Thread: The second shot heard round the world

The liberal state of MA has spoken. We do not want a socialist society.
The elected representatives work for us, the taxpayers.
Obama's agenda of the hard working people paying the way for the not so hard working people is not going to happen.

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Originally Posted by Dennis Robitaille

The liberal state of MA has spoken. We do not want a socialist society.
The elected representatives work for us, the taxpayers.
Obama's agenda of the hard working people paying the way for the not so hard working people is not going to happen.

There are a LOT of HARD WORKING PEOPLE who even work hard at TWO JOBS and still cannot afford health insurance.

Great Can Do American attitude you have there Dennis.

I'm sure our forefathers who fought the revolution would like to see this country in the condition it is in now.

Having been involved in local politics a bit in the past, I was really fired up over this election. Granted, Bush lost focus towards the end of his term, but the lawyering up of terrioists and the pushing upon the people of a socialist health care program was totally unacceptable. To call it health care reform is an insult upon our intelligence. We have so care health care reform here in MA. It consists of being forced to buy expensive health insurance or else face tax penalties.

Originally Posted by Dennis Robitaille

Granted, Bush lost focus towards the end of his term,

Huh? Did he ever have focus? Have you looked at his history? Pretty much everything he touched turned to dust.

I would like to see responses from individuals who have had the testicular or ovarian fortitude to confront their healthcare professionals (e.g. doctors, dentists,nurses, optometrists, opticians, etc) by telling them that they are charging too much for their service.

This is the only country where they are allowed to rip us off.

You can get superior service in Switzerland and other European countries for half the fees. This also applies to certain Asian countries.

Uh... the difference would be the lawyers. Of all people I'd think an HI would get that. The grand old USA is the only place on earth you can sue a doctor for saving your life.... and win.

Lawyers are presidents, congressmen, judges and pretty much every other person that has anything to do with our government. I'm not a conspiracy nut at all but I think our legal system will eventually be what does in our society.

Lawsuits are so commonplace these days that you can't even do a simple job like inspecting homes without looking over your shoulder. And that's just dealing with a house. How do you think a doctor deals with it? Yep, pays OUTRAGEOUS insurance premiums just so there's something there when the scumbags come a calling.

Originally Posted by Ken Bates

I would like to see responses from individuals who have had the testicular or ovarian fortitude to confront their healthcare professionals (e.g. doctors, dentists,nurses, optometrists, opticians, etc) by telling them that they are charging too much for their service.

This is the only country where they are allowed to rip us off.

You can get superior service in Switzerland and other European countries for half the fees. This also applies to certain Asian countries.

People that rip us off and are way over paid


doctor's way over paid...
Banker's way over paid...
Air Line Pilots way over paid...
Truck drivers way over paid...
Home Inspectors way over paid...
Congress men way over paid...
Movie producers way over paid...
this list should cover every job in the country...

All these should be controlled by and work for the Government...

And the Goverment should set there pay so they can't rip us off any more...

Best

Ron

Hi there Socialist Ron;
I'm one on those retired, "way over paid" airline pilots that has decided to take another passion (real estate/construction/building,etc), and do something with it (become a home inspector).

Back in the 70's, the government controlled the airlines and how they operated, and because of that, you couldn't afford to fly from Los Angeles to Orange County. That all changed when they de-regulated the industry. When they did that, guys like you (in your shorts, flip flops and hawaiian shirt) came along, and began denegrating the experience for everyone.

"Way over paid?" Tell me how you feel about that when the airplane you are riding in, sucks in a flock of geese, and you, remarkably end up in the Hudson River (BTW, alive and well) No smiley's here; You simply don't know what you're talking about.
Rick

Originally Posted by Charles Guinn

Hi there Socialist Ron;
I'm one on those retired, "way over paid" airline pilots that has decided to take another passion (real estate/construction/building,etc), and do something with it (become a home inspector).

Back in the 70's, the government controlled the airlines and how they operated, and because of that, you couldn't afford to fly from Los Angeles to Orange County. That all changed when they de-regulated the industry. When they did that, guys like you (in your shorts, flip flops and hawaiian shirt) came along, and began denegrating the experience for everyone.

"Way over paid?" Tell me how you feel about that when the airplane you are riding in, sucks in a flock of geese, and you, remarkably end up in the Hudson River (BTW, alive and well) No smiley's here; You simply don't know what you're talking about.
Rick

Chill Charles! For those that have been around, we knew that Ron's post had his tongue firmly planted in his cheek!
Did you notice he included home inspector's in his list?
I think Ron is about as much of a "capitalist pig" as you will find

Just because you got rid of one poltical party member and replaced them with another party member in no way means that the new party is going to work for you or do anything to make your life any better.

They do not work for us. They work for the lobbyists and special interests.

The second shot heard round the world is about how "THE PEOPLE" feel about the pending bill on health reform, and Obama's one sided "Jamb it down your throat" agenda.

Our state of Kennedy worshipers hasn't had a republican senator for over 50 years. In fact, only 12% of the registered voters in this state are republicans but 52% of the over 2 million that did vote selected a republican. That's a lot of dissatisfied people speaking out. It is unimaginable that this special election to replace Ted Kennedy is a republican.

This election has sent a strong message to Washington and will force major changes in our government. MARK MY WORDS - You will see Obama, taking two step's backward on health care reform and approaching it and his total agenda in a more bipartisan way. It's what we need to do.

THE PEOPLE HAVE SPOKEN!

Originally Posted by Ken Amelin

This election has sent a strong message to Washington and will force major changes in our government. MARK MY WORDS... THE PEOPLE HAVE SPOKEN!

I will be glad to mark your words Ken, but the reality is that it will be more of the same. The people in office change but political process does not change. It does not matter what the promises are.

Why is it that every elected official promises to eliminate "special interests"? Everyone and every thing is a "special interest".

Major changes? "Meet the new boss.. Same as the old boss". I think someone said it before me. As a matter of fact, it was Shakespeare that said, "First thing, we kill all the lawyers".

THIS IS HOW YOU FIX CONGRESS!!!!!
A friend sent this along to me. I can't think of a reason to disagree.

I am sending this to virtually everybody on my e-mail list and that includes conservatives, liberals, and everybody in between. Even though we disagree on a number of issues, I count all of you as friends. My friend and neighbor wants to promote a "Congressional Reform Act of 2009". It would contain eight provisions, all of which would probably be strongly endorsed by those who drafted the Constitution and the Bill of Rights.

I know many of you will say, "this is impossible". Let me remind you, Congress has the lowest approval of any entity in Government, now is the time when Americans will join together to reform Congress - the entity that represents us.

We need to get a Senator to introduce this bill in the US Senate and a Representative to introduce a similar bill in the US House. These people will become American hero's..

Thanks,

A Fellow American

***********************************
Congressional Reform Act of 2010


1. Term Limits: 12 years only, one of the possible options below.

A. Two Six year Senate terms
B. Six Two year House terms
C. One Six year Senate term and three Two Year House terms

Serving in Congress is an honor, not a career. The Found ing Fathers envisioned citizen legislators, serve your term(s), then go home and back to work.

2. No Tenure / No Pension:

A congressman collects a salary while in office and receives no pay when they are out of office.

Serving in Congress is an honor, not a career. The Founding Fathers envisioned citizen legislators, serve your term(s), then go home and back to work.

3. Congress (past, present & future) participates in Social Security:

All funds in the Congressional retirement fund moves to the Social Security system immediately. All future funds flow into the Social Security system, Congress participates with the American people.

Serving in Congress is an honor, not a career. The Founding Fathers envisioned citizen legislators, server your term(s), then go home and back to work.

4. Congress can purchase their own retirement plan just as all Americans.

Serving in Congress is an honor, not a career. The Founding Fathers envisioned citizen legislators, serve your term(s), then go home and bac k to work.

5. Congress will no longer vote themselves a pay raise. Congressional pay will rise by the lower of CPI or 3%.

Serving in Congress is an honor, not a career. The Founding Fathers envisioned citizen legislators, serve your term(s), then go home and back to work.


6. Congress loses their current health care system and participates in the same health care system as the American people.

Serving in Congress is an honor, not a career. The Founding Fathers envisioned citizen legislators, serve your term(s), then go home and back to work.

7. Congress must equally abide in all laws they impose on the American people.

Serving in Congress is an honor, not a career. The Founding Fathers envisioned citizen legislators, serve your term(s), then go home and back to work.


8. All contracts with past and present congressmen are void effective 1/1/11.

The American people did not make this contract with congressmen, congressmen made all these contra cts for themselves.

Serving in Congress is an honor, not a career. The Founding Fathers envisioned citizen legislators, serve your term(s), then go home and back to work.

If you agree with the above, pass it on to all in your address list. If not, just delete.

Originally Posted by Gunnar Alquist

I will be glad to mark your words Ken, but the reality is that it will be more of the same. The people in office change but political process does not change. It does not matter what the promises are.

Why is it that every elected official promises to eliminate "special interests"? Everyone and every thing is a "special interest".

Major changes? "Meet the new boss.. Same as the old boss". I think someone said it before me. As a matter of fact, it was Shakespeare that said, "First thing, we kill all the lawyers".

What we have going on today is not the same old thing.

The people of The liberal state of MA has spoken.
They do not want a socialist society.

If what you say is true Gunnar then you and I are the same. You are in no way as good looking as I am...

Best

Ron

As a resident of California, where we have term limits, I've been a witness to the destruction that this causes. It seems like a great idea but in practice does not make for good governance.

Its a double edged sword but governing in these complex times is not something you just pick up and consists equally of knowledge, experience and relationships. We've seen that, just as our legislators gain these critical skills they need they're out of office and we have to start all over again.

You can find a bazillion articles on the internets regarding this but here is one that is CA specific.

Ezra Klein - The folly of term limits

My favorite quote

"The product of this verges on the comical. As a California budget-watcher pointed out to me, when you get Arnold Schwarzenegger in a room with the leadership of the Senate and Assembly, Schwarzenegger has the most budget and legislative experience in the room. A guy who was starring in Terminator films as recently as 2003 is now the most seasoned elected official during one of the worst crises California has ever had. Term limits are one of those ideas that sound good in theory but are madness in practice. You wouldn't want to go to a hospital filled with medical residents or stock a sports team with an ever-changing cast of rookies. Legislating is hard. We need to give people time to learn how to do it."

Originally Posted by John Ghent

THIS IS HOW YOU FIX CONGRESS!!!!!
A friend sent this along to me. I can't think of a reason to disagree.

I am sending this to virtually everybody on my e-mail list and that includes conservatives, liberals, and everybody in between. Even though we disagree on a number of issues, I count all of you as friends. My friend and neighbor wants to promote a "Congressional Reform Act of 2009". It would contain eight provisions, all of which would probably be strongly endorsed by those who drafted the Constitution and the Bill of Rights.

I read a newspaper article about exit polling that indicated a majority of those who voted for Brown wanted health care reform. The gist of the report was that it seemed incongruous based on his vow to be the 41st vote against health reform.
Mass. had its own health care reform legislation passed with the help of then Governor Mitt Romney and then state rep Brown.
People of Mass. were not voting against health care reform as they already had it and don't care whether you and I do. They were voting against a terrible candidate who seemed to show disdain for the everyday citizen. She famously pooh-poohed standing outside a sporting event and shaking hands by wondering to a reporter why anyone would think standing in the cold was a good use of campaign time.
People accept or reject candidates for a lot of personal,quixotic reasons but according to exit polling this race was not decided on basis of health care, socialism, or bailouts.

Originally Posted by Jerry Peck

There are a LOT of HARD WORKING PEOPLE who even work hard at TWO JOBS and still cannot afford health insurance.

Great Can Do American attitude you have there Dennis.

I'm sure our forefathers who fought the revolution would like to see this country in the condition it is in now.

Forefathers my backside


you are not in the slight serious are you.

Quality of life, food, clothing, living conditions, HVAC, heart operations, cancer cures or successful treatment, grocery stores filled with food, planes, tranes, auto's, pants that fit, indoor plumbing, if your sick and can just not afford healthcare you will still be treated and not have to trade your goat.

Yeah yeah, you are about to say that taking care of the folks are costing all of us......You really don't have a clue. It would have cost all of us a whole lot more so let it be as it is instead of forcing someone to not by food so they can buy health care and not get fined.

I am so sick of the twisted (not just going after you Jerry) mind set that has been put in place.

Again...Forefathers. Most were losers. Most had slaves to make there money. Most folks with out money died at an age to horrific to think about because of the atrocious health care provided.

You want to go live with the forefathers for gosh sakes. Seriously. It is time to stop spewing the forefather mumbo jumbo.

Yes there needs to be health care reform but that is in lowering costs for all. Not raising costs for all. My ,mother was a proud woman. I used to sneek money into here account so she did not have to give up food and living conditions to pay for medicine. This was a 70 year old woman. It is high time that all this crap stops and start thinking about the massive amount of folks that are nearing their mid sixties that busted but all there life and half the time working 2 jobs and still won'y be able to afford health care and a place to live.

Cap and trade. My God man. Stlop with the crtazed mind set. Why do you think that after one year of a very popular President that has been trying to cram so much down everyones throats and ring the debt up to multiple trillions pushing for all the twisted Liberal things that have been wanted to be passed for decades but will do nothing but cost everyone half of their earned sallary in a short time to come has fallen off the top of the hill and is rolling to the bottom.

Before you get into the last admin. Please. Stop right there from blaming Bush . It was every single polititions fault not just old Bush and the Repubs.

Instead of thinking of every single thing possible that will cost everyone half there salary to pay for it is time to think of lowering costs on everything not raising them. If it means taking medical away from the insurance companies then let it be but it better be a 50% cost savings on running it instead of growing government to run the program the same if not more than it cost right now.

How about the fact that when a Doctors office turns in their bills to the insurance companies they only get about .60 on a 1.00 back. Does that mean that if there were not insurance companies involved health care would only cost us 60% of what it does now.

Forefathers my but. Most of the Forefathers brethren lived in homes with dirt floors and were worried about losing their scalp to my ancestors the Indians. Oh yeah. Why were they losing their scalps. Because your precious ass forefathers use to slaughter them by the thousands and who knows what the final tally was when you forefathers were done taking everything away from them because the wanted it. And then the disease you forefathers brought over that killed untold of the folks that owned this country.

Your precious forefathers that found (right) this country were butchers, thieves, self righteous bigots and racists and just plain filthy creatures that used to get an infection from a cut finger and die.

The poor folks have nothing to worry about as things stand. They will be treated if they get seriously sick. Even if they have a bad cpold you will see the have nots at the hospitals getting treated.

Enacting the [plan for health care they had in mind would have cost every single person in the US far more than what it cost right now and then have forced even more folks to chose between food, roof over their head and medical insurance.

What freaking possible good would it have done to cost everyone more for less.

As far as the Forefathers??????????????? The indians should have lined up on the shore when they saw a ship coming and slaughtered all of the occupants of those ships.

I might love the country we live in but you can keep or go back to live with your Forefathers.

As far as the country now compared to then.............. Come on, you cannot be the slightest bit serious. As far as the green earth crap. It is getting there and will continue to do so in a natural process. The greener earth is the only thing better about this country back then comapred to now. The only thing wrong with it is the animals (forefathers) slaughtered millions to get it throughout the entire Americas.

Originally Posted by Leigh Goodman

I read a newspaper article about exit polling that indicated a majority of those who voted for Brown wanted health care reform. The gist of the report was that it seemed incongruous based on his vow to be the 41st vote against health reform.
Mass. had its own health care reform legislation passed with the help of then Governor Mitt Romney and then state rep Brown.
People of Mass. were not voting against health care reform as they already had it and don't care whether you and I do. They were voting against a terrible candidate who seemed to show disdain for the everyday citizen. She famously pooh-poohed standing outside a sporting event and shaking hands by wondering to a reporter why anyone would think standing in the cold was a good use of campaign time.
People accept or reject candidates for a lot of personal,quixotic reasons but according to exit polling this race was not decided on basis of health care, socialism, or bailouts.

And its costs nearly bankrupt the state and still may. Fact not fiction.

By Karl Vick
Washington Post Staff Writer
Wednesday, January 20, 2010; 2:23 PM

BOSTON -- Scott Brown said he expects to be seated quickly in the U.S. Senate, but he was conciliatory on the question of what he will do there, noting that he voted for universal health insurance coverage in Massachusetts and wanted his election to encourage a new bipartisanship in Washington.

"We're past campaign mode: I think it's important for everyone to get some form of health care," Brown told a news conference Wednesday morning. "So to offer a basic plan for everybody I think is important.. "

"We have 98 percent of our people insured here," he said at another point. "We know what we need to fix it."


Scott Brown is FOR universal heath care. Maybe that is why he was elected in Mass. They want him to go to Washington and work toward that goal that he says, and has said in the past, that he believes in. This would be consistent with exit poll answers.
We know that pols say what they must to get elected and maybe he conned the teabaggers and and obstructionists into voting for him with his -"I'll be the 41st vote against.."- line and in so doing gained the edge he needed for victory.

Originally Posted by Ron Bibler

What we have going on today is not the same old thing.

The people of The liberal state of MA has spoken.
They do not want a socialist society.

If what you say is true Gunnar then you and I are the same. You are in no way as good looking as I am...

Best

Ron

Well if that's what you want like the republicons of MA then lets start with cutting off social security then medicare then how about all those socialist highways we drive on and lets close down all the library's and police stations and that stupid socialist fire department. Thats just for starters. Or is it that some just like to listen to rush limpballs with blind faith and spread there hatred every place they can on the internet.

Anyone from Tennesse want to brag about Tenn Care?

Originally Posted by Edward Loughran

.
Anyone from Tennesse want to brag about Tenn Care?

.
As with any other mismanaged bloated Government Run ANYTHING it has it's share of problems .

That said TN. Care does Cover Children.

The dead beat parents will not.
( but these children bear no responsibility in that.)

How sick does a child have to be to Receive Medical Care?
.
If you Wish to see the Very Best Case Example of National Health Care Visit your Locale VA Hospital.
.

The VA is a perfect example. Canadians flocking to the US to receive treatment for years, Brock Lesnar infomercial more recently, is another prime example. I was always taught that if you want something you work for it, don't expect it to be served on a silver platter to you.

Originally Posted by Bill Tomberlin

Well if that's what you want like the republicons of MA then lets start with cutting off social security then medicare then how about all those socialist highways we drive on and lets close down all the library's and police stations and that stupid socialist fire department.

Great idea... Let get all the power back into the hands of our local City and county goverments... and out of the hands of Washington D.C.

Best

Ron

Most of our elected officials are politicians.

Only a handfull could be deemed STATESMEN.

Politicians are like contraceptives;
they give you a feeling of security
while you are being scr*w*d.

Originally Posted by Ted Menelly

Forefathers my backside


you are not in the slight serious are you...

You want to go live with the forefathers for gosh sakes. Seriously. It is time to stop spewing the forefather mumbo jumbo.
.

Ted - nice to hear a voice of reason tossed in from time to time.

All I know is that a lot of independents, democrats and "tea party" people are not happy about the performance of our current leaders. Here's how a lot of people in this state (and country) feel about it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZs8k4pJcyk

Watch this. How do you judge it?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HcBaSP31Be8

Originally Posted by John Dirks Jr

Watch this. How do you judge it?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HcBaSP31Be8

The health care plan (the senate version) is bad on so many levels, from the cost, to the fact that it doesn't cover everybody, which is what it was suppose to be about all along!

How about tort reform and portability, I think that is something everybody would agree is a good place to start, but then I don't think it is really about affordable health care.