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  1. #1
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    Default Shocking surprise

    A friend of mine recieved a pretty good dose of AC in a house they just bought when he touched a handy box with an outlet mounted on a wall in the basement. We discovered on the hot side - the tab that connects the two screws was pressed against the romex connector. The ground wire was cut off at the outer casing of the romex on both ends. Why? I have no idea. Some DIY probably. Food for thought when you guys are inspecting electrical.

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  2. #2
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Borchardt View Post
    A friend of mine recieved a pretty good dose of AC in a house they just bought when he touched a handy box with an outlet mounted on a wall in the basement.

    The ground wire was cut off at the outer casing of the romex on both ends.
    Excellent example of the "why" metal boxes are required to be grounded.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
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  3. #3
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    . . . and another perfect example (in a world where any idiot - licensed or not - can legally purchase and install electrical equipment) of why metal junction boxes should be banned in residential construction.

    Texas Inspector
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    What the plainspoken man lacks in subtlety, he makes up in clarity.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron Miller View Post
    . . . and another perfect example (in a world where any idiot - licensed or not - can legally purchase and install electrical equipment) of why metal junction boxes should be banned in residential construction.
    In specific situations you need the durability of a metal box and possibility EMT or rigid conduit. Why penalize all for the few idiots that are out there?


  5. #5
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by Rich Goeken View Post
    In specific situations you need the durability of a metal box and possibility EMT or rigid conduit. Why penalize all for the few idiots that are out there?
    I guess they don't sell Schedule 80 PVC where you live.

    Texas Inspector
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    What the plainspoken man lacks in subtlety, he makes up in clarity.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    In my neck of the woods "and I mean woods", it's pretty common to use metel handy boxes in areas such as basements, garages/carports or other outbuildings in order to prevent rodents from seeking out the paper sheathing around the grounding conductor as a prefered nesting material. I personally have seen instances where a determined mouse has chewed through the plastic box to gain access. I would think from a rodents perspective that's like a one stop shop for rodent housing. It's got building material (paper) and climate control (the warmth of the electrical device). All of that being said, using metal handy boxes are your best solution if it's.done right. In my exprience, if the "electrician" would take the time to wrap the device using a 69 cent roll of electrical tape before securing it in the box, the likleyhood of what happened to your friend would be greatly reduced. J.M.O.

    George Hallaron: Owner primary inspector
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  7. #7
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    I agree with Rich.

    Nothing wrong with the product, just the way it was installed. You only solve a symptom, not the problem, by banning metal junction boxes in residential construction. Even if metal boxes were banned for residential, they could still put it in there as they would still be selling them for commercial use. I imagine if they used a plastic box they would have drilled a hole in the side of it to get it to work in this case… lol


  8. #8
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    if metal boxes are outlawed only outlaws will use them


  9. #9
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Ban idiots and we can all retire now. []

    John Kogel, RHI, BC HI Lic #47455
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  10. #10
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Ruth View Post
    if metal boxes are outlawed only outlaws will use them
    The multi-gang boxes are the real problem. Outlaw them and all those with single boxes can gang up on any outlaw that uses them! Problem solved.


  11. #11
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    I think the major point of my post got lost. If the ground wire, (which was avalible but cut off), was connected (even by an idiot) it would have tripped the breaker. The need to dispose of handy boxes would not fix stupid. But instead of eliminating handy boxes, just eliminate the center knock outs.
    Good comments by others.
    Thanks

    Last edited by Mike Borchardt; 08-20-2012 at 07:20 PM.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    I believe JP covered that in his original response, anymore would be redundant. That is a good point however.

    George Hallaron: Owner primary inspector
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  13. #13
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    banning idiots from the world would leave even more out there with nuthing to do. shocking experinces is just the tip of the iceberg of things that make you go hmmm


  14. #14
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron Miller View Post
    I guess they don't sell Schedule 80 PVC where you live.
    They do. But plastic at times just doesn't do it---sometimes you need the durability of metal.


  15. #15
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by Rich Goeken View Post
    They do. But plastic at times just doesn't do it---sometimes you need the durability of metal.
    And the "rustability"?

    Texas Inspector
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    What the plainspoken man lacks in subtlety, he makes up in clarity.

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron Miller View Post
    And the "rustability"?
    Come on Aaron, if the situation is THAT bad that metal would rust----you need to be installing waterproof materials, connectors, boxes, covers, gaskets, etc. (maybe even submarine cable).

    The installation in question here is just bad. Period. NO ground, entrance in the side of a box, good point by someone that the side entrance should be removed (I haven't seen anyone use them anyway), wired wrong, and the box is too small for the service contained.

    Based upon the installation, I could see the same person, if he/she had a plastic box, making a hole in the side with an Irwin bit and doing the same thing. What would you say about use installation of plastic then?


  17. #17
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Lol, (this is really nervous laughter). Apparently, anyone can do electrical work. I hope your friend is alright.

    The full loathe honey, but to the hungry, even what is bitter tastes sweet.

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    I have a good one for you! A couple of years ago I was called by an elderly homeowner who was complaining of shocks when she opened her door. I went to her house, touched the storm door, and then, lo and behold, I felt an electrical shock! Further investigation revealed that her house (which had aluminum siding) had a nick in the service cable feeding the home. Fortunately, no one was grounded when they came into contact with her house! She had a "free" home security system (potential electrocution of intruders) which, fortunately, was an easy fix before anyone was injured.


  19. #19
    Garry Blankenship's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron Miller View Post
    I guess they don't sell Schedule 80 PVC where you live.
    I would not mount a heavy light fixture / circ fan or combo on any kind of plastic - - - schedule 80 or otherwise. Well maybe if I wanted a cheap haircut.


  20. #20
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron Miller View Post
    . . . and another perfect example (in a world where any idiot - licensed or not - can legally purchase and install electrical equipment) of why metal junction boxes should be banned in residential construction.

    Possibly the most ridiculous response I've seen on Inspection News



  21. #21
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas Kessel View Post
    Possibly the most ridiculous response I've seen on Inspection News
    You must be new to the forum . . .

    Texas Inspector
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  22. #22
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron Miller View Post
    You must be new to the forum . . .
    And not read many of Watson's posts ...

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
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  23. #23
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    And not read many of Watson's posts ...
    Indeed!

    Texas Inspector
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    What the plainspoken man lacks in subtlety, he makes up in clarity.

  24. #24
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    And not read many of Watson's posts ...
    I think you may have hit to many keys.
    Should be "any", not "many".

    ' correct a wise man and you gain a friend... correct a fool and he'll bloody your nose'.

  25. #25
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by Rick Cantrell View Post
    I think you may have hit to many keys.
    Should be "any", not "many".
    In all fairness, HG has his moments . . .

    Texas Inspector
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  26. #26
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron Miller View Post
    In all fairness, HG has his moments . . .
    "In all fairness", really.
    Who is this?

    A kinder, gentler Aaron
    This is gonna take time to get used to.

    But still glad to hear from you.

    ' correct a wise man and you gain a friend... correct a fool and he'll bloody your nose'.

  27. #27
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by Rick Cantrell View Post
    A kinder, gentler Aaron
    This is gonna take time to get used to.
    Yes, it is indeed a chore . . . (seems to be no smiley for tongue-biting and blood drooling)

    Texas Inspector
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    What the plainspoken man lacks in subtlety, he makes up in clarity.

  28. #28
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron Miller View Post
    . . . (seems to be no smiley for tongue-biting and blood drooling)
    I use this one" "

    ' correct a wise man and you gain a friend... correct a fool and he'll bloody your nose'.

  29. #29
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    I believe the horse died several posts ago.


  30. #30
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by William Kievit View Post
    I believe the horse died several posts ago.
    Nope. We're still ladling water over its head and mouth in an effort to revive it ... every now and then it kicks, guess that means ... ... "It's still kicking."

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
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  31. #31
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Really J.P.? My dear Watson hasn't even wrote in this thread and your bustin his chops!
    What about the remark that electrical tape would've fixed this situation??
    You didn't jump on that one.


  32. #32
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas Kessel View Post
    Possibly the most ridiculous response I've seen on Inspection News
    Quote Originally Posted by bob smit View Post
    Really J.P.? My dear Watson hasn't even wrote in this thread and your bustin his chops!
    Really B.S.? Did not you read the post? (Okay, that does not sound like than when it is "Didn't read the post?", but write out the "did not" and it sounds kinda funky.)

    In case you missed it, here it is with highlighting: "Possibly the most ridiculous response I've seen on Inspection News"

    That is referring to a just this thread, that is referring to any and all threads "on Inspection News".

    With that settled, does not Watson post "on Inspection News"?

    Yes sire he sure does, and as such my post was quite applicable.

    What about the remark that electrical tape would've fixed this situation??
    You didn't jump on that one.
    Part of my 'kinder and gentler' me ...

    You may have noticed that since I stopped responding to Watson in big red crayon that he must have picked up the big red crayons I had because his use of those big red crayons has increased.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
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  33. #33
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron Miller View Post
    Yes, it is indeed a chore . . . (seems to be no smiley for tongue-biting and blood drooling)
    .....* click on # 3 and 4 for animation.

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  34. #34
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Darwinism at work. Why are you trying to stop the course of nature?

    Erby Crofutt, Georgetown, KY - Read my Blog here: Erby the Central Kentucky Home Inspector B4 U Close Home Inspections www.b4uclose.com www.kentuckyradon.com
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  35. #35
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by Erby Crofutt View Post
    Darwinism at work. Why are you trying to stop the course of nature?
    Darwin's Theory only applies when the perpetrators stay put. These cretins sold the place and moved their chromosomes to a fresh location.

    John Kogel, RHI, BC HI Lic #47455
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  36. #36
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    Quote Originally Posted by Billy Stephens View Post
    .....* click on # 3 and 4 for animation.
    #4 will do quite nicely.

    Texas Inspector
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    What the plainspoken man lacks in subtlety, he makes up in clarity.

  37. #37
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    Default Re: Shocking surprise

    So sorry J.P., I usually write or text dint... less key punches.
    I'll see (to view with eyes) next thread ifin I cant slip in a double negative w/o U catching (to receive a rock, usually thrown at a glass house) it.


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