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Thread: WOW

  1. #1
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    Default WOW

    I guess I'm pretty naive , over the years I've seen countles posts about how inspectors kiss agents bottoms, and are willing to screw the buyer to get inspection referrals from realtors.
    I've seen some reports that appeared to indiciate that but just figured the inspector screwed up.

    Well.. Now I've been converted.

    This is auctal wording from a company [ name withheld to prevent offering free marketing for them] that sells marketing flyers to home Inspectors to hand out to realtors.


    Heading on Flyer

    Some Inspectors do Dumb Things
    Like Saying Something On The Report
    That Scares The Buyer To Death!

    Here are some actual statements on OTHER home inspectors’
    • Deck could cause severe fatality or death
    • Roof has 2 years life left
    • Loose toilet. We recommend calling a licensed plumber
    • This house has polybutylene pipng which has cause many lawsuits.
    • We recommend a plumber, electrician, HVAC person, & structural engineer (house is 5 years old)

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    Phoenix AZ Resale Home, Mobile Home, New Home Warranty Inspections. ASHI Certified Inspector #206929 Arizona Certified Inspector # 38440
    www.inspectaz.com

  2. #2
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    Default Re: WOW

    Death is like, you know, like permanent. When you're dead, you are... like.... not alive..

    Did they offer alternative non alarmist wording? I am thinking like;
    "Deck could cause an owwie."
    I think most buyers would read that the same as "deck could cause death"......right?

    But seriously, I have known a few inspectors who make mountains out of every molehill.
    Being able to accurately communicate what you see is almost as important as being able to recognize and find defects.

    If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: WOW

    Dan, I really like the one about house only 5 years old. Heck, Like none of us has ever seen major screw ups on a house less than 1 year old.

    The above statements are expressed solely as my opinion and in all probability will conflict with someone else's.
    Stu, Fredericksburg VA

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    Default Re: WOW

    Quote Originally Posted by Lon Henderson View Post
    But seriously, I have known a few inspectors who make mountains out of every molehill.
    But seriously, I have known a few inspectors who make molehills out of every mountain.



    Just state the facts then give a personal story which relates to it, the client will understand, such as: Oh, the deck? You know, I attended by brother's funeral last Saturday ... (brief pause) ... he was on his deck - which looked just like this one ... (brief pause) ... then it fell in on him ... (voice trailing off) ...

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  5. #5
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    Default Re: WOW

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    But seriously, I have known a few inspectors who make molehills out of every mountain.



    Just state the facts then give a personal story which relates to it, the client will understand, such as: Oh, the deck? You know, I attended by brother's funeral last Saturday ... (brief pause) ... he was on his deck - which looked just like this one ... (brief pause) ... then it fell in on him ... (voice trailing off) ...
    But he looked great at the funeral.

    If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: WOW

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    But seriously, I have known a few inspectors who make molehills out of every mountain.



    Just state the facts then give a personal story which relates to it, the client will understand, such as: Oh, the deck? You know, I attended by brother's funeral last Saturday ... (brief pause) ... he was on his deck - which looked just like this one ... (brief pause) ... then it fell in on him ... (voice trailing off) ...
    I know Jerry is just kidding, at least I hope he did not say anything like that.
    It sounds like a "Molehill to Mountain" story to me.
    State the facts, you should even inform them of the consequences, but leave the dramatics (and stories) out.

    ' correct a wise man and you gain a friend... correct a fool and he'll bloody your nose'.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: WOW

    Quote Originally Posted by Rick Cantrell View Post
    I know Jerry is just kidding, at least I hope he did not say anything like that.
    Whenever I needed the client to grasp the reality of something, it became story-time, and, yes, I have used stories like that to get their attention - and sometimes even that did not work.

    It sounds like a "Molehill to Mountain" story to me.
    Not having seen the deck ... I would not say that.

    State the facts, you should even inform them of the consequences, but leave the dramatics (and stories) out.
    You are missing out on educating your client's if you do not use all means available to you.

    I once had a client who, when I told him that the roof needed to be removed, the roof structure needed to be removed (it was all eaten up by drywood termites) "until you can see the blue sky above" ... my client asked "Can I live here while doing that work?" Huh? He did not get the picture, so I continued: "Now that the roof covering, roof structure, insulation and all ductwork are gone, you now need to remove the second floor floor structure (it was also eaten up by drywood termites) "until you can see the blue sky above". He asked "Can I live here during the work?" I told him I doubted the city (Miami Beach) would allow him to pitch a tent in the middle of the house during demolition, and even if they allow it the tent would be in the way of the work.

    "Yeah, okay, but I want to liver here at that same time." So I continued: "Now that the only thing standing are the exterior walls and you can see the blue sky above, the exterior walls need to be removed because they are failing and ready to fall down (serious spalling EVERYWHERE), and once the walls have been removed you can remove the floor and foundation to allow correcting the failed foundation and all the severe settling which has occured." ... You guess it, he asked "But can I live here while the work is going on?"

    I responded that you might be able to get permission from the city to park a travel trailer there while the house was being demolished, but if you parked the travel trailer in the middle of the house the work would like destroy the travel trailer too.

    "Can I want to live there while the work is going on.", so I asked him "What part of "until you see the blue sky above" do you NOT UNDERSTAND? How many times do I have to say "No."? (I told him 'no' many times.)

    He paid me, I took his check to the bank, he bought the property anyway ... some people just do not understand "No." and some people just do not understand "until you can see the blue sky above" either - I have used that a few times, he was the only one who did not get it.

    I was not only not adverse to explaining things with a story, I used stories to "paint a fuller picture" for my clients. Maybe that is why they paid me the big bucks the did for my inspections?

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

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    Default Re: WOW

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Harris View Post
    I guess I'm pretty naive , over the years I've seen countles posts about how inspectors kiss agents bottoms, and are willing to screw the buyer to get inspection referrals from realtors.
    I've seen some reports that appeared to indiciate that but just figured the inspector screwed up.

    Well.. Now I've been converted.

    This is auctal wording from a company [ name withheld to prevent offering free marketing for them] that sells marketing flyers to home Inspectors to hand out to realtors.


    Heading on Flyer

    Some Inspectors do Dumb Things
    Like Saying Something On The Report
    That Scares The Buyer To Death!

    Here are some actual statements on OTHER home inspectors’
    • Deck could cause severe fatality or death
    • Roof has 2 years life left
    • Loose toilet. We recommend calling a licensed plumber
    • This house has polybutylene pipng which has cause many lawsuits.
    • We recommend a plumber, electrician, HVAC person, & structural engineer (house is 5 years old)
    Welcome home Danny...

    The MAZZA INSPECTION GROUP
    www.mazzainspections.com
    Level III Thermo-picture-taker-er...er

  9. #9
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    Default Re: WOW

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Harris View Post

    This is auctal wording from a company [ name withheld to prevent offering free marketing for them] that sells marketing flyers to home Inspectors to hand out to realtors.


    Heading on Flyer

    Some Inspectors do Dumb Things
    Like Saying Something On The Report
    That Scares The Buyer To Death!

    I think you missed the reasoning behind telling a Realtor you will not scare the Buyer to death with the report. If the Buyer were to die the Realtor would not receive commission on the sale unless the Buyer's estate decided to continue with the contract. Either way the Realtor is obligated to send flowers, a loose loose situation. So it just boils down to $$$$$$$$$.


  10. #10

    Default Re: WOW

    Quote Originally Posted by Rick Cantrell View Post
    I know Jerry is just kidding, at least I hope he did not say anything like that.
    I don't think Jerry is kidding. He hits the ball out of the park. I once described a very bad heat exchanger to the homeowner who had a baby in her arms. I likened it to a canary in a mine shaft. She did get the picture and she did have the furnace replaced.


  11. #11
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    Default Re: WOW

    Quote Originally Posted by John Ghent View Post
    I don't think Jerry is kidding. He hits the ball out of the park. I once described a very bad heat exchanger to the homeowner who had a baby in her arms. I likened it to a canary in a mine shaft. She did get the picture and she did have the furnace replaced.
    I had a French couple moving here. I told them that the crack in the furnace heat exchanger had the biggest gap I had ever seen, over 1/8". The 45 year old unit was belching CO and anything else that wasn't fully burned into the house. It was amazing that we didn't leave with a headache. (it was a vacant house in an estate sale. I could only wonder what might have led to the demise of the owner) I told them that this house would kill them if that furnace stayed.

    As they withdrew their cigarettes to speak, the buyers just said, "That's good to know". They were totally unconcerned. They bought the place and waited nearly a year before they replaced the furnace. Maybe the French are immune to CO.

    If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.

  12. #12
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    Default Re: WOW

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Harris View Post
    • Deck could cause severe fatality or death
    Ummm... "severe fatality"?

    Department of Redundancy Department
    http://www.FullCircleInspect.com/

  13. #13
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    Default Re: WOW

    Quote Originally Posted by Marc M View Post
    Welcome home Danny...
    I'm not sure if it's welcome home or not.
    Heck for all I know I might be doing the same thing and don't even know it.
    Yesterday a realtor called me and stated another agent in her office referred me because I don't kill deals. I hesitated for a second then replied I just tell it the way it is by explaining whats wrong and offer suggestions on how they be corrected and who should correct them.
    She scheduled 2 inspections, I guess she was OK with that, we'll see what she thinks after she see's the reports

    I'm thinking a lot of this realtor mindset comes from seeing guys that don't have a clue and recommended additional evaluation on every item.



    The guys ad states how he went from $0 to 3/4 million plus per year by using his flyers.
    Seeing that made me think back when I was just starting out..
    I had my ethical experience dealing with customers with other business's. If I didn't associate with other local guys when I started out in this business I could of very well thought that was the way everyone did it , and that was the best way to get customers and realtor referrals that everyone finds out are very hard to get.

    Phoenix AZ Resale Home, Mobile Home, New Home Warranty Inspections. ASHI Certified Inspector #206929 Arizona Certified Inspector # 38440
    www.inspectaz.com

  14. #14
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    Default Re: WOW

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Harris View Post
    The guys ad states how he went from $0 to 3/4 million plus per year by using his flyers.
    Making $750K in this biz..........holy schmolly.......if my wife sees that, she'll beat me like a rented mule.

    But I've been accused of being a deal killer and a week later had a realtor tell me that she likes me because I don't "scare buyers".

    My thought is that if everyone tells you that you are a deal killer or tell you that you don't scare buyers, then you need to take a look at how you are communicating. But if you get it both ways, then you're probably ok.

    If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.

  15. #15
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    Default Re: WOW

    Yesterday I had an HVAC system 15 years old in not the greatest shape and by looking things over not the greatest maintenance over time. The water heater was sitting on the garage floor with moisture around the bottom and it was18 years old, electric.

    Where the two systems working like hot air, cold air and hot water? Sure. Did I tell my client to not be surprised that they will more than likely need in the near future and already need immediate repair/replacement? Yes. Did I tell them that both systems are due for replacement? The water heater yes. The HVAC system "when I turn the key in the lock to close the home up there may be an immediate failure of some part of that system" and with today's standards for higher seer rating and such would be almost impossible to just replace half the system.

    On the other hand the foundation had a substantial amount of moving around in the past with cracks, mostly repaired in the past, around the entire home. The inside of the home was fine with no real show of concerns for a further foundation evaluation. The home had in the not to distant past in ground and surface drains installed and all down spouts entering into that system as well as all new retaining walls in the front and rear of the property. I suggested no further review was necessary with the foundation at this time.

    Last week I had a man walk when he tried to brush off a hundred feet of retaining wall that needed replacement until I pushed him on the fact that 15 to 20 grand was in view to have that done. Further more no gutters and no in-ground drainage contributed to washout at one side and the rear of the home. With other items I wrote up the home needed 20,000.00 in repairs. Yes he walked due to the seller not budging on any of it. He would have settled on the home if I did not bring to light the severity of the repairs needed and some kind of ballpark for that cost.Anyways folks. Deal killer? I think not.

    There is such a thing as knowing when to go beyond..."hey, um, I tink dat dare crack over dare should have some of that there follow up.

    If you are looking to do what you are paid to do you alarm folks when alarming is needed. If they still don't get it you are not their psychologist.

    By the way. The buyer that walked on that home last week? I am inspecting another home for him tomorrow. The first buyer did not walk and that was not my intention on either home. She just did not think much of the old systems. "Her Realtor already mentioned that it will be taken care of with the Home Warranty" NO it won't! They are existing conditions!!!!! They need taking care of now either by you or the seller. "Oh" she says. She asked for repairs/replacement.


  16. #16
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    Default Re: WOW

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    Whenever I needed the client to grasp the reality of something, it became story-time, and, yes, I have used stories like that to get their attention - and sometimes even that did not work.
    There, that's what I was getting at.
    Exaggerated stories of doom and gloom are not effective.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post

    Not having seen the deck ... I would not say that.
    The molehill to mountain reference was not in reference to the deck, as you said, I have not seen it. The M2M was in reference to the story, that is unless your brother really did die in a deck collapse. In that case, you have my sympathy


    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post


    You are missing out on educating your client's if you do not use all means available to you.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    I once had a client who, when I told him that the roof needed to be removed, the roof structure needed to be removed (it was all eaten up by drywood termites) "until you can see the blue sky above" ... my client asked "Can I live here while doing that work?" Huh? He did not get the picture, so I continued: "Now that the roof covering, roof structure, insulation and all ductwork are gone, you now need to remove the second floor floor structure (it was also eaten up by drywood termites) "until you can see the blue sky above". He asked "Can I live here during the work?" I told him I doubted the city (Miami Beach) would allow him to pitch a tent in the middle of the house during demolition, and even if they allow it the tent would be in the way of the work.

    "Yeah, okay, but I want to liver here at that same time." So I continued: "Now that the only thing standing are the exterior walls and you can see the blue sky above, the exterior walls need to be removed because they are failing and ready to fall down (serious spalling EVERYWHERE), and once the walls have been removed you can remove the floor and foundation to allow correcting the failed foundation and all the severe settling which has occured." ... You guess it, he asked "But can I live here while the work is going on?"

    I responded that you might be able to get permission from the city to park a travel trailer there while the house was being demolished, but if you parked the travel trailer in the middle of the house the work would like destroy the travel trailer too.

    "Can I want to live there while the work is going on.", so I asked him "What part of "until you see the blue sky above" do you NOT UNDERSTAND? How many times do I have to say "No."? (I told him 'no' many times.)

    He paid me, I took his check to the bank, he bought the property anyway ... some people just do not understand "No." and some people just do not understand "until you can see the blue sky above" either - I have used that a few times, he was the only one who did not get it.

    I was not only not adverse to explaining things with a story, I used stories to "paint a fuller picture" for my clients. Maybe that is why they paid me the big bucks the did for my inspections?
    Another story to emphasize/ justify / rationalize an earlier story.

    I wasn't trying to make a big deal out of this.
    Just wanted to show that (IMO) most home buyers actually are intelligent enough and have the capability to understand what is explained, without the use of exaggerated stories that result in death and destruction.

    Last edited by Rick Cantrell; 01-29-2013 at 01:31 PM.
    ' correct a wise man and you gain a friend... correct a fool and he'll bloody your nose'.

  17. #17
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    Default Re: WOW

    "Deck could cause severe fatality or death"
    - hmm, I think that demonstrates the depth of the writer's vocabulary. Or, perhaps he or she was just in a hurry and got it "close enough". No need to needlessly wear out that eraser.

    I have used the phrase, "A catastrophe waiting to happen", a few times referring to deck construction or condition .

    The above statements are expressed solely as my opinion and in all probability will conflict with someone else's.
    Stu, Fredericksburg VA

  18. #18
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    Post Re: WOW

    It is what it is. Just the facts. And if it could kill my client, that's what they hear. My favorite line: "I don't mind reading articles about my clients, as long as it isn't in the obituaries."

    Randall Aldering GHI BAOM MSM
    Housesmithe Inspection
    www.housesmithe.com

  19. #19
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    Default Re: WOW

    I was asked by a realtor to "tone it down about a leaking roof"

    So I offered 2 options:
    A..The roof leaks, but only when it rains.
    or
    B. Most of the roof does not leak..

    She laughed..I did my normal report...and the seller paid for a new roof...
    lots of funny stories are actual facts.
    .
    It is what it is.

    ..JUST DON'T GO RUNNING OUT OF THE HOUSE LIKE AN 11 YEAR OLD GIRL WITH HER SKIRT OVER HER HEAD YELLING" THE ROOF LEAKS!!"


  20. #20
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    Default Re: WOW

    Quote Originally Posted by CHRIS KRUSE View Post
    I was asked by a realtor to "tone it down about a leaking roof"

    So I offered 2 options:
    A..The roof leaks, but only when it rains.
    or
    B. Most of the roof does not leak..
    "B. Most of the roof does not leak." There you go ... exaggerating again ...

    "A. The roof leaks, but only when it rains." Actually, the roof is always leaking, it is just that on sunny days the roof is leaking sunlight, not rain.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  21. #21
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    Cool Re: realtor

    I bought a house last year and inspected it myself before going forward. I discovered that the old furnace was putting CO into the home. I reported my findings to my agent. Well what do you know he was reluctant to inform the buyers agent (note it was a foreclosure), he's reasoning that banks don't repair or replace high cost items. I told my agent to report it and and to negotiate it like he meant it, and that was from my realtor. In addition I told him to tell the sellers agent if they want my signature to repair or replace it if they wanted me to buy the home. Well bank opted to have the furnace their own inspection and as it turned out he confirmed my findings. Well they ended replacing the furnace with a new one. So to remind the readers my own agent was a reluctant partner, needles to say I will never use him nor would I recommend him in the future. Don't kiss no agent butts, no good can come of it but a stain on your nose.

    -Rick


  22. #22
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    Default Re: WOW

    Wrote the daylights out of a house the other day. Great house overall, lots of nice amenities, in-ground pool etc. Really liked the place. Unfortunately lots of mechanical issues, signs of leaks and major components all ~ 19 years old (original to the house).
    Guy calls today screaming at me, says he's the listing agent.
    - In 27 years this is the worst inspection report I have ever seen, how dare you say such things about this house
    - Do you purposefully try to kill deals
    - If I ever see your name on any deal I will immediately tell the Seller to cancel the contract
    - I am going to tell every agent I know to never hire you
    I said Thank You and hung up.
    When the 18 year old furnace and electronic air cleaner are sitting in an inch of water, severely rusted out and leaking air around the front of the heat exchanger there isn't much else one can recommend besides 'replace'.

    www.aic-chicago.com
    773/844-4AIC
    "The Code is not a ceiling to reach but a floor to work up from"

  23. #23
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    Default Re: WOW

    I would report that SOB to the Realesate Licencing Commission. He is going to slam your name anyway so you might as well get the first lick in.

    He is lacking in ethics, and thats being kind.


  24. #24
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    Default Re: WOW

    Quote Originally Posted by Raymond Wand View Post
    I would report that SOB to the Realesate Licencing Commission. He is going to slam your name anyway so you might as well get the first lick in.

    He is lacking in ethics, and thats being kind.
    I agree. Very unethical attitude and true bottom feeder. It's a shame when there are decent agents that work hard for their customers and probably don't make as much as this guy. I've only had report issues with one agent and we don't see each other any longer. In short, she wanted to be able to edit the reports before the client got them. Yeah, right! That's really going to happen.

    The above statements are expressed solely as my opinion and in all probability will conflict with someone else's.
    Stu, Fredericksburg VA

  25. #25
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    Default Re: WOW

    Yeah, I've had a couple agents ask me to send them my report as a Word doc before sending it to the client, 'so they could make sure everything is Ok'.
    I probably should report the guy, especially since he sent me a nasty text message later on as well. I probably won't though. I prefer to just move on and try to enjoy life. The whole getting back at people just doesn't do it for me, I prefer to have some ice cream.

    www.aic-chicago.com
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    "The Code is not a ceiling to reach but a floor to work up from"

  26. #26
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    Default Re: WOW

    Quote Originally Posted by Markus Keller View Post
    Yeah, I've had a couple agents ask me to send them my report as a Word doc before sending it to the client, 'so they could make sure everything is Ok'.
    I probably should report the guy, especially since he sent me a nasty text message later on as well. I probably won't though. I prefer to just move on and try to enjoy life. The whole getting back at people just doesn't do it for me, I prefer to have some ice cream.

    Been there. I have had agents ask to unlock PDFs and or send word docs unlocked so they could "correct them" buyers as well. Had one lady threaten to cancel my check if i did not send her a word doc so she could "correct it" and she would not give me a very good review.


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