Thread: What's the problem?

Hey folks. Haven't been here in a dog's age. Hope all is well. I found a wild one today. Have you ever seen this arrangement? 9 gas fired water heaters on one horizontal manifold? With the outgoing stack completely to to the left side (not visible in photo) I could not find one part of this that I would consider safe. Most draft hoods were not secured either.
Sorry about the blurred photo, new camera.




Keep Lookin

Similar Threads:

• Shoddy work adding to foreclosure problem
• Problem Shrubbery
• problem?
• a problem or not

Oh my!

I would have to say that it certainly does not pass the "Gut feeling" test. It looks like that the "flue manifold" (for lack of a better name) is level. This in itself is wrong, if it is. Then it looks like those are not approved fittings connecting to the manifold.

The WH manufacturer will have a venting table for joining multiple appliances to one flue pipe. This would be the direction that I think you would need to go. Overall it looks like a mess.

Was that for multi fam units or commercial? Not that it matters - just curious. What Scott said.
Good to see ya back here.

I agree with Scott.

Inadequate slope, questionable flue pipe size, homemade fittings and bad focus.

Hey guys I agree on all counts and more. My biggest fear here is one mechanical break in this "manifold" and you have the potential for a lot of gases to pump into the basement and into the living spaces of this commercial 9 family. Look at all the joints and tape on this mess.

Just imagine a holiday weekend with all the families demanding water, one crack, detachment, whatever and CM counts will be off the chart. This homemade cluster#$%@ is dangerous no matter how you slice it.

The thing that gets me is the plumber was just lazy, there are three available masonry chimneys he could have utilized to reduce the potential for problems here. Aargh.


Keep Lookin

I've seen that set-up too many times. It's a slumlord favorite. I agree slope looks almost nil, so you have them on that. Usually, the big one I use against Mr. Slumlord is the BTU total. Add up the BTU of all hwt's versus what the manifold diameter size can handle. The manifold is always undersized for the total BTU output. Usually Mr. slumlord ends up separating units out into different chimneys or changing the config altogether, unless there is an old boiler chimney. Other available small masonry chimneys often won't handle the total BTU output either.

There is a way to build a manifold but this ain't it. The common vent/ chimney must be sized for the entire load. Next, the chimney cannot be more than 7x the smallest vent collar. The manifold must slope 1/4"/ft up to the breeching. The manifold must increase in size with each appliance to accomodate the total load up to that point. The vent connector must be properly supported. There must be as much vent rise as possible, which means tail end charlie is probably just an ell off the draft hood, which is prone to spillage. There must be 50 cubic feet of room/ 1000 btus or a MUA system. The vent connector must be removable for inspection and service. If the draft in the chimney is too high, it can cause a door curtain effect that effectively blocks the flue gases at the draft hood causing CO spillage out the base. The connectors must be secured with mechanical fasteners--not foil tape with smooth transitions--not hacked holes into the manifold. There must be adequately size gas lines for the full load not only of these WHs but the full building. These should all be tested including combustion analysis and a Worst Case depressurization/ draft interference test. I would recommend unlisted low level CO monitors in every appartment and the CAZ.

That my first pass at it.
Bob

Hey Bob, great reply. You are the king of knowledge for me when it comes to these issues. I did not put it as eloquently as you did to the landlord, but I got my point across very well. She was not happy, her reply was that it had passed City inspection for 10 yrs. Oh, ok, never mind. WHAT???

What I didn't include here was the parlor heaters, which may be indiginous to New England in term, but basically they are squat size gas space heaters, one in every unit, which I determined to be equally as dangerous due to loose and detached stack pipes, filthy dust encrusted heater manifolds, and overall poor condition due to just plain aging. Oh and ya, you guessed it, not ONE carbon monoxide detector IN THE WHOLE BUILDING!!!

Bob, Thanks again for your informative reply. I really have to get back here more regularly. I miss you guys.

Must have been installed by this guy I passed on the road today.

rick

Rick,

Cool!

He must have (wants us to think he has) 4 exhaust pipes per cylinder in that 4 banger?

Or are those afterburners?

Notice his rear tire is a bit low? Must be all that weight from those scraps of metal.

They appear to be increasing lengths L-R. Maybe they are organ pipes covering 2 octaves. Does it play "la cucaracha"?

Joe the plumber again, boy that guy gets everywhere.

Kevin Stewart
F.I.R.E. EDC