Thread: The Cancer of America

Walmart

Found this to be interesting. Check it out.

Putting the mom and pop type business out of business everywhere.

Watching the Growth of Walmart Across America

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I agree, it's a 21st century evil that should be eradicated.

My wife is an anti-sprawl warrior. She will not set foot in a Walmart.

That's amazing... I thought we had a lot Walmarts in Oregon and it turns out we're about the most sparce place. Do you guys in the midwest have any other stores or business or is just all Wally World as far as the eye can see?

Yes we should shut down every Walmart store and fire every person that works at Walmart. every Truck drivers, checkers, box boys, clerks, building contractors that help build the buildings, all the inspectors and building suppliers, lumber suppliers, concrete company's, insurance suppliers, ship yard workers, mechanics, tire busters, roofers, door and glass contractors, street sweepers and parking lot keepers, sign makers. and on and on and on.

Walmart will stick around for a time an then the Feds will step in and run the company in the ground by taxing it to death. The unions will get a law past and the unions workers will driver up the cost of items and then no one will shop there any more and Walmart will either get a bail-out or the will wind up like Kmart or JC Penney's... closing 100s of stores and then everybody will be happy happy days are hear again.

Best

Ron

I am awed by the logistics of operating a empire that large.
I miss the center of towns. I wish mixed use buildings were the norm. I wish the guy who dreamed up clustering uses was never born. All the highway commercial,housing, schools industrial all in their Zones. Funny how the new stuff is so regulated.
I'm not so sure that the mom an pops are being driven out as much as the new mom an pops have too many obstacles to overcome.
god forbid if somebody wanted to sew a shirt for sale out of her house ,or a neighbor kid wants to fix a car in his driveway.or bake a pie for sale..they become criminals.
That's the cancer.

Originally Posted by Ron Bibler

Yes we should shut down every Walmart store and fire every person that works at Walmart. every Truck drivers, checkers, box boys, clerks, building contractors that help build the buildings, all the inspectors and building suppliers, lumber suppliers, concrete company's, insurance suppliers, ship yard workers, mechanics, tire busters, roofers, door and glass contractors, street sweepers and parking lot keepers, sign makers. and on and on and on...

You could say the same thing about the tobacco industry that is responsible for untold disease and death.

A close friend of ours lives/works in Bentonville. He is with EMC as a support role for WalMart/Sams. They were being transferred back to the DFW area and they were excited to be able to get out of the 'he__hole' (as he phrased it). He does not care for working for the WalMart world and their rules ... I won't go into details here, but they are absolutely amazing and they go way beyond work relationships. They impact who you can see or be seen with 'outside of work' on your personal time.

Anyway ... long story short. His boss said he needed to stay in Bentonville for job protection as they will be able to maintain same in that area. That same day EMC announced staff reductions (aka: layoffs) throughout their system.

Mom and Pop Store. What's that. A family cannot survive on one store today. Franchises took care of that. One needs to own 2, 3, 4 stores to make it now adays. The greedy humans strike again. No one is satisfied with a good days work for a good dollar. I need more, I need more. "I am only worth 5 billion. I want to be worth more than Bill Gates." Does anyone want to figure what one would make anually with say 1,000,000,000 in the bank on a 5% CD??? You cannot spend that much money. You would have to spend 5,700 dollars every waking hour. You still would not spend it all at the rate you would be gaining interest on the rest of the money.

Ah mallscape. Its what makes America practically look the same no matter where you are. At least you always know you are within easy access of McDonalds/Chilis/Wal Mart/Best Buy/etc.


I like Wal Mart. I know some good people who work for them and they have been with the company for many (>10) years. I think they get a bad rap. They give out over 1 million $$$ a day to charity.

I grew up in a small town with the Mom and Pop stores. Limited selections, somewhat of a monopoly on prices. It wasnt the Norman Rockwell portraits that most people imagine. My brother worked for an appliance dealer. The appliance dealer had poor labor practices that were much worse than Wal Mart has ever been accused of.

What does any of this have to do with Home Inspection?

General Chit Chat. Besides it is fun to throw stones at people that make that much money. It has been the way of things for centuries. Can't bash Italians, Little people, Irishman, black folks, Portericans, skinny people, fat people, might as well beat up on the rich folk. They are still open game. In case you are wondering I don't and never have bashed any of those folks listed. I am Italian, Cherokee Indian and Irish.

Let's see now ... maybe that this thread is known as "general chit chat" ... about anything that anyone wants to share.

We don't always have to have to be discussing HI items. I think it helps us all expand our bases.

I live near a GREAT traditional hardware store with GREAT service. The guys who work there actually know what they're doing and talking about.
It is very difficult for them to compete with Home Depot or Lowes on price. People will drive a long way to save some money. They obviously also can't carry as many items.

I once was in one of the big orange boxes looking for a particular faucet set for my wife's darkroom. I described it to a guy with an apron in the plumbing section. He not only said they didn't have such a thing, I found out later the only reason I didn't see it was because HE WAS STANDING IN FRONT OF IT!
I find myself in my neighborhood hardware store so many Sundays that I tell people I worship there (not being religious, otherwise).
The other thing the giant big box stores tend to destroy is walkable communities. Now everyone drives out to the burbs in their giant SUVs so they can drive from one big box to another.
End of rambling rant.

I suggest everybody rent the dvd "Walmart: The High Cost of Low Prices".

I am in no ways a bleeding heart liberal, but this documentary will probably make you think twice about shopping at Walmart. It did me and many I know who have watched it.

Walmart does a lot of things as bad or worse than just puttting Mom and Pop out of business.

Eric

I despise Wal-Mart as a cultural institution, but you need to be realistic about it: my mother lives in Espanola New Mexico, a few years ago when we needed to buy a rolling pin - we had to go to Santa Fe to find one. These days there's a Wal-Mart - and guess what they sell rolling pins.

More important, the mom-and-pop businesses in Espanola were charging very high prices relative to the quality and variety of the products on the shelves, I would say that my mother literally spends about 50% of what she did previously for food and basic household and kitchen items. Also, Espanola experienced a substantial surge in tax revenues, the reason is that Wal-Mart actually collects and remit sales taxes, where is the mom-and-pop businesses engaged in a wide variety of subterfuges to avoid remitting these taxes.

Originally Posted by Michael Thomas

Also, Espanola experienced a substantial surge in tax revenues, the reason is that Wal-Mart actually collects and remit sales taxes, where is the mom-and-pop businesses engaged in a wide variety of subterfuges to avoid remitting these taxes.

I see your points but it is very possible that Walmart got other very large tax breaks from the county and or city (or other ways) as part of their deal to build there, which is very common when they roll into town.

Eric

I like WalMart.

I don't buy very much throughout the year from the local store, but I like knowing that I can find just about anything I need at a local WalMart. Some things I will not even consider buying at WalMart and then I shop either at a local store or another chain store.

Michael

Depending on the exact definition everyone in America does the following to some extent.

"mom-and-pop businesses engaged in a wide variety of subterfuges to avoid remitting these taxes"

Whether it blatant dishonesty or legal blatant dishonesty, everyone pays as little as the possible can. I had an accountant in Mass years ago that could pick things apart that other accountants could not. All perfectly legal but I paid about 25% of what other folks did in the same business dollar per dollar.

Not all Mom and pops operated in the manner that you are quoting. And then again some were forced to by competition that bought billions of dollars in goods. They would not have to have done this if it were not for the Walmarts of the world.

In my post above. How many billions does one need before they have enough billions. People scream to have a Walmart in their area to save a few dollars.

If a body shops for food at Walmart and that is all they bought there they would save into the hundreds per year on a family shopping.

As far as the JC Pennys, I shop there as well. You can not get the same brands at a Walmart. In this tight economy (were I had 2 ininspection in the past 7 days) I do not think I will be hitting the JC Penny anytime soon.

Oh yeah. Nobody is forced to work at the Walmarts. Some have to because it is the only thing going in their area.

I'm not a Walmart fan or foe either way. I generally don't buy there but will if circumstances call for it. I prefer to shop at non-chain stores, even if it does cost more sometimes.
As evidence brought out clearly shows, their employment practices and those of other corporations are pretty appalling in many ways. Maybe that's why we stay self-employed.
As 'evil' as some feel those Corp's are, I don't think that idea looks at the real reason for their success.
Would you shop at a nicer, higher quality store if you could afford to? My guess is that many would.
The depression of average worker wages is really the incubator that has made it feasible for Walmart and others to be so successful, so dramatically. Many average families quite frankly can't afford to shop anywhere else.
This of course contributes to other societal ills, obesity (poor quality processed food purchases), lack of savings and repeat spending (low end products that need to be replaced), self-esteem issues (media portrayals of who shops at wally world) depressed wages and lack of US production (can't make the stuff that cheap here).
Corporations by nature are self-interested. As consumers and citizens can make choices to effect how those corporations do business. For some of our people making better choices is not economically feasible, which takes us back to depressed wages.

Walmart I can get just about any thing i need in one place. save me gas from driving all over town looking for some thing. I was on my way to an inspection and i had to get a new camera as i drop the one i had on the last inspection a Office depot did not have a camera that would do the job for the price they sent me to Walmart and BoomBaby Walmart had the correct little camera at a great price ...

Walmart Sucks.

Best

Ron

Originally Posted by Markus Keller

This of course contributes to other societal ills, obesity (poor quality processed food purchases), lack of savings and repeat spending (low end products that need to be replaced), self-esteem issues (media portrayals of who shops at wally world) depressed wages and lack of US production (can't make the stuff that cheap here).
Corporations by nature are self-interested. As consumers and citizens can make choices to effect how those corporations do business. For some of our people making better choices is not economically feasible, which takes us back to depressed wages.

It's going to be very interesting politically over the next decade or two as the potential for outsourcing white-collar jobs begins to be realized, most of the estimates I see suggest that somewhere between half and two thirds of the "white-collar" jobs in America could potentially be outsourced.

Case in point: a while back there was a new "associate" working at Home Depot, after had I run into him a few times it became apparent that he was far better educated and probably considerably smarter than most other people working the floor there.

After bit of conversation I discovered that this guy was an "underemployed" lawyer.

For 20 years he had a lucrative practice preparing patent applications for local companies like U.S. Robotics and Motorola, he could do two or three patent applications a week and he was charging about $3500 per application.

A year or two previously however one of his competitors began using law students in India to perform most of the research and prepare the boilerplate portions of the applications, only the final review and sign off was performed in the US, and applications could to be processed for corporate clients for between $500 and $700 each.

If you think about it, there's no reason why most or all of many such highly compensated "professional" and white-collar services can't be similarly outsourced, about the only jobs that are truly protected are those require "physical presence", and even a lot of the physical "presence" is optional, and can be replaced by teleconferencing and other similar techniques.

I suspect that a lot of white-collar citizens who are crying crocodile tears for displaced low-wage workers and mom-and-pop proprietors (if they bothered to give them a second thought at all) are gonna be crying for real when they realize they can no longer pay their mortgages or provide their children with the sorts of educations they are all too well aware will be requirements for the shrinking pool of highly compensated white-collar work.

For a long time in this country we have been tolerating increasingly wide differences in income and decreasing social mobility (contrary to what most Americans believe, social mobility - as measured by the difference between children's success in their parents - is higher in much of Western Europe than it is here, primarily because educational opportunity is more evenly distributed), in return for the 1) possibility that you will hit the jackpot and be allowed to keep it and that 2) your children if they work hard and play by the rules on the average they can expect a more prosperous life in your own.

Both those beliefs are being subverted by recent events: on the one hand it's become clear that a great many of the people who "hit the jackpot" in recent yars did so as a result of financial manipulations that are having a disastrous effect on the economic lives of ordinary citizens, and it's becoming increasingly likely that average Americans entering the workforce in the last few years and probably through the end of the decade will take decades to catch up with her parents living standard at the same age - if they are ever able to do so at all, while the same time a great many Americans at the other end of their working lives are facing severe economic strains as they contemplate retirement due to the loss of value in retirement savings.

And I think we're just starting to see how politically contentious these issues are going to become.

If facing severe economic strains you can get a job at Walmart Working out your days 8 to 5.. 5 days a weeksaved by Walmart...

Or you can get a job in the Fed.Goverment...


I just don't Understand this thread. what did you start Rick?
You should be ashamed of yourself....

Best

Ron

We should throw stones at people that make that much money? Whos that the shareholders? Most people own shares in Wal Mart in one of their 401K accounts.


If you have a beef with someone, it may be corporations as a whole, not just Wal Mart.

As far as taxes. The "mom and pop" vietnamese family that cut my hair only take cash. Gee I wonder how much tax they are paying.

Or the illegals that only work for cash.

"Leave it to beaver" isn't on TV anymore because times change. "Mom and Pop" stores are loosing out to Walmart and other large chains because the people do not support them. They get more at these places for their hard earned money. These places wouldn't exist if people didn't buy there.

It's about free enterprise and supply & demand. THIS IS ANY EVER CHANGING WORLD.

ADAPT or LOOSE OUT and joint others who fall behind the wayside.

Sorry, but that just the way it is.

For what its worth, I frequent my hometown coffee place. Why? It actually costs more than Four Bucks (Which I personally despise), but I like the service and the "feel" of the place. Same with my Physician. I could go to one of the mega clinics (probably cheaper), but I just like talking to my personal physician who I have dealt with for years.

Remember all the Exxon bashing back in July when crude was ~$150 per barrel? I dont hear many people bashing them now that crude is ~$40 per barrel.

Well let me see... a company that employs thousands, has goods priced at levels that are affordable for millions and donates millions to needy charities. Yes.. I say lets run them out of business.

Well lets see, A company that employs thousands (in sweatshops over seas for pennies a week, literally slave labor), has goods priced at levels that millions can afford (in large part do to their out-sourcing and sweatshop labor) ,and provides millions in charity (but won't provide even decent benefits for its own employees and to boot, spies on them to prevent them from trying to get better working environments ). Feeds off of my tax money to build their stores and damage local economies. But hey they are a great company!



Eric

"Feeds off of my tax money to build their stores and damage local economies."

Do you really thing that the tax break is forever? Do you really think they are destroying your economy?

Do you Really think Walmart is ruining your life?????????????????

Do you have any idea what a local Walmart puts into sales tax (state) on a daily, weekly, monthly basis????? Do you realize what Walmart puts into the economy (local) in the way of all the people that work at a local walmart and their salary that pumps into the local economy and their purchases for sales tax into the state sales tax book.

I may not like the whole Walmart thing in general they strengthen a local economy tremendously as well as the states welfare as well and the federal government tax rolls as well.

Originally Posted by Eric Shuman

Well lets see, A company that employs thousands (in sweatshops over seas for pennies a week, literally slave labor), has goods priced at levels that millions can afford (in large part do to their out-sourcing and sweatshop labor) ,and provides millions in charity (but won't provide even decent benefits for its own employees and to boot, spies on them to prevent them from trying to get better working environments ). Feeds off of my tax money to build their stores and damage local economies. But hey they are a great company!



Eric

Here's my take on this. People love to complain about this company, but the only thing that's going to make them go away is to stop shopping there. Some people love to talk a good game, but when it comes right down to it, it's the pocketbook that matters.
Don't read this as defending Walmart. Personally I hate that store. I've been in the one by me a few times and it's always dirty. I'd rater go to Target. I just don't want anyone tell me how I have to run my business.
How about you? How would you like to have someone tell you how much you have to pay your employees or how much in benefits you'd have to give. Stop shopping there and they'll be forced to change their ways.

Originally Posted by Ted Menelly

"Feeds off of my tax money to build their stores and damage local economies."

Do you really thing that the tax break is forever? Do you really think they are destroying your economy?

Do you Really think Walmart is ruining your life?????????????????

Do you have any idea what a local Walmart puts into sales tax (state) on a daily, weekly, monthly basis????? Do you realize what Walmart puts into the economy (local) in the way of all the people that work at a local walmart and their salary that pumps into the local economy and their purchases for sales tax into the state sales tax book.

I may not like the whole Walmart thing in general they strengthen a local economy tremendously as well as the states welfare as well and the federal government tax rolls as well.

Do you really think Walmart needs tax breaks to build in communities? Really? They are one of the most profitable companies in the world. Whats funny is that in areas where the tax breaks were denied, guess what? Walmart built the stores there anyway.

I want a tax break too.

Here are a couple of articles that delve into the walmart tax breaks, etc.

TomPaine.com - Wal-Mart's Tax On Us

The Raw Story | Wal-Mart pays itself rent, gets large tax breaks

These are just a couple of examples out of literally hundreds of ways that Walmart is sticking it to the Gov't and us.

And also guess who subsidzes the cost of the walmart workers health problems and welfare because Walmart will not provide the same benefits and pay of other similar large corporations, That's right, we do.

Originally Posted by Tony Infelise

Here's my take on this. People love to complain about this company, but the only thing that's going to make them go away is to stop shopping there. Some people love to talk a good game, but when it comes right down to it, it's the pocketbook that matters.
Don't read this as defending Walmart. Personally I hate that store. I've been in the one by me a few times and it's always dirty. I'd rater go to Target. I just don't want anyone tell me how I have to run my business.
How about you? How would you like to have someone tell you how much you have to pay your employees or how much in benefits you'd have to give. Stop shopping there and they'll be forced to change their ways.

I agree and I haven't shoppped at Walmart in years, and will not.

It's a free market and people can shop where they like, I won't hold it against them.

The problem is not WalMart, the problem is us. As long as "we the people" continue to shop at stores of this type, the more they will propagate. You don't like WalMart, don't shop there.

Agree with Gunnar and I don't and don't.

If you dont like wal mart and refuse to shop there because they are too big and have put smaller shops out of business, then you cant really shop at any big box store either. Your home depot, lowes, best buy's target's are all the same type of companies. Although none are as big as wal mart, they certainly aspire to be as large and as successful.

How many hardware stores have lowes and home depot put out of business? How many family owned appliance stores have best buy put out? Probably quite a few and thats unfortunate for them. But remember, most of those stores started out just like your family hardware store did. You think sam walton started with 1000 stores? Nope, had one in bentonville and it grew from there.

Lets face it, ya have to embrace the change. Or just refuse to shop at all franchises from now on. Or does everyone want the government to regulate everything and put them all out of business?

Walmarts are about the only store in the country that you can just about shop at anymore. I don't like them. The people in these stores are just pitiful to look at anymore. The employees are a sad bunch too. Guess the only requirement to work there is to have at least 3/4 of your teeth missing. Around here parts the Walmart is kind of like a meat market on Saturday night. I swear people go there to try and pick up somebody for the evening I believe. As far as the women in the stores I have never seen so many large women in stretch pants in one place in all my life. Bellies and bottoms hanging out everywhere. Don't get me started now on the men in the stores.