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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
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    NC
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    122

    Default One service, two panels

    It seems that every property has a more confusing electrical issue. I have never seen this before and my electrical contractor that wires my radon reduction systems had never heard of this as well. One service with two panels. Ground and neutrals in the right panel with the main disconnect and circuit breakers in the right panel. Is this improper, a defect, or is it okay.

    Thanks for all of your responses to my 70 amp kitchen breaker question.

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  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
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    Ormond Beach, Florida
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    Default Re: One service, two panels

    You can have one service and as many panels as you want - bu not LIKE THAT first photo!

    Looks like someone has really screwed around with the panel in that first photo!

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  3. #3
    Roger Frazee's Avatar
    Roger Frazee Guest

    Default Re: One service, two panels

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    You can have one service and as many panels as you want - bu not LIKE THAT first photo!

    Looks like someone has really screwed around with the panel in that first photo!
    That's an understatement. I don't believe we are looking at service equipment in either panel. 1st panel is a 4 wire feed with bonding means installed on the neutral bus and ground bus and no egc or bonding to 2nd panel for ground fault not that it would be ok if it did.. Crazy deal he has there.

    Just pointing out a few things.

    The entire job is just plain nuts.

    Last edited by Roger Frazee; 11-04-2010 at 09:54 AM. Reason: clarified bonding locations

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Southern Vancouver Island
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    4,547

    Default Re: One service, two panels

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    You can have one service and as many panels as you want - but not LIKE THAT first photo!

    Looks like someone has really screwed around with the panel in that first photo!
    It looks like the first panel, which is on the right, has had the breakers removed and a second panel, the one on the left, was added. You can see splices on the main conductors in the first, right hand panel, and the branch circuit feeders returning to be spliced in that panel.

    So it is a repair, and now the question is, is it a proper repair? I feel the first panel should have been removed if it was faulty, and thus eliminating this confusion and all those spices, but thankfully it is not up to me. There should be a permit in place for this repair. The client should get a copy to see if the work was approved.

    John Kogel, RHI, BC HI Lic #47455
    www.allsafehome.ca

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    NC
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    Default Re: One service, two panels

    Quote Originally Posted by John Kogel View Post
    It looks like the first panel, which is on the right, has had the breakers removed and a second panel, the one on the left, was added. You can see splices on the main conductors in the first, right hand panel, and the branch circuit feeders returning to be spliced in that panel.

    So it is a repair, and now the question is, is it a proper repair? I feel the first panel should have been removed if it was faulty, and thus eliminating this confusion and all those spices, but thankfully it is not up to me. There should be a permit in place for this repair. The client should get a copy to see if the work was approved.
    Should have mentioned that there is also a 200 amp disconnect at the far end of the home under the meter. So the two pictured panels are more or less distribution panels?...albeit with a secondary main disconnect in one.


  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    NC
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    Default Re: One service, two panels

    Mr Kogel,

    I think your summation is correct. Thank you very much.


  7. #7
    Fred Herndon's Avatar
    Fred Herndon Guest

    Default Re: One service, two panels

    Sidney,
    John is right, for some unknown reason they decided to relocate the breakers for the distribution panel without moving the whole thing. Maybe they figured one splice per circuit was better than three. You should definately recommend a thorough evaluation by a licensed electrical contractor and ask for copies of any permits. Good luck with that. As neat of a job as they did on the new panel it is hard to believe what a confusing mess the old one looks like.


  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    2,777

    Default Re: One service, two panels

    Possible scenario:

    Original panel set and then was relocated by using the 1st panel as a junction box.

    Not a repair but a change of specification to original plan for panel location.

    Does your local require elect sign off by inspector?
    If so, was a permit sticker found?
    If sticker found which panel door was it on?
    Could the doors have been switched to make appearance of being original sign off?


  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    122

    Default Re: One service, two panels

    I contacted the county planning and inspection department today and no permit had been drawn except for the original construction permit in 2005.


  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Southern Vancouver Island
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    Default Re: One service, two panels

    As Roger and Jerry pointed out, there are problems that need to be addressed. The second panel should be bonded to the first one.

    I wonder if there was a plan to use the space in front of the first panel? In any case, it needs to be checked over by an electrician and given approval by an authority.

    John Kogel, RHI, BC HI Lic #47455
    www.allsafehome.ca

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Chicago IL
    Posts
    1,984

    Default Re: One service, two panels

    Not even going to try to figure out anything on that first pic. The most panels I've had on one house so far was 6 or 7. Can't remember exactly.
    If I remember correctly, they are called 'subpanels', right Jerry?

    www.aic-chicago.com
    773/844-4AIC
    "The Code is not a ceiling to reach but a floor to work up from"

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