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  1. #66
    James Vincent's Avatar
    James Vincent Guest

    Default Re: Panel bonding which is correct?

    I know what you mean. We just look for water to get in and get cool. Love skiing in Vermont though. I use to drive down from Caribou, Me.(SAC) Now that was a chilling place Have a Great Weekend and enjoy the heat

    Inspection Referral SOC

  2. #67
    Paul Johnston's Avatar
    Paul Johnston Guest

    Default Re: Panel bonding which is correct?

    Quote Originally Posted by James Vincent View Post
    Hey Paul I was just curious was there a significant voltage drop at home outlets?
    No measurable voltage drop at the home. I have not responded for days not because I am scared away but we had no internet, See photo. This is common here. They do not believe in checking clearance first just react just fix it later.
    Thanks for all the comments and knowledge.
    Paul

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  3. #68
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Manchester, Vermont
    Posts
    298

    Default Re: Panel bonding which is correct?

    Dam, did you get hit by a Hurricance.

    Hope you read Jerry Peck post on how to make a true voltage drop test
    instrument. PLEASE SEND MORE PHOTO'S OF THIS STORM, if you can.




    Trust us were here to help, were not from the goverment.


  4. #69
    Paul Johnston's Avatar
    Paul Johnston Guest

    Default Re: Panel bonding which is correct?

    Yes I read JP post. This was not a storm buy a idiot with a backhoe on a trailer.


  5. #70
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
    Posts
    26,252

    Default Re: Panel bonding which is correct?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Johnston View Post
    Yes I read JP post. This was not a storm buy a idiot with a backhoe on a trailer.

    Paul,

    Actually, it was not the idiot with a backhoe on a trailer (most likely, anyway) ...

    Being as that is like the wild west, it was probably the idiot who installed that pole without proper clearance to ground.

    Not saying the guy with the backhoe on the trailer is not an idiot too, but most likely did not put the wires too low in the first place.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  6. #71
    Paul Johnston's Avatar
    Paul Johnston Guest

    Default Re: Panel bonding which is correct?

    Jerry most of the time the wires have the clearance for 13'6" trailers but the guys transport the backhoes with the booms to high. In the rainy season it gets worse because the poles without guy wires will tilt and then the wires get torn down.
    Never a dull moment.


  7. #72
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
    Posts
    26,252

    Default Re: Panel bonding which is correct?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Johnston View Post
    Jerry most of the time the wires have the clearance for 13'6" trailers but the guys transport the backhoes with the booms to high. In the rainy season it gets worse because the poles without guy wires will tilt and then the wires get torn down.
    Never a dull moment.

    "Never a dull moment."

    At ONLY 13'6" clearance over a roadway, alley, parking lot, etc., ... NO WONDER ... here it is 18' minimum.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  8. #73
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Manchester, Vermont
    Posts
    298

    Default Re: Panel bonding which is correct?

    Hi; Paul Johnston, I hope my attempt at a little humor didn't offend you.

    I was wonder it you got the answers you were looking for?

    Your a H.I. working in Costa Rica. Right?

    One mistake made by one H.I. me is I assume that the Services there was
    the same in the U.S. It not is Paul. (correct me if I wrong). House only
    have 120 volt service, not like here in the U.S. where the norm is 120/240.
    And the 120 volt service are generally found not to have an earth ground.
    (again correct if I am wrong). That being said, I not saying you won't.


    Now my next question could you take a photo of the electrical service
    at you H.I., include a photo of the interior of the panel if you could.

    I very much want to see you get the answers you were looking for.

    If you don't think you have, then by all means, Post and let the rest know.


    /S/ Robert


  9. #74
    Paul Johnston's Avatar
    Paul Johnston Guest

    Default Re: Panel bonding which is correct?

    Hi Robert,
    Yes my questions got answered and I now understand a lot more. My wife and I do home inspections here to help feed our animals.
    The electric servive here is the same as the US. A lot of older Tico homes only have 120V no ground service. All new construction is 120/240v. Most have 125-200 amp service. I saw a home the other day (1.8 million dollars) that will have a 400 amp service.
    Here is a couple of photos. Note the one with all the same color wires. Think about trying to trace a wire. Here they make up the splices in a box twist and tape, and it is above the ceiling with no access.
    Thanks for your help
    Paul

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  10. #75
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Manchester, Vermont
    Posts
    298

    Default Re: Panel bonding which is correct?

    Paul J. thanks for sending the photo's.


    In the right panel, this the panel that look like someone really made
    an effort.

    I notice a copper color wire connected to the neutral bus on the right side. Is this the grounding electrode conductor or just an odd color
    circuit conductor.

    Since many homes being built in your area, now come with 120/240 volt
    service, I would recommend talking to the local electricians about get the
    new electrical panels neutrals connected to earth ground, by way of using
    a grounding electrode conductor and a grounds. Here we use two, with
    6 ft. distance between the two. Each 8 Ft. in lenght. Both rods would be
    buried completetly beneath the ground. Another excellent ground system is called the UFER syem. More on that later at your request.


    "Bring Costa Rica into the 21 century" by Paul J. Has a nice ring to it.


  11. #76
    Philip Ngai's Avatar
    Philip Ngai Guest

    Default Re: Panel bonding which is correct?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    Paul,

    - - A "ground fault" is where the hot has faulted to ground (instead of the neutral as in a "short"). In this case, the circuit is still complete, the equipment will still operate, however the case has been energized by the hot making it not safe to operate. In most cases there is not enough current through the fault to ground to cause (allow) enough current to flow to cause the breaker to trip or the fuse to blow. This is because there is still current flowing through the neutral conductor, and, in fact, most of the current is flowing through the neutral conductor.
    Because you compared a ground fault to a short to neutral in the first quoted sentence, my first reading of this was you were defining a ground fault as a short to ground which I would expect to blow the breaker just like a short to neutral. But I think you really mean a flow of current from hot to ground but not as much current as a short would draw.

    Is that correct?


  12. #77
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
    Posts
    26,252

    Default Re: Panel bonding which is correct?

    Quote Originally Posted by Philip Ngai View Post
    Because you compared a ground fault to a short to neutral in the first quoted sentence, my first reading of this was you were defining a ground fault as a short to ground which I would expect to blow the breaker just like a short to neutral. But I think you really mean a flow of current from hot to ground but not as much current as a short would draw.

    Is that correct?
    I'll try it again and see if it is better.

    (I've added bold and underlining)
    - - A "ground fault" is where the hot has faulted to ground (instead of the neutral as in a "short"). In this case, the circuit is still complete, the equipment will still operate, however the case has been energized by the hot making it not safe to operate. In most cases there is not enough current through the fault to ground to cause (allow) enough current to flow to cause the breaker to trip or the fuse to blow. This is because there is still current flowing through the neutral conductor, and, in fact, most of the current is flowing through the neutral conductor.
    However, if the "ground fault" is a complete and total connection to ground, and the ground circuit is fully adequate, then, yes, there will be enough current flow on the ground to trip the breaker.

    I was describing, trying to describe, a typical "ground fault" which would not trip the breaker but which would energize the appliance cabinet. In which case appliance is still working, there is either no ground or a limited ground.

    Think of it this way: you have a range with the hot intentionally directly connected to the hot conductor and unintentionally directly touching (as being different from "directly connected to") ground. The range is still operating (presuming the range is not grounded at this point) but the cabinet of the range is energized. Now presume the range cabinet has a ground but the ground connection is loose, basically a poor connection, it is possible the breaker will not trip, the range cabinet is still hot, and the range is still working.

    Does that answer what you were asking?

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  13. #78
    Philip Ngai's Avatar
    Philip Ngai Guest

    Default Re: Panel bonding which is correct?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    Does that answer what you were asking?
    Yes, that is what I understood. Thanks.


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