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  1. #1
    Kevin Luce's Avatar
    Kevin Luce Guest

    Default Gas Appliances in Bathrooms and toilet rooms

    In the 2003 IRC Book states that "G2406 (303.3) Prohibited locations. Appliances shall not be located in, or obtain combustion air from, any of the following rooms or spaces:

    1. Sleeping rooms.
    2. Bathrooms.
    3. Toilet rooms.
    4. Storage closets."

    Then you have the exceptions.

    Then you have "M1701.4 Prohibited sources. Combustion air ducts and openings shall not connect appliance enclosures with space in which the operation of a fan may adversely affect the flow of combustion air. Combustion air shall not be obtained from an area in which flammable vapors present a hazard. Fuel-fired appliances shall not obtain combustion air from any of the following rooms or spaces:

    1. Sleeping rooms.
    2. Bathrooms.
    3. Toilet rooms."

    Then you have the exceptions.



    My question is what is the reasoning that a gas furnace, gas water heater or gas dryer cannot be installed in a toilet room. As long as it has enough combustion air (obtainable from the room, attic, crawlspace or exterior) then I cannot think of anything that would affect the performance or safety. Some towns around here have allowed this type of installation but the local gas company would not turn the gas back on until this application was corrected.

    I have asked the local gas company the reasoning and they just quote the code.

    Any help as to the reasoning for this codes would be appreciated.

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    Last edited by Kevin Luce; 08-16-2007 at 11:20 AM.
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  2. #2
    Martin lehman's Avatar
    Martin lehman Guest

    Default Re: Gas Appliances in Bathrooms and toilet rooms

    Moisture??
    Or maybe...methane??


  3. #3
    Kevin Luce's Avatar
    Kevin Luce Guest

    Default Re: Gas Appliances in Bathrooms and toilet rooms

    Methane, maybe.

    Moisture problems to a water heater, furnace or dryer in a tiolet room? They need to go back to throwing cheerios in the toilet to help them aim so they stop peeing on the water heater, furnace or dryer.


  4. #4
    Joseph P. Hagarty's Avatar
    Joseph P. Hagarty Guest

    Default Re: Gas Appliances in Bathrooms and toilet rooms

    How about Oil-Fired Boilers?

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  5. #5
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    Default Re: Gas Appliances in Bathrooms and toilet rooms

    I always thought it was because of a potential for CO in the room. The non allowed locations were to protect the occupants, in my mind. Funny thing today, I just saw for the first time a gas dryer install in a bedroom. Same house had a water heater in the bathroom.

    Jim Robinson
    New Mexico, USA

  6. #6
    Kevin Luce's Avatar
    Kevin Luce Guest

    Default Re: Gas Appliances in Bathrooms and toilet rooms

    CO detector sounds like it would take care of that problem.


  7. #7
    Brandon Chew's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gas Appliances in Bathrooms and toilet rooms

    The restriction could be due to concerns about the quantity or the quality of the combustion air, or both.

    Bathrooms do not have high quality air for combustion appliances due to high moisture content or due to various atomized substances that could be hanging in the air from hair sprays, deodorants, perfumes, etc.

    It may also be because bathrooms usually have mechanical exhaust fans in them that are running with the bathroom door closed. Perhaps the fan would interfere with the draft on the combustion appliance, so to eliminate the risk of back-drafting on the appliance they prohibit the appliance in the room?

    Last edited by Brandon Chew; 08-16-2007 at 04:27 PM. Reason: added comment about ventilation fan

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Gas Appliances in Bathrooms and toilet rooms

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Luce View Post
    CO detector sounds like it would take care of that problem.

    It won't.

    Any device that can be exposed to 70 PPM of CO for up to four hours before it alarms and can then be silenced should be banned.

    Check out the Standard by which CO alarms are rated, be sure and have a pillow in your lap for when your jaw drops.

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  9. #9
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    Default Re: Gas Appliances in Bathrooms and toilet rooms

    Brandon has a part of it, but the bathroom would have an inadequate volume of air for combustion.

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  10. #10
    Kevin Luce's Avatar
    Kevin Luce Guest

    Default Re: Gas Appliances in Bathrooms and toilet rooms

    Quote Originally Posted by Brandon Chew View Post
    The restriction could be due to concerns about the quantity or the quality of the combustion air, or both.

    Bathrooms do not have high quality air for combustion appliances due to high moisture content or due to various atomized substances that could be hanging in the air from hair sprays, deodorants, perfumes, etc.

    It may also be because bathrooms usually have mechanical exhaust fans in them that are running with the bathroom door closed. Perhaps the fan would interfere with the draft on the combustion appliance, so to eliminate the risk of back-drafting on the appliance they prohibit the appliance in the room?
    Just as a reminder, I am inquiring about a toilet room. No sink, shower, tub, or exhaust fan required. Just a place where a man wants to sit and do his thing.

    Bathrooms I agree with you 100%.


  11. #11
    Kevin Luce's Avatar
    Kevin Luce Guest

    Default Re: Gas Appliances in Bathrooms and toilet rooms

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidR View Post
    It won't.

    Any device that can be exposed to 70 PPM of CO for up to four hours before it alarms and can then be silenced should be banned.

    Check out the Standard by which CO alarms are rated, be sure and have a pillow in your lap for when your jaw drops.

    Maybe I'm looking at this wrong, it looks to me that the detectors are designed properly.

    400 plus or minus 10, which CO detectors have a 4 to 15 minute response time. On that chart, that wouldn't even result in the average person having a headache before the CO detector would alarm.


  12. #12
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    Cool Re: Gas Appliances in Bathrooms and toilet rooms

    Davidr is one of the leading opponents to UL 2034 CO alarms in this country and for good reason--they are a joke! Do a little research on your own. They do a good job of providing a false sense of security at best. BTW, I had another CO response last week. I'll post details later.

    Can a flushing toilet in a confined space backdraft a combustion appliance? Now, can a combustion appliance backdraft a toilet in a confined space?? Which is worse?

    Joe, I just love those Weil-Mac Gold boilers. They draw like a 3 yr old with crayons.. Beckett AFG burners have gotten much better and is the most common in our market so parts and familiarity not a problem. What's that pig firing at? About 1.10 GPH? And it still uses a 7" chimney connector...
    TPR drain tube missing. Lots of stains on floor and around combustion chamber door. Hmm. I always install brass caps on those hose threads on the drains. Protects the threads and cheap insurance against floods. Secondary filter good but should be a little better out of the way and protected. I'd install a Tiger Loop with a Gar-ber spin on secondary and stainless flex hoses. If he switched the door, it could swing left without disconnecting the fuel line from the filter. Electrical cable too short to swing right as well. What's that wall? Is there combustible construction in there? Any shots of the breeching and expansion tank. Just curious... BTW, How did your guy make out on his home they said didn't need a home inspection? What turkeys...

    Bob H.

    Keep the fire in the fireplace.

  13. #13
    Kevin Luce's Avatar
    Kevin Luce Guest

    Default Re: Gas Appliances in Bathrooms and toilet rooms

    Davidr is one of the leading opponents to UL 2034 CO alarms in this country and for good reason--they are a joke! Do a little research on your own. They do a good job of providing a false sense of security at best. BTW, I had another CO response last week. I'll post details later.
    Didn't mean anything by it. I do not inspect CO detectors as a home inspector so I haven't done any research on it. I was questioning him from the information that was posted here.

    I did learn recently that sulfur dioxide which emits from a battery that goes to a back up sump pump can set off a CO detector. Why a CO detector cannot differentiate between the two I'll have to look up.


  14. #14
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    Talking Re: Gas Appliances in Bathrooms and toilet rooms

    Combustion air contains oxygen.
    No oxygen, no combustion.
    People require oxygen to breath. (live)
    No oxygen - people die.
    Gas burning appliances burn oxygen and can use up the entire amount contained in a small room wherein the entry door is usually shut.
    In other words a relaxing bath and I'm so sleepy…argh……..
    Then there's folks who spend long amounts time reading or pondering the meaning of life while perched on the porcelain princess, I'm feeling so sleepy…………… argh .!

    That's it in a nutshell.

    Jerry McCarthy
    Building Code/ Construction Consultant

  15. #15
    Joseph P. Hagarty's Avatar
    Joseph P. Hagarty Guest

    Default Re: Gas Appliances in Bathrooms and toilet rooms

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Harper View Post
    .... BTW, How did your guy make out on his home they said didn't need a home inspection? What turkeys...

    Bob H.
    Negotiated a substantial credit for a new direct vent gas fired Boiler and abandonment of the chimney.


  16. #16
    Joseph P. Hagarty's Avatar
    Joseph P. Hagarty Guest

    Default Re: Gas Appliances in Bathrooms and toilet rooms

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Harper View Post

    Joe, I just love those Weil-Mac Gold boilers. They draw like a 3 yr old with crayons.. Beckett AFG burners have gotten much better and is the most common in our market so parts and familiarity not a problem. What's that pig firing at? About 1.10 GPH? And it still uses a 7" chimney connector...
    TPR drain tube missing. Lots of stains on floor and around combustion chamber door. Hmm. I always install brass caps on those hose threads on the drains. Protects the threads and cheap insurance against floods. Secondary filter good but should be a little better out of the way and protected. I'd install a Tiger Loop with a Gar-ber spin on secondary and stainless flex hoses. If he switched the door, it could swing left without disconnecting the fuel line from the filter. Electrical cable too short to swing right as well.

    What's that wall? Is there combustible construction in there? Any shots of the breeching and expansion tank.

    Bob H.
    Wall covering behind the Boiler is older asbestos / cement board.

    This home was a Flip gone Wrong.

    A Full Bathroom was added to what was originally the unfinished Heater & Electrical Utility Room.

    Buyer walked.


  17. #17
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    Default Re: Gas Appliances in Bathrooms and toilet rooms

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Luce View Post

    I did learn recently that sulfur dioxide which emits from a battery that goes to a back up sump pump can set off a CO detector. Why a CO detector cannot differentiate between the two I'll have to look up.
    It has to do with hydrogen, almost all CO alarms are not hydrogen compensated and will go crazy around a charging battery due to off gassing.

    Even the low level CO monitors we sell are cross-sensitive to nitrous oxide, makes life kind of rough when trying to use one in a dentist office.

    Most UL 2034 rated alarms are cross-sensitive to a lot of things you wouldn't suspect and it is a long list.

    If the monitor uses an electrochemical sensor that is your best bet, it's what is used in combustion analyzers.

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  18. #18
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    Default Re: Gas Appliances in Bathrooms and toilet rooms

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Harper View Post
    Davidr is one of the leading opponents to UL 2034 CO alarms in this country and for good reason--they are a joke!
    I am just a very vocal complainer in regards to them Bob.

    Measured Performance more than just a buzzword

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