Thread: Double taped breakers

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The heat that trips the breaker can be absorbed by the other wire long enough to start a fire down the line.And you mean Tapped right?

Originally Posted by John Stephenson

I know it is wrong to double tape the breakers. Saw two hots today going to one 20amp breaker. Exactly what problem does it cause when you double tape a breaker?

1. The breaker is not designed for more than one wire, unless it is one by Square D and I think that Cutler Hammer makes one as well. They are not all that common, but you will see them from time to time.
2. The connections can never be made tight with two wires. One will always be looser.
3. Loose wire will arc and or overheat.
4. A fire will start and the house will burn down.
5. You will be named in the lawsuit and you will also be named in a subrogation lawsuit by the insurance company.

Off the top of my head I can't think of much more at this time!

Let's not be hasty ....

There are a number of breakers out there that are listed for having two wires attached to the one lug.

If such a breaker is used, it is perfectly OK to have two wires going to that breaker.

If it is not such a breaker, you do have a code violation. The risk is from a fear that one, or more, of the wires will be loose, leading to heat issues. There is also the fear that the multiple wires will take up more space than the clamp is intended to open ... again, leading to a loose connection.

The same principle applies to any wiring connection, even wire nuts. If you connect the wrong wires, or too many wires, the connection may not be reliable.

Please note that I say "may." The fact that something is not listed for more than one wire does not mean a good connection is not possible; it may simply mean that the manufacturer never asked UL to evaluate it for more than one wire. The difference is moot; you still have a code violation.

There are some breakers that are doubled up in the space of one breaker, that is,for example two 15 amp w connectors but thinner in the footprint of one 15 amp breaker. I'm sure lots of you have seen them. Why not use one of them, presuming they are available for the brand of panel box.
Unless someone has had or has heard of bad experiences?

Just a thought
Joe

OK - just a quick question to confirm my understanding about which breakers can accept two wires...

IF the Square D breaker shows ONLY a single wire icon or image on the side of it, then it is designed to accept only a single wire correct?

Thanks in advance for your words of wisdom - I tried searching for a picture that shows the difference, but I may have imagined such a photograph.

Best regards and inspect safely - jdj

John, could you please provide us with a list of the "number of available breakers" beyond the two most of are already aware of.

Issue: The coefficient of friction of two wires, drawing different amperage produces the effect of expanding at two different rates. Thus back to the original issue with aluminum branch wiring and the ability to loosen the connection, provide arcing, provide heat, provide fire,...etc. Engineer fix: 1 wire = 1 breaker. AL branch wiring = AL rated equipment.

Originally Posted by JD Johnson

OK - just a quick question to confirm my understanding about which breakers can accept two wires...

IF the Square D breaker shows ONLY a single wire icon or image on the side of it, then it is designed to accept only a single wire correct?

Thanks in advance for your words of wisdom - I tried searching for a picture that shows the difference, but I may have imagined such a photograph.

Best regards and inspect safely - jdj

No, that does not necessarily mean that it is "listed" for doubling up under the lug of this particular breaker...There must be documentation included with the device in order to legally terminate in this manner!

Originally Posted by Don Gerjevic

No, that does not necessarily mean that it is "listed" for doubling up under the lug of this particular breaker...There must be documentation included with the device in order to legally terminate in this manner!

No! Incorrect! The requirement is that it be listed and labeled! And when the side of the breaker shows the flat terminal plate with the raised curved edges on each side and shows a wire terminated in each one, that is on part of being labeled!

If you were to look at the box those breaker come in, the listing and labeling information would be on that box!

I like as these ! points all over! Cool!

Originally Posted by Joe Tribuzio

There are some breakers that are doubled up in the space of one breaker, that is,for example two 15 amp w connectors but thinner in the footprint of one 15 amp breaker. I'm sure lots of you have seen them. Why not use one of them, presuming they are available for the brand of panel box.
Unless someone has had or has heard of bad experiences?

Just a thought
Joe

A pigtail and a properly sized wirenut installed by a qualified person would work as well.

Chad

Don, did you happen to notice the date of the post you replied to.

Originally Posted by Jerry Peck

No! Incorrect! The requirement is that it be listed and labeled! And when the side of the breaker shows the flat terminal plate with the raised curved edges on each side and shows a wire terminated in each one, that is on part of being labeled!

If you were to look at the box those breaker come in, the listing and labeling information would be on that box!

I like as these ! points all over! Cool!

Well, guess we both are saying the same thing...bottom line is the device must be listed and labeled!

Finally an answer after 5 years.

Originally Posted by Jim Port

Finally an answer after 5 years.

And just in time too. We all know how many house fires and deaths have resulted from the dreaded "double tap"!

Jim, if you want to look at NEC 408.41, it will explain away any doubt about if and when you can "double up" a grounded conductor in a panelboard.
Have a great day!

Originally Posted by Don Gerjevic

Jim, if you want to look at NEC 408.41, it will explain away any doubt about if and when you can "double up" a grounded conductor in a panelboard.
Have a great day!

Jim knows the NEC perfectly well. His point was: why did you bring up a thread that was started 5 years ago?

Originally Posted by Derek Guridi

Jim knows the NEC perfectly well. His point was: why did you bring up a thread that was started 5 years ago?

Geez...you guys are touchy! Excuse me! I'm new to this forum and was just trying to help!