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Thread: 2 hot 240 leads

  1. #1
    Anthony Alderman's Avatar
    Anthony Alderman Guest

    Question 2 hot 240 leads

    had both sides of the 240 range breaker going to the range without a neutral or ground. Now how does that work???? Can it be right ? Seen it twice this week..
    Tony

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  2. #2
    Bob White's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2 hot 240 leads

    It'll work 'cause each leg of the 240 acts as "return" for half of each cycle, especially with the purely resistive load of an electric range.....


    It ain't right, though. The chassis is floating, and is (very) prolly a shock hazard.


  3. #3
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    Default Re: 2 hot 240 leads

    True, no neutral needed for 240V only devices, ground there for safety.

    But....

    How do you probe the outlet when you check it?

    I have found that the voltage indicator probes are hard to make contact in range and dryer outlets.

    added with edit: I see now where you did not see the neutral at the panel end.....


  4. #4
    Anthony Alderman's Avatar
    Anthony Alderman Guest

    Default Re: 2 hot 240 leads

    Thanks guys,
    It makes sense now as to how it can work also why it's not done anymore.


  5. #5
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    Default Re: 2 hot 240 leads

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony Alderman View Post
    why it's not done anymore.

    Why what is not done anymore?

    Things not being grounded?

    240 volt circuits?

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  6. #6
    Anthony Alderman's Avatar
    Anthony Alderman Guest

    Default Re: 2 hot 240 leads

    Why what is not done anymore?

    Things not being grounded?

    Running a 240 circuit with out a ground "not being done anymore". I know terrible sentence structure. Now ,for example, on a hot water heater, do you not use a neutral. Are the 4 wire plugs only for equipment that has a 120 component to it?


  7. #7
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    Default Re: 2 hot 240 leads

    Doesn't there have to be a neutral on anything with 110 stuff?

    example- a range has a clock and light, a dryer has a timer and maybe a light but a water heater is just juice to the elements.


  8. #8
    Anthony Alderman's Avatar
    Anthony Alderman Guest

    Default Re: 2 hot 240 leads

    I guess that's part of what I'm wondering too. I would think there would have to be, unless the other leg can serve as a neutral also. Seems that would make for an unbalanced load though.


  9. #9
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    Default Re: 2 hot 240 leads

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony Alderman View Post
    Running a 240 circuit with out a ground "not being done anymore".
    Running a 240 volt circuit without a ground should not have been 'being done' since the 1950/60s when grounding became required.

    That's why I didn't understand the statement/question.

    Now ,for example, on a hot water heater, do you not use a neutral.
    Correct.

    But ... it has a ground.

    Are the 4 wire plugs only for equipment that has a 120 component to it?
    Yes.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  10. #10
    Anthony Alderman's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2 hot 240 leads

    Thanks Jerry.

    Also both the houses I was in were circa 40's so I guess that makes sense.


  11. #11
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    Default Re: 2 hot 240 leads

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony Alderman View Post
    Also both the houses I was in were circa 40's so I guess that makes sense.
    Back then, and earlier, equipment grounding was not a requirement.

    *IF* metal conduit was used, it was required to be grounded, but if metal conduit was not used, and metal conduit was not used with knob and tube and other methods, then no grounding was present.

    Thus, you would find what you did: the two conductors for the 240 volt circuit, no ground (not required at that time) and no neutral (not required for a 240 volt circuit anyway).

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

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