Thread: Webinar on "Obamacare and Small Business: What You Need To Know NOW

Thought I would pass this along to those that may be interested, Put on by Hanley Wood.


Webinar on "Obamacare and Small Business: What You Need To Know NOW" at 1 p.m. ET Thursday, Feb. 28. During this session, two experts on the Affordable Care Act will discuss its impact on small businesses like yours as well as answer your written questions. Note: This is intended for companies with fewer than 50 employees; we'll hold a webinar later on how Obamacare affects businesses with 50+ workers. To sign up, go here, and click on the "Registration" link.

https://hanleywood.webex.com/mw0307l...url=hanleywood

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Since they chose to use the derogatory term "Obamacare" in their title instead of the correct term of "Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act" I would have a hard time believing anything they said.

Maybe you have to accept it before you go to it. Kinda like passing it without knowing what is in in it. Aaaaaaaaaaah blind faith.

Isn't there a saying about a trough and water? Its may be informative. Maybe not. Probably more than you know now.

Well, Ken has a point about the title. I don't necessarily think it's derogatory but it does have a derogatory connotation attached to it. And I think most people wouldn't know what it was if you called it the "Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act". It's most widely known as Obamacare for good or bad.

Info I have read about Obamacare is that is will not affect most small businesses but I could be wrong.

Originally Posted by Nick Ostrowski

Well, Ken has a point about the title. I don't necessarily think it's derogatory but it does have a derogatory connotation attached to it. And I think most people wouldn't know what it was if you called it the "Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act". It's most widely known as Obamacare for good or bad.

Info I have read about Obamacare is that is will not affect most small businesses but I could be wrong.

I do know that in January my private health insurance went up in price by $131 a month which amounted to a 19% increase in my monthly premium. The reason stated by Golden Rule/United Healthcare were the new mandates and changes required in the "Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act"..... In other words I'm now paying for folks that can't afford insurance or those that have conditions that formally made them uninsurable.

To me this is affecting my bottom-line profit as a small business.

Originally Posted by Scott Patterson

I do know that in January my private health insurance went up in price by $131 a month which amounted to a 19% increase in my monthly premium. The reason stated by Golden Rule/United Healthcare were the new mandates and changes required in the "Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act"..... In other words I'm now paying for folks that can't afford insurance or those that have conditions that formally made them uninsurable.

To me this is affecting my bottom-line profit as a small business.

Hmmmm.....if that's the case, then I am wrong. That's quite a monthly hike.

Originally Posted by Scott Patterson

I do know that in January my private health insurance went up in price by $131 a month which amounted to a 19% increase in my monthly premium. The reason stated by Golden Rule/United Healthcare were the new mandates and changes required in the "Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act"..... In other words I'm now paying for folks that can't afford insurance or those that have conditions that formally made them uninsurable.

To me this is affecting my bottom-line profit as a small business.

The HMOs use any excuse necessary to make money. It doesn't mean it's true. Like the oil companies raising the price of gas because a hurricane storm is entering the gulf. It might not effect their production at all but they'll sure raise prices because of it.

Originally Posted by Ken Rowe

The HMOs use any excuse necessary to make money. It doesn't mean it's true. Like the oil companies raising the price of gas because a hurricane storm is entering the gulf. It might not effect their production at all but they'll sure raise prices because of it.

Somebody has to pay for those that can't afford health insurance and for those that could not get coverage in the past due to a preexisting condition.

It is kind of like trying to get insurance on your house after it has burned down and you did not have coverage on it prior to the fire. Same difference if a person has a condition that they use to not be able to get insurance coverage for. Somebody has to pay for it.

We need to ask on friends in Canada how their health coverage is working for them and at what cost because we are heading in that direction!

The President has accepted the term Obamacare, so I don't think it's derogatory anymore.
My insurance premium constantly goes up, too, but I also got a refund from Aetna, because of .... Obamacare!

First of all, in one of the debates, the president said he liked the term "Obamacare". Even his strongest supporters use the term.

Secondly, years after the law was written, there is still debate over the interpretations of some of the provisions of the act. Only when it is fully implemented and some of the fuzzy provisions are adjudicated, will we really know how it affects us. It is likely to be roller coaster ride for the next few years.

A little food for thought.

Those in-favor of something will skew their presentation against mentioning the negative aspects of the topic.

Those opposed will bring up as many negative aspects to the topic that they can while minimizing positive aspects.

If someone tell you they are bias neutral how can you be certain that they do not lean one way or the other. They can skew their explanation and yet make it look balanced.

If you know where the presenter stands you are prepared to filter their comments.

So, if you only listen to one side you will only hear what you want to hear. God forbid you might change your opinion or view of something.

Personally I would rather hear the negatives, since that seems to be the hardest side to gain knowledge about, how it will adversely affect me. Those marketing (selling) a topic will readily give you the positive side. Some what like drugs, would you not want to know the negative side affects before you take something so you could make an informed decision.

Always have liked : The surgical procedure will correct the problem, but more than likely will kill you.

Scott. I would have a hard time figuring out the cost of Canadian health care because it has been entrenched in our system since the 1960's.

In my province, everybody pays $66.50 a month.

"MSP Premiums
In B.C., premiums are payable for MSP coverage and are based on family size and income.
From January 1, 2012, to December 31, 2012 monthly rates are $64.00 for one person, $116.00 for a family of two and $128.00 for a family of three or more. Effective January 1, 2013, monthly rates are $66.50 for one person, $120.50 for a family of two and $133.00 for a family of three or more."


This is a mandatory fee. If you have a pulse and an income, you pay.
But compared to what the private companies are charging Americans, I think it is reasonable. Maybe I'm just an indoctrinated socialist. Haven't been to a doc in a while, but when I go, I don't get a bill. If I need an ambulance, I have to pay for that, and if I stay too long in a hospital, I have to pay. But if I go in for stitches or some other minor repair, it is covered by the plan.


Doctors bill the medical system. They don't get to set the fee. It is so much per, take it or leave it. Some docs prefer to move down to the US where they can gouge for their services. Most of them here just run as many patients as they can through the office and get their money that way.


We pay higher taxes than US citizens do. Our fuel is heavily taxed and incomes are taxed. In Canada, rich folks pay taxes too. Even so, we are almost as broke as you guys are.

Originally Posted by Ken Rowe

Since they chose to use the derogatory term "Obamacare" in their title instead of the correct term of "Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act" I would have a hard time believing anything they said.

Oh please Ken. Even Obama himself said he did not mind folks referring to it as "Obamacare".

Besides, he needs to have his name attached to this travesty of what he billed to us as being an "affordable" mandate.

You know. Those that do not have health care????? We were already paying for it. Why is it we have to pay more for it now than we used to. What is going to happen is that everyone that cannot afford it will get it for free and be sitting in a doctors office with the slightest sniffle or 1/64th of an inch splinter in their finger. Go to a county hospital sometime and head to the emergency room where it is filled with indegent folks that have no insurance. Now that cost of taking care of those folks at the hospital emmergency room??? Multiply that ten fold with doctors offices filled in every city in the US. We were already paying for that.

Social security, Medicaid and Medicare????? Being they largest outlay. It should be and will have to be two folded in the future. For those older folks. I know countless folks over the years that lost everything for one reason or another. Those that pay no federal taxes which is the largest part of the wok force....need to. Folks like full time census workers that go around their area all year asking folks silly questions..Gone. Along with a few hundred thousnad other gov employees. They are talking about federal workers will have to go on ferloe. Good for them. It is high time federal, state, county workers etc felt the brunt of reality. The guy at home depot can get laid off ???? so can't the gov workers.

A whole lot more going onn here than just Obama care.

Originally Posted by Ted Menelly

You know. Those that do not have health care????? We were already paying for it. Why is it we have to pay more for it now than we used to. What is going to happen is that everyone that cannot afford it will get it for free and be sitting in a doctors office with the slightest sniffle or 1/64th of an inch splinter in their finger. Go to a county hospital sometime and head to the emergency room where it is filled with indegent folks that have no insurance. Now that cost of taking care of those folks at the hospital emmergency room??? Multiply that ten fold with doctors offices filled in every city in the US. We were already paying for that.

Social security, Medicaid and Medicare????? Being they largest outlay. It should be and will have to be two folded in the future. For those older folks. I know countless folks over the years that lost everything for one reason or another. Those that pay no federal taxes which is the largest part of the wok force....need to. Folks like full time census workers that go around their area all year asking folks silly questions..Gone. Along with a few hundred thousnad other gov employees. They are talking about federal workers will have to go on ferloe. Good for them. It is high time federal, state, county workers etc felt the brunt of reality. The guy at home depot can get laid off ???? so can't the gov workers.

A whole lot more going onn here than just Obama care.

I could support an extra sales tax (I think they call it a VAT) to help fund healthcare since it looks like it is here to stay. Put on an extra .5% to 1% nationwide on everything that is purchased/sold. Oh wait, they won't do this because that would be a "fair" tax!

Increased taxes is NEVER the answer to overspending and entiliments.

The answer IS to cut spending....Cut Spending!.....CUT SPENDING!

Originally Posted by Ken Amelin

Increased taxes is NEVER the answer to overspending and entiliments.

The answer IS to cut spending....Cut Spending!.....CUT SPENDING!

Stop with the entitlements. That is another word for how the older folks survive. A multitude of them. Whether it be from loss of spouse, market crashes, health wjho knows. There are a multitude of reasons why medicade and medicare and social security can never and will never go away.

UYou could lose everything this year for one reason or a snowball of others.

Lets see. Get old, you helped build this country and the yo9unger folks are living off of it no matter what screwed way of thinking they have now a day.

And let you ROT AND BE HOMELESS.

Die of easily cured illness

I THINK NOT

I'LL GIVE YOU A COOKIE.

There is no such thing as entitlements with the aged. It is a must and absolute necessity

Now, if you had a retirement and did not lose it, health care being able to be afforded by you???? Tuff crap. You won't get social security, Medicare or Medicaid or housing or any other damn thing.

Originally Posted by John Kogel

..........an indoctrinated socialist. Haven't been to a doc in a while, but when I go, I don't get a bill. If I need an ambulance, I have to pay for that, and if I stay too long in a hospital, I have to pay. But if I go in for stitches or some other minor repair, it is covered by the plan.

I was having a conversation with one of my daughters after a job interview. The company offers benefits and some perks. This was the first interview for the job. My daughter didn't get into benefits at that time.

I reminded her that don't just accept that they have benefits, ask exactly what they are and the associated costs and deductibles. Point being that you can have benefits, but they may be costly. Like $300/month with $40 copay and $5000 deductible. The devil is in the details. Just saying there is health coverage is cheap talk.

Like Scott, her present job's health coverage is going up, $800/yr (single person).

John, you say go to the doctor and no bill. But then mention that you pay additional for ambulance or stay to long in hospital then look for bills. I would imagine there is quite a list of non covered items/services, not to mention a committee that may say that you are to old for value out of a procedure. Broken hip, just suck it up, no hip replacement for your age.

Scott,
They have already looked at a Luxury Tax on rich boys toys like boats. Didn't work out to well. Boat industry tanked. Well at least for the poorer rich, like you and I.

Like the sequester issue going on, few really take about the fact that it is a % (partial) reduction in growth of future budgets, not in the actual budget itself. Not a total removal of any budget increases for the future. The noise is all about radically inflated consequences, and it seems the majority believe the false rhetoric. Just like the US national health plan is the panacea to health coverage for all. Maybe the Fed Gov should take over the Home Inspection Industry and Nationalize it. We all know it would be much better , cost less and protect all of the people.

Hello Garry. The Canadian Health care system provides pretty well for old folks. If you need a new hip, you can get one. But if someone wants to they can find plenty of info for or agin, as with any political football.

It's insurance. when you don't need it, paying the premiums is a drag and a drain on your finances. When you need it, for yourself or for a family member, it is a blessing.

Ambulance and hospital costs have been trimmed off the basic coverage over the years to keep the premium costs down. I am grateful for that. You can pay for additional coverage any time you want. Doctors in the US will fight to stop national Medicare, because it will put an end to their inflated incomes. But they have their private facilities, so the rich can still support them.

Originally Posted by Ken Rowe

Since they chose to use the derogatory term "Obamacare" in their title instead of the correct term of "Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act" I would have a hard time believing anything they said.

After listening to the debate your comment came to mind.

Well, after hearing the House Of Rep debate today (5/16/13) it seems that you would have a hard time believing anything anyone said since they all (both parties) used the term "Obama Care".

Originally Posted by Garry Sorrells

After listening to the debate your comment came to mind.

Well, after hearing the House Of Rep debate today (5/16/13) it seems that you would have a hard time believing anything anyone said since they all (both parties) used the term "Obama Care".

It's really Romney Care ... ... he started it when he was the gov back when.

Originally Posted by Jerry Peck

It's really Romney Care ... ... he started it when he was the gov back when.

But Rom didn't ram it through in the middle of the night without publication or discussion of the actual Bill. Also, it was a state issue not a federal issue. I would not want to carry over what Maryland has done to cover you. I have voted in the booth for decades and now I'm thinking of voting with my feet.

The point of my posting was related to the indignation some have on some topics.

Originally Posted by Garry Sorrells

The point of my posting was related to the indignation some have on some topics.

Precisely why I posted that - the indignation is from people calling it Obama Care when it really is Romney Care Re-done (and mostly re-done by them there republicans who would not accept the original version either, they intentionally made it as bad as they could ... and who gets blamed for that - the democrats).

Que Sera, Sera (or something like that)

Originally Posted by Jerry Peck

Precisely why I posted that - the indignation is from people calling it Obama Care when it really is Romney Care Re-done (and mostly re-done by them there republicans who would not accept the original version either, they intentionally made it as bad as they could ... and who gets blamed for that - the democrats).

Que Sera, Sera (or something like that)

Huh? Please tell me that you were making some kind of saracasm. The Republicans had zero input in the Affordable Care Act (aside.....what a joke name that is!). As Pelosi famously said and I paraphrase, 'We can't know what is in it until we vote it in'.......which was Democrat code for, 'we don't want you to know what we are doing to America so we have to hurry up and vote this monster in before the Republicans have a chance to read the entire thing'

Originally Posted by Jerry Peck

Precisely why I posted that - the indignation is from people calling it Obama Care when it really is Romney Care Re-done (and mostly re-done by them there republicans who would not accept the original version either, they intentionally made it as bad as they could ... and who gets blamed for that - the democrats).

Que Sera, Sera (or something like that)

This song may not be about you. Carly Simon - You're So Vain - YouTube

No, not directed at you, but if the shoe fits. I was referring to those whose shorts wadded up over the use of "Obama Care" as opposed to "Affordable Care Act". That the use of "Obama Care " was some how a slur against the Pres. and that those that used it could not be trusted. Which if I agreed with would mean that every party and non-party congressman could not be trusted, since each that spoke used the term"Obama Care" during the floor debate. Though it would seem, the lack of trust/veracity would be more directed to those that actually voted for the Act before they say it.

Ultimately it really does boil down to a bill passed without being scrutinized, discussed and rushed through by one party with an agenda. The concept of any movement is better than no movement/action may/has put the nation into quick sand.

I learned that standing on a job site with a foreman shouting "I want to see movement, just do something" which turned out to be a costly concept for the company. Had to undo what was done and start over again. Ill conceived action is worse than lack of action.

Originally Posted by Garry Sorrells

Ill conceived action is worse than lack of action.

Not always, but frequently, yes.

Sometimes it is better to just go ahead and ... DUCK! ... without looking down to see what one is about to land on ... other times it is prudent to make sure one is not landing on a land mine, for example.

Originally Posted by Jerry Peck

Not always, but frequently, yes.

Sometimes it is better to just go ahead and ... DUCK! ... without looking down to see what one is about to land on ... other times it is prudent to make sure one is not landing on a land mine, for example.

Would have been better not to run into the mine field in the first place. Staying put and doing nothing.

Originally Posted by Garry Sorrells

Would have been better not to run into the mine field in the first place. Staying put and doing nothing.

I may be an idiot at times about certain things but seriously......


We will just have to wait to see it to find out what is in so lets get it voted on and bend over and hold our behinds.

They should have all been fired. Every single one of them. And these morons are in complete control of our lives. And they actually sit around and smile about it. They don't even know they are morons. Ignorance is bliss I guess. And we have to eat their ignorance on a daily basis.

And the IRS .................................................. .........

With all that has occurred or hasn't (implementation without access), figured I would

With effectively one insurance policy (benefits) and variation on monthly payments vs deductible. Have many of you actually been able to access information on insurance benefit coverage and its real annual costs for the first year (pretty confident it will increase significantly once they have it implemented). Especially since the statement of "being able to keep the coverage if you like" it has been shot down.

After many false starts and problems with the healthcare.gov website, my application finally went through one day. Compared to the policies my wife and I have now, the new policies cost less and cover more.
I had a lot of options to choose from. It's a bit of a crap shoot deciding which one to go with, but I guess insurance in general is a bit of a crap shoot.

Originally Posted by John Arnold

After many false starts and problems with the healthcare.gov website, my application finally went through one day. Compared to the policies my wife and I have now, the new policies cost less and cover more.
I had a lot of options to choose from. It's a bit of a crap shoot deciding which one to go with, but I guess insurance in general is a bit of a crap shoot.

John what is your deductible?

Originally Posted by Scott Patterson

John what is your deductible?

Zero.

Originally Posted by John Arnold

After many false starts and problems with the healthcare.gov website, my application finally went through one day. Compared to the policies my wife and I have now, the new policies cost less and cover more.
I had a lot of options to choose from. It's a bit of a crap shoot deciding which one to go with, but I guess insurance in general is a bit of a crap shoot.

My insurance didn't cancel, but my policy went up 70 bucks. John is the only person that I've heard of that is getting better coverage for less. Have you actually paid a premium or received a premium confirmation or invoice? Kinda makes me wonder about the policy that you had previously.

I am the only person I know with an individual policy that didn't have their insurance cancelled.

Originally Posted by Lon Henderson

My insurance didn't cancel, but my policy went up 70 bucks. John is the only person that I've heard of that is getting better coverage for less. Have you actually paid a premium or received a premium confirmation or invoice? Kinda makes me wonder about the policy that you had previously.

I am the only person I know with an individual policy that didn't have their insurance cancelled.

I have paid the first month's premium, yes. My current policy is an Aetna HMO policy I've had for years. Every year the premium went up a lot, unless I opted to change to higher copays, which I have done a couple of times. It got to the point where if I needed something like an MRI, my copay was $ 275. My wife's current policy is with a different company and is more expensive than mine.
We never got notices of cancellation. Maybe we beat them to it by letting our broker know we'd gotten new policies through the ACA.

Originally Posted by John Arnold

Zero.

I did not see any with A zero deductible..... My state did not do their own, they let the Gov do it so I guess each is different.

For me and my 17 year old son we would pay $790 with a $5,000 deductible and copay is $40 per visit if in network. My part was $400 and his is $390. We both get maternity coverage and birth control! Bad part is my Cardiolgist and primary care doctor are not in the plan at this time.... I would have to change doctors and can not use the hospital down the street. The hospital in the plan is 30 miles across town.

I have coverage now through United Healthcare, it has not been canceled. I had it way before Onama Care went into play... I'm staying with what I have.... I pay $640 a month with a $35 copay and $2,500 for both of us.

Originally Posted by Scott Patterson

I did not see any with A zero deductible..... My state did not do their own, they let the Gov do it so I guess each is different.

For me and my 17 year old son we would pay $790 with a $5,000 deductible and copay is $40 per visit if in network. My part was $400 and his is $390. We both get maternity coverage and birth control! Bad part is my Cardiolgist and primary care doctor are not in the plan at this time.... I would have to change doctors and can not use the hospital down the street. The hospital in the plan is 30 miles across town.

I have coverage now through United Healthcare, it has not been canceled. I had it way before Onama Care went into play... I'm staying with what I have.... I pay $640 a month with a $35 copay and $2,500 for both of us.

I will be paying considerably more than that for myself and my wife, but with zip deductible, so that's the tradeoff. We both have significant pre-existing conditions, so we're betting we're going to be using the coverage. I would have gotten a much lower premium policy if we were both in tip top shape and expecting to stay that way.
As for in-network and out-of-network, here in the big city it's never been much of an issue for us. I was able to check which physicians and hospitals were "in" before signing up. No problem.

John,
Was curious as what you had but couldn't find an Aetna plan. I guess that you have is something like this?

Keystone HMO Silver Proactive
HMO | Silver
Independence Blue Cross

Monthly premium
$579/mo 2 enrollees
Deductible: $0/yr Family total / $0/yr Per individual

Out-of-pocket Maximum : $12,700/yr Family / $6,350/yr Per individual
Copayments/Coinsurance:
Primary Doctor: $20
Specialist Doctor: $45
Generic Prescription: $10
ER Visit: $450



Copayments/Coinsurance:

Primary doctor $20 Specialist doctor $45 Inpatient doctor No Charge In-Patient facility $400 Copay per Day Emergency room $450 Generic prescription $10 Preferred brand prescription 50% Non-preferred brand prescription 50% Specialty prescription 50%

---

https://www.healthcare.gov/find-prem...ge0=45&age1=45



https://www.healthcare.gov/find-prem...ge0=45&age1=45

Originally Posted by Garry Sorrells

John,
Was curious as what you had but couldn't find an Aetna plan. I guess that you have is something like this?

Keystone HMO Silver Proactive
HMO | Silver
Independence Blue Cross

Monthly premium
$579/mo 2 enrollees
Deductible: $0/yr Family total / $0/yr Per individual

Out-of-pocket Maximum : $12,700/yr Family / $6,350/yr Per individual
Copayments/Coinsurance:
Primary Doctor: $20
Specialist Doctor: $45
Generic Prescription: $10
ER Visit: $450



Copayments/Coinsurance:

Primary doctor $20 Specialist doctor $45 Inpatient doctor No Charge In-Patient facility $400 Copay per Day Emergency room $450 Generic prescription $10 Preferred brand prescription 50% Non-preferred brand prescription 50% Specialty prescription 50%

---

https://www.healthcare.gov/find-prem...ge0=45&age1=45



https://www.healthcare.gov/find-prem...ge0=45&age1=45

I went with Keystone HMO Gold Proactive, so the monthly premium is a bit more.

Originally Posted by John Arnold

I went with Keystone HMO Gold Proactive, so the monthly premium is a bit more.

Have you calculated what your total annual cost will be including monthly premium and anticipated minimum and maximum use costs, would you share?

Originally Posted by Garry Sorrells

Have you calculated what your total annual cost will be including monthly premium and anticipated minimum and maximum use costs, would you share?

Other than the monthly premium, I haven't calculated annual cost, no. All I know is the monthly is less than what I pay now, and the copays are less also, assuming I stay in network and pay attention to the Tier system. I checked and all of our physicians are in Tier 1, so the copays will be lower.

It looks like you're in that tiny percentile who are actually getting a better deal on Obamacare.

Originally Posted by Lon Henderson

It looks like you're in that tiny percentile who are actually getting a better deal on Obamacare.

May be the case. There has to be some situation that the system works despite the probable extremely low number.

Even the Titanic had enough life boats to save some of the passengers. 2224 on board, lifeboats for 1,178, estimated 705 survivors. Does this seem to parallel the present law? And like Jonestown the leaders are forcing everyone to drink the cool aide with the twist that the leaders exempt themselves from full/equal participation.

Oh, It was the Titanic's maiden voyage wasn't it. Followed by her sister ship the Britannic who after a redesign but looking much like the Titanic, still sank in only 55 min. Iceberg or mine, still tested an failed.

Originally Posted by Jerry Peck

Precisely why I posted that - the indignation is from people calling it Obama Care when it really is Romney Care Re-done (and mostly re-done by them there republicans who would not accept the original version either, they intentionally made it as bad as they could ... and who gets blamed for that - the democrats).

Jerry, it is time you check your facts.

This is a big blunder you just made. Won't hold up in court.

The final vote tally for the Senate version of President Obama's health care reform legislation


In the House was 219-212, with 34 Democrats joining all Republicans in opposition.



In the Senate a vote of 60–39 on December 24, 2009, with all Democrats and two independents voting for, and all Republicans voting against


So Jerry is correct it was the result of the efforts of the Republicans to create the unAffordable Health Care for America Act an the Democrats are now getting the blame for the Republicans actions. An the poor Democrats have been forced to genuflect every since that vote.

Time to check your facts guys, then you can post all you want.

From almost Day 1 of the Affordable Care Act the Democrats have given in to demands from the Republicans with the result being the mess we now have.

No Republicans voted for it? Sure, they screwed it all up and went for 'nothing or nothing' (either it fails and doesn't get adopted - or - it passes and it is so compromised that it doesn't do what it was intended to do).

You call that good for the Republicans and bad for the Democrats? I agree, if the Republicans were not going to compromise then the Democrats should not have compromised one bit either ... oh, wait, that is what lead to the Republican GOVERNMENT SHUT-DOWN WHICH COST $24 BILLION ... but, oh, wait, $24 BILLION is just chump change - I get it, the Republicans think that when THEY LOSE $24 BILLION it is not a big deal, but when the Democrats want to spend some money to help the country it is a BFD?

You guys are hilarious! You've got me ROFLMAO ... and puking ... but that's okay, at least we now have it started. Someday, hopefully, the Republican demanded compromises can be taken out as they did not want them anyway, they only wanted it to fail.

Guys, complain all you want if it makes you feel better.

Originally Posted by Jerry Peck

Time to check your facts guys, then you can post all you want.

From almost Day 1 of the Affordable Care Act the Democrats have given in to demands from the Republicans with the result being the mess we now have.

No Republicans voted for it? Sure, they screwed it all up and went for 'nothing or nothing' (either it fails and doesn't get adopted - or - it passes and it is so compromised that it doesn't do what it was intended to do).

You call that good for the Republicans and bad for the Democrats? I agree, if the Republicans were not going to compromise then the Democrats should not have compromised one bit either ... oh, wait, that is what lead to the Republican GOVERNMENT SHUT-DOWN WHICH COST $24 BILLION ... but, oh, wait, $24 BILLION is just chump change - I get it, the Republicans think that when THEY LOSE $24 BILLION it is not a big deal, but when the Democrats want to spend some money to help the country it is a BFD?

You guys are hilarious! You've got me ROFLMAO ... and puking ... but that's okay, at least we now have it started. Someday, hopefully, the Republican demanded compromises can be taken out as they did not want them anyway, they only wanted it to fail.

Guys, complain all you want if it makes you feel better.

I am not accustom to Jerry saying idiotic things but this is the most idiotic thing I've seen from just about anybody not named Pelosi. I could add pathetic in its absurdly lame attempt to divert blame from the dems who richly deserve it. Fact check......the repubs had nothing.....zero.......good or bad with the final Obamanation Care act.

Jerry, you don't have me ROFLMAO nor does your puny opinion invoke a puke. However, you did garnish a resigned grimace from me that fools have the same right to vote that I do.

Originally Posted by Jerry Peck

Time to check your facts guys,

You guys are hilarious! You've got me ROFLMAO ..

Guys, complain all you want if it makes you feel better.

Yeah I'm laughing.

A Montage of Obama's "If You Like Your Plan Keep It" Lies - YouTube

All I know is that I did not vote for it or for its author or his supporters. I'm not pleased with it or with what has happened to my private healthcare policy because of it. I also do not need maternity coverage!

I will vote against anyone who suported the healthcare act in the upcoming elections in hopes that we will see positive changes.

Originally Posted by Lon Henderson

I am not accustom to Jerry saying idiotic things but this is the most idiotic thing I've seen from just about anybody not named Pelosi. I could add pathetic in its absurdly lame attempt to divert blame from the dems who richly deserve it. Fact check......the repubs had nothing.....zero.......good or bad with the final Obamanation Care act.

Jerry, you don't have me ROFLMAO nor does your puny opinion invoke a puke. However, you did garnish a resigned grimace from me that fools have the same right to vote that I do.

You sure have selective memory, Scott, and you are entitled to it and your opinion, and, yes, fools have the same right to vote as you and I, and many have voted for Tea Party candidates and are now beginning to realize what an error that was - not implying that you are a Tea Party person as I don't know and am not asking either, just stating a fact that is happening ... heck, even our Gov down here is doing that too.

That's okay because the democrats swung too far left decades ago when I was a Republican, then they returned toward the middle as the Republicans started leaning so far right that they were falling off a cliff ... and that was long, long, long before this current Tea Party thing. I've been a Democrat far longer now than I was a Republican as I am more middle of the road than many in either party ... and the problem with being in the middle of the road is that one gets hit from both directions - been getting hit from both directions for decades now and I've gotten used to it, so lay it on me, man. Git those feelin's out in the open. Cool.

I'm neither a Democrat or Republican and these are my personal views. The Democrats tried to get public health care, similar to what's going on in Canada and nearly every other non-third world country. The Republicans didn't want it with the "public option". So that was taken out to please the Republicans. Even though they got the changes they wanted the Republicans still declined to vote for the bill, leaving basically half of a health care bill.

What's going to happen next? I'm pretty sure more Republican will be voted into office. But they won't get rid of the Affordable Health Care Act. They will change it. And over the course of a few election cycles the Affordable Health Care Act will be something most of us will agree on. Hopefully their website is running correctly by then.

Look back in history at the "socialist" programs. The New Deal included; Federal Emergency Relief Administration, Civil Works Administration, Works Progress Administration, Social Security Act, United States Housing Authority, Farm Security Administration, Fair Labor Standards Act of 1938, Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation, Federal Crop Insurance Corporation, Federal Housing Administration, Tennessee Valley Authority, Securities and Exchange Commission.
Some of these programs were found to be unconstitutional by the supreme court and their descriptions were changed. All of these were subsequently changed by new lawmakers throughout their history. All of these programs brought dissension to the United States populous.

Originally Posted by Billy Stephens

Yeah I'm laughing.

A Montage of Obama's "If You Like Your Plan Keep It" Lies - YouTube

Then there was the promise of a Transparent Administration. And the reason for it not happening has been the Republicans and George Bush?

Originally Posted by Jerry Peck

You sure have selective memory, Scott, and you are entitled to it and your opinion, and, yes, fools have the same right to vote as you and I, and many have voted for Tea Party candidates and are now beginning to realize what an error that was - not implying that you are a Tea Party person as I don't know and am not asking either, just stating a fact that is happening ... heck, even our Gov down here is doing that.

On paper I'm registered as a Republican, but unlike my parents who always voted their party(Blue Dog Democrats) I vote for what and who I feel will do the best job and benefit my family the best.

Right now if I had to give my support for a presidential candidate I would like to see Mike Huckabee, the former governor of Arkansas throw his hat in the ring. Yes, he is conservative but he also knows how to manage and work with the political party indifferences that have hamstrung our country for too long.

Originally Posted by Scott Patterson

On paper I'm registered as a Republican, but unlike my parents who always voted their party(Blue Dog Democrats) I vote for what and who I feel will do the best job and benefit my family the best.

Right now if I had to give my support for a presidential candidate I would like to see Mike Huckabee, the former governor of Arkansas throw his hat in the ring. Yes, he is conservative but he also knows how to manage and work with the political party indifferences that have hamstrung our country for too long.

When it comes to voting my parents always preached to

1. Vote for the person in a local election.
2. Vote for the platform in a state run election.
3. Vote for the party in a presidential election.

It turned out to be the one of the best lessons I learned from them.

The president is the leader of the "Party" - not the people - don't forget it. AND it is the party that controls the president's platform, agenda and goals.

I highly doubt that the affordable care act (AKA Obama Care) will be full implemented. We are already seeing it collapse under it's own weight. The idea of affordable health care for everyone is a great idea, after all I am self employed and could really use some affordable health insurance.

The law is simply to complex, poorly written, not thought out, not read or understood by the people that passed it. The famous quote from Nancy Pelosi "We will have to pass the law so that you can to find out what's in it". This law is the largest government screw up that I have seen in my adult life. So far it's hurting far more people than its helping. Yes maybe that will change in the future, I guess we will have to wait and see.

I think that the Affordable Care Act will be a major problem in 2014. I think it poses a huge threat to the economy. We can only hope for the best to come out of all of it.