Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 65 of 113
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Atlanta, Georgia
    Posts
    1,078

    Default Door blocks Light Switch

    Working a draw inspection contract for a lender. They lender money to flippers. House is a 1960s brick ranch getting some lipstick.

    GC ordered and recieved the correct interior doors for the house. Accidently switched two doors during install. When you open the bedroom door, it covers up the overhead light switch. Seems I remember that you aren't allowed to block switches.

    Am I making up my own rules or is there something in NEC or IRC that says you can't do that?

    Similar Threads:
    2018 ASHI InspectionWorld
    "The Code is not a peak to reach but a foundation to build from."

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Columbus GA
    Posts
    3,746

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    It's stupid, but not addressed in the code.

    ' correct a wise man and you gain a friend... correct a fool and he'll bloody your nose'.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Mesa AZ
    Posts
    1,181

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce Ramsey View Post
    Working a draw inspection contract for a lender. They lender money to flippers. House is a 1960s brick ranch getting some lipstick.

    GC ordered and recieved the correct interior doors for the house. Accidently switched two doors during install. When you open the bedroom door, it covers up the overhead light switch. Seems I remember that you aren't allowed to block switches.

    Am I making up my own rules or is there something in NEC or IRC that says you can't do that?

    Arizona does adress this in the AZ workmanship standards.
    Does the builders association address this in their standards ?

    Phoenix AZ Resale Home, Mobile Home, New Home Warranty Inspections. ASHI Certified Inspector #206929 Arizona Certified Inspector # 38440
    www.inspectaz.com

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    1,898

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Not an NEC issue. In fact the switch does not even have to be in the room according to the NEC. You could have just about all the switches in the house in one location and meet the NEC. The one exception would be a switch for an attic light that needs to be near the entrance to the attic.


  5. #5
    Michael Garrity's Avatar
    Michael Garrity Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    If you check your R code book you will find your answer.At least one wall switch in every habitable room and bathroom.Also look for the words"customary wall switch location"


  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Snowbird (this means I'm retired and migrate between locations), FL/MI
    Posts
    4,086

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce Ramsey View Post
    Working a draw inspection contract for a lender. They lender money to flippers. House is a 1960s brick ranch getting some lipstick.

    GC ordered and recieved the correct interior doors for the house. Accidently switched two doors during install. When you open the bedroom door, it covers up the overhead light switch. Seems I remember that you aren't allowed to block switches.

    Am I making up my own rules or is there something in NEC or IRC that says you can't do that?
    BR: No, you aren't making up your own rules; and Yes, (its a three part construction not just a single citation...) its in the NEC; see below for citations and quotes from 2005 NEC.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rick Cantrell View Post
    It's stupid, but not addressed in the code.
    RC: I disagree, IMO it IS addressed, in the readily accessible requirement for the switch location, which is required to be IN the habital (Bed)room and controlling the required lighting outlet. If entry to the room (necessary to open at least partially the existing door) creates an obstruction to the required readily accessible place of the switch, and the door blank orientation must be removed from the location of access to the switch in order to access the switch; then: that switch LOCATION would NOT be a readily accessible place.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Port View Post
    Not an NEC issue. In fact the switch does not even have to be in the room according to the NEC. You could have just about all the switches in the house in one location and meet the NEC. The one exception would be a switch for an attic light that needs to be near the entrance to the attic.
    JP: I believe that the NEC DOES cover this issue! The ROOM is a BEDROOM, NOT a hallway, stairway, or outdoor entrance which is the ONLY exception to a switch or switch override location via automation. The NEC Clearly REQUIRES the Switch for the lighting outlet be IN the Bedroom, which IS habital space.


    BR (and others) here goes (I'm using 2005 NEC because that's what was handy):

    First, we look at the requirements to having lighting outlets for bedrooms, and how they can be accomplished {note that 270.70(A)(1) REQUIRES the wall switch be IN the BEDROOM, despite Jim Ports claim otherwise}:
    Quote Originally Posted by 2005 NEC
    210 Branch Circuits,
    Part III Required Outlets,




    210.70 Lighting Outlets Required. Lighting outlets shall be installed where specified in 210.70(A), (B), and (C).
    (A) Dwelling Units. In dwelling units, lighting outlets shall be installed in accordance with 210.70(A)(1), (A)(2), and (A)(3).
    (1) Habital Rooms. At least one wall switch-controlled ligting outlet shall be installed in every habital room and bathroom.
    Exception No. 1: In other than kitchens and bathrooms, one or more receptacles controlled by a wall switch shall be permitted in lieu of lighting outlets.
    Exception No. 2: Lighting outlets shall be permitted to be controlled by occupancy sensors that are (1) in addition to wall switches or (2) located at a customary wall switch location and equipped with a manual override that will allow the sensor to function as a wall switch.
    (2) Additional Locations. Additional lighting outlets shall be installed in accordance with (A)(2)(a), (A)(2)(b), and (A)(2)(c).
    (a) At least one wall switch-controlled lighting outlet shall be installed in hallways, stairways, attached garages, and detached garages with electric power.
    (b) For dwelling units, attached garages, and detached garabes with electric power, at least one wall switch-controlled lighting outlet shall be installed to provide illuminiation on the exterior side of outdoor entrances or exits with grade level access. A vehicle door in a garage shall not be considered as an outdoor entrance or exit.
    (c) Where one or more lighting outlet(s) are installed for interior stairways, there shall be a wall switch at each floor level, and landing level that includes an entryway, to control the lighting outlet(s) where the stairway between floor levels has six risers or more.
    Exception to (A)(2)(a), (A)(2)(b), and (A)(2)(c): In hallways, stairways, and at outdoor entrances, remote, central, or automatic control of lighting shall be permitted.
    (3) Storage or Equipment Spaces. For attics, underfloor spaces, utility rooms, and basements, at least one lighting outlet containing a switch or controlled by a wall switch shall be installed where these spaces are used for storage or contain equipment requiring servicing. At least one point of control shall be at the usual point of entry to these spaces. The lighting outlet shall be provided at or near the equipment requiring servicing.


    Next we backtrack to Article 100, Definitions, Part I, General at:
    Quote Originally Posted by 2005 NEC
    Accessible, Readily (Readily Accessible). Capable of being reached quickly for operation, renewal, or inspections without requiring those to whom ready access is requisite to climb over or remove obstacles or to resort to portable laders, and so forth.
    With this definition in mind we can better understand the phrase "readily accessible place" as it appears in 404.8(A) which I will quote later below.

    Having to swing a door closed in order to access is IMHO requiring the removal from the place of the switch access, i.e. relocation/movement of the obstacle, (the door blank) which by one's entrance to the room and the purpose for the required switch location, is obstructed by the door blank, and requires removal/movement of the obstical, by operation of the hinge (to close or partially close the door, in the dark, for the purpose of accessing and operating the switch to the required lighting outlet.

    Next, we address the requirement of ready access to the place of the switch from Article 404, Switches (in case there is doubt, included the Scope as well):

    Quote Originally Posted by 2005 NEC

    404.1 Scope. The provisions of this article shall apply to all switches, switching devices, and circuit breakers where used as switches.



    404.8 Accessibility and Grouping
    (A) Location. All switches and circuit breakers used as switches shall be located so that they may be operated from a readily accessible place. They shall be installed such that the center of the grip of the operating handle of the switch or circuit breaker, when in its highest position, is no mroe than 2.0 m (6 ft 7 in.) above the floor or working platform.

    Exception No. 1: On busway installations, fused switches and circuit breakers shall be permitted to be located at the same level as the busway. Suitable means shall be provided to operate the handle of the device from the floor.
    Exception No. 2: Switches and circuit breakers installed adjacent to motors, appliances, or other equipment that they supply shall be permitted to be located higher than 2.0 m (6 ft 7 in.) and to be accessible by portable means.
    Exception No. 3: Hookstick operable isolating switches shall be permitted at greater heights.

    Thus, the wall switch location, as you described it, for the required lighting outlet (or substitute switch controlled receptacle/s) in the room, is not readily accessible, or in a location which provides ready access upon entry to the room in question via the door; as required by the article(s) section(s) referenced above.





    Last edited by H.G. Watson, Sr.; 03-16-2010 at 10:41 PM. Reason: Formatting; Never posts exactly as it looks in preview mode!!

  7. #7
    A.D. Miller's Avatar
    A.D. Miller Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    HG: Good call.


  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Columbus GA
    Posts
    3,746

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    H.G.
    I must say. That is the best rebuttal I can remember you posting. You did not put down, or demean anyone. It was well thought out, with a clear direction of what you wanted the reader to understand.
    Good job.

    ' correct a wise man and you gain a friend... correct a fool and he'll bloody your nose'.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    state of jefferson
    Posts
    520

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    hg,
    would you approve a clapper?


  10. #10
    A.D. Miller's Avatar
    A.D. Miller Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by brian schmitt View Post
    hg,
    would you approve a clapper?
    Exception No. 2: Lighting outlets shall be permitted to be controlled by occupancy sensors that are (1) in addition to wall switches or (2) located at a customary wall switch location and equipped with a manual override that will allow the sensor to function as a wall switch.



  11. #11
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    745

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by A.D. Miller View Post
    HG: Good call.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rick Cantrell View Post
    H.G.
    I must say. That is the best rebuttal I can remember you posting. You did not put down, or demean anyone. It was well thought out, with a clear direction of what you wanted the reader to understand.
    Good job.
    I agree it was well thought out, however.....I don't agree with you. You don't have to "remove" the door to access the switch. I believe this section means that you can't have the switch in an area that requires you to climb over anything, you don't have to remove an obstacles, you may need to close the door a little but you're not removing it. It's still there! or to resort to portable laders, and so forth.

    Not addressed in the code IMO.


  12. #12
    A.D. Miller's Avatar
    A.D. Miller Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne Carlisle View Post
    I agree it was well thought out, however.....I don't agree with you. You don't have to "remove" the door to access the switch. I believe this section means that you can't have the switch in an area that requires you to climb over anything, you don't have to remove an obstacles, you may need to close the door a little but you're not removing it. It's still there! or to resort to portable laders, and so forth.

    Not addressed in the code IMO.
    WC: Only a building official would argue against a common sense interpretation of the code. Any idiot who installs a switch behind a door is no worse than one who approves that sort of hair-brained installation. Present company excepted - of course . . .


  13. #13
    dana1028's Avatar
    dana1028 Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Wow!! Whew!!

    May I give you a real life perspective on this, from an electrical inspector's view...i.e. what authority I have to actually enforce the electrical code.

    1. readily accessible - whew! Having to close a door makes this not readily accessible?? No way - having to close a door when entering a room to access a switch does not violate the electrical code ... period.

    2. Requiring the light switch to be inside the 'habitable room'....sorry, have some bad news folks.

    Per NEC 210.70(A)(1) - Habitable Rooms - 'at least one wall switch-controlled lighting outlet shall be installed in every habitable room...'

    The 'lighting outlet' must be in the room....not the switch.... a switch is not an 'outlet' as defined by the NEC.

    Outlet - 'a point on the wiring system at which current is taken to supply utlization equipment.' - a switch does not utilize current [a light bulb does]...the 'outlet' is where current is utilized.

    So - believe it or not, the switch really can be outside the room; sometimes this is a better location than inside the room; depending on how the room is layed out, where built in cabinets are placed, door swing, etc....it just might be more convenient for the occupant to have the switch just outside the door rather than inside the room behind the door.

    I know you all have your opinions, but my opinions must be supported by the code - when I have questions about code application I look at the ROPs, ask members of the code making panels to the NEC, or other experts in that field.

    Have you had an inspector make you do something 'because he thinks so' or 'I like it this way', 'this is how we do it in Dodge', of course you have; that doesn't make it right. Push come to shove, when a contractor complains up through the chain of command, up to the Board of Appeals if necessary these types of 'corrections' or 'cowboy calls' are not enforcable.


  14. #14
    A.D. Miller's Avatar
    A.D. Miller Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Push come to shove, when a contractor complains up through the chain of command, up to the Board of Appeals if necessary these types of 'corrections' or 'cowboy calls' are not enforcable.
    HG presented the argument eloquently, but that sort of reasoning never seems to stop AHJs or their lackeys from carrying on as if their anachronistic asses were on fire.

    Being on the Building and Fire Codes Board of the tenth largest city in Texas, I would have to take exception with your last statement. If this one comes across my desk, the switch will be moved. Additionally, the inspector who green-tagged the installation will get a rather pointed note from me that will be CC'd to the AHJ and the city council.


  15. #15
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    745

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    It's all in the interpretation! And guess what? A HI's interpretation don't count! A HI can only give an opinion.

    Is it stupid to put a switch behind a door? Yes! Is it against code? No!


  16. #16
    Michael Garrity's Avatar
    Michael Garrity Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    So what does "customary wall switch location" mean.I believe in most places the custom would be to place the switch inside as you enter the room.



  17. #17
    A.D. Miller's Avatar
    A.D. Miller Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne Carlisle View Post
    It's all in the interpretation! And guess what? A HI's interpretation don't count! A HI can only give an opinion.

    Is it stupid to put a switch behind a door? Yes! Is it against code? No!
    WC: Either English is not your first language or you simply inherited the AHJ (Anti Heuristic Judgment) gene. And, stupid is as stupid does, either installing or approving.

    As for the inability of an HI to render an interpretation, on the street, maybe you are right. That is, until you meet up with a competent one on the other side of the court room from you.


  18. #18
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Snowbird (this means I'm retired and migrate between locations), FL/MI
    Posts
    4,086

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    The phrase "remove obstacles" is actually saying exactly that.

    "obstacles" is the example object in plural.

    "remove" can be found in the dictionary, you will not find it defined in the NEC.

    remove means to position again or move again.

    I invite you to peruse your dictionary, take notice of the use of the verb remove with an object,

    The prefix "re" when used with a verb

    And the verb "move" when used with an object ("to move").

    The object requiring re-positioning or adjusting its position or placement AGAIN is the obstacle, in this case the door blank. Just because it remains attached to the door frame via the hinge does not mean it has not had to be removed from the area required for the "readily accessible place".

    There is more than one definition for access, readily in the NEC, key is knowing WHICH one applies to WHICH use of the phrase. Application and construction, as per the style manual, etc.

    Furthermore, one can review prior editions of the code, in addition to the ROP discussions to "devine" the history, intent, and application. One needs also to keep in mind the introduction of the code itself, its purpose and scope. The intent is to increase minimum safety not reduce. The safety is not just in how the equipment is installed and maintaining the safety of the equipment and the structure it is in, but safety in its approach, use and operation by persons.

    The days of wandering through a vast dark room waving ones arms in the air feeling for a pull string (without a special knowledge of the floor plan of the items contained there-in and special knowledge of just where and how high or low that pull chain/string would be encountered, falling down stairs in the dark before a switch is encountered are supposed to be in the past.

    The phrase was "switch controlled lightiing outlet" and that field assembled and installed object system - must be IN the (bed) ROOM, A portion - the "lighting outlet" may be substituted for switch controlled receptacle, which also must be IN the ROOM. Both the "switch controll" and the "Lighting Outlet" are required to be in the room. There is nothing which prohibits an alternate controll (as long as there is an override IN the room) or switch (such as a 3-way or 4-way switch loop) to be in the room or outside the room but there must be one IN the HABITAL room.

    Occupied, but not habital spaces have their own rule construction regarding required SWITCH(es) location(s), should there be one (or two, etc.), ex. storage spaces, closets, hallways, entrances, stairways, etc. and bathrooms.

    We can approach it from another direction regarding a room with more than one entryway requiring more than one switch to control a required lighting outlet, or more than one switch controlled lighting outlets (if the multiple switch locations do not share the same lighting outlet).

    Door openings and door swing directions are noted on electrical plans. The OP indicates the plans were correct and the contractor inadvertantly swapped a LH door with a RH door, both doors indicated in the supply list and plans, but installed in the wrong door openings.

    Door swing, path of travel, egress paths, these are all reviewed during the plan review/permitting process. The door is in violation - and a deviation from plans. Natural light would not necessarily be available for example in the middle of a dark, cloudy, and moonless night.

    We can also approach it from yet another direction; would a receptacle be required along the wall space which is obstructed by the door blank when the door is fully open, and why or why not?

    Last edited by H.G. Watson, Sr.; 03-17-2010 at 03:44 PM.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    745

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by A.D. Miller View Post
    As for the inability of an HI to render an interpretation, on the street, maybe you are right. That is, until you meet up with a competent one on the other side of the court room from you.
    I know several who think they are competent..........

    Yes sir....I allowed that switch to be installed behind the door! Well it's not actually behind the door if you are on the inside and the door is closed!


  20. #20
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Snowbird (this means I'm retired and migrate between locations), FL/MI
    Posts
    4,086

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne Carlisle View Post
    I know several who think they are competent..........

    Yes sir....I allowed that switch to be installed behind the door! Well it's not actually behind the door if you are on the inside and the door is closed!
    Flies in the face of the logic that is behind the code provisions in the first place.

    The primary function of the "switch controlled lighting outlet" requirement in the first place is to assist one's (especially one who does not have special knowledge as to everything's placement within the room [or area] and its overall floor plan & contents) entrance into the room (or area) safely, when no natural light is available, and to safely navigate one's path of travel within the area.


  21. #21
    A.D. Miller's Avatar
    A.D. Miller Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    [quote=Wayne Carlisle;124684]I know several who think they are competent..........

    WC: I can introduce you to a couple of AHJs here in my area who have been successfully sued based solely upon a home inspector's interpretations of their nasty selective code enforcement tactics. You could always move up here to Nosebleed North Texas and try your luck . . .

    Or, perhaps you would rather remain ensconced in the part of the State where it is more than rumored that at least 70% of the new homes have not even been inspected by the AHJs responsible for them in the past few years.

    Last edited by A.D. Miller; 03-18-2010 at 03:19 AM.

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    On The Mason-Dixon Line
    Posts
    577

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Based on the ORIGINAL post ...
    The electrician did not screw up, the Carpenter did. Make him put the correct doors in the correct locations.


  23. #23
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
    Posts
    26,248

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    H.G.,

    Good post and good use of the NEC, albeit an incorrect post and incorrect use of the NEC.

    To wit: (I've changed the highlighting)
    - 210.70 Lighting Outlets Required. Lighting outlets shall be installed where specified in 210.70(A), (B), and (C).
    - - (A) Dwelling Units. In dwelling units, lighting outlets shall be installed in accordance with 210.70(A)(1), (A)(2), and (A)(3).
    - - - (1) Habital Rooms. At least one wall switch-controlled ligting outlet shall be installed in every habital room and bathroom.

    The above only requires the lighting OUTLET to be located IN every habitable room and bathroom. That section does not address the SWITCH location at all - it only states that the OUTLET must be SWITCHED ... wherever the switch may be located.

    Next we have:
    - Accessible, Readily (Readily Accessible). Capable of being reached quickly for operation, renewal, or inspections without requiring those to whom ready access is requisite to climb over or remove obstacles or to resort to portable ladders, and so forth.

    If applying that to doors, which swing "out of the way", and calling them "obstacles", then, but that application, no ... yes, NO ... panel would be allowed to have a door as that door would be an "obstacle" the "readily accessible place" where the overcurrent devices are located.

    That section simply does not fly, or, should I say, it flies in the face of over 110 years of NEC application, interpretation, and use.

    Finally we have:
    - 404.8 Accessibility and Grouping
    - - (A) Location. All switches and circuit breakers used as switches shall be located so that they may be operated from a readily accessible place. They shall be installed such that the center of the grip of the operating handle of the switch or circuit breaker, when in its highest position, is no more than 2.0 m (6 ft 7 in.) above the floor or working platform.

    The switch itself does not have to be "readily accessible", just the location of the switch must be "readily accessible", and that space is "readily accessible", otherwise no door would be allowed to be installed anywhere as one would not be able to be required to open a door to turn a light on or off. Thus, if a bedroom light, as in this example, were left on and the door closed, then the door ... er ... "obstacle" would need to be "removed" before the switch could be accessed.

    Nope, there is nothing in the NEC which requires a switch to be in the same room as the switched lighting OUTLET.

    And, yes, the above is from someone who would like to have the code specify that a switch should be located within the same room as the wall- switch controlled lighting outlet, but, alas, it does not.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  24. #24
    A.D. Miller's Avatar
    A.D. Miller Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    JP: That is mere nonsense. Well written, but nonsense nevertheless. The "door" on an electrical panel, as you refer to it, is an integral part of the panel as it was tested for its listing and labeling. The door in the wall is not a part of the electrical panel, but rather in this case, it is an obstacle, installed by a skilled carpenter just to confuse an electrician (something nearly anyone can do with no practice) and provide us with fodder for the current discussion.

    As for your ultimate statement regarding location, location, location - more blather, I fear. How was it? Only the switch's location and not the switch itself must be readily accessible? If this is some Flahidian's backhanded attempt at holding forth on quantum physics, it is not working . . . Look at it from this perspective: You demand access to your money, right? Maybe even ready access? Not to worry. Send it to me. After all, it is not its location that is important, but just its location's access. And, I am always readily accessible. Email me for a bank account number and we'll begin the transfer of funds . . .

    I'll play along for a moment, though. Since you were obviously thinking with the wrong head, it is not your logic that is faulty, just the location from whence it came.



    Last edited by A.D. Miller; 03-18-2010 at 05:18 AM.

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    745

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by A.D. Miller View Post
    WC: I can introduce you to a couple of AHJs here in my area who have been successfully sued based solely upon a home inspector's interpretations of their nasty selective code enforcement tactics. You could always move up here to Nosebleed North Texas and try your luck . . .

    Or, perhaps you would rather remain ensconced in the part of the State where it is more than rumored that at least 70% of the new homes have not even been inspected by the AHJs responsible for them in the past few years.
    I can agree with your comment where AHJ's have been successfully sued for their nasty selective code enforcement and they should be.

    However as long as you apply all of your policies and interpretations uniformly to contractors, that is not being selective.

    And as far as it's rumored that at least 70% of the new homes have not even been inspected by the AHJs responsible for them in the past few years. I've never heard that one before! That's quite a large number. Is this your rumor?


  26. #26
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    state of jefferson
    Posts
    520

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce Ramsey View Post
    Working a draw inspection contract for a lender. They lender money to flippers. House is a 1960s brick ranch getting some lipstick.

    GC ordered and recieved the correct interior doors for the house. Accidently switched two doors during install. When you open the bedroom door, it covers up the overhead light switch. Seems I remember that you aren't allowed to block switches.

    Am I making up my own rules or is there something in NEC or IRC that says you can't do that?
    i have no problem with that arrangement. for those who feel otherwise for anal reasons simply remove the door and let the owner put it back on the hinges later,or change the swing and patch the jamb!


  27. #27
    Michael Garrity's Avatar
    Michael Garrity Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    It's only anal if you think it is OK to have a light switch behind a door or any other obstacle regardless of your interpretation of the code.If you think other wise you should be flipping burgers.


  28. #28
    A.D. Miller's Avatar
    A.D. Miller Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne Carlisle View Post
    I can agree with your comment where AHJ's have been successfully sued for their nasty selective code enforcement and they should be.

    However as long as you apply all of your policies and interpretations uniformly to contractors, that is not being selective.

    And as far as it's rumored that at least 70% of the new homes have not even been inspected by the AHJs responsible for them in the past few years. I've never heard that one before! That's quite a large number. Is this your rumor?
    WC: It's not from me and is apparently not a rumor . . .

    Attached Files Attached Files

  29. #29
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Atlanta, Georgia
    Posts
    1,078

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    While at the last inspection, I mentioned to the carpenter the doors covered the light switches. His response was "it is the same way in my house." I also pointed out he recieved the correct doors, they were just installed in the wrong bedrooms.

    Perfomed another draw inspection this morning. The carpenter swapped the doors and the light switches are no longer blocked or inaccessible.

    Thanks for all the spirited debate. All it took was to mention the error to the carpenter and investor. Things got better.

    "The Code is not a peak to reach but a foundation to build from."

  30. #30
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    745

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by A.D. Miller View Post
    Or, perhaps you would rather remain ensconced in the part of the State where it is more than rumored that at least 70% of the new homes have not even been inspected by the AHJs responsible for them in the past few years.
    You made it sound like 70% of all the homes constructed in Texas was not inspected. From the article you posted San Antonio didn't make all inspections required. That's a little different than 70% of all homes constructed didn't even get inspected. just a tad bit of difference.

    I'll agree there are some corrupted AHJ inspectors out there however I would be willing to bet you a dollar to a donut that there are more good inspectors than bad ones. just like in the HI profession, you've got your good one and your bad ones.

    I like to know how many HI's are actually qualified to make code inspections. Not the ones that perform the inspections, but those actually qualified. And I'll include you in those HI's that are qualified.


  31. #31
    Michael Garrity's Avatar
    Michael Garrity Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    From what I've read if I were living in Texas, I would be worried about the inspectors who are qualified and working for my local government.It's easy to get the piece of paper.How you perform your duties,well that's a different matter.


  32. #32
    A.D. Miller's Avatar
    A.D. Miller Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    You made it sound like 70% of all the homes constructed in Texas was not inspected. From the article you posted San Antonio didn't make all inspections required. That's a little different than 70% of all homes constructed didn't even get inspected. just a tad bit of difference.
    WC: No, I did not "make it sound like" that. You read what you wanted to read, while I wrote what I wrote. Big difference between those, huh?

    I'll agree there are some corrupted AHJ inspectors out there however I would be willing to bet you a dollar to a donut that there are more good inspectors than bad ones.
    WC: I have no way of confirming those statistics. What I can do is speak from my personal 35 years of experience. I believe the above-board municipal inspectors to be a small minority of the whole.

    I like to know how many HI's are actually qualified to make code inspections. Not the ones that perform the inspections, but those actually qualified.
    WC: Unfortunately the TREC allows any schmuck who passes their simplistic coloring book exam to inspect whatever they want to. Are they qualified? Not likely. Entry level qualifications to inspect new builds in Texas should be an ICC R-5 ticket and a minimum of 5 years of construction experience. The same is true of municipal inspectors.


  33. #33
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    745

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Garrity View Post
    From what I've read if I were living in Texas, I would be worried about the inspectors who are qualified and working for my local government.It's easy to get the piece of paper.How you perform your duties,well that's a different matter.


    It is a bad situation where the only license an inspector needs is to inspect plumbing. I'm sure there are plenty of inspectors that rely on the tradesmen to do the "right thing". But for the most part most tradesmen are honest and try to do what's right. Yes there are the crappy ones, just like in every state, but hopefully those are the ones who get busted and hammered for shoddy work.

    I for one feel like our inspection department does a good job. Do we catch it all? Nope, but we do our very best too. Take this week for instance, I had around 30 inspections, 12 of those inspections were turned down for various violations. In fact it scares me a little when they ask when the "other" inspector is going to be back. Maybe I'm just a little tougher than what they are used too. I'll definitely have a talk with the other inspector when he gets back!


  34. #34
    A.D. Miller's Avatar
    A.D. Miller Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    WC: I empathize with your plight. Budget cuts, political pressure, et al. . . not for me. I'll stick to this side of the equation where I have a bit more control over things and I do not have to be PC. That, for me, would be the death knoll.


  35. #35
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    1,898

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by H.G. Watson, Sr. View Post
    JP: I believe that the NEC DOES cover this issue! The ROOM is a BEDROOM, NOT a hallway, stairway, or outdoor entrance which is the ONLY exception to a switch or switch override location via automation. The NEC Clearly REQUIRES the Switch for the lighting outlet be IN the Bedroom, which IS habital space.


    BR (and others) here goes (I'm using 2005 NEC because that's what was handy):

    First, we look at the requirements to having lighting outlets for bedrooms, and how they can be accomplished {note that 210.70(A)(1) REQUIRES the wall switch be IN the BEDROOM, despite Jim Ports claim otherwise}:


    Nice try but 210.70 deal with the lighting outlet, not a switch. Read Dana's post #13 or Jerrys in post #23. Only the location of the lighting outlet, not the switch is required to be in the room. I will accept your apology.

    Reading and understanding are two different things entirely.

    I will comment as someone else did that you managed to present your side without your usual derogatory comments. Good job.


  36. #36
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    state of jefferson
    Posts
    520

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Garrity View Post
    It's only anal if you think it is OK to have a light switch behind a door or any other obstacle regardless of your interpretation of the code.If you think other wise you should be flipping burgers.
    michael,
    would you approve the installation of a jamp switch?


  37. #37
    Michael Garrity's Avatar
    Michael Garrity Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    210.70 [1] exception No.2 [2] located at a customary wall switch location -------

    Now is it custom to put the wall switch in the same room as the lighting outlet?yes or no?


  38. #38
    Michael Garrity's Avatar
    Michael Garrity Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    jamp switch?


  39. #39
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Healdsburg, CA
    Posts
    1,741

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    My 1897 NEC mentions nada about lighting switches not being located behind entry doors. Also, did we not have this same discussion about 5 - 6 years ago or was that on another BB?

    Contrary to popular belief I did not provide the string for Benís kite.

    BTW, it was the 1962 NEC that first required new 120 V residential receptacle outlets for general use be both grounded and polarized.

    Jerry McCarthy
    Building Code/ Construction Consultant

  40. #40
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    state of jefferson
    Posts
    520

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Garrity View Post
    jamp switch?
    make that jamb switch! well would ya punk? go ahead make my day! (channeling eastwood in dirty harry) no offense intended!


  41. #41
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Snowbird (this means I'm retired and migrate between locations), FL/MI
    Posts
    4,086

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    210 Branch Circuits,

    III Required Outlets,

    210.70 Lighting Outlets Required. Lighting outlets shall be installed where specified in 210.70(A), (B), and (C).
    (A) Dwelling Units. In dwelling units, lighting outlets shall be installed in accordance with 210.70(A)(1), (A)(2), and (A)(3).
    (1) Habital Rooms. At least one wall switch-controlled ligting outletshall be installed in every habital room and bathroom.
    Exception No. 1: In other than kitchens and bathrooms, one or more receptacles controlled by a wall switch shall be permitted in lieu of lighting outlets.
    Exception No. 2: Lighting outlets shall be permitted to be controlled by occupancy sensors that are (1) in addition to wall switches or (2) located at a customary wall switch location and equipped with a manual override that will allow the sensor to function as a wall switch.

    Lets take a look at that sentance again:

    210 Branch Circuits,
    Part III Required Outlets,

    210.70 Lighting Outlets Required.
    (A) Dwelling Units.
    (1) Habital Rooms. At least one wall switch-controlled ligting outlet shall be installed in every habital room and bathroom.
    Exception No. 1: In other than kitchens and bathrooms, one or more receptacles controlled by a wall switch shall be permitted in lieu of lighting outlets.
    Exception No. 2: Lighting outlets shall be permitted to be controlled by occupancy sensors that are (1) in addition to wall switches or (2) located at a customary wall switch location and equipped with a manual override that will allow the sensor to function as a wall switch.


    At least one
    wall switch-controlled ligting outlet
    shall be installed
    in every habital room and bathroom

    The subject of this requirement is compound.

    The subject IS "wall switch-controlled lighting outlet".

    The subject object IS to be installed
    IN the ROOM.

    In our applied case the habital room within the dwelling IS A BEDROOM.

    The subject of the requirement is not just the lighting outlet itself. It is the REQUIRED CONTROL for the lighting outlet - the SWITCH control (or OVERRIDE for the OCCUPANCY SENSOR) for the lighting outlet which MUST withOUT exception BE IN THE HABITAL ROOM. The LIGHTING OUTLET is ALLOWED to be substituted for a receptacle outlet within the room which is controlled by the required switch which must STILL BE IN THE ROOM.

    Beyond the face of the door along the room side wall when opened or on the latch side, inside wall of the room. Never behind the door.

    The builder needs to swap the prehung doors and install them where they were intended and to plan.


  42. #42
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    1,898

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Try again HG,

    This article is about lighting outlets, not switches.

    The wall-switch is a modifier of the subject lighting outlet. It defines how the lighting outlet is controlled, ie it cannot be an pull chain switch controlled outlet.


  43. #43
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    1,898

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Garrity View Post
    210.70 [1] exception No.2 [2] located at a customary wall switch location -------

    Now is it custom to put the wall switch in the same room as the lighting outlet?yes or no?

    Exception No. 2: Lighting outlets shall be permitted to be controlled by occupancy sensors that are (1) in addition to wall switches or (2) located at a customary wall switch location and equipped with a manual override that will allow the sensor to function as a wall switch.

    This only applies if occupancy sensors are used. If the sensors were not located at the entrance to the room it could turn off while you were in the room as it would not see you.


  44. #44
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Healdsburg, CA
    Posts
    1,741

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    The NEC does not state; above, below, in front of, behind, around the corner, or on the ceiling or floor and never has. In other words, no loction is stipulated within the room, only that it controls a lighting or receptacle outlet!
    Time to move on as this subject is now a very dead horse.

    Jerry McCarthy
    Building Code/ Construction Consultant

  45. #45
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
    Posts
    26,248

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by H.G. Watson, Sr. View Post
    At least one
    wall switch-controlled ligting outlet
    shall be installed
    in every habital room and bathroom

    The subject of this requirement is compound.

    The subject IS "wall switch-controlled lighting outlet".

    The subject object IS to be installed
    IN the ROOM.

    H.G.,

    Try again.

    This is what it says and how it reads:
    At least one
    wall switch-controlled lighting outlet
    shall be installed
    in every habitable room and bathroom

    The subject of this requirement is compound.

    The subject IS "lighting outlet", which is further defined as required to be "wall switch-controlled" ... i.e. "wall switch controlled" is simply a descriptive requirement for the "lighting outlet".

    The subject object IS to be installed
    IN the ROOM.[/quote]

    The lighting outlet is to be installed IN the ROOM, yes.

    The "wall switch-control" for that lighting outlet is not addressed other than to state that it is required to have that type of control (controlled by a wall switch). The "location" of the "wall switch control" is not addressed at all.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  46. #46
    Michael Garrity's Avatar
    Michael Garrity Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Exception 2 states that you can use a sensor along with a wall switch.If you want to use the sensor instead of the wall switch then it must have a manual override and be placed where a wall switch would normally be.As in the customary location.Now the customary location for a switch in the northeast is just inside the door,not behind.Now I have never been to every state in the union but I cannot imagine that there is much of a difference from state to state.
    Now the NEC does not tell us where exactly to put the switch,but it does say it should conform to local custom.

    Time to move on

    jamp switch,I knew what you meant.


  47. #47
    A.D. Miller's Avatar
    A.D. Miller Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    There seem to be only two or three people contributing to this thread that:

    (1) Understand the English language.

    (2) Have a shred of common sense.

    (3) Know anything at all about building houses that are livable for the occupants.

    Those who would argue for the illogical, inconvenient, and possibly unsafe location of light switches behind doors are not counted among these.

    Please put your switches where ever you like. I have some suggestions for locations that might be appropriate.


  48. #48
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
    Posts
    26,248

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by A.D. Miller View Post
    There seem to be only two or three people contributing to this thread that:

    (1) Understand the English language.

    (2) Have a shred of common sense.

    (3) Know anything at all about building houses that are livable for the occupants.

    Those who would argue for the illogical, inconvenient, and possibly unsafe location of light switches behind doors are not counted among these.

    Likewise there seem to only be two or three people contributing to this thread WHO (not "that"):

    (1) Understand the English language ... enough to know that "people" are "who", not "that", and understand the English language enough to see that (3) above is not applicable to the question at hand, to wit:
    "Am I making up my own rules or is there something in NEC or IRC that says you can't do that?"

    For those who do understand the English language, the question at hand was NOT whether some location does or does not have (as stated in (2) above by Aaron) have or relate to "common sense", but relates to "is there something in the NEC or IRC that says you can't do that?"

    For those who understand the English language, the question is, quite obviously, does the NEC or IRC address the LOCATION of the switches which control the LIGHTING OUTLETS IN the rooms, and they also understand the answer to that question is, quite simply, "No, neither the NEC nor the IRC addresses switch LOCATION with regard to within or outside *the room*."

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  49. #49
    Michael Garrity's Avatar
    Michael Garrity Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    what does customary location mean?


  50. #50
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
    Posts
    26,248

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Garrity View Post
    what does customary location mean?
    To whom?
    "Customary location" would, at best, mean "near a point of use", but even that has a problem in that you walk into a bedroom and turn the light on with a switch by the door and lay down in bed, and where is the switch by the bed to turn the light off? In that example, "by the bed" would be "near a point of use", yet that is not required, is it?

    How about walking into a laundry room from a garage and turning a light on, then walking through the laundry room into the kitchen and turning the light off ... no 3-way switch is required, but that sure would be a "customary location" for anyone addressing this with Aaron's "common sense" aspect.

    Code does not address "common sense", code only addresses "minimum" requirements, and, thus, code is silent on the location as "minimum" requirements simply states that the light be "wall switch-controlled" versus having to go to the light and turn it on with a pull chain hanging from the light in the center of the room (like was done in the old days).

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  51. #51
    A.D. Miller's Avatar
    A.D. Miller Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    JP: Dream on, Flahdah.

    ***IMPORTANT*** You Need To Register To View Images ***IMPORTANT*** You Need To Register To View Images

  52. #52
    Phil Brody's Avatar
    Phil Brody Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    sweet AD


  53. #53
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    1,898

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by A.D. Miller View Post
    JP: Dream on, Flahdah.
    Should be a short book for you to read since switch locations aren't mandated, except for attic lighting and stairways with landings that require switches.

    Do you now understand how you were incorrect?


  54. #54
    Ted Menelly's Avatar
    Ted Menelly Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    I write it up if I find it but.............................The light has to be controlled by a switch. It does not say it has to be in the room with the light. As far as the sensor theory........It can be used along with a switch.

    No matter what the code says I write it up for common sense convenience and yes it is just simply stupid to have the switch behind the door.The carpenter that installed the doors needs to come back and switch the doors out.

    I write switches up behind doors in existing homes. This is just to make folks aware that it is behind the door. I do feel it is an accessibility issue but that issue is just for the first time someone walks in the room to find it. It's just a pain in the ass but no longer an accessibility issue.
    AHHHH yup, the switch is behind the door.

    Got that one figured out


  55. #55
    A.D. Miller's Avatar
    A.D. Miller Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Port View Post
    Should be a short book for you to read since switch locations aren't mandated, except for attic lighting and stairways with landings that require switches.

    Do you now understand how you were incorrect?
    JP: Being correct supersedes being logical in your world. Thanks for the invitation, but I think I'll remain in mine.


  56. #56
    Michael Garrity's Avatar
    Michael Garrity Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    customary location

    customary location

    keep repeating these words

    customary location

    customary location

    again

    customary location

    customary location


  57. #57
    A.D. Miller's Avatar
    A.D. Miller Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Garrity View Post
    customary location

    customary location

    keep repeating these words

    customary location

    customary location

    again

    customary location

    customary location
    A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines. - Emerson


  58. #58
    Michael Garrity's Avatar
    Michael Garrity Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    I was just saying the exact same thing to my dog.


  59. #59
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
    Posts
    26,248

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Port View Post
    Do you now understand how you were incorrect?
    Quote Originally Posted by A.D. Miller View Post
    JP: Being correct supersedes being logical in your world.

    Jim,

    Aaron keeps repeating his 'logical' and 'common sense' mantra and uses that to drown out the the original question of whether of not "code" requires lighting switches in those rooms.

    Aaron's droning on is so he does not have to acknowledge that he screwed up and was incorrect.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  60. #60
    Michael Garrity's Avatar
    Michael Garrity Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    ..."The light has to be controlled by a switch. It does not say it has to be in the room with the light. As far as the sensor theory........It can be used along with a switch."


    Yes a sensor can be used along with a switch.But if you want to use a sensor instead of a switch it must have a manual over ride and placed in the customary light switch location.
    Which is where?
    Where is the customary light switch location?
    The NEC tells us that the light switch should be in the customary location.
    Now in your state where would you normally find a light switch?


  61. #61
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
    Posts
    26,248

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Garrity View Post
    ..."The light has to be controlled by a switch. It does not say it has tYes a sensor can be used along with a switch.But if you want to use a sensor instead of a switch it must have a manual over ride and placed in the customary light switch location.
    Which is where?
    Where is the customary light switch location?
    The NEC tells us that the light switch should be in the customary location.
    Now in your state where would you normally find a light switch?
    We keep telling you ... ANYWHERE ... anywhere the switch is "customarily installed".

    It MAY be IN the room ... it MAY be NOT IN the room ... I am not sure how many other ways there are to tell you.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  62. #62
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    1,898

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    In regards to placement of occupancy sensors it is better to locate them on the knob side of the door on the inside of the room. Due to the way the sensor "sees" the movement it is better to go across more than one segment of the beam. Walking straight at the sensor will result in poor performance.

    Ceiling mounts should "see" you anywhere in the room, unless you were blocked by a partition like in an office cubicle or the stall.

    Quote Originally Posted by A.D. Miller View Post
    JP: Being correct supersedes being logical in your world. Thanks for the invitation, but I think I'll remain in mine.
    Being correct is different than being logical. Myself and others clearly explained to you how our answers were correct and yours were not. Heck, a simple adjective seemed to confuse you so logic does not appear to be one of your strong suits.

    Would I ever install a switch not near its' point of function? Being logical I doubt it. Could I, yes and I would be correct and completely satisfy the code. Since post #4 you have been told that you were misinterpreting the Code . However, IMO being correct and logical is even better than being correct, and certainly better than being incorrect. AD, you need to read the part about the Code not being a design manual.

    BTW thanks for staying in your world. I prefer people who can learn from others and are not close-minded.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    Jim,

    Aaron keeps repeating his 'logical' and 'common sense' mantra and uses that to drown out the the original question of whether of not "code" requires lighting switches in those rooms.
    I feel sorry that he has apparently missed this oppurtunity to expand his knowledge of the code and to learn the difference between a requirement and a design issue.

    Last edited by Jim Port; 03-19-2010 at 09:44 PM.

  63. #63
    Michael Garrity's Avatar
    Michael Garrity Guest

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    Is it not the custom in most states, if not all states, that the light switch is in the room where the light is?
    It has to conform to local custom.
    Not anywhere but in the customary location.

    C-U-S-T-O-M-A-R-Y

    YOU CAN FIND OUT WHAT THE WORD MEANS IN A BIG BOOK CALLED A DICTIONARY

    I'm sorry I thought you were hard of hearing.


  64. #64
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    1,898

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    MG,

    Customary is one thing. Having the location mandated by code is something else. Switch location, with few exceptions, is a design issue. The NEC clearly states that it is not a design manual.

    You are also trying to apply a requirement that only applies to occupancy sensors, not all switches. You were also told why this applied to occupancy sensors.


  65. #65
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Southern Vancouver Island
    Posts
    4,546

    Default Re: Door blocks Light Switch

    I'll call it incorrect. Concealed by the open door - Repair. Period. JMO.
    If it's out past the edge of the open door, verbal comment, maybe.

    I had a living room lightswitch a couple of days ago, older condo unit, no light fixture and no wall outlets were on the switch.
    I suspect someone replaced a receptacle and screwed up the hookups, but that's just an opinion.
    I called for an electrician to repair. I know it's a code requirement for that switch to be hooked to an outlet, but I don't use the "C" word, just call for a repair.

    John Kogel, RHI, BC HI Lic #47455
    www.allsafehome.ca

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •