Results 1 to 15 of 15
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    122

    Default 2/4 TYPE STO WIRE

    am re-posting this to the correct section. wire insulation states "2/4 type sto" and is connected to 100 amp breaker at main distribution panel to sub panel in attic with 2 60 amp breakers for the air handler. have never seen this before, how common is this?

    sid

    Similar Threads:
    ***IMPORTANT*** You Need To Register To View Images ***IMPORTANT*** You Need To Register To View Images
    NHIE Practice Exam

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Snowbird (this means I'm retired and migrate between locations), FL/MI
    Posts
    4,086

    Default Re: 2/4 TYPE STO WIRE

    Quote Originally Posted by sidney alstad View Post
    am re-posting this to the correct section. wire insulation states "2/4 type sto" and is connected to 100 amp breaker at main distribution panel to sub panel in attic with 2 60 amp breakers for the air handler. have never seen this before, how common is this?

    sid
    See comment below picture.



    I just don't know where to begin! I am overwhelmed with the issues in the first three pictures! I guess the thing to do is point out the obvious and focus on your thread title "2/4 TYPE STO WIRE"

    This is not WIRE, this is not CABLE, this is CORD, Hard Service Cord though it may be. It is not a permited wiring method for this application (feeder).

    This is not a portable or pendant application. This is not a Chapter 4 application.

    How about Chapters 1, 2, 3 & 4 of NFPA 70 (NEC), and take a peek at Table 400.4.

    Lets try this (see attached pdf for easy to read table of identifying CORD markings):

    Attached Files Attached Files
    Last edited by H.G. Watson, Sr.; 07-23-2010 at 11:13 AM.

  3. #3
    James Duffin's Avatar
    James Duffin Guest

    Default Re: 2/4 TYPE STO WIRE

    It doesn't look like STO cable is rated to be used as a feeder conductor.

    400.7 Uses Permitted.
    (A) Uses.
    Flexible cords and cables shall be used only for
    the following:
    (1) Pendants
    (2) Wiring of luminaires
    (3) Connection of portable luminaires, portable and mobile
    signs, or appliances
    (4) Elevator cables
    (5) Wiring of cranes and hoists
    (6) Connection of utilization equipment to facilitate frequent
    interchange
    (7) Prevention of the transmission of noise or vibration
    (8) Appliances where the fastening means and mechanical
    connections are specifically designed to permit
    ready removal for maintenance and repair, and the
    appliance is intended or identified for flexible cord
    connection
    (9) Connection of moving parts

    (10) Where specifically permitted elsewhere in this
    Code



  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Chicago, IL
    Posts
    2,797

    Default Re: 2/4 TYPE STO WIRE

    Those neutrals: Holy Kazoozous! That's a veritable catalog of defects right there.

    I would defer both those panels and everything in between to an exorcist.

    ***IMPORTANT*** You Need To Register To View Images ***IMPORTANT*** You Need To Register To View Images
    Last edited by Michael Thomas; 07-23-2010 at 11:25 AM.
    Michael Thomas
    Paragon Property Services Inc., Chicago IL
    http://paragoninspects.com

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Snowbird (this means I'm retired and migrate between locations), FL/MI
    Posts
    4,086

    Default Re: 2/4 TYPE STO WIRE

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Thomas View Post
    That neutral: Holy Kazoozous!
    Yeah no kidding. So much to "see" in those photos to just stop you in your tracks, scratch head, and say, "Hmmm... Just where do I start?, What can I presume he already knows or sees for himself?"

    Unfortunately, being the non-perfect world that residential is, crazy, nutty, stupid, unsafe, unqualified, poorly executed work; inappropriate materials, etc. is frequently encountered by the average Home Inspector, be it new construction, or long-time existing dwelling, I think that's fair to say. Although age isn't a true litmus test, I think it is also fair to say that generally, the older the dwelling, the more likely one is to find more "interesting" examples of such encounters.


  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Manchester, Vermont
    Posts
    298

    Cool Re: 2/4 TYPE STO WIRE

    Great job on cover the use portable cords, H.G. I like how you get right
    to the point. And as always thanks for joining in. Robert


  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Snowbird (this means I'm retired and migrate between locations), FL/MI
    Posts
    4,086

    Default Re: 2/4 TYPE STO WIRE

    Thanks Robert, I try.

    I just hope Sidney Alsted finds it helpful. Without feed-back I'm not sure if his question(s) were answered, he finds/found it helpful; and if not, if he knows he is welcome to follow-up. I've been told my directness & writing style can be perceived as harsh, , but it isn't intended (usually) .


  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    122

    Default Re: 2/4 TYPE STO WIRE

    Thank you Mr Watson. I just returned from a long day on the inspection trail. Nothing unusual today, but I was wondering if the cord you stated was at one time suitable for feeding a sub panel?

    Sid


  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Snowbird (this means I'm retired and migrate between locations), FL/MI
    Posts
    4,086

    Default Re: 2/4 TYPE STO WIRE

    I don't recall ST or STO(il resistant) Cord as ever having been an approved use or method for such a (residential, dwelling, not elevator-or lift-related) permanent (non-temporary) feeder, no.

    *p.s. not certain ever approved even for that (lift or elevator, residential feeder) possiblity.

    Last edited by H.G. Watson, Sr.; 07-23-2010 at 07:17 PM. Reason: added italic content as an afterthought & p.s.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Chico,Ca
    Posts
    423

    Default Re: 2/4 TYPE STO WIRE

    In addition to the cord issue & the funky method of connecting the neutral that others have brought up, that is a 1970's I-T-E Imperial Corp. panel full of Bryant BR frame breakers, I see only the GFCI circuit breaker being a I-T-E....


  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    122

    Default Re: 2/4 TYPE STO WIRE

    Exactly, condo was constructed in 1973.


  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Chicago, IL
    Posts
    2,797

    Default Re: 2/4 TYPE STO WIRE

    Quote Originally Posted by H.G. Watson, Sr. View Post
    Unfortunately, being the non-perfect world that residential is, crazy, nutty, stupid, unsafe, unqualified, poorly executed work; inappropriate materials, etc...
    ... and let's not forget the people who decide to add a new trade on the side, as for example at this afternoons inspection, where the AC guy decides he's also an electrician...

    And - what the hell - let's throw in the neutrals from this one too, while we are at it...

    ***IMPORTANT*** You Need To Register To View Images ***IMPORTANT*** You Need To Register To View Images
    Last edited by Michael Thomas; 07-23-2010 at 07:46 PM.
    Michael Thomas
    Paragon Property Services Inc., Chicago IL
    http://paragoninspects.com

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Twin Cities, Minnesota
    Posts
    150

    Default Re: 2/4 TYPE STO WIRE

    What's the vinyl vent connected to?

    -Jon
    Errickson Home Inspections, LLC
    http://www.erricksonhomeinspections.com

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    122

    Default Re: 2/4 TYPE STO WIRE

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Errickson View Post
    What's the vinyl vent connected to?
    Flexible vinyl is for the dryer venting snaked around the attic.


  15. #15
    James Duffin's Avatar
    James Duffin Guest

    Default Re: 2/4 TYPE STO WIRE

    Quote Originally Posted by sidney alstad View Post
    Flexible vinyl is for the dryer venting snaked around the attic.
    Hope you wrote that up too...


Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •