing hinges but the builders usually loosen the retaining screws so they won't self-close.

    The above statements are expressed solely as my opinion and in all probability will conflict with someone else's.
    Stu, Fredericksburg VA

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
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    26,243

    Default Re: Door Between House & Garage

    Quote Originally Posted by Stuart Brooks View Post
    I love it. The label says, "DO NOT PAINT OR COVER", usually found after I scraped the paint off. I've gotten so when I do a pre-drywall inspection I check and take a picture of the label. When I come back for the final and find the label painted over, I put the pictures in the report and call it a deficiency - just to tick off the builder. Around here, the doors may have self-closing hinges but the builders usually loosen the retaining screws so they won't self-close.
    "Around here, the doors may have self-closing hinges but the builders usually loosen the retaining screws so they won't self-close."

    If the door is rated as a 20-minute rated door then the self-closing hinges are required, is not set then that is a must-fix for the door to maintain its 20-minute rating. If not, check the door to see if it meets other door requirements (solid wood and 1-3/8" min thickness, or, steel door with foam core. etc.). If the door meets the other requirements (may not) then it may be okay without the self-closing hinges ... unless your area requires self-closing hinges or requires a 20-minute rated door - in which case the self-closing hinges are required to be set properly.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    St. Louis, Mo. area.
    Posts
    276

    Default Re: Door Between House & Garage

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    Rich,
    The 20-minute rated door will have self-closing hinges, the other doors are not required to be self-closing. All require a threshold and weatherstrip as that door is also an opening through the thermal envelope of the house and is required to meet the same weather-resistance/thermal-resistance of any other "exterior door".
    Is this (self-closing hinges) a fairly new code thing? I have yet to see self-closing hinges on any garage service door, much less one with a rating tag on it - even in new construction.

    I did see a rated door with a glass window in it however. That was a first.


  9. #9
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    Mar 2007
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    Ormond Beach, Florida
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    Default Re: Door Between House & Garage

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Chambers View Post
    Is this (self-closing hinges) a fairly new code thing? I have yet to see self-closing hinges on any garage service door, much less one with a rating tag on it - even in new construction.

    I did see a rated door with a glass window in it however. That was a first.
    You've got to keep the same items together and keep different items separated; ie, keep the 20-minute rated door and self-closing hinges together, while keeping non-rated doors separate from any requirement for self-closing hinges.

    Self-closing hinges are part of the rated door assembly, as is using the same frame/jambs as was used for the testing and rating. Same for the threshold for the rated door. Additionally, some rated doors specify what hardware is required to be used (door handle set, etc).

    Using anything other than what is specified in the approval and/or installation instructions voids the rating of the door.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    St. Louis, Mo. area.
    Posts
    276

    Default Re: Door Between House & Garage

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    You've got to keep the same items together and keep different items separated; ie, keep the 20-minute rated door and self-closing hinges together, while keeping non-rated doors separate from any requirement for self-closing hinges.

    Self-closing hinges are part of the rated door assembly, as is using the same frame/jambs as was used for the testing and rating. Same for the threshold for the rated door. Additionally, some rated doors specify what hardware is required to be used (door handle set, etc).

    Using anything other than what is specified in the approval and/or installation instructions voids the rating of the door.
    Interesting, and thanks for the clarification. So to thereby narrow it down, I have yet to see self-closing hinges on any rated garage service door, even in brand new construction by reputable builders. I know that AHJ's often lag their adoption of the latest codes by a few years, and that was why I was wondering if this was a fairly recent requirement that just hasn't been adopted in our area yet.


  11. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
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    Ormond Beach, Florida
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    26,243

    Default Re: Door Between House & Garage

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Chambers View Post
    So to thereby narrow it down, I have yet to see self-closing hinges on any rated garage service door, even in brand new construction ...
    The question I have is this: Are the doors you've seen actually "rated doors", or are those doors simply "code compliant" doors?

    If those doors are "code compliant" but are not "rated doors" self-closing hinges are not required (by most codes), if that is the case then you would not see self-closing hinges on the doors between garages and living spaces.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    california
    Posts
    11

    Default Re: Door Between House & Garage

    In California any door between the house and garage must be self closing, regardless if its a 20 minute rated door or solid core. The code also requires at least two self closing hinges per door.


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