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  1. #1
    Gregg Austensen's Avatar
    Gregg Austensen Guest

    Default Hot temp on ACFI's

    The Seimens ACFI's measured 15-20 degrees hotter than standard breakers. I've not seen this much variation on AFCI's before. Is this common?

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  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
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    Spring Hill (Nashville), TN
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    Default Re: Hot temp on ACFI's

    Quote Originally Posted by Gregg Austensen View Post
    The Seimens ACFI's measured 15-20 degrees hotter than standard breakers. I've not seen this much variation on AFCI's before. Is this common?
    Yep, pretty normal. One of the reasons they should not be stacked on top of each other.

    Scott Patterson, ACI
    Spring Hill, TN
    www.traceinspections.com

  3. #3
    Richard Rushing's Avatar
    Richard Rushing Guest

    Default Re: Hot temp on ACFI's

    I seen'em with a 50 degree difference on a regular basis (summer time).

    M-sparky's around here pretty much agree that to be normal when stacked and in the summer-time.

    rr


  4. #4
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    Mar 2007
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    Peoria Arizona
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    75

    Default Re: Hot temp on ACFI's

    See following PDF:
    http://www.eatonelectrical.com/unsec...D00402001E.PDF

    Jeff Euriech
    Peoria Arizona


  5. #5
    Gregg Austensen's Avatar
    Gregg Austensen Guest

    Default Re: Hot temp on ACFI's

    Jeff,

    Thanks for the pdf! Great stuff.


  6. #6
    Paul Tooley's Avatar
    Paul Tooley Guest

    Default Re: Hot temp on ACFI's

    Gregg,
    I see the temperature variances upwards of twenty degrees quite regularly when there are three or more stacked. I have talked to some of the sparkys in the area and they say that "they" always stagger them or alternate left and right side. I have made it a suggestion with a short explanation in the "nice to know" section of my reports.

    Jeff,
    thanks for the link to the pdf. muchy much awesome and will forward it on to the local chapter here.


  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Lake Barrington, IL
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    1,363

    Default Re: Hot temp on ACFI's

    Scott:

    My understanding is that stacking AFCI's is not recommended due to the heat issue. Not sure that it's something one could make much of an issue on, though best practice would dictate no stacking. Yes?

    Eric Barker, ACI
    Lake Barrington, IL

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
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    Hudson, WI
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    645

    Default Re: Hot temp on ACFI's

    When the 2008 NEC takes affect, "stacking" will be the norm as all 15 and 20 circuits will be required to be AFCI protected.


  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
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    25,314

    Default Re: Hot temp on ACFI's

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Larson View Post
    When the 2008 NEC takes affect, "stacking" will be the norm as all 15 and 20 circuits will be required to be AFCI protected.
    Thus, the newer AFCI breakers produce less heat, trying to combat this know .problem'. How well the manufacturer's have done this will only be known for sure when we start seeing AFCI breakers stacked.

    That will be "Truth or Consequences" time.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Hot temp on ACFI's

    Eaton has a new version of their tech bulletin on AFCI operating temperatures up at http://www.eaton.com/ecm/idcplg?IdcS...me=AD00402001E

    Michael Thomas
    Paragon Property Services Inc., Chicago IL
    http://paragoninspects.com

  11. #11
    David Banks's Avatar
    David Banks Guest

    Default Re: Hot temp on ACFI's

    Thanks Michael. The old one is gone anyway.


  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
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    Default Re: Hot temp on ACFI's

    Michael,

    They didn't address the cumulative temperature increase by placing more than one, or by stacking more than one above another, other than as a maximum temperature rise.

    "On residential circuit breakers, the temperature rise of this terminal must be 50C or less above ambient when carrying rated current, or 65C or less above ambient in an enclosure."


    That means, say in a 90 degree F (approximately 32 degrees C) garage the maximum temperature rise (at full rated current) allowed is 65 degrees C, or to approximately 98 degrees C (which is approximately 205 degrees F).

    Now, if you have that temperature rise at limited current flow, that would (to me) indicate there was a potential problem with the breaker(s) - all based on their information.

    However, the handle shall not exceed 60 degrees C (140 degrees F).


    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

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