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  1. #1
    Randy Yates's Avatar
    Randy Yates Guest

    Question Floor drain required

    This may sound like a dumb question so correct me if I'm wrong everyone, but aren't all basments, finished or not required to have a floor drain tied into a storm drain or sump pump system with a discharge system to the outside of the house or to a storm sewer system. I can't seem to find the code reference in the IRC or any other code source. Your help would be greatly appreciated. I thought I saw somewhere for basments and habitable space or something along those lines.
    Happy New Year to all,
    Randy Yates

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  2. #2
    chris mcintyre's Avatar
    chris mcintyre Guest

    Default Re: Floor drain required

    Randy,
    I'm not aware of a drain being required by code, or at least I hope not because it is rarely done in my area.


  3. #3
    Randy Yates's Avatar
    Randy Yates Guest

    Default Re: Floor drain required

    Hi Chris,
    Thanks for the reply. I found what I was looking for. FYI IRC R405-406 states the requirments for foundation drainage systems.
    Randy


  4. #4
    chris mcintyre's Avatar
    chris mcintyre Guest

    Default Re: Floor drain required

    ....but aren't all basments, finished or not required to have a floor drain tied into a storm drain or sump pump....
    Quote Originally Posted by Randy Yates View Post
    FYI IRC R405-406 states the requirments for foundation drainage systems.
    Randy
    Randy,
    All I have here is the 2003 IRC and I see that a drainage system is required, but I don't see where a floor drain is required.


  5. #5
    Randy Yates's Avatar
    Randy Yates Guest

    Default Re: Floor drain required

    Chris,
    You are right. It doesn't specifically state "floor drain" however R405.1 states " Drainage tiles, gravel or crushed stone drains, perforated pipe or other approved systems or materials shall be installed at or below the area to be protected and shall discharge by gravity or mechanical means into an approved drainage system." I think in other words if gravity flow would work in a case, drain tile systems could in fact be tied into a floor drain system. Just speculating again.
    Randy


  6. #6
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    Default Re: Floor drain required

    Quote Originally Posted by Randy Yates View Post
    Chris,
    You are right. It doesn't specifically state "floor drain" however R405.1 states " Drainage tiles, gravel or crushed stone drains, perforated pipe or other approved systems or materials shall be installed at or below the area to be protected and shall discharge by gravity or mechanical means into an approved drainage system." I think in other words if gravity flow would work in a case, drain tile systems could in fact be tied into a floor drain system. Just speculating again.
    Randy
    Randy,

    You are mixing terms, at least I think you are, and that seems to be confusing you.

    You started out asking about floor drains, which would be used to drain the basement, and then asked about where those would drain to. This is about water *in* the basement.

    The section you have latched onto, though, is about foundation drainage, i.e., draining water away from the footing and the foundation wall - the water *outside* the foundation wall and *under* the footing.

    That section has nothing to do with draining the basement or floor drains.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Floor drain required

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    Randy,

    You are mixing terms, at least I think you are, and that seems to be confusing you.

    You started out asking about floor drains, which would be used to drain the basement, and then asked about where those would drain to. This is about water *in* the basement.

    The section you have latched onto, though, is about foundation drainage, i.e., draining water away from the footing and the foundation wall - the water *outside* the foundation wall and *under* the footing.

    That section has nothing to do with draining the basement or floor drains.
    Exactly. Basement floor drains and drain tile are two completely different things.

    MinnesotaHomeInspectors.com
    Minnesota Home Inspectors LLC
    ASHI #242887 mnradontesting.com

  8. #8
    Randy Yates's Avatar
    Randy Yates Guest

    Default Re: Floor drain required

    So then Jerry,
    Is there a code requirement to have a floor drain or if not practicle, a sump pit and pump for a basement that is currnetly used as "useable space", storage, etc., someday finished habitable space?
    Thanks for your time,
    Randy


  9. #9
    Join Date
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    Default Re: Floor drain required

    Quote Originally Posted by Randy Yates View Post
    So then Jerry,
    Is there a code requirement to have a floor drain or if not practicle, a sump pit and pump for a basement that is currnetly used as "usable space", storage, etc., someday finished habitable space?
    Thanks for your time,
    Randy

    Not required and not necessary if constructed as code minimum:

    (bold and underlining are mine)
    - SECTION R506
    - - CONCRETE FLOORS (ON GROUND)
    - - - R506.1 General. Concrete slab-on-ground floors shall be a minimum 3.5 inches (89 mm) thick (for expansive soils, see Section R403.1.8). The specified compressive strength of concrete shall be as set forth in Section R402.2.
    - - - R506.2 Site preparation. The area within the foundation walls shall have all vegetation, top soil and foreign material removed.
    - - - - R506.2.1 Fill. Fill material shall be free of vegetation and foreign material. The fill shall be compacted to assure uniform support of the slab, and except where approved, the fill depths shall not exceed 24 inches (610 mm) for clean sand or gravel and 8 inches (203 mm) for earth.
    - - - - R506.2.2 Base. A 4-inch-thick (102 mm) base course consisting of lean graded sand, gravel, crushed stone or crushed blast-furnace slag passing a 2-inch (51 mm) sieve shall be placed on the prepared subgrade when the slab is below grade.
    - - - - - Exception: A base course is not required when the concrete slab is installed on well-drained or sand-gravel mixture soils classified as Group I according to the United Soil Classification System in accordance with Table R405.1.
    - - - - R506.2.3 Vapor retarder. A 6 mil (0.006 inch; 152 μm) polyethylene or approved vapor retarder with joints lapped not less than 6 inches (152 mm) shall be placed between the concrete floor slab and the base course or the prepared subgrade where no base course exists.
    - - - - - Exception: The vapor retarder may be omitted:
    - - - - - - 1. From garages, utility buildings and other unheated accessory structures.
    - - - - - - 2. From driveways, walks, patios and other flatwork not likely to be enclosed and heated at a later date.
    - - - - - - 3. Where approved by the building official, based on local site conditions.
    - - - -
    R506.2.4 Reinforcement support. Where provided in slabs on ground, reinforcement shall be supported to remain in place from the center to upper one third of the slab for the duration of the concrete placement.



    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  10. #10
    Join Date
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    Snowbird (this means I'm retired and migrate between locations), FL/MI
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    4,086

    Default Re: Floor drain required

    Floor drain(s) often present in lieu of a drain pan for water storage tanks (usually water heaters) or washing machine (has overflow tube to floor), if there is other equipment (such as heating equipment) is present and/or if the electrical equipment (panel) is also present (dry path to panel).


  11. #11
    Join Date
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    Default Re: Floor drain required

    Quote Originally Posted by Randy Yates View Post
    shall discharge by gravity or mechanical means into an approved drainage system." I think in other words if gravity flow would work in a case, drain tile systems could in fact be tied into a floor drain system. Just speculating again.
    Randy
    Yes, I think this is correct a lot of the time. Not always, and "No, I don't have X-ray vision".
    Sometimes, the floor drain will become a fountain if it's tied to downspouts and a bunch of plugged up draintiles.
    If there's no sign of one I would never suggest they put one in, either. Could be high water table.


  12. #12
    Randy Yates's Avatar
    Randy Yates Guest

    Default Re: Floor drain required

    Thanks guys for your valuable input and clarification!
    Randy


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