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Thread: Help needed

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
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    NC
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    Default Help needed

    Upon looking opening this panel I informed the seller that she had no main disconnect, picture 1, larger picture of entire panel with picture 2. She replied that when she purchased the home they told her that the main dosconnect was the top left breaker (60 amps with #4 copper. After turning the 60 amp breaker off, the range, and all of the electric baseboard heat on one side of the home worked but no lights. What's up with this?...any ideas. Then in picture 3 the breaker could not be reset until the panel cover was screwed in place. I tried to reset numerous times when the dead front cover was off, and it would not reset. Lastly, disconnect switch for pressure tank has two (2) 15 amp fuses, and wiring then continues to a 20 amp breaker. Is this proper.

    All replies are welcome.

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  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
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    Default Re: Help needed

    This looks like it might be a split buss panel. Up to 6 DP breakers at the top, one of which controls the power to the single pole branch circuit breakers on the bottom buss.


  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
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    Default Re: Help needed

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Port View Post
    This looks like it might be a split buss panel. Up to 6 DP breakers at the top, one of which controls the power to the single pole branch circuit breakers on the bottom buss.
    Agreed.

    You can see the conductors from that breakers turning back down and going in under the upper mains to the bottom section of the split bus panel.

    That gives you the 'up to six mains' allowed for service equipment along with the lighting panel below it.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  4. #4
    Join Date
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    Default Re: Help needed

    So that is okay, no main disconnect needed at the 2/0 aluminum? Multiple breakers to turn off should you need to turn off all power.
    Sid


  5. #5
    Join Date
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    Default Re: Help needed

    Quote Originally Posted by sidney alstad View Post
    So that is okay, no main disconnect needed at the 2/0 aluminum?
    That would be an incorrect statement as stated.

    The correct statement would be that you have up to the allowable 6 mains. Those are the "mains".

    Also, the ratings of those mains cannot be added together to determine a "main rating size".

    Multiple breakers to turn off should you need to turn off all power.
    Yep, up to 6 are allowed.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  6. #6
    Bill Nolte's Avatar
    Bill Nolte Guest

    Default Re: Help needed

    Up to 6 mains were allowed with a split bus load center, however split bus load centers are no longer manufactured and residential structures are limited to 2 mains since adoption of the 1984 NEC (I think, though I didn't check it). Typically there were 12 breaker spaces utilized by 6 two pole circuit breakers giving you up to 6 moves of the hand. 1 breaker fed the lower section of the load center and the other 5 - 2 pole breakers handled the larger 240 volt loads in the residence. Each of those 6 circuiit breakers was a main circuit breaker. Though not often used, handle ties were legal allowing single pole breakers to be used in the main section and keep the number of "moves of the hand" limited to 6.
    This is only intended to assist in what you may see and why it is or was installed that way.
    Master Electrician, 1979-current.


  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
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    NC
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    Default Re: Help needed

    Thank you Mr Nolte


  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
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    Snowbird (this means I'm retired and migrate between locations), FL/MI
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    Default Re: Help needed

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Nolte View Post
    Up to 6 mains were allowed with a split bus load center, however split bus load centers are no longer manufactured and residential structures are limited to 2 mains since adoption of the 1984 NEC (I think, though I didn't check it). Typically there were 12 breaker spaces utilized by 6 two pole circuit breakers giving you up to 6 moves of the hand. 1 breaker fed the lower section of the load center and the other 5 - 2 pole breakers handled the larger 240 volt loads in the residence. Each of those 6 circuiit breakers was a main circuit breaker. Though not often used, handle ties were legal allowing single pole breakers to be used in the main section and keep the number of "moves of the hand" limited to 6.
    This is only intended to assist in what you may see and why it is or was installed that way.
    Master Electrician, 1979-current.
    Check that, and get back to us with supporting citations and documentation.

    Local ammendments and local POCO requirements aside, I'd like to know where you come up with that "no more than 2 main disconnects for residential" rule in either IRC or NEC now supposedly circa 1984! You've made that claim on more than one thread in the same hour!


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