FPE - Fire Hazard or not! What the Home Owner thought

**Mike Gault** · 10-02-2009, 04:01 AM

Things that make you smile when you see them...:-)

Similar Threads:

Michael Schirmer · 10-02-2009, 11:26 AM

Possible. Up to 60% of the breakers did not trip during an overload, which lead to Fed.Pac. loosing their UL rating. They then went out of business to avoid a re-call.

Federal Pacific Electric FPE Stab-Lok Panel Circuit Breaker Hazard, Repairs, Electrical Panel Replacement Electricians Directory for Stab-Lok Repairs

Bill Nolte · 08-04-2010, 12:01 PM

Originally Posted by Michael Schirmer

Possible. Up to 60% of the breakers did not trip during an overload, which lead to Fed.Pac. loosing their UL rating. They then went out of business to avoid a re-call.

Federal Pacific Electric FPE Stab-Lok Panel Circuit Breaker Hazard, Repairs, Electrical Panel Replacement Electricians Directory for Stab-Lok Repairs

Actually I am pretty sure FPE did not go out of business as they still manufacture transformers, Medium Voltage Switchgear and other electrical items. They lost their UL listing on "Stab-Lok" and ceased manufacture of such equipment. Check them out @ Welcome to Federal Pacific Switchgear and Transformers.
As a Master Electrician, I always recommend replacement as there just don't appear to be any other good remedies for a stab-lok load center.

**wayne soper** · 08-04-2010, 06:27 PM

Local code enforcement here in ct has no problem with them because the state has not issued a statement indicating they should be changed out.
I find them in fully remodeled homes listed as all new electricals.
I always say replace.
By the way, that one looks real nice.
UNtil it catches on fire

**Randy Aldering** · 08-06-2010, 08:55 AM

I always pull the panel cover, to look for signs of arcing or overheating. From my recollection, the FPE name was sold and re-sold several times. There are still replacement breakers out there. I see these frequently enough. I found one in a garage that had originally been the main panel in the house. It was being used as a sub-panel in the garage. The property belonged to a chief at one of the local fire departments. We discussed the history of FPE panels. He had it replaced the next day, and gave me the FPE panel and breakers. I opened it up in the shop and removed the breakers. WOW. The bus bars were discolored, there were areas of pitting and crazing, suggesting arcing. The breakers showed signs of over-heating near the stab. And all of this was not visible with the breakers installed, unless the panel was examined very carefully.

**H.G. Watson, Sr.** · 08-30-2010, 09:35 AM

Originally Posted by Bill Nolte

Actually I am pretty sure FPE did not go out of business as they still manufacture transformers, Medium Voltage Switchgear and other electrical items. They lost their UL listing on "Stab-Lok" and ceased manufacture of such equipment. Check them out @ Welcome to Federal Pacific Switchgear and Transformers.
As a Master Electrician, I always recommend replacement as there just don't appear to be any other good remedies for a stab-lok load center.

Well, you're wrong.

Apparently you have no idea what happens when a company is bankrupted and assets (including I.P. and non-tangables) are liquidated.

There have been many such in the long history of "federal" and at least two such dissolutions in the (relatively recent) history of the transformer and switchgear.

If you don't bother to even do a cursory bit of research to support your "certanties" why bother to post?

This is not unlike thinking "American Standard" Furnaces manufactured in the 50s 60s and early 70s have ANYTHING to do with the "American Standard" of today, or HVAC items mfg today with the "licensed brand name" have anything to do with the plumbing fixture manufacturer!

**Paul Kondzich** · 08-30-2010, 09:43 AM

Originally Posted by H.G. Watson, Sr.

Well, you're wrong.

Apparently you have no idea what happens when a company is bankrupted and assets (including I.P. and non-tangables) are liquidated.

There have been many such in the long history of "federal" and at least two such dissolutions in the (relatively recent) history of the transformer and switchgear.

If you don't bother to even do a cursory bit of research to support your "certanties" why bother to post?

This is not unlike thinking "American Standard" Furnaces manufactured in the 50s 60s and early 70s have ANYTHING to do with the "American Standard" of today, or HVAC items mfg today with the "licensed brand name" have anything to do with the plumbing fixture manufacturer!

HG are you in a worse mood than usual today. It appears you are looking at all your replies today.

Maybe you are itching to get back to your doublewide and be miserable with all the other people in the 'resort."

**H.G. Watson, Sr.** · 08-30-2010, 10:43 AM

Originally Posted by Paul Kondzich

HG are you in a worse mood than usual today. It appears you are looking at all your replies today.

Maybe you are itching to get back to your doublewide and be miserable with all the other people in the 'resort."

Reported.

**Randy Aldering** · 08-30-2010, 10:46 AM

The name may have survived, but the company did not. The name was sold several times after the company went under. The previous link posted is not the same company.

As for that fire extinguisher next to the panel - I think it would be better to mount it about 6 feet away. No sense in becoming a statistic reaching for a fire extinguisher. It's not going to do much good any way, if that panel lites up. The meter would have to be pulled first, and then the fire extinguished. No one should pull a meter under load without proper protective gear. I know firefighters that have been injured pulling meters even while fully suited and wearing gloves.

Bill Nolte · 08-30-2010, 12:33 PM

Originally Posted by H.G. Watson, Sr.

Well, you're wrong.

Apparently you have no idea what happens when a company is bankrupted and assets (including I.P. and non-tangables) are liquidated.

There have been many such in the long history of "federal" and at least two such dissolutions in the (relatively recent) history of the transformer and switchgear.

If you don't bother to even do a cursory bit of research to support your "certanties" why bother to post?

This is not unlike thinking "American Standard" Furnaces manufactured in the 50s 60s and early 70s have ANYTHING to do with the "American Standard" of today, or HVAC items mfg today with the "licensed brand name" have anything to do with the plumbing fixture manufacturer!

The division that manufactured transformers and also the division that manufactured switchgear are both in operation in many of the same plants with many of the same people. These FPE items were never unavailable as is frequently typical with a bankrupt or dissolved company. The only division that went away were the divisions that manufactured "Stab-lok" equipment. Even 'Stab-lok" was manufactured in Canada for a while after they were no longer made in the U.S.. "Stab-lok replacements have been made by a myriad of companies since the demise of FPEs "Stab-lok" manufacturing division. The selling of a division does not mean the company is no longer in business, somewhat similar to when IBM spun off Lexmark, both are still in business. If you sold you inspection business does it mean the business is no longer functioning????
The attitude is not needed and counter-productive.

**H.G. Watson, Sr.** · 08-30-2010, 04:26 PM

Originally Posted by Bill Nolte

The division that manufactured transformers and also the division that manufactured switchgear are both in operation in many of the same plants with many of the same people. These FPE items were never unavailable as is frequently typical with a bankrupt or dissolved company. The only division that went away were the divisions that manufactured "Stab-lok" equipment. Even 'Stab-lok" was manufactured in Canada for a while after they were no longer made in the U.S.. "Stab-lok replacements have been made by a myriad of companies since the demise of FPEs "Stab-lok" manufacturing division. The selling of a division does not mean the company is no longer in business, somewhat similar to when IBM spun off Lexmark, both are still in business. If you sold you inspection business does it mean the business is no longer functioning????
The attitude is not needed and counter-productive.

You are so very WRONG in your rendition!!!!!

I earlier made a comparison between FPE and American Standard - IT FITS - as almost Identical happenings at nearly the same time period and both subsequent "divisional" reorganizations, sales, later mergers, etc. "FPE" however is even MORE complicated and YES neither "operation" is related to its 1960s and early 70s "ownership heirachy" That hierachy hasn't existed as a functioning corporate entity with any market assets in any form for a long time.

Not only have there been NUMEROUS full liquidations, NUMBEROUS reorganizations of a MULTITUDE of OWNERS, MULTITUDE of restructurings of divisions, parent companies, partial sell-offs, re-organizations, etc. but your claim that there as also been a complete uninterupted production and workforce is also false! There was at least TWO complete shutdowns with liquidation via arbitrage third parties and at least one via total bankruptcy liquidation of the late 60's/early 70s Federal Pacific (actually IIRC there have been at least 3 such liquidations, 2 of which were via Delaware, one N.Y forward (including successor "owners") and several re-organizations. That at any point a successor entity HIRED much of the OLD workforce and management, DOESN'T MATTER (which actually happened twice).
Not the least important is that "divisions" of one have been sold/acquired/acquired/divested multiple times. "FPE- NJ" wasn't even just one singular company but three wholey owned subsidarues held via two DE corps with a percentage owned by others (creditors) that were forced into bankruptcy liquidation.

As far as the license to manufacture "Stab-Lok" in U.S. and Canada - that's another long litany, as is who owns that US trademark and who owns that Canadian Trademark.

You'd think being an "electrician" you'd know more about what you're carrying on about!

Neither was "spun off". The ENTITY known then has NOT EXISTED since it was disolved and liquidated - creditors paid and funds via third party abitrage and holding companies to pay out to stockholders (the DE corps and creditors secured via collateralized STOCK), then the DE corps were liquidated. The assets, INCLUDING those INTANGABLES such as the right to use the many divisional "name" of the companies were SOLD, trademarks, Intellectual Properties (such as patents, etc.) sold, as were the factories, equipment, receivables, etc.

Schneider Canada IIRC was producing Canadian panels and breakers via license - IIRC some arrangement now with the US holder runs out end of this or next year..."A...something".

Anyway, neither is the "same company".