garage door opener - InspectionNews

Jerome W. Young · #1 (**permalink**) 08-26-2009, 01:05 PM

ever seen one installed off center? is this a problem?

Brandon Whitmore · #2 (**permalink**) 08-26-2009, 01:17 PM

I would want to see the manufacturers installation instructions on that one, but............

If the door springs are adjusted properly, what could it hurt? That would just be like someone manually opening the door off center.

Jerry Peck · #3 (**permalink**) 08-26-2009, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jerome W. Young

ever seen one installed off center? is this a problem?

Almost always is a problem as that can cause the door to not go down straight, the door goes a little crooked, which upset the automatic reverse sensitivity, which then needs to be adjust to allow the door to close, with makes it not operator properly.

That is almost all installation instructions state to install the door at the center of the door (mainly for the above reason, but also likely because that is the only way the opener was tested, listed and labeled).

I recall (I think) seeing one brand which allowed off-center installation but only with an extra kit you had to get from them which would compensate for the operator not being centered (to compensate for that twist effect of pushing down on only one side of the door).

When the opener cannot be centered on the door, then the better operator is one which mounts directly above the door and lifts it straight up from the bottom roller points, which allows the door to roll up and back on those tracks.

From one Craftsman garage door operator installation instructions:
- 1. With door closed, located and mark the vertical centerline of the garage door. Extend line onto header wall above door.
- 2. Locate height for header bracket by opening door to highest point of travel as shown. Draw an intersecting horizontal line on header wall 2" above high point. This height provides travel clearance for top edge of door.

A.D. Miller · #4 (**permalink**) 08-26-2009, 01:40 PM

Quote:

I recall (I think) seeing one brand which allowed off-center installation but only with an extra kit you had to get from them which would compensate for the operator not being centered (to compensate for that twist effect of pushing down on only one side of the door).

JP: I have not seen this. If you recall it, pass the info on, please.

Quote:

When the opener cannot be centered on the door, then the better operator is one which mounts directly above the door and lifts it straight up from the bottom roller points, which allows the door to roll up and back on those tracks.

JP: True, but much pricier.

Quote:

From one Craftsman garage door operator installation instructions:
- 1. With door closed, located and mark the vertical centerline of the garage door.

JP: All that I have seen starts just like that.

Matt Fellman · #5 (**permalink**) 08-26-2009, 10:43 PM

And when there isn't enough room front to back just use this handy conversion kit

Brandon Whitmore · #6 (**permalink**) 08-26-2009, 11:11 PM

Quote:

And when there isn't enough room front to back just use this handy conversion kit

Or, just install the automatic opener in front of the beam so that the door will not fully open. I just had that on a high end 5k sq. ft. home 2 days ago

Any vehicles lower than 6'4" were good to go.

Dom D'Agostino · #7 (**permalink**) 08-27-2009, 08:55 PM

Liftmaster/Craftsman allows up to a 4 foot variance from the center mark, and has done so for many years. (Limitations apply, but typically they work fine.)

Dom.

Michael Schirmer · #8 (**permalink**) 08-27-2009, 11:49 PM

If it worked when you tested it - I would just say that this installation might not be ideal. Opening the door from off-center can sometimes cause the door to bind in the track. Should this occur, contact a garage door service technician for repairs or to approve/certify this current installation.

Safe writing can be Ambiguous if need be...

Jerry Peck · #9 (**permalink**) 08-28-2009, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Schirmer

If it worked when you tested it - I would just say that this installation might not be ideal. Opening the door from off-center can sometimes cause the door to bind in the track. Should this occur, contact a garage door service technician for repairs or to approve/certify this current installation.

Safe writing can be Ambiguous if need be...

And writing like that does not help your client at all - which IS why you are there.

What you wrote is, you think, going to protect you, but that IS NOT why you were there. Besides, not fulfilling your part of the contract is not going to protect you, if your report does your client no good, your report is worthless, which means your contract is worthless.

A.D. Miller · #10 (**permalink**) 08-28-2009, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Safe writing can be Ambiguous if need be...

MS: Ambiguous writing in this business is never safe.

William Zoller · #11 (**permalink**) 10-01-2009, 03:09 PM

I just inspected an off center garage door opener. The opener was loose at the point of connection at the door. I defected it citing stress on the opening mechanism due to being off center. I believe the brand was LiftMaster.

A.D. Miller · #12 (**permalink**) 10-01-2009, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by William Zoller

I just inspected an off center garage door opener. The opener was loose at the point of connection at the door. I defected it citing stress on the opening mechanism due to being off center. I believe the brand was LiftMaster.

WZ: I write up each one that is off center. I have yet to see a Chamberlain manual which allows it. Get the model number and use this link to verify:

LiftMaster instruction manuals, LiftMaster garage door openers and operators instruction manuals

Rick Hurst · #13 (**permalink**) 10-01-2009, 03:36 PM

Here's one I came across the other day mounted off to the side. Seems the attic door laddler was cut directly in the center of the garage ceiling making installation of the door opener off.

The seller mentioned that the garage door opener installer had mentioned that if the door opener was a 1/2hp. it would operate with no problems.

A 1/3hp. would not.

It still made my report.

rick

Jim Luttrall · #14 (**permalink**) 10-01-2009, 04:29 PM

Speaking of garage door operators (notice I did NOT call it an "opener"

) I remembered the story a while back of the kid that was killed by an improperly grounded detached garage and opener when I saw this one today.
This was a 1960's house with a two wire branch system that had the opener plugged into a adapter which plugged into a homemade two wire lamp cord stapled to the ceiling and down the wall to a brand new three wire outlet. I knew it could not be grounded and just for kicks brought out my non-contact voltage tester and sure enough, it light up like a Christmas tree everywhere on the door, opener, and tracks. Bare foot on the wet concrete and it could light up your life.
Of course the electrician will be there anyway since they had both a Zinsco and a Federal Pacific Stab-Loc panel.

Gunnar Alquist · #15 (**permalink**) 10-01-2009, 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick Hurst

It still made my report.

Rick,

What about the attic ladder?

Rick Hurst · #16 (**permalink**) 10-01-2009, 04:49 PM

Gunnar,

You talking about the fire separation comments?

rick

Michael Thomas · #17 (**permalink**) 10-01-2009, 05:09 PM

Jerome,

FWIW, I read somewhere that a somewhat off-center operator will work on a door with torsion spring, but often will not work on a door with a tension type springs.

For Genie operators "Center of bracket must be on centerline of door..."

Chamberlain allows installation up to 4' off the centerline. http://www.chamberlain-diy.com/doity...s/114A3060.pdf

Rick Hurst · #18 (**permalink**) 10-01-2009, 09:20 PM

Check out this spring from today.

rick

Gunnar Alquist · #19 (**permalink**) 10-01-2009, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick Hurst

Gunnar, You talking about the fire separation comments?

Yeah. Around here, if you have a ladder into the garage attic, it is generally the separation wall.

A.D. Miller · #20 (**permalink**) 10-02-2009, 05:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Thomas

Jerome,

FWIW, I read somewhere that a somewhat off-center operator will work on a door with torsion spring, but often will not work on a door with a tension type springs.

For Genie operators "Center of bracket must be on centerline of door..."

Chamberlain allows installation up to 4' off the centerline. http://www.chamberlain-diy.com/doity...s/114A3060.pdf

MT: Chamberalin actually says, in the document you posted:

The opener should be installed above the center of
the door. If there is a torsion spring or center
bearing plate in the way of the header bracket, it
may be installed within 4 feet (1.22 m) to the left or
right of the door center.

That does not give the installer carte blanche to install it off center due to the presence of a beam, attic stair unit, or a fly on the ceiling.

BARRY ADAIR · #21 (**permalink**) 10-02-2009, 06:30 AM

there's these???

Sidemount Door Opener - patented sidemounted garage door opener

Liftmaster model 3800 RJO sidemount garage door opener | Liftmaster Garage Door Part 3800

Model 3800 DC Motor Side Mount Opener

NEW idrive Garage Door Operator by Wayne-Dalton

A.D. Miller · #22 (**permalink**) 10-02-2009, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BARRY ADAIR

there's these???

Sidemount Door Opener - patented sidemounted garage door opener

Liftmaster model 3800 RJO sidemount garage door opener | Liftmaster Garage Door Part 3800

Model 3800 DC Motor Side Mount Opener

NEW idrive Garage Door Operator by Wayne-Dalton

BA: Correlation is not causation.

Steve Duchene · #23 (**permalink**) 10-02-2009, 10:36 AM

If, and I said if, a door is properly balanced the location of the opener does not have to be directly centered. The opener is a helper and is not designed to lift the weight and horsepower has no bearing. But, how many doors are properly balanced. I have installed many doors and openers in a past life (before the easy life of an inspector) and there are occasions where off- center is the only way some could be installed.

I checked a nine foot door yesterday that was so unbalanced that i could hardly lift it, though the opener did not seem to struggle.

Greg Lambke · #24 (**permalink**) 10-02-2009, 11:45 AM

There is no problem mounting a Garage Door "OPERATOR" ( It also closes the door ) off center as long as adequate support is provided accross the top of the door with the GDO attached through the support. Support is ussually provided by adding an addition steel angle.
There are even kits to install one operator for two doors with the unit mounted between the double doors.
The affore mentioned conditions are not at all uncommon.

A.D. Miller · #25 (**permalink**) 10-02-2009, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greg Lambke

There is no problem mounting a Garage Door "OPERATOR" ( It also closes the door ) off center as long as adequate support is provided accross the top of the door with the GDO attached through the support. Support is ussually provided by adding an addition steel angle.
There are even kits to install one operator for two doors with the unit mounted between the double doors.
The affore mentioned conditions are not at all uncommon.

GL: No, there is no problem mounting a garage door operator off center so long as the manufacturer states there is no problem.

Jerry Peck · #26 (**permalink**) 10-02-2009, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Duchene

If, and I said if, a door is properly balanced the location of the opener does not have to be directly centered.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greg Lambke

There is no problem mounting a Garage Door "OPERATOR" ( It also closes the door ) off center as long as adequate support is provided accross the top of the door with the GDO attached through the support.

This deserves repeating: (bold is mine)

Quote:

Originally Posted by A.D. Miller

GL: No, there is no problem mounting a garage door operator off center so long as the manufacturer states there is no problem.

Cobra Cook · #27 (**permalink**) 10-07-2009, 06:27 AM

Rick, did you also write up the fact that the trim around the door was touching the ground?

Cobra Cook · #28 (**permalink**) 10-07-2009, 06:35 AM

Also, remember an inspection is not a warranty, at a given day at a given time. some openers can be allowed to be offset and operate for many years with no problems. If the door was opening and closeing at the time of the inspection and the safeties were working where is the problem? I wish i had a crystal ball as some inspectors do to look in the future of what could happen just so i could pick the correct lottery numbers.

biglebowski · #29 (**permalink**) 11-06-2009, 07:19 PM

shouldnt we be at least making the observational note that this installation could potentially have problems in the future and monitor it for that even if it is working properly at the inspection?