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Old 08-16-2008, 10:28 AM
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william siegel william siegel is offline
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The lawyers have already jumped on the bandwagon
Granite Countertops Source of Dangerous Radon Emissions


Granite Countertops Source of Dangerous Radon Emissions
Please click here for a free evaluation of your case
Radon, the second leading cause of lung cancer after smoking, may be leaking from your countertops, if you have granite. According to recent news reports, more and more concerned consumers and radon inspectors are contacting the environmental protection agency with radon measurements several times higher than those considered to be acceptable background levels. The radon is emanating from the granite.

Researchers currently studying the most commonly used granite in kitchen countertops have found that all the 55 samples they've tested emit radon radiation at higher than background levels. The samples were collected from US fabricators and wholesalers.

Radon is a radioactive gas that naturally occurs from traces of uranium in soil and rock. It can be found at varying levels around the world. In outdoor air, radon is present in low concentrations. However, in indoor air or enclosed spaces, radon can pose a long-term health risk because the levels can increase.

The Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) has stated that homeowners need to be concerned if the radon gas levels in their homes exceed 4 picocuries per litre of air. Some granite countertops do in fact let off far more than that with reports as high as 100 picocuries per litre. Consequently, the U.S. Surgeon General and EPA recommend that all homes be tested.

Following that advice, four counties in central Nebraska recently sent out test kits to its residents. Amazingly, 75 percent of the homes in those locations were found to have radon levels higher than 4 picocuries per liter. In Adams County the average level was nearly 9 picocuries, considerably higher than levels considered safe.

The Risk of Living with Radon
As radon gas decays it turns into radioactive particles that can get trapped in the lungs just from breathing. As the particles continue to break down, they release small bursts of energy. This can damage lung tissue and lead to lung cancer over the course of your lifetime. The amount of time between exposure and the onset of the disease may be many years.

Like other environmental pollutants, there is some uncertainty about the magnitude of radon health risks. However, the EPA states that they know more about radon risks than risks from most other cancer-causing substances, because estimates of radon risks are based on studies of cancer in humans, specifically underground miners. "Scientists are more certain about risks from radon than risks from most other cancer-causing substances," they state.

Exposure to Radon And Lung Cancer
According to the EPA, "Lung cancer kills thousands of Americans every year. Smoking, radon, and secondhand smoke are the leading causes of lung cancer. Although lung cancer can be treated, the survival rate is one of the lowest for those with cancer. From the time of diagnosis, between 11 and 15 percent of those afflicted will live beyond five years, depending upon demographic factors. In many cases lung cancer can be prevented; this is especially true for radon." Radon exposure is the leading cause of lung cancer in non-smokers.


Granite Countertop Radon Emissions Legal Help
If you or a loved one has suffered ill health effects, injury or damages from radon exposure, please click the link below to send your complaint to a lawyer to evaluate your claim at no cost or obligation.


Please click here for a free evaluation of your case
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Old 08-16-2008, 10:33 AM
Jim Luttrall Jim Luttrall is offline
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Re: The lawyers have already jumped on the bandwagon
This is probably the "mold is gold" lawyers that have been waiting in the wings for the next greatest scare.
Expect to see the flames fanned every chance they get.
Long on hype and short on facts.
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Old 08-16-2008, 12:55 PM
Jerry Peck Jerry Peck is online now
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Re: The lawyers have already jumped on the bandwagon
Pretty soon the "Mold is Gold" guys will take down their "Mold Certifications" and hang up "Granite Countertop Radon Certifications" and buy Geiger counters, attesting that 'x' readings are 'not good and should go to the lab for analysis', and state 'we are not responsible, we only do sampling, Pro Radon Lab does the analysis'.

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Old 08-16-2008, 05:00 PM
Randy Aldering Randy Aldering is offline
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Re: The lawyers have already jumped on the bandwagon
We really need to be charging minimum fees in the $1000's. This kind of stuff is going to make business really interesting. Just how safe is the mildewcide in the paint? What if kids ingest it? What about the plastic in faucets - is it affecting the water? Are faucets from foreign manufacturers tested to make sure there isn't an excessive amount of lead in the solder, if they have any metal parts in them? What about tile flooring and walls - is there any Radon being given off from them? Do foreign-made nails meet the same shear strengths as American made nails? What about holding power - how do they compare? Is the copper wiring in the cables 100 percent copper, or are there trace metals in it? Does that affect the rating of the conductors?
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Old 08-16-2008, 05:09 PM
Ron Bibler Ron Bibler is online now
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Re: The lawyers have already jumped on the bandwagon
Infrared inspection on counter tops for Radon Emissions.
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Old 08-16-2008, 05:27 PM
Randy Aldering Randy Aldering is offline
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Re: The lawyers have already jumped on the bandwagon
I am just curious - has any body ever pointed their IR imaging unit at a real estate agent?
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Old 08-16-2008, 05:40 PM
Ted Menelly Ted Menelly is offline
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Re: The lawyers have already jumped on the bandwagon
It would just show as a big blue spot
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Old 08-16-2008, 05:55 PM
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Rick Hurst Rick Hurst is offline
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Re: The lawyers have already jumped on the bandwagon
And what do I do now with all these baby pacifiers I made from granite?

Rick
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Old 08-16-2008, 06:00 PM
Ted Menelly Ted Menelly is offline
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Re: The lawyers have already jumped on the bandwagon
Exhibit A for the Lawyers
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Old 08-17-2008, 11:03 AM
Evan Grugett Evan Grugett is offline
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Re: The lawyers have already jumped on the bandwagon
Here in the NYC metro area we have been testing for radon on Home Inspections since 1988. This is not the first time that this issue has hit the media, one expert from Columbia University says its the third time this has come around. The fact that the recent study cited in may news reports was actually funded by the manufacturers of the competing counter top materials (solid stone, corian, etc..) shows us where this "old news" is coming from.
Whatever the individual Home Inspectors technical opinion on this matter may be, however, the markeplace's opinion is formed by these media reports ("Perception is Reality", however skewed it may be). We all must deal with the clients and others who ask questions about this, or any other issue about houses that they see in the media.
In my opinion, Home Inspectors should sieze this opportunity to conduct more than one radon test in a home with granite counter tops beyond the lowest livible area (i.e. the basement and the kitchen, or in any other space where granite counter tops are installed). Make money on the media frenzy, for as long as it lasts.
Lastly, a gieger counter reading does not give the radon reading in the atmosphere of the house, so you don't need to buy one. Use EPA approved radon test kits and approved State testing lab (if required in your State) and follow the instructions.
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Old 08-17-2008, 11:27 AM
Brandon Chew Brandon Chew is offline
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Re: The lawyers have already jumped on the bandwagon
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evan Grugett View Post
In my opinion, Home Inspectors should sieze this opportunity to conduct more than one radon test in a home with granite counter tops beyond the lowest livible area (i.e. the basement and the kitchen, or in any other space where granite counter tops are installed). Make money on the media frenzy, for as long as it lasts.
At what level would the results of this additional radon test be a concern to the client? What is the basis for picking that value?
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Old 08-17-2008, 11:31 AM
Jim Luttrall Jim Luttrall is offline
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Re: The lawyers have already jumped on the bandwagon
Sounds like mold is gold to me. Test it and charge the client whether it gives the client any meaningful information or not.
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Old 08-17-2008, 12:33 PM
Jerry Peck Jerry Peck is online now
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Re: The lawyers have already jumped on the bandwagon
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evan Grugett View Post
Make money on the media frenzy, for as long as it lasts.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brandon Chew View Post
What is the basis for picking that value?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Luttrall View Post
Sounds like mold is gold to me.
I believe Evan hit the nail on the head, and that is precisely the reason those HIs who jumped on the Mold is Gold bandwagon jumped on it ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evan Grugett View Post
Make money on the media frenzy
Don't worry or be concerned about whether or not there is any "real value" to what you are doing, just *DO IT* ... after all, the media has created this opportunity and heaven forbid any self respecting HI miss an opportunity to rip their clients off.
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Old 08-18-2008, 05:11 AM
Patrick McCaffery Patrick McCaffery is offline
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Re: The lawyers have already jumped on the bandwagon
I suppose we should stay away from older office buildings with granite facades and definitely stay away from cemetarys with all the granite headstones.
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Old 08-18-2008, 06:09 AM
Evan Grugett Evan Grugett is offline
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Re: The lawyers have already jumped on the bandwagon
Brandon,
The way I handle this situation is to let the client call the shots. I may have arranged to conduct a "standard" radon test in the basement, for my standard fee, at the time the inspection is booked.
If the granite counter tops are present in the home, I bring up the matter with the client and offer to conduct one or more additional tests in those locations. If the client is concerned, they will do the test. If not they won't. I offered it to them, and make a note of same. That way it can't come back to haunt me. I don't push it on them.
Houses in this market area commonly sell for more than $700K and so a few more sheckles for another radon test is not going to kill the client. Around here, realtors and attorneys are hesitant about telling a client not to do something as far as specialst discovery, to cover their own behinds. I personally don't care what the agent thinks.
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Old 08-18-2008, 08:39 AM
John Cahill John Cahill is offline
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Re: The lawyers have already jumped on the bandwagon
Homes with granite countertops will have the safest food there is?

Food irradiation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


In mid 1990's I collected rock from my climbs. I have two expensive Femto's. I bagged the granite from Oklahoma and ran a two day test. 45 picos. Did not beleive it so repeated test with Honeywell. Same. When granite started becoming popular I wondered how long it would take to sensationalize it. It took 8 years.

I need granite for my home. If you know someone taking out their tops tell em delever them to my front yard. (intact)
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Old 08-18-2008, 09:32 AM
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Michael Larson Michael Larson is offline
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Re: The lawyers have already jumped on the bandwagon
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Cahill View Post
Homes with granite countertops will have the safest food there is?

Food irradiation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


In mid 1990's I collected rock from my climbs. I have two expensive Femto's. I bagged the granite from Oklahoma and ran a two day test. 45 picos. Did not beleive it so repeated test with Honeywell. Same. When granite started becoming popular I wondered how long it would take to sensationalize it. It took 8 years.

I need granite for my home. If you know someone taking out their tops tell em delever them to my front yard. (intact)
Interesting, what protocol was used when you measured "45picos"
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Old 08-18-2008, 10:00 AM
John Cahill John Cahill is offline
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Re: The lawyers have already jumped on the bandwagon
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Interesting, what protocol was used when you measured "45picos"
Well it certainly was not EPA. Just put 3 soccer ball sized pieces of granite in a double lined hefty trash bag; zip locked and tested. I have not read how to test c-tops. I would guess two ways
1 put meter on counter and cover with a bowl. (higher results expected)
2 put meter on counter in still air
3 put meter on counter with modest air flow (like ac)
4 put meter a variety of feet away. (direct, 2, 4, 6, 8)?

I quit radon years ago (not much in Dallas). Am digging out Femtos just to do fun stuff. I am not interested in selling the service. At least not until EPA or TDA develops a protocol.


It would be cool to get a c-top with a high level then figure out to do a bacteria culture test on it. Not sure how to do that. It would be cool if it killed salmonella.
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Old 08-18-2008, 11:09 AM
Matt Bezanson Matt Bezanson is offline
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Re: The lawyers have already jumped on the bandwagon
"At what level would the results of this additional radon test be a concern to the client? What is the basis for picking that value?"

There's a fairly simple way to test for this that doesn't involve geiger counters, flux-to-dose equasions or anything else fancy. The question we are trying to answer is "Is the stone contributing to the radiation level in the house?" I place a radon monitor in the basement, as usual, and then another in the kitchen. Since most "normal" radon problems originate from the soil, basement levels are normally higher than 1st floor levels. If this 2-test method shows more radon in the kitchen than in the basement, there is a reason for concern. End of inspector's job, right there. No hype, no lawyers, no media, just common sense.

So far, there are no standards for converting gamma from the stone into a dose equivalency. It would seem simple, but such a standard will have to take into account the amount of stone surface area, the variation in radiation from one spot on the counter to another, how much time one is in range, what's the range, what's the energy level of the particular gamma, and how much of the gamma being measured is background from other natural sources. We have answers for most of those questions already for radon, so measuring the radon makes more sense to me.

And make sure your monitors show a recent calibration date; the public is getting smart and starting to ask about that. Too bad they're not smart enough to stick with formica, the best counter surface ever made.

Detroit Matt
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