HVAC in Kitchen - InspectionNews

Jim Kasterko · #1 (**permalink**) 12-23-2007, 10:54 AM

I was a taken back when I saw the HVAC unit and water heater installed in the kitchen, a first for me. I checked the IRC and I believe I found the places they could not be, which didn’t include a kitchen. So, are there any technical or safety type reasons not to install these units in a kitchen? Also, I’m having trouble determining the age of the Sears/Dunkirk boiler (series PW41 Model 229 963440 Serial 29830015). Thanks in advance.

imported_John Smith · #2 (**permalink**) 12-23-2007, 12:32 PM

Photo Shop is a great software package.

Billy Stephens · #3 (**permalink**) 12-23-2007, 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Kasterko

I’m having trouble determining the age of the Sears/Dunkirk boiler (series PW41 Model 229 963440 Serial 29830015). Thanks in advance.

Quote:

Originally Posted by imported_John Smith

Photo Shop is a great software package.

29th

John,
If it's a staged photo he made the flash shadows also (Look at top of Sink)

Jim,

The Dunkirk Boiler was made in the 29yh week of 1983.

Your photo shows a water heater and a Boiler.

Help me understand the AC part.

There are numerous things

Jerry Peck · #4 (**permalink**) 12-23-2007, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billy Stephens

Your photo shows ... a Boiler.

Help me understand the AC part.

Billy,

HVAC refers to that type of equipment as it falls under HVAC (i.e., "mechanical"), and the 'H' in HVAC stands for (as you already know) "Heating" - which that is. Thus, it is HVAC 'equipment'.

Michael Thomas · #5 (**permalink**) 12-23-2007, 07:43 PM

Around here (Chicago and suburbs) I frequently see the HVAC, hot water and/or laundry in a utility closet off the kitchen - usually there are louvered doors, but sometmes it's just open to the kitchen. Same, thing, if you think about it.

Rick Hurst · #6 (**permalink**) 12-23-2007, 08:07 PM

Thats one of the worst photoshop pics I've seen.

rick

Jerry Peck · #7 (**permalink**) 12-24-2007, 08:49 AM

The first house I owned was built in 1894. The gas water heater was in the kitchen (in a corner of the kitchen). The heater was an old kerosene burner smack in the living room. I'm talking about one of those old ones in which the kerosene pooled in the bottom and was ignited, burning on its own, with the control being a 'flow valve' which controlled the amount of kerosene which would flow down into the fire bowl, gravity fed from a higher tank outside. There was no pump/spray/atomizer, just kerosene in a bowl burning and putting off heat within its fire-pot and cabinet. And not a lot of heat at that. On colder nights we had to sleep in the living room.

That was in Gainesville, Florida, and it would get into the teens there. Was always having pipes freeze if we did not leave the water running fast enough (fortunately, no broken pipes while we lived there).

The clothes washer was on the screened rear porch.

Michael Thomas · #8 (**permalink**) 12-24-2007, 09:59 AM

Rick,

Over on TIJ that load fill size (500K) and does not appear 'Shopped to me.

Jim Kasterko · #9 (**permalink**) 12-24-2007, 10:54 AM

Ok,... How did I screw up the photo?

Billy Stephens · #10 (**permalink**) 12-24-2007, 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Kasterko

Ok,... How did I screw up the photo?

Jim,

I think the questions about the Photo is it a single picture or a combination of 2 or more photos?

Jim Kasterko · #11 (**permalink**) 12-24-2007, 12:11 PM

Ok,... How did I screw up the photo?

Jim Kasterko · #12 (**permalink**) 12-24-2007, 12:13 PM

oooppps. It was a single photo.

Michael Thomas · #13 (**permalink**) 12-24-2007, 12:32 PM

Some people think it may be "Photoshopped"

The Worldâ€™s Most Famous Photoshop Fakes | Make Money Selling Your Photos

Robert Dalga · #14 (**permalink**) 12-26-2007, 07:23 AM

I guess I don't get it??? Why would an inspector post a photoshopped photo??? Isn't Jim merely asking for some advise? I see a HUGE safety concern with the mechanicals installed in the kitchen like this. The boiler poses the greatest concern. The potoential for CO emissions from the combustion chamber if a range hood (or ceiling exhaust fan) were running, for example. Furthermore, small children in the vicinity of the boiler could be burned from the exposed equipment.

Billy Stephens · #15 (**permalink**) 12-26-2007, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert Dalga

Furthermore, small children in the vicinity of the boiler could be burned from the exposed equipment.

Or electrocuted from the Loose & unsecured wiring.

Michael Thomas · #16 (**permalink**) 01-08-2008, 07:40 PM

Quick question for Jerry or someone else with the codes on CD: where is the minimum separation of a cold air return from a GFAF specified.

And where is the distance measured from? The draft hood?

- Thanks

Jerry Peck · #17 (**permalink**) 01-09-2008, 06:45 AM

Michael,

From the 2006 IRC. (bold and underlining are mine)

- M1602.2 Prohibited sources. Outdoor and return air for a forced-air heating or cooling system shall not be taken from the following locations:
- - 1. Closer than 10 feet (3048 mm) to an appliance vent outlet, a vent opening from a plumbing drainage system or the discharge outlet of an exhaust fan, unless the outlet is 3 feet (914 mm) above the outside air inlet.
- - 2. Where flammable vapors are present; or where located less than 10 feet (3048 mm) above the surface of any abutting public way or driveway; or where located at grade level by a sidewalk, street, alley or driveway.
- - 3. A room or space, the volume of which is less than 25 percent of the entire volume served by such system. Where connected by a permanent opening having an area sized in accordance with ACCA Manual D, adjoining rooms or spaces shall be considered as a single room or space for the purpose of determining the volume of such rooms or spaces.
- - - Exception:The minimum volume requirement shall not apply where the amount of return air taken from a room or space is less than or equal to the amount of supply air delivered to such room or space.
- - 4. A closet, bathroom, toilet room, kitchen, garage, mechanical room, furnace room or other dwelling unit.
- - 5. A room or space containing a fuel-burning appliance where such room or space serves as the sole source of return air.
- - - Exceptions:
- - - - 1. The fuel-burning appliance is a direct-vent appliance or an appliance not requiring a vent in accordance with Section M1801.1 or Chapter 24.
- - - - 2. The room or space complies with the following requirements:
- - - - - 2.1. The return air shall be taken from a room or space having a volume exceeding 1 cubic foot for each 10 Btu/h (9.6 L/W) of combined input rating of all fuel-burning appliances therein.
- - - - - 2.2. The volume of supply air discharged back into the same space shall be approximately equal to the volume of return air taken from the space.
- - - - - 2.3. Return-air inlets shall not be located within 10 feet (3048 mm) of any appliance firebox or draft hood in the same room or space.
- - - - 3. Rooms or spaces containing solid-fuel burning appliances, provided that return-air inlets are located not less than 10 feet (3048 mm) from the firebox of such appliances.

Note that those listed under 5. (underlined) *are not* applicable *unless* "room or space serves as the sole source of return air."

I believe that some of these may often be mis-used by applying them to locations where the return air inlet *is not the sole source* of return air.

Michael Thomas · #18 (**permalink**) 04-01-2008, 05:26 PM

The "decorator" version: