Any help is appreciated (except "call an electrician").
The bathroom vanity light wiring somehow developed a short, I am guessing either rodents or a nail or screw somehow penetrated the insulation.

NM wiring in the wall, hot to the wall switch then to the light. I removed the switch and wiring connections and removed the fixture. With the fixture removed I am getting continuity between the hot and neutral so I think the fault has to be between the switch and fixture outlet.

I cant run new wiring without removing a bunch of drywall.
I can't afford a $500 tracer. I am thinking I could use a circuit breaker finder that costs about $30. Any ideas how I would connect this? They usually plug into an outlet. Will it work to find the short? I am not sure about that because it seems like all 3 conductors are now "connected" and I would be able to trace the wires but not find the ground fault.

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"Some people are like slinkies. They serve absolutely no useful purpose. But still put a smile on your face when pushed down a flight of stairs."

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Disconnect all wires at the switch, fixture, and junctions to isolate each wire and use a simple continuity tester on each end of each wire to find the bad section. Assuming it is NM cable the whole piece needs to be replaced from point to point but at least you will know which piece before damaging dry wall. With any luck it is just a connection touching the junction box and the problem will go away once you disconnect everything or maybe it is a short section of NM that you can pull the new piece in with the old one. Also some stud finders will do a pretty good job of tracing the wire (not the short) so you can minimize wall damage. Good luck.

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Jim Luttrall
www.MrInspector.net
Allen, Texas 75002

When and if you find the break, how will you fix it? Will you be able to pull enough slack to make a splice with a wire nut? A splice will need to be made in a j-box and must remain accessible. I would look into pulling a new wire in. Invest in a fish tape. JMO.

Are you tracing a ground fault (as per thread title); or a direct short/wiring error (which is what your post, as I'm reading it, implies)?

Are you sure power from the panel is to the wall switch or to the lighting outlet first (or tapped off elsewhere, i.e. power from the panel first to hall light or other hall outlet). Dedicated circuit or sharing hall lighting, exterior, etc. (i.e. older home b/4 deicated requirement for bathrooms)?

Unmarked/not reidentified in switch loops frequently found in older installations. Intermitant stripping of wire insulation was often substituted for a separate true pig-tail, some sparkies still do even today - something DIYers often miss when replacing.

Boxes for switch & box metalic? NM with ground or not i.e. older (noted 3-conductor but could be BRW w/no ground or BW w/ground)? self-grounding switch?

No attic above (why can't you fish), is this a combo cabinet/light or luminaire(s), check fixture wiring for wiring insulation damage or loose contact.

How about some pics?

I am guessing a short because with the switch removed and the fixture removed and wires separated at each end I get continuity between hot and ground (will check neutral today). There is an attic but this is an outside wall so it is way under the eave. I may have to go with conduit on the exterior if I have to install new wiring.

It is hot to the switch, not a loop. Plastic boxes.

Here is what I an thinking of trying: Leave the neutral and ground disconnected and energize the hot (through the GFCI receptacle for safety). This way the breaker won't trip. Carefully check the approximate path with the voltage sniffer looking for a nail / screw / towel bar that is energized.

I think I can install a j box and splice the damaged area as long as it is not behind the glued-on mirror or something.

__________________
"Some people are like slinkies. They serve absolutely no useful purpose. But still put a smile on your face when pushed down a flight of stairs."

How about STOP NOW, call in someone more knowledgable , who knows what he/she is doing, talking about, basic electrical theory, etc. If you can't answer questions, describe properly, etc. After your last post !!!!! , I'm outta this!!!

P.S.

Remember what you said:
WA Home Inspector Apparently Electrocuted In Hot Tub He Installed

Because the son said his father 'read a book'? Believe.

What is that quote...stupid is as stupid does?

Fritz,

That would be a "ground fault".

Whenever "ground" is involved, it is a "ground fault".

A "ground fault" can be between hot and ground or between neutral and ground.

A "short" is between hot and neutral (between the ungrounded conductor and the grounded conductor). I.e., the circuit is "shorted", which simply means that the circuit which normally runs out one conductor, through the load, then back in the other conductor is not 'taking a short cut' and is not making it out to the load and back, it is not getting all the way to the load before it 'short cuts' its way back to the supply, ... or, for short (pun intended) "shorts out".

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Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
www.AskCodeMan.com

Conflicting posts (first says continuity between hot & neutral with fixture and switch removed and not connected, then says continuity between hot & ground) then mention of receptacle no clear info, no pics, not assuming anything. Hot and neutral (grounded conductor) shouldn't neet without electricity first being worked.

Looks to me like the "call an electrician" option is the only reasonable course of action here.

Got it solved today. There was continuity between all 3 conductors (so a short and a ground fault). I was able to disconnect the ground and neutral and energize the wiring. Once energized I was able to find the path behind the drywall with the sniffer.
It runs vertically behind the linen closet. I cut out an inspection hole and found the insulation was totally gone for about 2 feet from mice or pack rats. Installed 2 j boxes, one high and one low and replaced the bad section.

__________________
"Some people are like slinkies. They serve absolutely no useful purpose. But still put a smile on your face when pushed down a flight of stairs."

That's good news, and it sounds like your tracer system was the way to go. Except that you could have shocked yourself or set fire to the wall. but, hey, you knew that, and were warned here from HG's post.

Now how about electrocuting a few rodents with that bare wiring? No, that'll just stink the place up.

You're a Lucky man. Go buy a lottery ticket!