Thread: Good article from the Consumerist blog about choosing a home inspector

Thought this might be of interest!

How To Not Suck? At Home Inspections ? Consumerist

Kevin

I have to agree. These articles to remain neutral should either mention all recognized associations or none at all.

As you know Royal Bank of Canada was recently taken to task for promoting one association over that of others on its website about home purchasing. As result a number of complaints were lodged with the bank. As result the bank has updated the page and now does not mention any association thus alleviating what could be termed biases/favouritism.

Originally Posted by Kevin Wood

How is that a good article when it does not mention any InterNachi Inspectors. Now I am not saying that the comment about being Certified is a valid one but I am saying that given the same amount of education provided by InterNachi would put them on the same or even better level than most Associations as a minimum for licensing.

Kevin, this just shows the power that ASHI has developed with its marketing and public relations campaign over the years. In addition its members tend to promote the organization as well as their own business so it becomes a win win for all. ASHI also works for the betterment of the profession and this would include non members.

Nick, if he was so inclined to spend the dollars could do the same for his organization but he choose to spend his members money on other things. He would rather spend it on things that sound grand but turn out being little more than smoke and mirror hype. Just ask Nick how he feels about non members! I guess I could post some of his statements, they might surprise a few folks but then I bet they wouldn't.

Originally Posted by Raymond Wand

Kevin

I have to agree. These articles to remain neutral should either mention all recognized associations or none at all.

Ahh... Recognized Associations...

Just because a particular association, club, organization or loose gathering of simiarly minded individuals is not mentioned by an author means nothing. Absolutely nothing.

Authors cannot and will not list every stupid organization. It is an article not a telephone book. Authors list organizations that for reasons known only to them are representative of the point the author is trying to make. Typically only three different examples on anything are ever given in any written article. Just the way the world works.

If your particular favorite club or group was left off the list, it could be something as simple as the author did not know it exists. Maybe the organization does not demonstrate the points the author was trying to make. Have to ask the author why they left your favorite off the list.

The member makes the association, not the other way around. The better inspector I am, the better the associations I belong to look to outsiders. The association did not make me better, I made the association better. The association may encourage members to sit through more training, but it is the inspector who actually takes something away from the training and puts it to use.

Operated in a licensed state for about 7 years. The state mandated X number hours of training to maintain my license. Spent a lot of time sitting in hotel conference room chairs. Gleaned a few pearls of wisdom. Most of it was a rehash of the same old stuff. State only recognized classroom training. No other method was acceptable to the state.

My time spent participating in mulitple interweb forums provided a much more indepth and broad training. None of the multiple associations I belong to accept the hours of forum time as training. Guess what, other inspectors call me for information not because I am a member of club X, Y or Z, but because I can usually help point them in the direction of a valid technical answer.

Quit whinning about how your club is not getting the respect you think it should. Become the best inspector you can in spite of your club.

Oh, regarding the comment about the need to "Remain Neutral". The point of articles in not to remain neutral but to provide a point of view. Neutral articles are boring.

Who are you referring to as whining?

The article is not informing the public considering its labelled the Consumerist. The consumer is not being given all the facts.

Leave the reader to make their own decision based on all the facts by thorough research. Its too easy to write an opinion piece based on lousy research or ignorance.

Further since many states recognize multiple associations your rebuttal is moot.

As with the example of the Royal Bank up here they were contacted by various association members, they chose to equal the playing field because they didn't do their research. The revised website omitting as many as 6 associations up here is in my opinion a realization they had not done their homework.

Not sure what people are complaining about. Nachi was referred to right here:

Check to see the requirement for membership because some groups will be happy to “certify” anyone willing to write a check.

Originally Posted by Kevin Wood

WOW!!! You think InterNachi is just a club. Don't forget that every piece of material they provide is open to all Hi's for one membership fee. Many many courses have been recognized by the Government. So if you do represent the public correctly you had better not write an Article about Home Inspector Associations without doing your research first.
As for training on line it is only InterNachi that has made leaps and bounds over other Associations and have the Government approvals to back them up.

Kevin, getting approval for CE corses is notable but not difficult. Keeping the courses updated with fresh information and resubmitting is the challenge. Many states do not allow the repeating of CE courses so after a few years, the CE courses become unless to an individual as they can't get credit any longer and the are forced to take courses that the really have no interest in. Sure it makes great fodder to use for bragging but it soon becomes as sad as a builder who brags that they build to code.

Originally Posted by Scott Patterson

... as sad as a builder who brags that they build to code.

Excellent example "builder who brags that they build to code" as they are bragging that they have no bragging rights as they do the absolute least they are legally allowed to do - and they think that is something to brag about?

Always confounded me too.

Code = "The crappiest one is legally allowed to build,"

When some people say that "crappiest" implies "workmanship" and 'code' does not address "workmanship" (code does not), I change the wording to this: Code = "The most unsafe one is legally allowed to build."
- (I started out with 'the least safe one is legally allowed to build to', but 'least safe' and 'most unsafe' really mean the same thing, so I changed to 'most unsafe' as that gives a stronger message.)

Give them a minute to think about that and then ask which they prefer: "crappiest" or "most unsafe" ... usually they will prefer "crappiest" over "most unsafe" ...

Ya know I use to think much along the same lines that Nachi inspectors and verification where lacking, however I cannot find any case law finding fault with a home inspection conducted by a Nachi inspector. Since Nachi has been around for some time now I would have thought it only a matter of time before one popped up in the courts in Canada fwiw.

Originally Posted by Kevin Wood

Any Home Inspector should not be dependent on how much money they have to be educated. I would love to see a stop to the education of Home Inspectors on top of what is required to belong to an Association. All should be added at no cost. Now if a Home Inspector wants to have advanced education like IR levels or advance HVAC then go ahead and pay. Capping it at 500/Inspector was a great Idea by InterNachi.
CMI is at 1000 but going up. What is CMI doing for Home Inspectors?
A lot!!!

Kevin, you might not realize that many CMI'ers acquired that designation without meeting the requirements that Nick set. It was before you were around, but in order to get the thing going Nick was handing out his CMI designation to any of his members. Once he had a good member base in that program he then enacted the 1000 hour requirement. I bet Ray recalls this as well..

Why is capping a designation good? Shouldn't an orginization want all of its members to strive for its highest designation of education and experience?

I would be very surprised if a Nick created membership levels without the word certified in it. If he did that would cut his new member numbers drastically with the folks that are looking for that instant title that one now gets when they join. By doing this he would also be reducing the money in his pocket that all of those members give him, and I just do not see this in the stars. I could be wrong and I hope I am.

Originally Posted by Kevin Wood

WOW!!! You think InterNachi is just a club.

Club, association, organization, society, ponzei scheme, group of like minded people who pay a fee to say they belong. Semantics. The title of preference for the group is just a title. Yes, I think InterNachi is just a club, like ALL the home inspector associations, organizations, societies, etc. A group of people who pay a fee to belong to club. Each club offers its members something that non-members don't have. Mostly that something is that you are a member. You seem to imply that I am putting down InterNachi. Never said or implied that. Never wrote that other clubs are better. Settle down Francis.

Originally Posted by Kevin Wood

Don't forget that every piece of material they provide is open to all Hi's for one membership fee.

For a fee. Nothing special about pay to play. InterNachi has entrance requirements besides a fee. So do most clubs.

Originally Posted by Kevin Wood

So if you do represent the public correctly you had better not write an Article about Home Inspector Associations without doing your research first.

If one is going to write an article, one should do research. You seem to have a vested emotional interest in InterNachi being represented often and well. You have strong convictions that your club is the best. The author may not have done adequate research or may not agree with you that InterNachi meets the articles criteria for vetting inspectors. I did not say I agreed with the choice of listed clubs. I said authors typically choose a maximum of 3 when giving examples.

Originally Posted by Kevin Wood

As for training on line it is only InterNachi that has made leaps and bounds over other Associations and have the Government approvals to back them up.

Agreed. InterNachi was worked hard to provide online training and getting various governmental approvals. The fee to join InterNachi might be worth it just to get access to the training materials. In my case, the training offered by InterNachi did not meet my local licensing requirements. Might be the best stuff in the world but not recognized by my local government.

Originally Posted by Kevin Wood

Resistance is futile as soon it will be accepted.

We are too late, he has already been assimilated!

To the comment about stopping training and CE courses: I would like to see a lot more advanced and in depth material. It seems to me most courses are geared to newbies. But a lot of us could use the science behind the basics. It helps to recognize how things tie together. But then, I think all contractors and trades people CE and training. Then maybe they will realize why things like using copper fittings to connect to steel water heaters are a no-no.

The sanest approach and first step a buyer should do is ask friends, family or trusted co -workers if they have ever hired an HI they thought was good or excellent. Nowhere is this advice mentioned. The article reeks of uninformed Realtor babble.

Originally Posted by Mike Lamb

The sanest approach and first step a buyer should do is ask friends, family or trusted co -workers if they have ever hired an HI they thought was good or excellent. Nowhere is this advice mentioned. The article reeks of uninformed Realtor babble.

True - most of my work comes my web site and previous client referrals. I never tried to sell myself to REAs. I do get a few inspections from REA referrals but it's the one who know my inspections and reports and are well aware I don't inspect to help or kill a sale. Just the facts.

But references from friends and neighbors can backfire. I inspected an older A-frame undergoing modifications by a contractor that my client said had been doing work in the neighborhood for years and everyone said he was great. - This guy was one of those who should not be allowed near a house or building with anything other than a broom. His low pay crews of questionable legal status had butchered every thing they attempted. I wouldn't let him work on my dog house.

Originally Posted by Welmoed Sisson

Thought this might be of interest!

How To Not Suck? At Home Inspections ? Consumerist

Yes, a pretty good article. I like to use HUD's "10-questions to ask your home inspector", which I modify a bit to clarify some generalist statements.

Going into my 23rd year of inspecting, and I can tell you I have met my fair share of rogue Realtors. Some of them are real pieces of work.

Returned questionnaires over the years from clients indicated they didn't care about qualifications/memberships and that they retained my services as a result of my reputation, or a referral from friends, agents, lawyer, webpage, repeat clients.

While membership may be a qualifying factor in choosing it doesn't rate at the top in 99 percent of the reasons for choosing my service.

Come to think of it I can't recall any client ever saying they read an article on how to choose an inspector which leads me to think there is very little credence in articles like the one mentioned in the link. At least from my perspective.

Originally Posted by Stuart Brooks

Yes, a pretty good article. I like to use HUD's "10-questions to ask your home inspector", which I modify a bit to clarify some generalist statements.

This is not a pretty good article. It stinks. You can't write published material that is 90% OK and 10% uninformed crap. The general public is supposed to know which is which? It is just more half-assed media reporting on unsubstantiated info from questionable sources that hurts our profession.


Checking the exterior for joists? Enough said.
Recommend mold testing? No responsible HI does this.
Ask about guarantees. Really?
Your agent should give you a handful of referrals? Ugh!
Grout is a cosmetic issue? It's not.


Garbage.