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  1. #1
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    Default weird drain trap

    this is kitchen sink drain, weird? P-trap then 2-90 turns, even more the seller/owner is a plumber.

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    Last edited by Peter Louis; 06-30-2013 at 07:01 PM.
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  2. #2
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    Default Re: weird drain trap

    I can't make out what is what.
    But I can see that the label on the rubber adapter say it's 1 1/4".
    Kitchen sinks should be 1 1/2" (USA)

    ' correct a wise man and you gain a friend... correct a fool and he'll bloody your nose'.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: weird drain trap

    Quote Originally Posted by Rick Cantrell View Post
    I can't make out what is what.
    But I can see that the label on the rubber adapter say it's 1 1/4".
    Kitchen sinks should be 1 1/2" (USA)
    I'm thinking bathroom lavatories ... but that drain should not be going back uphill after the trap (looks to me like the right drain goes into the left drain which goes down to the trap and then turns back to the wall - which is higher so they had to do some fancy foot-work and route the trap arm up to the connection coming out the back of the cabinet).

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  4. #4
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    Default Re: weird drain trap

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    I'm thinking bathroom lavatories
    You might be thinking Lavs, but the OP said it is kitchen sinks

    ' correct a wise man and you gain a friend... correct a fool and he'll bloody your nose'.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: weird drain trap

    Quote Originally Posted by Rick Cantrell View Post
    You might be thinking Lavs, but the OP said it is kitchen sinks
    That he did ... me bad ...

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  6. #6
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    Default Re: weird drain trap

    Able to cut and glue pipe does not make him a "plumber".

    That thing is a water-logged mess.

    John Kogel, RHI, BC HI Lic #47455
    www.allsafehome.ca

  7. #7
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    Default Re: weird drain trap

    Cqn't make out much, if anything in the blurry (first) and poorly lit photos of limited view (close-ups repleat with obstructions) in qny of the three photos.

    However, wet venting is/was allowed, and although the bylaws are and have been quite different in your region compared to codes in the lower 48, there is little to nothing determinable in your (sorry, but they are horrendous) pictures that would be a defacto concern.

    vertical risers in horizontal branches wet vented were/are allowed.

    Here is one such example, although the restrictions noted in the diagram are/were more restrictive than those in your own region (which even permit traps below the floor level and aren't nearly so restrictive to riser height nor tail piece length.

    Attachment 29049

    - - - Updated - - -

    Cqn't make out much, if anything in the blurry (first) and poorly lit photos of limited view (close-ups repleat with obstructions) in qny of the three photos.

    However, wet venting is/was allowed, and although the bylaws are and have been quite different in your region compared to codes in the lower 48, there is little to nothing determinable in your (sorry, but they are horrendous) pictures that would be a defacto concern.

    vertical risers in horizontal branches wet vented were/are allowed.

    Here is one such example, although the restrictions noted in the diagram are/were more restrictive than those in your own region (which even permit traps below the floor level and aren't nearly so restrictive to riser height nor tail piece length.

    Attachment 29049

    appears to be more than six inch rise before the first offset (upstream) to right behind sink and another six inch rise before last offset to right as well as sufficient slope uphill to meet any of the allowable (conventional or not). IBc/IRC/IPC rules for the system methods allowable are discussed in summary in the following four articles (links below, pdf versions of same attached).


    ICC BSJ Online: Methods to Venting Plumbing Fixtures and Traps in the 2009 IBC

    ICC BSJ Online: Methods to Venting Plumbing Fixtures and Traps in the 2009 IBC

    ICC BSJ Online: Methods to Venting Plumbing Fixtures and Traps in the 2009 IBC

    ICC BSJ Online: Methods to Venting Plumbing Fixtures and Traps in the 2009 IBC-Part 4

    HTH


    Last edited by H.G. Watson, Sr.; 07-02-2013 at 12:26 PM.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: weird drain trap

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Louis View Post
    this is kitchen sink drain, weird? P-trap then 2-90 turns, even more the seller/owner is a plumber.
    Behind the double sink those are not "2-90 turns" those are "1/4 bends" or sweeps (i.e. drainage type as opposed to vent type fittings) not "90-degree 'ells'", never heard of "turns" in general for directional or offset fittings. Where is the trap of which you speak? Down below the double sink's tail pieces behind and below the stored stuff under the sink pictured I'm guessing. Why did you not remove the obstructions or stick your camera in the sink cabinet to get a useful photograph? What are you trying to indicate with your two fingers in the picture of the left sink tail piece connection? Is the 1-1/8" rubber adapter for a dishwasher, icemaker or water filtration/treatment device? Where is it in relationship to the balance of the DWv? Where is the P-trap you mention in your photos - the drainage fittings ("two-90 turns) you reference with bends appear to be Up-stream (drainage wise or to air/vent direction wise) to go up through the cabinet wall to the right and appear to be BEHIND the plumbing connecting the sinks' tail pieces/drain baskets.

    Do you have paint, photoshop or some other program, or a scanner, so you can sketch or highlight what your concern is, because as what can and can not be seen on the unenhanced pictures - there is nothing of concern as you picture & or describe except your description and question doesn't seem to match (directionally or nomenclature) what is poorly photographed????


    From what can and can not be seen in the three photographs, it seems the 1-1/2" or 2" ABS with the two bends and with the short horizontal section between same being higher than the interconnection between the double sinks' tails and it being behind same and going the opposite direction as the drainage for the double sink - I SUSPECT it to be an Auxiliary Vent going to the right and up (possibly due to this kitchen sink being under an exterior window, or in a peninusla, eventually through the roof to outside air; a loop vent if sink is at an island; or an additional wet vent/drainage RISER for something higher and adjacent. Since you have neither photographed/posted an image of a trap, a trap airm nor the interconnections (behind the junk in the cabniet) of the DWV nor diagramed same, looks like that's what's going on, and see nothing of concern, nor cause to disparage "the plumber"/HO/seller.

    Last edited by H.G. Watson, Sr.; 07-02-2013 at 11:44 AM.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: weird drain trap

    Hello HG. Those are pictures taken with a cellular telephone or a mini computer with touch screen sometimes called an iPad.

    Get used to them, because it is the new way.

    We have been assuming the pipe to the right wall of the cabinet is the drain trap arm, as implied but not made clear by Peter. Peter's English is broken. Give him a break.

    John Kogel, RHI, BC HI Lic #47455
    www.allsafehome.ca

  10. #10
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    Default Re: weird drain trap

    Sorry for the blurried pictures & broken Eng. These are bad shots. I do my best to explain.

    This kitchen is in the reno basement under a window. Double sink P-trap is under the left one, which is normal. I point a leaking/dripping adapter none related to the drainage & vent issue I questioned. The 2 1/4 bends are downstream of P-trap, which are actual drain full of water all the time. I cannot see the vent function on this installation. But I did not challenge it because the seller/owner is a plumber running a plumbing store. What I put on my report is this drain is unusual which has to be verified by plumber.

    Thank you H.G for the info attached.

    Last edited by Peter Louis; 07-02-2013 at 06:30 PM.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: weird drain trap

    What a coincidence. I have inspected this property again in 2 weeks. I hope the new pictures are clear. I think the reason the owner built the trap this way because he wanted to use the drain pipe in the adjacent wall & not to touch the foundation, which caused weird construction & dripping adapter.

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  12. #12
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    Default Re: weird drain trap

    Pictures are much better
    No that setup is not allowed
    There is a 10-12" trap seal, should be 2-4"

    ' correct a wise man and you gain a friend... correct a fool and he'll bloody your nose'.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: weird drain trap

    Just as bad now as it was two weeks ago.


    Peter, how did you like inspecting a familiar house?

    John Kogel, RHI, BC HI Lic #47455
    www.allsafehome.ca

  14. #14
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    Default Re: weird drain trap

    Quote Originally Posted by John Kogel View Post
    Just as bad now as it was two weeks ago.


    Peter, how did you like inspecting a familiar house?
    This is a hard call. Actually it was the first time a repeat ispection on me. the first client dropped ball. I was called to inspect the same property by an agent I did not know. I hesitated to tell him I had done this one 2 weeks ago. But I thought the existing client wanted it inspected anyway. I was happy seeing the seller did some minor repair according my last report.


  15. #15
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    Default Re: weird drain trap

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Louis View Post
    This is a hard call. Actually it was the first time a repeat ispection on me. the first client dropped ball. I was called to inspect the same property by an agent I did not know. I hesitated to tell him I had done this one 2 weeks ago. But I thought the existing client wanted it inspected anyway. I was happy seeing the seller did some minor repair according my last report.
    It is not unethical if you give the second client the same effort you put in for the first client.
    I like the second time because I can move faster thru the house and maybe spend more time on the shaky parts and find even more to put in the report. Or like you say, report a few things that are repaired and functioning that were defective before. I will tell the second client that I know the house, been there before.

    John Kogel, RHI, BC HI Lic #47455
    www.allsafehome.ca

  16. #16
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    Default Re: weird drain trap

    yes, good experience. found something not noticed previously; had to be careful all the time.


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