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  1. #1
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    Default Shower pan discharges to floor drain

    OK, I know this discharge at the outer edge of a shower stall's pan is hinkey, but why exactly is it wrong?

    I know that even assuming the drain is trapped below floor, that if this discharge was otherwise allowed the air gap would be insufficient, but it seems to me there must be a more fundamental reason why the whole arrangement is just wrong... Wrong.. WRONG.

    I mean, is such a discharge method from a sink, tub or shower even (ever) ALLOWED?

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    Michael Thomas
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  2. #2
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    Default Re: Shower pan discharges to floor drain

    I believe those floor drains are not vented and that's why they shouldn't be used as a shower drain.

    -Jon
    Errickson Home Inspections, LLC
    http://www.erricksonhomeinspections.com

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Shower pan discharges to floor drain

    I belive the curb be should be no higher than 4".

    ' correct a wise man and you gain a friend... correct a fool and he'll bloody your nose'.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Shower pan discharges to floor drain

    Looks like indirect waste receptor to me! If this shower is in a restaurant they can wash the dishes in there .

    I really don't know if there is a code problem.


  5. #5

    Default Re: Shower pan discharges to floor drain

    That looks like a trap primer to me.


  6. #6
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    Default Re: Shower pan discharges to floor drain

    !!!!!

    Michael Thomas
    Paragon Property Services Inc., Chicago IL
    http://paragoninspects.com

  7. #7

    Default Re: Shower pan discharges to floor drain

    Michael,

    If the exlamation marks were in regards to my post, I was joking. I'll add smileys from now on.


  8. #8
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    Default Re: Shower pan discharges to floor drain

    Looks to me like someone said "Hey! I have a floor drain right there! Hot dang! I can just set a shower there and drain it to the floor drain!", followed with "Dang that sure was easy!"



    Nope, not gonna fly.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Shower pan discharges to floor drain

    Quote Originally Posted by Brandon Whitmore View Post
    Michael,

    If the exlamation marks were in regards to my post, I was joking. I'll add smileys from now on.
    I guess !!! is not a convention used on this board.

    Some other places where I hang out, it means ""Ha! very fully/cool/creative comment...".

    Michael Thomas
    Paragon Property Services Inc., Chicago IL
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  10. #10
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    Default Re: Shower pan discharges to floor drain

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    Nope, not gonna fly.
    Well, I certainly hope not... I've got enough on my plate today without adding "levitating shower stall" verbiage to my report template, and if anything it appears to me to be more likely to slink, or something similar.

    As I've noted, I can't believe it's right, but so far nobody's been able to tell me exactly why it's wrong....

    .... I suppose it's "obvious"....

    .... however unfortunately it's not obvious to me.

    So if you don't mind indulging me, please explain how I can knock it on the head in my report.

    Thanks

    Michael Thomas
    Paragon Property Services Inc., Chicago IL
    http://paragoninspects.com

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Shower pan discharges to floor drain

    Aren't floor drains sometimes tied to storm drains as opposed to sanitary lines?

    Also, I'd imagine there's some requirement that waste water be contained in a closed system. An air gap is another story that has different reqiurements from what I've seen.


  12. #12
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    Default Re: Shower pan discharges to floor drain

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Thomas View Post
    .... I suppose it's "obvious"....

    .... however unfortunately it's not obvious to me.


    Sorry 'bout dat.

    Start with this:
    - From the IRC: (bold and underlining are mine)
    - - P3201.6 Number of fixtures per trap. Each plumbing fixture shall be separately trapped by a water seal trap. The vertical distance from the fixture outlet to the trap weir shall not exceed 24 inches (610 mm) and the horizontal distance shall not exceed 30 inches (762 mm) measured from the center line of the fixture outlet to the centerline of the inlet of the trap. The height of a clothes washer standpipe above a trap shall conform to Section P2706.2. Fixtures shall not be double trapped.
    - - - Exceptions:
    - - - - 1. Fixtures that have integral traps.
    - - - - 2. A single trap shall be permitted to serve two or three like fixtures limited to kitchen sinks, laundry tubs and lavatories. Such fixtures shall be adjacent to each other and located in the same room with a continuous waste arrangement. The trap shall be installed at the center fixture where three fixtures are installed. Common trapped fixture outlets shall be not more than 30 inches (762 mm) apart.
    - - - - 3. Connection of a laundry tray waste line into a standpipe for the automatic clothes-washer drain is permitted in accordance with Section P2706.2.1.

    Then there is the shower base is to be installed as tested and listed, which includes connection to a drain and trap, and securing and supporting of the shower base.

    Then there is that pressure elbow being used for a waste line.

    Those should do for starters.


    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Shower pan discharges to floor drain

    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Fellman View Post
    Aren't floor drains sometimes tied to storm drains as opposed to sanitary lines?

    Most floor drains are tied to the sanitary system, or at least should be.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Shower pan discharges to floor drain

    Thanks.

    Michael Thomas
    Paragon Property Services Inc., Chicago IL
    http://paragoninspects.com

  15. #15

    Default Re: Shower pan discharges to floor drain

    Some other places where I hang out, it means ""Ha! very fully/cool/creative comment...".
    I had no clue. I thought you wanted to bit** slap me through the computer.


  16. #16
    Phil Brody's Avatar
    Phil Brody Guest

    Default Re: Shower pan discharges to floor drain

    There could be a trap under the base, the last picture looks as if it the whole stall was used some where else and cutoff leaving a piece of pipe in the elbow.


  17. #17
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    Talking Re: Shower pan discharges to floor drain

    Classic example of a 'redneck shower' if I ever saw one!

    RJDalga
    http://homeanalysts.com
    Kalamazoo, MI

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Shower pan discharges to floor drain

    Illinois Plumbing Code if other than City of Chicago; Plumbing Chapters of the IRC would not apply anywhere in Illinois; Illinois Plumbing Code is unique and UPC based not International Plumbing Code based (differences in drainage calculations, etc, it also is written in a different style and does not allow what is not otherwise expressly permitted.

    To answer your closing quesiton, nothing about this set up is ever allowed for a bath or shower in Illinois, violates both the under slab/below ground floor drain accessiblity to trap cleanout exception provisions (screened) exceptions to specific clear water indirect drainage; fixture drains to traps being sealed to air and water and not being increased in size beyond tables referenced, and a host of others. Both the floor drainage system and the shower fixture drainage requirements are compromised.

    If outside the City of Chicago; you can start with:

    Subpart F: Plumbing Fixtures, Shower Receptors and Compartments provisions of Section 890.690; and

    Subpart D: Traps and Cleanouts , Fixture Traps/Continuous Waste provisions of 890.410; and

    Subpart C: Joints and Connections; and

    Subpart H, Indirect Waste Piping provisions of 890.1010

    Keeping in mind the Illinois Plumbing Codes definitions and general provisions, and its entirety, Appendixes are incorporated into its code.
    PART 890 ILLINOIS PLUMBING CODE : Sections Listing

    If within an incorporated area or in Cook County outside of the City of Chicago, the Local Authority (home rule - county rules if unincorporated, or municipal rules if incorporated and adopting home rule authority) rules can be MORE RESTRICTIVE, from the Illinois Plumbing Code and based upon it - not more permissive. If within the City of Chicago - proper, then reference the Chicago Plumbing Code.




    Last edited by H.G. Watson, Sr.; 03-30-2010 at 05:15 AM.

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Shower pan discharges to floor drain

    The ultimate "indirect waste receptor", complete with "air gap":

    https://i.chzbgr.com/completestore/1...VivUB2zKg2.jpg

    Michael Thomas
    Paragon Property Services Inc., Chicago IL
    http://paragoninspects.com

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