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  1. #1
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    Default GFCI under kitchen sink

    This may have been answered before, but need information. Just under the kitchen sink and inside the cabinet door is a receptacle. Does the location of this require GFCI-protection? The receptacle is hot and easily reached by hand.



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  2. #2
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    Default Re: GFCI under kitchen sink

    NEC
    210.8 (A) (6)

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  3. #3
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    Default Re: GFCI under kitchen sink

    Quote Originally Posted by Gunnar Alquist View Post
    NEC
    210.8 (A) (6)
    Thanks for the quick response, Gunnar. Yeah, I've been reporting the counter top code for long time, but this one under raised a question in my mind.


  4. #4
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    Default Re: GFCI under kitchen sink

    Quote Originally Posted by Donald Stauffer View Post
    This may have been answered before, but need information. Just under the kitchen sink and inside the cabinet door is a receptacle. Does the location of this require GFCI-protection? The receptacle is hot and easily reached by hand.

    if that flexible cord is servicing a dw 210.8(D)

    Last edited by BARRY ADAIR; 05-09-2019 at 02:40 AM.
    badair http://www.adairinspection.com Garland, TX 75042 TREC # 4563
    Commercial-Residential-Construction-EIFS-Infrared Thermography
    life is the random lottery of events followed by numerous narrow escapes

  5. #5
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    Default Re: GFCI under kitchen sink

    Quote Originally Posted by BARRY ADAIR View Post
    if that flexible cord is servicing a dw 210.8(D)
    210/8(D) was added into the 2014 NEC as I recall ... and it should have been part of 210.8(A) as it only addresses Dwelling Unit kitchens, and 210.8(A) is for receptacles in Dwelling Units which require GFCI protection.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  6. #6
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    Default Re: GFCI under kitchen sink

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    210/8(D) was added into the 2014 NEC as I recall ... and it should have been part of 210.8(A) as it only addresses Dwelling Unit kitchens, and 210.8(A) is for receptacles in Dwelling Units which require GFCI protection.
    obviously the codies chose differntly & put it in other than dwelling
    their call not mine

    badair http://www.adairinspection.com Garland, TX 75042 TREC # 4563
    Commercial-Residential-Construction-EIFS-Infrared Thermography
    life is the random lottery of events followed by numerous narrow escapes

  7. #7
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    Default Re: GFCI under kitchen sink

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    210/8(D) was added into the 2014 NEC as I recall ... and it should have been part of 210.8(A) as it only addresses Dwelling Unit kitchens, and 210.8(A) is for receptacles in Dwelling Units which require GFCI protection.
    It figures that I chose to open the 2013 CEC (uses the 2011 NEC) and not the current one. Oh well.

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  8. #8
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    Default Re: GFCI under kitchen sink

    Donald, Scott Walker of CMP 5 explained that the intent of the rules to our IAEI chapter, saying that the panelists were talking about room doors as exempting receptacles near sinks from the GFCI requirement. Hence revised wording for 2020.


  9. #9
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    Default Re: GFCI under kitchen sink

    Quote Originally Posted by david shapiro View Post
    ... the intent of the rules to our IAEI chapter, saying that the panelists were talking about room doors as exempting receptacles near sinks from the GFCI requirement.
    And for kitchens which do not have room doors? Very few modern kitchens have doors closing them off from the surrounding areas/spaces/rooms, does that mean that GFCI protection is to be carried even farther out from countertop spaces?

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
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  10. #10
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    Default Re: GFCI under kitchen sink

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    And for kitchens which do not have room doors? Very few modern kitchens have doors closing them off from the surrounding areas/spaces/rooms, does that mean that GFCI protection is to be carried even farther out from countertop spaces?
    For 2020, they've eliminated "door, doorway, or" in describing how to measure distance from an appliance connected to the receptacle to a sink in 210.8.

    If you're an NFPA member, and if we learn later today that a Certified Amending Motion challenges this change, you can vote against it in San Antonio on June 20 or 21. If not, you can urge AHJs not to enforce it, or to ask local legislators to amend it out when adopting the 2020.

    As a HI, whether you can discount the 2020 as representing best practices is something you would know much better than I.

    And that's about all I know on the matter.


  11. #11
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    Default Re: GFCI under kitchen sink

    So, what is the answer to his question? All other responses are garblygook.


  12. #12
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    Default Re: GFCI under kitchen sink

    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce Low View Post
    So, what is the answer to his question? All other responses are garblygook.
    The answer is: "It depends."

    It depends on if the question is "Is the receptacle under the sink is for a dishwasher?" Yes, maybe.

    And it depends on if the question is "If that receptacle under the sink is for a dishwasher, is that receptacle required to be GFCI protected?" Yes, maybe.

    If the question is: "If that receptacle under the sink is for a dishwasher, and the house was built before the 2014 NEC was applicable in that area, or the receptacle was added prior to the 2014 NEC being applicable in that area, is that receptacle required to have GFCI protection?" No, it is not required to have GFCI protection.

    If the last question above was asking: " ... , is should that receptacle have GFCI protection?" Yes, because current code recognizes the hazard that the dishwasher receptacle presents when not GFCI protected, that receptacle "should" (but is not "required to") "have GFCI protection".

    So, the best answer, without elaboration, would be: "It depends.", and "it depends" on what additional information is given.



    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

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