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  1. #1
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    Default How Asbestos Becomed Friable

    I'd not seen this one before: pipe insulation notched to allow door installation. The remediators apparently overlooked this short section in a storage area only accessible from the exterior.

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  2. #2
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    Default Re: How Asbestos Becomed Friable

    Michael. Friable means the Asbestos can easily enter the air if it is disturbed. And will float around for weeks. That is Friable. The sheets you see sometimes on garage entry doors is Not friable, although if you sand it chop it up and snort it it does the trick.
    Also Asbestos floor tiles. Not Friable.
    Typically any area that is away or sealed from living space would be considered not a problem but if a company was hired to remove all asbestos in the home, they should be coming back to finish the job.
    I find the tail ends of asbestos insulation going up into the walls on every home I inspect that has been remediated. There is no way to get it all unless you burn down the house and pick up the asbestos after the rest burns.
    That is an interesting product that I have not seen. Just one wrap of asbestos and then Fiberglass, Is that correct?
    Are you sure its Asbestos? Looks the right age. but like I said. Not your usual asbestos application


  3. #3
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    Default Re: How Asbestos Becomed Friable

    Can't say for sure unless it's tested - and perhaps not even then, based on what I've been reading - OTHO I've seen a competent IH with a lot of asbestos experience visually ID similar insulation as ACM.

    And I'm willing to bet that was friable when they were chopping out that section.

    Michael Thomas
    Paragon Property Services Inc., Chicago IL
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  4. #4
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    Default Re: How Asbestos Becomes Friable

    Quote Originally Posted by wayne soper View Post
    Michael. Friable means the Asbestos can easily enter the air if it is disturbed.
    Correct.

    The sheets you see sometimes on garage entry doors is Not friable, although if you sand it chop it up and snort it it does the trick.
    To clarify, you can make asbestos friable by crushing it, so what is shown in the photo was made friable by the removal/cutting away/wearing away of the asbestos.

    Also Asbestos floor tiles. Not Friable.
    Unless crushed, sanded, scraped, or otherwise abraded. Then it becomes Friable.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
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  5. #5
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    Default Re: How Asbestos Becomes Friable

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    Correct.



    To clarify, you can make asbestos friable by crushing it, so what is shown in the photo was made friable by the removal/cutting away/wearing away of the asbestos.



    Unless crushed, sanded, scraped, or otherwise abraded. Then it becomes Friable.
    You can add DRY cut, broken or snapped to the list.

    Wetted with water AND a SURFECTANT (common detergent works well) fibers tend not to get airborne (untill dry).


  6. #6
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    Default Re: How Asbestos Becomes Friable

    Quote Originally Posted by H.G. Watson, Sr. View Post
    You can add DRY cut, broken or snapped to the list.

    Wetted with water AND a SURFECTANT (common detergent works well) fibers tend not to get airborne (untill dry).

    True.

    In a recent class I attended, part of the discussion was remediation of asbestos here in Florida, and both DRY and WET remediation was discussed, with the lady from the Florida Department of Environmental Protection stating that only WET remediation is allowed here in Florida, which is because dry remediation, in and of itself, creates friable asbestos where there may not have been any, or increases the amount of friable asbestos over what was being remediated.

    They *presume* that all buildings, regardless of age, *even new construction* buildings *will have* asbestos and that the only way to state that a building does not have asbestos is to test it - everything being renovated/repaired/etc., even concrete.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
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  7. #7
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    Default Re: How Asbestos Becomed Friable

    Correct,
    Thats where the "although if you sand it chop it up and snort it it does the trick", came in.
    do you think they would have let you on the bus if you had a load of Asbestos


  8. #8
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    Default Re: How Asbestos Becomed Friable

    Every time that door swings by, there are asbestos fibers released into the air.
    If? that is asbestos.


  9. #9
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    Default Re: How Asbestos Becomed Friable

    It doesn't become friable, it already would have been in that state, you've just disturbed it.Friable simply means readily crumbled, or brittle, with PACM or ACM it refers to the overall state of the material itself.


  10. #10
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    Default Re: How Asbestos Becomes Friable

    Quote Originally Posted by H.G. Watson, Sr. View Post
    It doesn't become friable, it already would have been in that state, you've just disturbed it.Friable simply means readily crumbled, or brittle, with PACM or ACM it refers to the overall state of the material itself.

    Not sure which of the above posts that is referring to, so I will clarify what I think it is too:

    Concrete has asbestos in it (yes, some of it, maybe even a lot of it, does) and that asbestos is not friable.

    Go in there and make a dry saw cut ... the asbestos which was released in the dust is now friable.

    Take the entire concrete slab and jack hammer it up into pieces ... the asbestos which was released in that process is not friable.

    It was not friable, but it became friable by being disturbed.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  11. #11
    Daniel Leung's Avatar
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    Default Re: How Asbestos Becomed Friable

    Quote Originally Posted by wayne soper View Post
    Also Asbestos floor tiles. Not Friable.
    See what Minnesota Health Department said:
    How do I know when non-friable flooring material becomes friable?
    Flooring material should remain intact during the removal process. If the flooring material you are removing begins to consistently break, your previously non-friable flooring material may now be considered friable and regulated by MDH.


  12. #12
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    Default Re: How Asbestos Becomed Friable


  13. #13
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    Default Re: How Asbestos Becomed Friable

    I have never heard of DRY removal methods, or sampling methods for that matter. I would have to dig out my EPA training manuals to see if there was anything in there about a DRY method.
    By the way, the stuff in the photo doesn't look like any asbestos material I have seen before, but maybe the photo isn't clear enough for me.


  14. #14
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    Default Re: How Asbestos Becomed Friable

    "Looks" like "possible" chrysotile and/or crocidolite to me.


  15. #15
    Ron Isaacson's Avatar
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    Lightbulb Re: How Asbestos Becomed Friable

    When in doubt - recommend testing

    Rather than leaving the question, "is she is or is she aint" asbestos
    Recommend it be encapsulated - i.e. take that extra wall paint that's just laying around (not lead based, not flamable) and glop, dab, coat, cover or seal all exposed surfaces, edges, gaps, ends, holes, joints and junctions.

    Once sealed it can not become airborne unless someone attempt any modification to that area. If that happens, repeat the painting-colors need not match....


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