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Thread: afci ?

  1. #1
    bb_becker's Avatar
    bb_becker Guest

    Smile afci ?

    This is more a ?
    I would like to ask
    I have a new home " " now this home has 3 bedrooms ,2 bathrooms 1 kitchen and so on.
    2 bedrooms have a 12/3 as a line (to different circuits sharing the same neutral) (phase "a"=n of out lets --- phase "b"=n of out lets ) (phase "a" bedroom1--- phase "b" bedroom2)

    Now the question is: Can we install on the circuit panel a AFCI type of breakers for this 2 particular branch circuits?

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  2. #2
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    Default Re: afci ?

    Quote Originally Posted by bb_becker View Post
    Now the question is: Can we install on the circuit panel a AFCI type of breakers for this 2 particular branch circuits?
    Not only can you, but you are also required to.

    AFCIs are different than GFCIs, and the answer would be different for GFCIs.

    Question: Why? As in 'Why do you want to use 12-3 instead of two separate 12-2 circuits?'

    There is very little cost savings and it can have a negative effect later if someone tries to move circuits around in the panel.

    I really see no distinct advantage of running one 12-3 multi-wire circuit over two 12-2 circuits.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  3. #3
    Jim Farmer's Avatar
    Jim Farmer Guest

    Post Re: afci ?

    The answer to using 12/3 (comman netrual) on AFCI breakers is this will cause nuisance triping. The instructions for the AFCI will tell you this. Go to a electical or building supply and read the instulation instructions.

    Jim Farmer
    Out here in God's country.


  4. #4
    Shannon Guinn's Avatar
    Shannon Guinn Guest

    Default Re: afci ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    I really see no distinct advantage of running one 12-3 multi-wire circuit over two 12-2 circuits.
    Can I get an amen from anybody on this one? ................AMEN!


  5. #5
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    Default Re: afci ?

    This arc-fault detection device is not
    designed or intended for use on circuits
    in which the neutral conductor is shared
    with other circuits. The circuit breaker
    will nuisance trip in “shared neutral”

    circuits.


    This is from the Square D homeline instructions from their website.
    It appears Mr. Farmer is correct for at least this brand.

    http://ecatalog.squared.com/pubs/Circuit%20Protection/Miniature%20Circuit%20Breakers/Homeline/HOM-AFI/48840-249-01.pdf


    Jim Luttrall
    www.MrInspector.net
    Dallas, Texas

  6. #6
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    Default Re: afci ?

    Thank you Jim.

    Learned something new (as I always try to every day).

    Know what that means?

    It means *NO MORE MULTI-WIRE CIRCUITS* for bedrooms. Cool!

    Because, after all, the bedroom circuits *are required* to have AFCI protection. Not 'unless the circuits are multi-wire', just as plain and simple 'required to have'.

    I like it.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  7. #7
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    Default Re: afci ?

    don't forget two pole afci's

    Attached Files Attached Files
    Last edited by paul hardy; 06-02-2008 at 06:54 PM. Reason: add attachment

  8. #8
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    Default Re: afci ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    It means *NO MORE MULTI-WIRE CIRCUITS* for bedrooms. Cool!

    Because, after all, the bedroom circuits *are required* to have AFCI protection. Not 'unless the circuits are multi-wire', just as plain and simple 'required to have'.
    Quote Originally Posted by paul hardy View Post
    don't forget two pole afci's
    I had forgotten about them ...

    DANG!

    That means multi-wire circuits to bedrooms can be AFCI protected.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  9. #9
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    Default Re: afci ?

    When is an AFCI not a code-compliant AFCI?

    The latest version of the NEC specifies "combination" type AFCI's. I am given to understand - times change, and I could be / maybe will be wrong - that there are no two-pole combination AFCI's made.

    The two-pole AFCI's I've seen up to now were not the "combination" type.

    I've even seen something circulated on the internet, purporting to be a NEMA statement, to the effect of "too bad" if the lack of two-pole combo AFCI's means no more shared neutrals.

    Just what we need - more confusion, more uncertainty.


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