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Thread: Spaghetti Bowl

  1. #1
    mathew stouffer's Avatar
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    Default Spaghetti Bowl

    Ok I am not electrician and electrical is probably my weakest aspect. However, when I see something like this and the electrician on the remodel says it's fine and I am a trouble maker, I had to laugh. I am glad it's Friday. Time for a few Stellas.

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  2. #2
    Brian Thomas's Avatar
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    Quote Originally Posted by mathew stouffer View Post
    Ok I am not electrician and electrical is probably my weakest aspect. However, when I see something like this and the electrician on the remodel says it's fine and I am a trouble maker, I had to laugh. I am glad it's Friday. Time for a few Stellas.
    Electrical is my weakest area as well which is why Im curious about the first pic. Did you take that pic because of the knockout that doesnt have a protective sleeve so the wire wont get cut or damaged? Or is it because of the doorbell transformer in the box? If that is indeed a doorbell transformer, i cant be sure


  3. #3
    A.D. Miller's Avatar
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Thomas View Post
    Electrical is my weakest area as well which is why Im curious about the first pic. Did you take that pic because of the knockout that doesnt have a protective sleeve so the wire wont get cut or damaged? Or is it because of the doorbell transformer in the box? If that is indeed a doorbell transformer, i cant be sure
    BT: I think he took the first photo for both reasons you stated.


  4. #4
    Brian Thomas's Avatar
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    Quote Originally Posted by A.D. Miller View Post
    BT: I think he took the first photo for both reasons you stated.
    Thanks AD. So whats the problem with doorbell transformer being placed in the panel? I know its not a good thing but Im just wondering the reason


  5. #5
    mathew stouffer's Avatar
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    you got it. Plus there were two double taps above that but I forgot that photo


  6. #6
    Brian Thomas's Avatar
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    Quote Originally Posted by mathew stouffer View Post
    you got it. Plus there were two double taps above that but I forgot that photo
    2 double taps is enough to refer it out to an electrician on its own but it seems that box had alot more problems than just the double taps


  7. #7
    A.D. Miller's Avatar
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Thomas View Post
    Thanks AD. So whats the problem with doorbell transformer being placed in the panel? I know its not a good thing but Im just wondering the reason
    BT: It is not NEC compliant. It belongs in its own covered junction box - with all of the splices concealed within.


  8. #8
    Brian Thomas's Avatar
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    Quote Originally Posted by A.D. Miller View Post
    BT: It is not NEC compliant. It belongs in its own covered junction box - with all of the splices concealed within.
    Thanks for the info. AD it is much appreciated


  9. #9
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    Quote Originally Posted by mathew stouffer View Post
    the electrician on the remodel says
    I think you are stretching the use of the word "electrician" about as much as he is stretching saying those are okay.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
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  10. #10
    mathew stouffer's Avatar
    mathew stouffer Guest

    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    Possibly


  11. #11
    Brian Thomas's Avatar
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    I think you are stretching the use of the word "electrician" about as much as he is stretching saying those are okay.
    very true!

    Whats the deal with those cut wires in the last few pics?


  12. #12
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Thomas View Post
    Thanks AD. So whats the problem with doorbell transformer being placed in the panel? I know its not a good thing but Im just wondering the reason
    Quote Originally Posted by A.D. Miller View Post
    BT: It is not NEC compliant. It belongs in its own covered junction box - with all of the splices concealed within.
    Actually, the door bell transformer does not need its own junction box, it is simply installed incorrectly in that enclosure ... however, installing it in its own junction box would make correction easier and save a LOT of work which would needed to accommodate that mounted in that enclosure.

    Also, the low voltage which is in that panel and running to the low voltage transformer needs to be removed and run outside that enclosure.

    The transformer could actually be mounted through a knock out in that enclosure with the 120 volt wires inside the enclosure and the low voltage transformer on the outside of the enclosure, with the low voltage wires run outside the enclosure.

    Of course, though, if that were down, one would need to make a cut out in the wall and box it in to allow access to and replacement of the transformer, and that drywall being used to box that cut out in would need framing behind it, so ...

    It would be EASIER to run a piece of NM cable to a junction box, with a proper clamp at each end, and flush mount the junction box where the transformer is mounted through a knock out in its cover, or, surface mount a junction box where the transformer can be mounted through a side knock out in the junction box, provided there is clearance to the wall to install the transformer (i.e., would require a deep box).

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
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    www.AskCodeMan.com

  13. #13
    A.D. Miller's Avatar
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    It would be EASIER to run a piece of NM cable to a junction box, with a proper clamp at each end, and flush mount the junction box where the transformer is mounted through a knock out in its cover, or, surface mount a junction box where the transformer can be mounted through a side knock out in the junction box, provided there is clearance to the wall to install the transformer (i.e., would require a deep box).
    JP: And that is why I stated that this is where it "belongs".


  14. #14
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    Quote Originally Posted by A.D. Miller View Post
    BT: It is not NEC compliant. It belongs in its own covered junction box - with all of the splices concealed within.
    Quote Originally Posted by A.D. Miller View Post
    JP: And that is why I stated that this is where it "belongs".
    It does not "belong" there, it just "makes sense" there.

    There is a difference.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
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  15. #15
    A.D. Miller's Avatar
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    It does not "belong" there, it just "makes sense" there.

    There is a difference.
    JP: Webster's seems to believe that the term "belong" denotes "to be suitable, appropriate or advantageous". With that in mind, I feel certain that my chosen word "belongs" in the statement right where I put it.

    Does that "make sense" to you?


  16. #16
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    Quote Originally Posted by A.D. Miller View Post
    JP: Webster's seems to believe that the term "belong" denotes "to be suitable, appropriate or advantageous". With that in mind, I feel certain that my chosen word "belongs" in the statement right where I put it.

    Does that "make sense" to you?
    Webster's also says other definitions in there, read them, read what I said again, and you will see that I am MORE correct than you are.


    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
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  17. #17
    A.D. Miller's Avatar
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    Webster's also says other definitions in there, read them, read what I said again, and you will see that I am MORE correct than you are.
    JP: You need to learn to read that old high school dictionary of yours. The definitions are listed (and even numbered) in order of their common acceptance and usage. Those w-a-y d--o--w--n a---t t----h----e
    e-----n-----d, you know, down there where you are referring to, are only used on occasion by fringe groups who have chronically been off of their meds.

    As to you being more correct than I, we are in agreement, at least in part. You are definitely more something than I am. Exactly what is a matter for yet another debate.


  18. #18
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Thomas View Post
    2 double taps is enough to refer it out to an electrician on its own but it seems that box had alot more problems than just the double taps
    I am just curious. Can you go through a couple of those "a lot more" problems?
    I see a couple of things, but other than being a mess there is not a whole lot "wrong" there.
    I am wondering what you all see. (Jerry, you keep out of this one. )

    I bet one of those dreaded double taps is the chime transformer.


  19. #19
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    Quote Originally Posted by A.D. Miller View Post
    JP: You need to learn to read that old high school dictionary of yours. The definitions are listed (and even numbered) in order of their common acceptance and usage. Those w-a-y d--o--w--n a---t t----h----e
    e-----n-----d, you know, down there where you are referring to, are only used on occasion by fringe groups who have chronically been off of their meds.

    As to you being more correct than I, we are in agreement, at least in part. You are definitely more something than I am. Exactly what is a matter for yet another debate.

    Aaron,

    As usual you are leaving out what you want to, so ... one of the ones I posted was at the same number as yours, which makes yours not applicable (according to you)?

    You posted *1* definition to support you.

    I posted *3* definitions to support the most common thinking, again, not you.

    Now, if my math is correct ... *3* is "lower down" the number chain than *1* is, but ... *3* is a higher number, so that means the list is of more importance as the numbers go up?

    Now, as to you being off your meds ...

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
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  20. #20
    Brian Thomas's Avatar
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    Quote Originally Posted by Speedy Petey View Post
    I am just curious. Can you go through a couple of those "a lot more" problems?
    I see a couple of things, but other than being a mess there is not a whole lot "wrong" there.
    I am wondering what you all see. (Jerry, you keep out of this one. )

    I bet one of those dreaded double taps is the chime transformer.
    Well, for one thing...the 2 previous problems I mentioned which are the doorbell transformer being in the panel(which seems to have sparked quite a debate between JP and AD ) another problem is the knockout in the bottom that doesnt have a protective collar to protect the wire coming in.

    Also there appears to be 2 wires in the 2nd 3rd and 4th pic near the top, that have no wire nuts or anything to protect anyone from shock...are those wires live? Are they dead? Im not sure. That plus the entire box appears to be very crowded with wires. Thats enough for me to recommend electrician.

    Im sure JP or others can see some problems that I cant see and I would love to know what they are as electrical is definitely my arera where I need the most improvement in.


  21. #21
    A.D. Miller's Avatar
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    As usual you are leaving out what you want to, so ...
    You posted *1* definition to support you.
    JP: As is my prerogative.

    I posted *3* definitions to support the most common thinking, again, not you.
    JP: Those three, not being in first place, all totaled, do not equal the definition if first place. It's an algorithm thing, you know.

    Now, if my math is correct ... *3* is "lower down" the number chain than *1* is, but ... *3* is a higher number, so that means the list is of more importance as the numbers go up?
    JP: Yeah, boy. Numbers may not be your forte.

    Now, as to you being off your meds ...
    JP: From the horse's mouth.


  22. #22
    Mike Truss Guy's Avatar
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    Talking Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    I thought this would be about Las Vegas. "Spaghetti Bowl" is the locals name for the I-15 / I-95 freeway interchange.


  23. #23
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Truss Guy View Post
    I thought this would be about Las Vegas. "Spaghetti Bowl" is the locals name for the I-15 / I-95 freeway interchange.

    Huh????

    I-95 is in Vegas?

    I-95 runs up and down the east coast, 2 miles from my house ... and I live a l-o-n-g way from from Vegas.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
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    www.AskCodeMan.com

  24. #24
    Darrel Hood's Avatar
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    Whatsa Stella?


  25. #25
    Mike Truss Guy's Avatar
    Mike Truss Guy Guest

    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    Huh????

    I-95 is in Vegas?

    I-95 runs up and down the east coast, 2 miles from my house ... and I live a l-o-n-g way from from Vegas.
    OK OK. I used to live in Connecticut where I-95 was near my house so I get confused. It's actually US-95.


  26. #26
    max Ng's Avatar
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    Default Re: Spaghetti Bowl

    Quote Originally Posted by Darrel Hood View Post
    Whatsa Stella?
    Stella Artois = Alcohol


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