Thread: Chimney height 15 '

Anyone know where I can find this code reference regarding the minimum height of 15' as shown in this image?

Originally Posted by Marc M

Anyone know where I can find this code reference regarding the minimum height of 15' as shown in this image?

I'm guessing it comes from a 12' roof and the chimney being 3' higher than the roof.

Nothing in the IRC maybe it's a Canadian thing, CD does have some Canadian references in their publications.

May have been from an installation instructions, but my guess that it is a typo.

Minimum height of a gas vent is 5 feet above the Draft hood - is that a gas fireplace or a solid fuel burning fireplace?

Minimum height above the roof is 3 feet, but without specifying the roof height above the appliance the 15 feet doesn't make sense.

CAT I gas appliances are tested with only 5 feet of vertical venting, hence the 5ft. usually stated in their listed instructions. With factory built fireplaces, each mfr. will state the minimum chimney height for that model. Note virtually all brands will require additional height for each offset so there's almost always a chart showing the various min. heights (plural). Most mfrs. reference this stated height as measured from the base of the fireplace to the flue gas outlet--not as drawn here.

Note there are some B-vented gas fireplaces that do not allow offsets greater than 45 degrees from vertical with a min. height. Some mfrs. will specify not to use high wind terminations but only the low loss rain caps.

With direct vent gas fireplaces, furnaces, boilers and WHs, all the venting should be spelled out in great detail.

This CD drawing is rather useless.

There are no provisions on the codes or NFPA 211 on min. chimney height except above the roof line as Jerry noted = 3/2/10 rule.

Originally Posted by Jim Abram

@ Bob Harper -"There are no provisions on the codes or NFPA 211 on min. chimney height except above the roof line as Jerry noted = 3/2/10 rule."

Bob - You seem to have missed R-1004.1

Minimum chimney height?????
- SECTION R1004 FACTORY-BUILT FIREPLACES
- - R1004.1 General.
- - - Factory-built fireplaces shall be listed and labeled and shall be installed in accordance with the conditions of the listing. Factory-built fireplaces shall be tested in accordance with UL 127.
- - R1004.2 Hearth extensions.
- - - Hearth extensions of approved factory-built fireplaces shall be installed in accordance with the listing of the fireplace. The hearth extension shall be readily distinguishable from the surrounding floor area. Listed and labeled hearth extensions shall comply with UL 1618.
- - R1004.3 Decorative shrouds.
- - - Decorative shrouds shall not be installed at the termination of chimneys for factory-built fireplaces except where the shrouds are listed and labeled for use with the specific factory-built fireplace system and installed in accordance with the manufacturer’s installation instructions.
- - R1004.4 Unvented gas log heaters.
- - - An unvented gas log heater shall not be installed in a factory-built fireplace unless the fireplace system has been specifically tested, listed and labeled for such use in accordance with UL 127.

Originally Posted by Jim Abram

No need to guess. It comes from the manufacturers specifications.

Majestic has minimum heights listed for their products as do most manufacturers

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Jerry - First if you look at the picture it says wood burning. That generally means solid fuel.I will get you a definition if you need it.

The 15 feet may not make sense to you as not much does. It is a general specification by manufacturers of these components.

Jerry - You are an embarrassment with this fire , ready , aim SOP. Wrong again.

What the heck? How about some professionalism?

Originally Posted by JB Thompson

What the heck? How about some professionalism?

Originally Posted by Jim Abram

@ Bob Harper -"There are no provisions on the codes or NFPA 211 on min. chimney height except above the roof line as Jerry noted = 3/2/10 rule."

Bob - You seem to have missed R-1004.1

Thank you Jim for that useless response. If you think someone has spoken in error, it is customary to clarify EXACTLY what the correction is--not refer to general reference, which does not clearly state the issue and to do so in a respectful, civil manner. In your case, you quoted R-1004.1 with no explanation what this is from. It appears to be from the International Residential Code but again, you did not state your reference. You also failed to state what within section 0.1 of R-1004 of the IRC or whatever standard this is from actually says much less how it conflicts with what I said.

Methinks you are in a big hurry to put others down, embarrass them or be a show boat. Try a little humility and professionalism..........for a change. Have a good day.

Originally Posted by Jim Abram

Assuming from your comment that you had researched the Codes prior to posting,

Does Your Moma know your on the Computer?

SMOMOTIONTV - YouTube

I want to thank all of you for helping me decide not to waste any more time looking at this forum. With the things I have seen in this thread as an example, I will warn anyone who asks to avoid it at all costs.

Originally Posted by Jack Foster

I want to thank all of you for helping me decide not to waste any more time looking at this forum. With the things I have seen in this thread as an example, I will warn anyone who asks to avoid it at all costs.

I hope not to many folks decide the same. What will I do for entertainment? This is better than the WWF!

And in the end, I did learn something.

Jim I am intimately familiar with R1004 so don't try to lecture me.
you still miss the point : R1004.1 does NOT state 15 ft but refers you to the listed instructions just as i did if you could read.
fyi, i have. been the leading voice on this site for a long time instructing inspectors to refer to the listed instructions. see the archives
you were unprofessional because you thought you caught me in error and wanted to show me up. instead you made a fool of yourself.

Originally Posted by Jim Abram

No need to guess. It comes from the manufacturers specifications.

Majestic has minimum heights listed for their products as do most manufacturers

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Jerry - First if you look at the picture it says wood burning. That generally means solid fuel.I will get you a definition if you need it.

The 15 feet may not make sense to you as not much does. It is a general specification by manufacturers of these components.

Jerry - You are an embarrassment with this fire , ready , aim SOP. Wrong again.

I think it's time we vote Mr. wrong direction off the board!? We do not need his insults hidden at times and other times not and his usually wrong information that he interprets out of nowhere
..

The drawing can be found at InspectApedia - Chimney height rules. However, their link to Carson Dunlop Associates, Toronto, does not actually link to their site (carsondunlop.com). I also do not find that drawing on CD's site.

The InspectApedia site shows the drawing with almost no commentary, context or code reference. Google shows a page from CD's HI course in which the "15 foot" diagram is Figure 2.21 (Chapter 2, Masonry Chimneys, page 5) and the previous page repeats the 15' claim (11' for an oil burner and 5' for a gas appliance).
Principles of Home Inspection: Chimneys and Wood Heating - Carson Dunlop - Google Books

I am tired of the continual put downs and unprofessional conduct of Mr. Abram. I don't mind the the odd bit of discourse, which is normal on any forum, but this is continual.

Brian, how long do we all have to tolerate this unprofessional conduct and put downs of long time contributors and their professional approach to questions?

I believe in free speech but this forum is suffering as a result of Mr. Abram, know-it-all, boorish behaviour, superiority complex, and his constant need for put downs.

I am lodging a complaint and I trust others will do the same, its a blemish on an otherwise professional forum.

Mr Abrams,

If you want to get someone then you should use a manufacturer spec that matches the graphic depicted.

In your attached example (From Monessen) the height is 15' from the floor to the flue outlet. Which is less than the 15' from the top of the fireplace as shown in the Carson Dunlop graphic.


Here is one that is like Carson Dunlaps-
http://www.napoleonproducts.com/down.../W415-0711.pdf

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Just to add the the fun the Monssen chimney is about 10.5' tall.

So following manufacturer specs counts

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Just to add the the fun the Monssen chimney is about 10.5' tall.

So following manufacturer specs counts

Originally Posted by Raymond Wand

I am tired of the continual put downs and unprofessional conduct of Mr. Abram. I don't mind the the odd bit of discourse, which is normal on any forum, but this is continual.

Brian, how long do we all have to tolerate this unprofessional conduct and put downs of long time contributors and their professional approach to questions?

I believe in free speech but this forum is suffering as a result of Mr. Abram, know-it-all, boorish behaviour, superiority complex, and his constant need for put downs.

I am lodging a complaint and I trust others will do the same, its a blemish on an otherwise professional forum.

Raymond,

If Brian wants to boot Jim Abram but is reluctant to do so because of others involved, I will volunteer to step-aside for awhile and stop participating in the forum if that will facilitate Brian booting Jim Abram.

Personalities like the one being complained about are one of the primary reasons my time and contributions here are much less than previously. Sadly, it's easier to lurk and just read than be an active contributing member.

Jerry

You stepping aside is not the answer - thanks for the offer, it is very clear that JA will argue with anyone at any time for his own selfish reasons. He certainly has isolated himself and clearly is not part of the camaraderie here at Inspection News.

Originally Posted by Jim Abram

Bob - Whenever a declaratory statement such as, "There are no provisions on the codes or NFPA 211 on min. chimney height except above the roof line as Jerry noted = 3/2/10 rule."
It raises some concerns and a need for clarification. That is a very strong statement without clarification. On its own, your statement is incorrect.

There should have been some clarification of that statement as there are provisions in the codes that relate to chimney height. These provisions are "shall be installed in accordance with the conditions of the listing.",which direct you to the installation instructions, which indicate minimum heights for factory built fireplace chimneys.

Jim, let me try to get through to you one last time: if you will refer to my initial post: "With factory built fireplaces, each mfr. will state the minimum chimney height for that model. Note virtually all brands will require additional height for each offset so there's almost always a chart showing the various min. heights (plural). Most mfrs. reference this stated height as measured from the base of the fireplace to the flue gas outlet--not as drawn here. "

Now, that coincides with the IRC and NFPA 211 just in case you cannot comprehend what I wrote. There is NO flat statement in either the IRC or 211 calling for a universal 15 ft. height, which is what the OP was about. Do you remember that? I was pointing out that there is no such single reference in the code or 211. I don't have to cut and paste both the entire IRC Chapter 10 and NFPA 211 to prove that point dude. Clarification? You are the one who needs to clarify just what in the heck you think IS in the IRC or 211 that references a 15 ft. min. Get a grip...

Meanwhile, you continued to make vague references to R1004.1 without explaining just what in the world you felt that reference has to do with the price of eggs in China or the topic of this thread. Instead, you recited it to my like I was a dumb school kid. I certainly don't need you to lecture me on codes and standards about combustion venting, chimneys and fireplaces. I guess you don't know anything about me but I am a Certified Fireplace and Chimney Inspector, have taught over 60 certification courses for the National Fireplace Institute, and currently sit on the NFPA 211 cmte. and the UL Standard Technical Panel 103, which writes all the venting listings.

If you weren't in such a hurry to embarrass or upstage someone you might not stick you foot in your mouth. As it is, you've made a complete fool of yourself not to mention turned off some people from this site. I have been on this site for many years volunteering a lot of information about hearth appliances, chimneys and venting. I make some people unhappy when I share all this information freely as they provide training and are concerned some may feel they don't need to take those courses because I have shared so much here. I can back up anything I say on this site and always look in the codes and stds. before I post, even though I'm in those books EVERY day.

Apparently, you are the only one who did not comprehend what I wrote Jimbo. Maybe you need to take your anger and disdain for professionals somewhere else. I can assure you I do not appreciate your attitude here or your attacks. You seem to be a miserable person. Take your misery elsewhere please.