Thread: sump pump on gfci outlet

hey all and jp

JP i have your attachment on where and when afci and gfci outlets should be installed. i have always used common sense on what awht not should be on gfci outlets. refrigerator and freezers and sump pump i always thought was a no brainer. go on vacation the breaker trips and your meat is dead and you have a flood.

wrote up this house {see photo] with sump pump connected to gfci..electrician came back and told me that code changed in july of 2008 and now they must be on gfci.

this does not make sense to me. anyone heard of this and what is the code.

help jerry

charlie

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Charlie,

Sump pumps have supposed to have been on GFCI for some time now.

Where is that receptacle outlet located? Basement? Finished or unfinished? Garage?

The sump pumps themselves are limited to less than 0.5 ma of leakage current, a GFCI trips are 5.0 ma of leakage current, thus when the GFCI trips it is a "good thing". Sure, the sump pump will be off and there may be some water damage, but the alternative is that the sump pump could energize the water it is in and electrocute a person in contact with something in contact with that water.

Which is worse: a) damage to basement; b) dead person?

I've been saying that for a number of years as the allowable leakage for appliances, motors, etc., was reduced probably 20 years ago ... back then, the appliance leakage itself could trip the GFCI and cause nuisance tripping, since that change an appliance tripping a GFCI *IS A GOOD THING*.

Same goes for a refrigerator, would you rather have: a) spoiled food; b) dead person?

I advised my clients that the refrigerator and freezer SHOULD BE GFCI PROTECTED FOR THEIR benefit, and, yes, the risk of THEIR SAFETY is spoiled food should the GFCI trip - a reason that the refrigerator, sump, etc., should *be on its own circuit* - that way *nothing else* can trip the GFCI.

THAT is "good old *common sense* and also makes code sense".

Back in the 1960s, 70s, even into the 1980s, yeah, the allowable leakage in the appliances was a problem, and your recommendations made sense.

However, TODAY and back to about 20 years ago, no, your recommendation no longer made sense.

Advise your client that THEIR LIFE is worth more than THEIR FOOD (refrigerators and freezers) or THEIR STORED items (sump pump).

THANKS JERRY
but you need to update your gfci outlet cheat sheet if i read it right bullet 7b] states except frig--freezer, sump
and yes this is in ans unfinished basement

see attachment

thanks i'm eating crow

charlie

Originally Posted by CHARLIE VAN FLEET

THANKS JERRY
but you need to update your gfci outlet cheat sheet if i read it right bullet 7b] states except frig--freezer, sump
and yes this is in ans unfinished basement

see attachment

thanks i'm eating crow

charlie

Charlie,

7b has not applied since 2002, it's on the chart.
7c,d for 2005 and 7e for 2008.

thanks jp, read it wrong, 61 year old eyes and brain not meshing

charlie