Results 1 to 17 of 17
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    6

    Default Newbie - Doing Research, Got Questions, Need Constructive Help.

    @RTR Process Description pg7.pdf
    Hello everyone,

    I've browsed this site several times in the past and got a lot of good information. So since I can't find an answer to my specific problem, I decided to risk my neck and ask for help.

    I'm doing research for a remodeling job in Texas, I may take on. The owner/customer (who's acting as the General Contractor) on the project wants to "Raise The Roof". Since the roof on his 1960's home is still in good shape but at a 2:12 pitch, the plan is to raise each side at the center, and splice a 19" extension to each of the 2x6 rafters. My plan is to nail 1/2" plywood doublers (6" x 32") to both sides of the rafter and extension. I've worked out the problems of how to raise the roof, but I'm concerned that the city inspectors may have a problem with splicing the rafters. I've attached a page from the project description that shows the center section framing and rafter splicing that I came up with. The answer I haven't found is, will this fly with the inspectors?

    Yay's, Nay's, and suggestions needed.
    Thanks.

    Inspection Referral SOC

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Columbus GA
    Posts
    3,746

    Default Re: Newbie - Doing Research, Got Questions, Need Constructive Help.

    Quote Originally Posted by Stephen Jenkins View Post
    @RTR Process Description pg7.pdf
    Hello everyone,

    I've browsed this site several times in the past and got a lot of good information. So since I can't find an answer to my specific problem, I decided to risk my neck and ask for help.

    I'm doing research for a remodeling job in Texas, I may take on. The owner/customer (who's acting as the General Contractor) on the project wants to "Raise The Roof". Since the roof on his 1960's home is still in good shape but at a 2:12 pitch, the plan is to raise each side at the center, and splice a 19" extension to each of the 2x6 rafters. My plan is to nail 1/2" plywood doublers (6" x 32") to both sides of the rafter and extension. I've worked out the problems of how to raise the roof, but I'm concerned that the city inspectors may have a problem with splicing the rafters. I've attached a page from the project description that shows the center section framing and rafter splicing that I came up with. The answer I haven't found is, will this fly with the inspectors?

    Yay's, Nay's, and suggestions needed.
    Thanks.
    Nay
    HO acting as the GC?
    If the HO is the GC why are you asking?
    Can a HO be the GC in Texas?
    I doubt that splices in the rafters will be acceptable to the AHJ.
    Hire an architect and a real general contractor.

    ' correct a wise man and you gain a friend... correct a fool and he'll bloody your nose'.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    6

    Default Re: Newbie - Doing Research, Got Questions, Need Constructive Help.

    HO acting as the GC?
    If the HO is the GC why are you asking?
    Can a HO be the GC in Texas?
    I doubt that splices in the rafters will be acceptable to the AHJ.
    Hire an architect and a real general contractor.

    The city will issue the HO a permit with him listed as GC, he is allowed to hire help, and I'm it.
    I'm trying to make sure that the remodeling will work, and allow the HO and his restricted budget to get the job done with reasonable assurance that it'll all meet code. He's going to put in more hours of work than I will. Hence, his idea, my plan.

    What sources are there on splicing rafters that would show how it should be done? There must be something that fits. This is a situation is as if the rafters had been damaged in that area and needed to be repaired, how could it be done correctly?

    Thanks for your input.


  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Charlotte NC
    Posts
    2,303

    Default Re: Newbie - Doing Research, Got Questions, Need Constructive Help.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rick Cantrell View Post
    Nay
    HO acting as the GC?
    If the HO is the GC why are you asking?
    Can a HO be the GC in Texas?
    I doubt that splices in the rafters will be acceptable to the AHJ.
    Hire an architect and a real general contractor.
    You can act as your own GC in North Carolina. People put too much faith in the GC license. The GC is mostly about the legal contract, hence the name "contractor", not so much about the actual construction and definitely not about structural design.

    I'm not a architect or engineer, but I agree with Jim, I don't think this design will fly. One of the problems not addressed is point load at the birds mouth cut that will now have a new angle. Around here anything that has this much of a design change needs a licensed engineers stamp on the plans.

    The beatings will continue until morale has improved. mgt.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Columbus GA
    Posts
    3,746

    Default Re: Newbie - Doing Research, Got Questions, Need Constructive Help.

    I just don't see it.
    Let us (me) know how it turns out.

    ' correct a wise man and you gain a friend... correct a fool and he'll bloody your nose'.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Columbus GA
    Posts
    3,746

    Default Re: Newbie - Doing Research, Got Questions, Need Constructive Help.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vern Heiler View Post
    You can act as your own GC in North Carolina.
    Around here a HO is not allowed to act as the GC anymore, even on his own property.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vern Heiler View Post
    People put too much faith in the GC license. The GC is mostly about the legal contract, hence the name "contractor", not so much about the actual construction and definitely not about structural design.
    I know what you mean
    However the GC does have insurance, some training and has passed a state given exam.
    A HO has none.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vern Heiler View Post
    I'm not a architect or engineer, but I agree with Jim,
    I think you meant Rick

    Quote Originally Posted by Vern Heiler View Post
    I don't think this design will fly. One of the problems not addressed is point load at the birds mouth cut that will now have a new angle. Around here anything that has this much of a design change needs a licensed engineers stamp on the plans.
    Yep
    With the blessing of an architect or engineer, the AHJ may approve the HO as GC.

    Last edited by Rick Cantrell; 08-29-2013 at 08:32 PM.
    ' correct a wise man and you gain a friend... correct a fool and he'll bloody your nose'.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Orlando, FL
    Posts
    1,339

    Default Re: Newbie - Doing Research, Got Questions, Need Constructive Help.

    First, I can't imagine how you can properly modify an existing roof the way you described, and to do so meeting whatever code your area has. Splicing a rafter (or two, three, whatever) is a repair; splicing them all is completely different. Changing the pitch of an existing roof without removing everything sounds like a plan for disaster. Re-framing the roof is faster and it will be done right.

    In FL you can act as HO/GC, but that doesn't exclude you from having drawn plans and having it all blessed one stage at a time.

    Dom.


  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Knoxville, TN
    Posts
    2,445

    Default Re: Newbie - Doing Research, Got Questions, Need Constructive Help.

    I really don't understand why you are asking this question on a home inspector's forum instead of asking the AHJ directly on what they will or will not approve.
    In the end, it really doesn't matter if 27 inspectors here think your idea is the greatest thing since sliced bread, if the AHJ will not approve it.


  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Plano, Texas
    Posts
    4,170

    Default Re: Newbie - Doing Research, Got Questions, Need Constructive Help.

    Welcome to the wild, wild west. Texas does not have any license for GC, Builders, or carpenters.
    A HO can do anything they want but may need to get a contractor to sign off on electrical, plumbing or HVAC.

    But no it will not work to do as you have explained, the code is a prescriptive method for building. If you stay within the normal methods, the code addresses that and you can follow the code. THERE IS NO CODE for what you propose which means the AHJ will not bless it unless he is blind or blinded by some green (SURELY NOT in TEXAS!)
    This does not mean it is not possible or even desirable, it just means you need an engineer to design it and bless it with his credentials, then the AHJ will bless it.

    Jim Luttrall
    www.MrInspector.net
    Plano, Texas

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Lansdale, PA
    Posts
    876

    Default Re: Newbie - Doing Research, Got Questions, Need Constructive Help.

    Quote Originally Posted by Stephen Jenkins View Post
    @RTR Process Description pg7.pdf
    Hello everyone,

    I've browsed this site several times in the past and got a lot of good information. So since I can't find an answer to my specific problem, I decided to risk my neck and ask for help.

    I'm doing research for a remodeling job in Texas, I may take on. The owner/customer (who's acting as the General Contractor) on the project wants to "Raise The Roof". Since the roof on his 1960's home is still in good shape but at a 2:12 pitch, the plan is to raise each side at the center, and splice a 19" extension to each of the 2x6 rafters. My plan is to nail 1/2" plywood doublers (6" x 32") to both sides of the rafter and extension. I've worked out the problems of how to raise the roof, but I'm concerned that the city inspectors may have a problem with splicing the rafters. I've attached a page from the project description that shows the center section framing and rafter splicing that I came up with. The answer I haven't found is, will this fly with the inspectors?

    Yay's, Nay's, and suggestions needed.
    Thanks.
    Generally using plywood for splices is weaker than wood and the pieces you suggest using are probably too short. The number of nails is also important. Find a local structural engineer with a small practice (like a one-man company) familiar with engineering for wood frame construction. He (or she) can work that out is less than an hour, and maybe review other concerns. Anything less than a 3:12 pitch should be built with a structural ridge beam. Even at 3:13 to 4:12 pitch and no structural ridge the nailing requirements for the ceiling joist/rafter connections require many nails. A few hundred dollars in engineering on a few thousand dollar or more job is not much and could save a lot of problems.

    I am a structural engineer and much of my work involves evaluating and designing repairs for things that contractors did without having a clue as to whether it was correct.

    Its great that you asked the question, but most people on this forum cannot really answer it. I can do the calculations, but you need an engineered licensed in your state.


  11. #11
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Rock Hill S.C.
    Posts
    94

    Default Re: Newbie - Doing Research, Got Questions, Need Constructive Help.

    Quote Originally Posted by Stephen Jenkins View Post
    @RTR Process Description pg7.pdf

    ....the plan is to raise each side at the center, and splice a 19" extension to each of the 2x6 rafters. My plan is to nail 1/2" plywood doublers (6" x 32") to both sides of the rafter and extension.


    Yay's, Nay's, and suggestions needed.

    Nay


    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Luttrall View Post

    This does not mean it is not possible or even desirable, it just means you need an engineer to design it and bless it with his credentials, then the AHJ will bless it.
    Yay

    This is the only way it would pass around here as well.


  12. #12
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    6

    Default Re: Newbie - Doing Research, Got Questions, Need Constructive Help.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Feldmann View Post
    I really don't understand why you are asking this question on a home inspector's forum instead of asking the AHJ directly on what they will or will not approve.
    In the end, it really doesn't matter if 27 inspectors here think your idea is the greatest thing since sliced bread, if the AHJ will not approve it.
    I ask the question here because my past browsing of this site gave me more to work with than any place else. Despite the tone that some of the conversations I observed here took, I felt that of what I was able to find on the web, this was the best place to start, even if no one agreed. I was looking more for suggestions and solutions than approval from the inspectors here.

    Based on the suggestions here, I told the HO this morning that he should get an engineer to look at the plans. He called me about an hour ago to tell me that he applied to the AHJ for the permit based on what we currently have. Now I'll wait and see what happens.

    Thanks to all who've contributed to the discussion.


  13. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Chicago IL
    Posts
    1,984

    Default Re: Newbie - Doing Research, Got Questions, Need Constructive Help.

    As an experienced carpenter who has built many additions, dormers and raised roofs, my vote is NO. Raising the roof works pretty well for small dormers, i.e. providing decent headroom for a new bathroom or at the top of a staircase.
    Raising the roof however does NOT work well with larger roof areas. The weight, size and potential hazards are far too great. Its much better to just cut the existing roof off and start fresh. As far as telling you how to do it, ABSOLUTELY NOT.
    Years ago a friend took over a job from a client who hired a guy who was trying to raise a room sized roof section, the entire roof section almost slid off into the neighbors yard while the neighbor and her kids were playing in the yard.
    If you don't have the skills for this type of job, find other work.

    www.aic-chicago.com
    773/844-4AIC
    "The Code is not a ceiling to reach but a floor to work up from"

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    6

    Default Re: Newbie - Did Research, Answered Questions, Got Constructive Help.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rick Cantrell View Post
    I just don't see it.
    Let us (me) know how it turns out.
    Rick,

    RTR Project completed.
    Inspection late last week, only open items were roof vent extensions that owner hasn't completed and the A/C work that's just starting (not me). Inspector peered into every nook and cranny. He was impressed with rafter extensions and purlin support structures. Needless to say the project took longer than expected. The owners portion of the work progressed at less than half the speed planned, and "Murphy" did not take a vacation.

    Next/New project is to do soffit and ridge vent construction and installation.


  15. #15
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Columbus GA
    Posts
    3,746

    Default Re: Newbie - Did Research, Answered Questions, Got Constructive Help.

    Quote Originally Posted by Stephen Jenkins View Post
    Rick,

    RTR Project completed.
    Inspection late last week, only open items were roof vent extensions that owner hasn't completed and the A/C work that's just starting (not me). Inspector peered into every nook and cranny. He was impressed with rafter extensions and purlin support structures. Needless to say the project took longer than expected. The owners portion of the work progressed at less than half the speed planned, and "Murphy" did not take a vacation.

    Next/New project is to do soffit and ridge vent construction and installation.
    Good for you, and glad you let us know the outcome.
    Got any pics? It would be interesting to see what and how it was done.

    ' correct a wise man and you gain a friend... correct a fool and he'll bloody your nose'.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    6

    Default Re: Newbie - Did Research, Answered Questions, Got Constructive Help.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rick Cantrell View Post
    Good for you, and glad you let us know the outcome.
    Got any pics? It would be interesting to see what and how it was done.
    Loaded several to RTR photo album.
    http://www.inspectionnews.net/home_i...r-project.html


  17. #17
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Columbus GA
    Posts
    3,746

    Default Re: Newbie - Did Research, Answered Questions, Got Constructive Help.

    Quote Originally Posted by Stephen Jenkins View Post
    You da man.
    Good job.

    ' correct a wise man and you gain a friend... correct a fool and he'll bloody your nose'.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •