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  1. #1
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    Default Garage service door width

    Hello all...I am wondering if there is a minimum width requirement for a garage service door to the interior? Any help?

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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Bishop View Post
    Hello all...I am wondering if there is a minimum width requirement for a garage service door to the interior? Any help?
    I don't think that the garage man door has a requirement as it can not be part of the egress of the home. I would like to see 36" but I don't think it has to be.....

    Scott Patterson, ACI
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  3. #3
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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    While SP may be correct about the width, some local regulations do set minimum heights on all doors. One example is from the State of Connecticut:

    The required exit door shall be a side-hinged door not less than 3 feet in width and 6 feet, 8 inches in height. Other doors shall be permitted to be side-hinged, swinging, sliding, bi-fold or revolving doors, shall not be required to comply with the minimum door width and shall be permitted to be not less than 6 feet, 6 inches in height (IRC R 311. 4. 2, 2003 IRC Portion of the 2005 State Building Code)

    So then, be certain to check with the local codes and amendments in order to be safe.


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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Quote Originally Posted by A.D. Miller View Post
    ...Other doors ...shall not be required to comply with the minimum door width ...
    Any idea why "other doors" wouldn't be required to meet the minimum width?

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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Presuming you are referring to an attached garage (service door to the interior).

    Is there a "man door" from the garage to the exterior? Is there service equipment for the attached structure in the garage? If present is this equipment separated from the general garage space by walls and/or doors?

    For example electrical panel, HVAC equipment, DWH, etc. Accessibility and egress requirements may be found in other areas of the codes.

    If the "service door to the interior" refers to the "man door" for a free-standing garage, and the door is for access from the outside to the interior of the garage, please clarify - that's a "horse of a different color".

    Also please indicate presence or lack of window in garage and window size.

    Occupied space.

    Also please clarify if you are referring to a single family residence/garage, duplex, multi-family, condo, etc. commercial garage, or if the "garage" is an auxilliary structure to a manufactured home lot, etc.

    I'm assuming from your "garage" description it is safe to assume we are not discussing a smaller auxilliary structure that could be considered a "shed" and due to its smaller size and height would meet certain exceptions to requiring a separate service door ("man door").

    Note your location California. Also presuming not a HUD assisted property.

    Last edited by H.G. Watson, Sr.; 03-13-2010 at 02:12 PM.

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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Quote Originally Posted by H.G. Watson, Sr. View Post
    Also please indicate presence or lack of window in garage and window size.
    Window size? Why?

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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Quote Originally Posted by Gunnar Alquist View Post
    Window size? Why?
    Gunnar,

    Notice I asked a series of questions, and explained there were a number of areas of the California Codes which might address this.
    Depends upon the series of answers.

    Recall I inquired if the garage was attached or detached auxiliary structure, and if he was referring to a door between garage & interior of the home/common hall of condo, etc. or referring to service door ("man door")from the outdoors to the interior of the garage?

    Note I mentioned Occupiable space. I also inquired as to what type of property the inquiry was about (not assuming single family residential single lot with attached garage - he hasn't said that ... yet ).

    Further note I inquired if other equipment in garage. Lets say for example laundry facilities (although I inquired about DWH, HVAC, electrical panel, etc.).

    Do you see some of the directions I was heading? Many different areas.

    I'm waiting for the answers.


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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Quote Originally Posted by H.G. Watson, Sr. View Post

    I'm waiting for the answers.
    .
    .
    Well I Certainly Hope You get What You want.
    .

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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Quote Originally Posted by H.G. Watson, Sr. View Post
    Do you see some of the directions I was heading? Many different areas.
    HG,

    I recognize that I took it out of context. Most of what you were asking, I got. The window did not make sense to me.

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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    thank you


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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    LOL.

    Ron Bishop,

    If S.F. Res, detached or attached garage and you're asking about the doors for a person to exit the garage area (occupied not habital space): An "exit door" shall be capable of opening so that the clear width is not less than thirty-two (32) inches and not less than six feet, eight inches (6'8") in height.


    Horizontal Sliding Doors are okay.

    Overhead doors do not count. Operating mechanisms must be 34-48" above the finished floor. Exit doors from garage must be operable without a key - this excludes deadbolts locks if the key side is towards the inside of the garage.

    You'll find it in Chapter 10 of Title 24 California Building Code 2007.
    1001.1, 1002.1, 1008.1.1, 1008.1.3.3, 1008.1.8, 1008.1.8.2

    and if attached garage see also: 1014.2.

    If you have equipment in garage, laundry, furnace closet, electrical panel, etc. there are more provisions to consider on doors, also if other than R1.

    Last edited by H.G. Watson, Sr.; 03-13-2010 at 11:49 PM.

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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Quote Originally Posted by James Risley View Post
    Is "clear width" to be interpreted in such a manner as to prevent the use of a 2'-8" door as the stop would reduce the actual "clear width" to about 2'-7 5/8"?? (same for height?)

    James
    JR:

    Most pre-hung swing doors allow for a greater than 90 degree swing (105 at least usually). Not really following your question or logic on the "stop" issue. Also don't know why you're asking without having first actually read Chapter 10 of the California Code, which was specific to the location of the original poster of the topic; or why you'd care since you're in TX and the response was specific to the California Code. There are a number of other factors not addressed by the OP which may influence the requirements for the minimum clear openings for exit door(s) from garage.

    Clear Width means that even the door hardware may not incroach the path. There are a few exceptions and some factors which may increase the minimum clear width and height - they were not addressed.

    Clear Width refers to the opening/path and in no way refers to the actual dimensions of the door blank itself?!?!??

    To provide the clear width a minimum sized exit door in question and therefore the hinge would necessarily have to open beyond 90 degrees.

    Therefore you would not be permitted to install or adjust a door or hinge stop in such a manner which restricted or encroached upon the minimum Clear Width, and may not allow door hardware, adornments upon the door, doorway, area storage, furniture, fixtures, wall decor, plantings, or any other obstruction/encroachment which would hinder that minimum clear width at any time, damaged hinges or pins, misalignments, etc. which restricted or present stress which required more than the maximum force pressures required to operate the door and acquire the minimum clear width would also have to be addressed/corrected. There is more to a "means of egress system" than just the exit door itself.

    Quote Originally Posted by 2007 CBC 1001.1
    Buildings or portions thereof shall be provied with a means of egress system as required by this chapter. The provisions of this chapter shall control the design, construction and arrangement of means of egress components required to provide an approved means of egress from structures and portions thereof.


    If you are interested, the "definitions" section was also cited in the prior post, have a read.

    Finally, are you not familiar with "full extension hinges"?

    Last edited by H.G. Watson, Sr.; 03-14-2010 at 10:46 AM.

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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Quote Originally Posted by James Risley View Post
    HG,

    Thanks for your extensive answer to the question concerning the clear space for a 32" door unit. Assume nothing else encroaches the clear width either inside or outside of the garage, the door opens sufficiently (or for that matter is completely removed from the opening) such that the door itself does not encroach upon the "clear width", thus leaving only the opening itself to be considered. Note that the "door stop" (the portion of the jamb which is either made as an integral portion of the jamb in an exterior unit or as an additional piece attached to the jamb), in the case of an interior unit, will by "necessity to function" have to encroach into the 32" opening enough to "stop" the door from swinging through the opening. Thus the "clear width" opening for a 32" door unit will be about 31 5/8" and would mean a wider unit would need to be installed according to your answer. I will read the definitions you referred to when I get a chance.

    Thanks again for your response.
    JR,

    Confusion/failure to communicate arising between "the stop" and "a door stop". You're asking about "the stop" rest which stops the face of the door when closed, not "a door stop" which limits the maximum open swing radius of a door. Okay, lets address your question. (Keeping in mind we're presuming single family residence occupancy load 10 or less, but we still don't know if attached or detached garage, or if there are other systems within, closets, walls, doors or other factors within, or in the path of egress to consider):

    Quote Originally Posted by 2007 Calfornia Building Code



    1008.1.1 Size of doors.

    The minimum width of each door opening shall be sufficient for the occupant load thereof and shall provide a clear width of not less than 32 inches (813 mm). Clear openings of doorways with swinging doors shall be measured between the face of the door and the stop, with the door open 90 degrees (1.57 rad). Where this section requires a minimum clear width of 32 inches (813 mm) and a door opening includes two door leaves without a mullion, one leaf shall provide a clear opening width of 32 inches (813 mm). The maximum width of a swinging door leaf shall be 48 inches (1219 mm) nominal. Means of egress doors in a Group I-2 occupancy used for the movement of beds and litter patients shall provide a clear width not less than 44 inches (1118 mm). The height of doors shall not be less than 80 inches (2032 mm).

    Exceptions:

    1. The minimum and maximum width shall not apply to door openings that are not part of the required means of egress in Group R-2 and R-3 occupancies.

    2. Other than those required to be accessible by Chapter 11B, door openings to resident sleeping units in Group 1-3 occupancies shall have a clear width of not less than 28 inches (711 mm).

    3. Door openings to storage closets less than 10 square feet (0.93 m2) in area shall not be limited by the minimum width.

    4. Width of door leafs in revolving doors that comply with Section 1008.1.3.1 shall not be limited.

    5. Door openings within a dwelling unit or sleeping unit shall not be less than 78 inches (1981 mm) in height.

    6. Exterior door openings in dwelling units and sleeping units, other than the required exit door, shall not be less than 76 inches (1930 mm) in height.

    7. In other than Group R-1 occupancies, the minimum widths shall not apply to interior egress doors within a dwelling unit or sleeping unit that is not required to be adaptable or accessible as specified in Chapter 11A or 11B, as applicable.

    8. Door openings required to be accessible within dwelling units shall have a minimum clear width as specified in Chapter 11A or 11B, as applicable.

    1008.1.1.1 Projections into clear width.

    There shall not be projections into the required clear width lower than 34 inches (864 mm) above the floor or ground. Projections into the clear opening width between 34 inches (864 mm) and 80 inches (2032 mm) above the floor or ground shall not exceed 4 inches (102 mm).

    Exception: In a Group I-2 occupancy, there shall be no projections into the clear width of doors used for the movement of beds and litter patients in the means of egress.
    You'll find more details and exceptions throughout Chapter 10.
    Although the door blank may be smaller You'll find the clear openings for prime (exterior) and rated doors are generally a bit larger and the stop to door face is sufficient with 2-8 (32") doors. The measurements you're providing are generally what is found for the door blank itself, not the clear opening, unless the hinge plate has been shimmed or isn't sufficiently tightened (post install) to the hingle gasket (if applicable).

    Last edited by H.G. Watson, Sr.; 03-15-2010 at 10:10 AM.

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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Quote Originally Posted by H.G. Watson, Sr. View Post
    LOL.

    Ron Bishop,

    If S.F. Res, detached or attached garage and you're asking about the doors for a person to exit the garage area (occupied not habital space): An "exit door" shall be capable of opening so that the clear width is not less than thirty-two (32) inches and not less than six feet, eight inches (6'8") in height.


    Horizontal Sliding Doors are okay.

    Overhead doors do not count. Operating mechanisms must be 34-48" above the finished floor. Exit doors from garage must be operable without a key - this excludes deadbolts locks if the key side is towards the inside of the garage.

    You'll find it in Chapter 10 of Title 24 California Building Code 2007.
    1001.1, 1002.1, 1008.1.1, 1008.1.3.3, 1008.1.8, 1008.1.8.2

    and if attached garage see also: 1014.2.

    If you have equipment in garage, laundry, furnace closet, electrical panel, etc. there are more provisions to consider on doors, also if other than R1.
    h.g.
    see section 1008.1.2 exc#1 or copy and paste it if you want. a garage with an occupant load of less than ten can use the overhead door for egress and does not require a man door!


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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Quote Originally Posted by brian schmitt View Post
    h.g.
    see section 1008.1.2 exc#1 or copy and paste it if you want. a garage with an occupant load of less than ten can use the overhead door for egress and does not require a man door!
    Nope. Not only must the hardware be within floor measurement limitations, the means to operate the door (unlatch, provide for opening) and the weight/force required still has to meet the requirements (30 lbs/15 lbs force). The section & its exceptions you refer to are regarding the otherwise required side-hinge SWING to the door, that exception allows for a SLIDING door to be used or a folding door, it does not provide for an OH door for the required exit door.

    If you finished reading the section following the exceptions it says:

    "The opening force for interior side-swinging doors without closers shall not exceed a 5-pound (22 N) force. For other side-swinging, sliding and folding doors, the door latch shall release when subjected to a 15-pound (67 N) force. The door shall be set in motion when subjected to a 30-pound (133 N) force. The door shall swing to a full-open position when subjected to a 15-pound (67 N) force. Forces shall be applied to the latch side."

    The entirety of Ch. 10 & if applicable Ch. 11A or 11B.

    Here's a quote from a ruling:


    Required Exit Doors in Garages.

    The California Building Code requires that every portion of the building have a code complying means of egress.

    Requirements for minimum exiting from a residential garage.

    The CBC (2007) requires that exit doors be openable from the inside without the use of a key, or any special knowledge or effort. Operating mechanisms must be installed 24" to 48" above the finished floor.

    Therefore an overhead garage door does not meet the requirements for an exit door.

    An exterior key-operated deadbolt is often installed at the door between the garage and the residential portion of the building for security purposes. In this case, the door between the house and the garage cannot serve as a complying exit FROM the garage because the deadbolt lock requires a key from the garage side to open.

    An "exit door" shall be capable of opening so that the clear width is not less than thirty-two (32) inches and not less than six feet, eight inches (6'8") in height.

    For the above reasons, it is often necessary to provide an additional door that opens directly to the exterior, which is openable from the garage side without the use of a key, or any special knowledge or effort.



    Last edited by H.G. Watson, Sr.; 03-15-2010 at 11:21 AM.

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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Bishop View Post
    Hello all...I am wondering if there is a minimum width requirement for a garage service door to the interior? Any help?
    Jeez, this thread is growing heads like Medusa. All the boy asked was the min. width requirement for a garage service door to the interior. No more and no less......

    Scott Patterson, ACI
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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Patterson View Post
    Jeez, this thread is growing heads like Medusa. All the boy asked was the min. width requirement for a garage service door to the interior. No more and no less......
    And since the poster is from California, the answer is, it DEPENDS.


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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Quote Originally Posted by H.G. Watson, Sr. View Post
    Nope. Not only must the hardware be within floor measurement limitations, the means to operate the door (unlatch, provide for opening) and the weight/force required still has to meet the requirements (30 lbs/15 lbs force). The section & its exceptions you refer to are regarding the otherwise required side-hinge SWING to the door, that exception allows for a SLIDING door to be used or a folding door, it does not provide for an OH door for the required exit door.

    If you finished reading the section following the exceptions it says:

    "The opening force for interior side-swinging doors without closers shall not exceed a 5-pound (22 N) force. For other side-swinging, sliding and folding doors, the door latch shall release when subjected to a 15-pound (67 N) force. The door shall be set in motion when subjected to a 30-pound (133 N) force. The door shall swing to a full-open position when subjected to a 15-pound (67 N) force. Forces shall be applied to the latch side."

    The entirety of Ch. 10 & if applicable Ch. 11A or 11B.

    Here's a quote from a ruling:


    [/size]
    h.g.,
    nice try but no cigar you just keep on thinking!


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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Quote Originally Posted by brian schmitt View Post
    h.g.,
    nice try but no cigar you just keep on thinking!

    Argue with the commission. The entirety of Ch. 10 & if applicable "R" occupancy group, potentially Ch. 11A or 11B.

    Get your headroom rules/ceiling and horizontal projections regarding the opening and path as well.

    Then get real and get your head out of the hole its in. Try clarifying attached or detached. Then try to understand the original post hasn't even clarified an occupancy type for the question. "U" group, "S" group or "R" group if attached. If you cannot read a short chapter in its entirety and retain the information long enough to realize what the Code says, I posted the ruling from a Bulletin.

    You're wrong on representation as to what the section you cited actually says, and it does not stand alone.


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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Quote Originally Posted by H.G. Watson, Sr. View Post
    Argue with the commission. The entirety of Ch. 10 & if applicable "R" occupancy group, potentially Ch. 11A or 11B.

    Get your headroom rules/ceiling and horizontal projections regarding the opening and path as well.

    Then get real and get your head out of the hole its in. Try clarifying attached or detached. Then try to understand the original post hasn't even clarified an occupancy type for the question. "U" group, "S" group or "R" group if attached. If you cannot read a short chapter in its entirety and retain the information long enough to realize what the Code says, I posted the ruling from a Bulletin.

    You're wrong on representation as to what the section you cited actually says, and it does not stand alone.
    h.g. aka jerk azz,
    the original poster is a hi and would not normally be inspecting chapter 11a or 11b structures,which don't include s.f.d.'s. i could care less about quotes from some comission. jurisdictions i have worked for and all local jurisdictions in the norcal area allow the overhead door to serve as an exit door for an attached or detached garage for an sfd,period. go scream or rant to a chicken


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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Quote Originally Posted by brian schmitt View Post
    h.g. aka jerk azz,
    the original poster is a hi and would not normally be inspecting chapter 11a or 11b structures,which don't include s.f.d.'s. i could care less about quotes from some comission. jurisdictions i have worked for and all local jurisdictions in the norcal area allow the overhead door to serve as an exit door for an attached or detached garage for an sfd,period. go scream or rant to a chicken
    Condos, other multi-family dwellings are inspected by HIs every day. (11A). SFDs with a person confined to bed, etc. - exit door requirements also change. HUD financed, guaranteed, or otherwise "assisted" properties are common.

    7'6" clear ceiling area, headroom min 80" due to horizontal encroachment in path not to be encroached more than 50 percent.

    Name a jurisdiction under 2007 CBC that approves special knowledge and greater forces than the unammended California code permits, control out of permitted floor height for same, or that applies and ignores different sections for attached and detached garages on lots with residential occupancy groups regarding the strength and forces required to open.

    Don't forget to provide us with the individual NAMES at those offices too.

    During the interim, as a Seinfield character said: "NO SOUP FOR YOU!"

    Last edited by H.G. Watson, Sr.; 03-15-2010 at 03:04 PM.

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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Quote Originally Posted by H.G. Watson, Sr. View Post
    Condos, other multi-family dwellings are inspected by HIs every day. (11A). SFDs with a person confined to bed, etc. - exit door requirements also change. HUD financed, guaranteed, or otherwise "assisted" properties are common.

    7'6" clear ceiling area, headroom min 80" due to horizontal encroachment in path not to be encroached more than 50 percent.

    Name a jurisdiction under 2007 CBC that approves special knowledge and greater forces than the unammended California code permits, control out of permitted floor height for same, or that applies and ignores different sections for attached and detached garages on lots with residential occupancy groups regarding the strength and forces required to open.

    Don't forget to provide us with the individual NAMES at those offices too.

    During the interim, as a Seinfield character said: "NO SOUP FOR YOU!"
    h.g. aka einstein,
    i specifically said s.f.d.'s in my post. you got the attention span of a rock, a dense one 11a and 11b na genius.


  23. #23
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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Quote Originally Posted by James Risley View Post
    Maybe the window size needs to be known so while everyone is trying to figure out whether they can get through the door the fire department can gain access by breaking out the window.
    JR: . . . and maybe HG will make his escape about the same time . . .


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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Talk about stretching one simple question into a thread about nothing that the original poster asked just so one can show how smart they are in areas that don't even matter.........WOW!

    Now that I think about it......did the window that has nothing to do with anything, that's not there, meet the energy code?

    This site is entertainment at the least!


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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    And the sad thing is HG is wrong on most of his interpretations of the CBC.

    Jerry McCarthy
    Building Code/ Construction Consultant

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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry McCarthy View Post
    And the sad thing is HG is wrong on most of his interpretations of the CBC.
    Really WC Jerry!

    Why don't you stick your neck out and explain EXACTLY where and WHAT is wrong?

    I'm waiting. Since you failed to grasp the particulars of another brian's garage conversion post...I'm really interested to know just WHERE.

    YOU POINT IT OUT, EXACTLY. The Code language is NOT ambiguous, only the poster's DETAILS were ambiguous.

    Fact set and citations - Lets have it - RIGHT HERE.


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    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Quote Originally Posted by H.G. Watson, Sr. View Post
    JR,

    Confusion/failure to communicate arising between "the stop" and "a door stop". You're asking about "the stop" rest which stops the face of the door when closed, not "a door stop" which limits the maximum open swing radius of a door. Okay, lets address your question. (Keeping in mind we're presuming single family residence occupancy load 10 or less, but we still don't know if attached or detached garage, or if there are other systems within, closets, walls, doors or other factors within, or in the path of egress to consider):



    You'll find more details and exceptions throughout Chapter 10.
    Although the door blank may be smaller You'll find the clear openings for prime (exterior) and rated doors are generally a bit larger and the stop to door face is sufficient with 2-8 (32") doors. The measurements you're providing are generally what is found for the door blank itself, not the clear opening, unless the hinge plate has been shimmed or isn't sufficiently tightened (post install) to the hingle gasket (if applicable).
    Quote Originally Posted by H.G. Watson, Sr. View Post
    Nope. Not only must the hardware be within floor measurement limitations, the means to operate the door (unlatch, provide for opening) and the weight/force required still has to meet the requirements (30 lbs/15 lbs force). The section & its exceptions you refer to are regarding the otherwise required side-hinge SWING to the door, that exception allows for a SLIDING door to be used or a folding door, it does not provide for an OH door for the required exit door.

    If you finished reading the section following the exceptions it says:

    "The opening force for interior side-swinging doors without closers shall not exceed a 5-pound (22 N) force. For other side-swinging, sliding and folding doors, the door latch shall release when subjected to a 15-pound (67 N) force. The door shall be set in motion when subjected to a 30-pound (133 N) force. The door shall swing to a full-open position when subjected to a 15-pound (67 N) force. Forces shall be applied to the latch side."

    The entirety of Ch. 10 & if applicable Ch. 11A or 11B.

    Here's a quote from a ruling:


    [/size]
    Quote Originally Posted by H.G. Watson, Sr. View Post
    Really WC Jerry!

    Why don't you stick your neck out and explain EXACTLY where and WHAT is wrong?

    I'm waiting. Since you failed to grasp the particulars of another brian's garage conversion post...I'm really interested to know just WHERE.

    YOU POINT IT OUT, EXACTLY. The Code language is NOT ambiguous, only the poster's DETAILS were ambiguous.

    Fact set and citations - Lets have it - RIGHT HERE.
    .
    Just a Little Patience Please.
    * it's coming.
    .

    .
    .

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    It Might have Choked Artie But it ain't gone'a choke Stymie! Our Gang " The Pooch " (1932)
    Billy J. Stephens HI Service Memphis TN.

  28. #28
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Healdsburg, CA
    Posts
    1,741

    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Sorry to disappoint Billy, but Scott is right in that this thread has gotten out of hand, too long, argumentative, and worse….. boring..
    We need to move on.

    Jerry McCarthy
    Building Code/ Construction Consultant

  29. #29
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Snowbird (this means I'm retired and migrate between locations), FL/MI
    Posts
    4,086

    Default Re: Garage service door width

    Because it was NOT wrong.


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