Thread: New Poll - Testing Appliances

I am interested in creating a poll on how many inspectors test appliances.

1. routinely
2. only if requested by client
3. no I don't inspect appliances

Or any other pertinent question related to appliance testing.

Thank you.

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I routinely test all burners on stoves. I routinely do not test dishwashers, compactors, refrigerators, microwaves, washing machines, vacuums, etc.

If asked to, that is a different story.

Of course with dishwashers I look inside and also check for high loop and/or vacuum breaker.

Originally Posted by Raymond Wand

I am interested in creating a poll on how many inspectors test appliances.

1. routinely
2. only if requested by client
3. no I don't inspect appliances

Or any other pertinent question related to appliance testing.

Thank you.

1) routinely.

I do not test washing machines, refrigerators, central vacuums (other than they go on), wine coolers, or juke boxes.

I am not routinely asked to inspect appliances. But will if asked.

I do occasionally write down the serial numbers as vendors have been known to change out the appliance for an older one or one that does not work.

If I hired a person to inspect a home for me, I would expect them to inspect everything in that home that I was buying. Put the shoes on your feet and what would you expect from a "Home Inspection"......

This morning I had a disposal with a spot of rust on the side of it. When I turned the water on in the sink it did not leak but when I turned on the disposal it leaked. I would not have known that the disposal was leaking unless I had turned it on.

I check them all except for washing machines and dryers. I disclaim them in my report. As for refrigerators if the are built-in I check to see if they are cooling, that is about all I do with them.

If the appliance runs, does not leak, it heats up, it cools or sucks then it is working at the time of the inspection! That is the limit of the inspeciton....

I check them all for operation. I don't really have a way to test if the dishwasher is working properly, as in getting the dishes clean. Same for the other stuff, but I do operate everything that I can within reason.

Routinely for the ones that normally transfer with the property in Texas.
W/D are a no. Refrigerators area no unless custom built in that obviously stays.
Yes on everything else if it is attached to the house (i.e. built-in, not portable.

Originally Posted by Raymond Wand

I am interested in creating a poll on how many inspectors test appliances.

1. routinely
2. only if requested by client
3. no I don't inspect appliances

Or any other pertinent question related to appliance testing.

Thank you.

Send an email to Brian Hannigan, the IN administrator, and he will set up a poll for you.

I check all appliances. If there is a cup handy I will see if the microwave heats up water.

I test the sump; well pumps and the pressure tank. If I can turn it on and off I operate it...but, I am not testing the dishwasher, washer or dryer....they aren't part of the house. They fall under plumbing and electrical.
I think that the only test and inspection I do perform is on the garage door and opener.

I am conducting a home inspection. The appliances are only inspected because they are attached to plumbing or maybe electrical connections. I am not there to see if fluff and fold works or water saver on the dishwasher. These things have hundreds of setting and cycles...you would be there all day verifying that.

This is my 5 cents, since we got rid of the penny....

I always test kitchen appliances. I turn the dishwasher on as soon as I get in the house. I always open the dishwasher, make sure no plastic spoons are on the heater element, and the rack is not broken. My disclaimer about the dishwasher states, that I don't determine how well it will clean dishes. I am amazed at how often I find a leaking dishwasher. If the fridge is included, I just open the doors to see if it's cold, has ice, etc. If the washer and dryer are included in the transaction, I'll run them, but I note that I don't check every cycle setting. Sometimes a washer will walk across the room on the spin cycle (slight exaggeration).

I never note brands, serial numbers, etc. People often ask me what I think of the brand, and I'll tell them if I have an opinion.........and I usually do.

A week ago, I was inspecting a house with a gas cook top and hidden vent. The wife and kids were watching when I pressed the button at the back of the cooktop and the vent rose up. The wife looked at me in amazement. Funny, the little things that instill confidence.

One more thing about dishwashers, I run into a lot of broken soap container covers.

I routinely melt the plastic bag with the manual inside it that gets left in the brand new oven.

Seriously, I will check for basic functions in the kitchen, but only when time allows, all the other stuff is done, and Yes I record all particulars and serial #'s. I will run the dishwasher if it doesn't appear to have been used much. Clean dishes in it, I move on.

Originally Posted by John Kogel

and Yes I record all particulars and serial #'s.

It's easier to just take pictures of the appliances.

i test all appliances--except the oven--to many times i have left it on when left--client distraction i claim. exceptions--compactors--humidifiers-sprinklers-hot tubs--pools- ice machines-personal vibrators-

cvf

Originally Posted by CHARLIE VAN FLEET

i test all appliances--except the oven--to many times i have left it on when left--

cvf

Been there. I make sure to leave the oven door open. It reminds me to turn it off.

mike

good idea

cvf

I do not "test" appliances. I operate them. To "test" an appliance, it seems to me it would be necessary to verify calibration of oven temperature, air/fuel mixture at burners, actual wattage of a microwave oven, etc. I turn them on in the same way a resident would. Different from testing.

In addition to the items noted by others, I also disclaim self-cleaning on ovens.

I do the same as MIke - leave the oven door open as a reminder.
As far as dishwashers go, its pretty easy.
Check soap door.
Make sure its connected to hot water.
Open door during cycle to ensure the spray wands are actually turning (many do not).
Make sure it doesn't leak.
Check the heater comes on - and goes off.

I check all kitchen appliances; the dishwasher is run on a normal cycle when I first walk in the house so it's done by the time I get to the kitchen.
I run clothes washer & dryer if the client tells me they are staying.
I also run a central humidifier and check an electronic air cleaner and show the client the parts of the cleaner.

As Scott said, if I'm paying for an inspection...

DW, oven/range, exhaust fan, disposal - yes, washers/dryers, microwaves, trash compactors and others - no

Most important is to explain in your contract and report what you are doing. I recently had a complaint about an "Instant-Hot" water dispenser and coughed up a couple bucks. It isn't addressed one way or another in my state SOPs or my contract or report.... it just slipped through the cracks so far.

Originally Posted by Matt Fellman

DW, oven/range, exhaust fan, disposal - yes, washers/dryers, microwaves, trash compactors and others - no

Most important is to explain in your contract and report what you are doing. I recently had a complaint about an "Instant-Hot" water dispenser and coughed up a couple bucks. It isn't addressed one way or another in my state SOPs or my contract or report.... it just slipped through the cracks so far.

Matt, the Oregon SOP's say you need to observe and operate installed microwaves and trash compactors. Just a heads up.

I test all appliances that are included in the sale except for portable (I don't consider W&D and refrig as portable). I have lots of caveats in the report about the extent of testing.
I disclaim alarms, speakers, audio / video, anything low voltage.

Funny thing is we are not required by our SOP to inspect appliances. I say in my blurbs that there is no time to inspect appliances, but if time allows I will check them for function as a courtesy.

My out-of-town client sent me an email. I never get feedback after the fact so this is big. What is the make of the fridge? There's a picture of the fridge in the report, and I had recorded the make, but that one comment had dropped out of my program on the final edit. So I gave her the make and some more info about all the appliances. 2 weeks later another email, could I send a corrected report containing the make of the fridge? Sure, happy to oblige.

Appliances are big in the eyes of some clients. There were no questions about the various defects, but the make of the fridge was big and had to be in the report. She was applying for insurance.

I'll test most appliances that are typical to a home. I don't run compactors, central vacs or microwaves.

I routinely find problem while running appliances that adversely effect the home. Leaking dishwasher, leaking disposals, under sized breakers for the electric range etc. I always run the washing machine on it's largest load setting. Because of the large amount of water discharged when it completes a cycle I routinely find problems with the sewer lateral pipes.

It's much easier to take a couple minutes during the inspection to run the appliances than to deal with the angry client when they find the problem after they move in.

It's up to you if you want to be the regular SOP inspector or if you want to go that extra mile for your client.

Testing appliances is no big deal.

But then it is required by our Texas TREC SOP.

Still ... testing appliances is not a big effort for a lot of good PR in the report for the clients.

Originally Posted by John Kogel

I routinely melt the plastic bag with the manual inside it that gets left in the brand new oven.

Seriously, I will check for basic functions in the kitchen, but only when time allows, all the other stuff is done, and Yes I record all particulars and serial #'s. I will run the dishwasher if it doesn't appear to have been used much. Clean dishes in it, I move on.

I have a bad habit of turning on the oven and then, opening the door to see what is inside. I also check to see if the anti-tip cleat is in place for the range.
I use one of those little microwave test devices. Clients love to see that thing glowing in the microwave and then I run it around the door checking for leaks. I've never found a leaking microwave but it is one of those little things that instill confidence with the client that I am indeed inspecting everything I can get at.

Test them all?

I run them all.

The only actual test would be the oven temp set at 350 and see f it is on or how much off.Microwaves? I have found many that set my sensor off. Not sure exactly how accurate the are but if it starts singing the micro is leaking.

I do not run washers and dryers. Sprinklers are set to manual all zones for a minute or two and make sure there are no fountains or water coming up out of the ground or heads broken. I do not measure anything to do with the sprinklers other than is the water hitting all areas. Sprinklers are optional but I include them. It only takes ten minutes or so.

Central vacs are just switched on at the vacuum. I do not go to each outlet. 99% of the time there is no hose anyway to plug in.

Yes? I have turned around many a time to go back and shut the oven off.

I know of a man that inspected a home and set the AC way down. He left it running and the thing ran for a month and a half as no one went to the home in that time. Yup, he paid the bill in the hundreds.

Charlie????? Personal vibrators??????

Appliance operation is required by licensing in North Carolina. States dishwasher must be run thru a normal cycle.

Run dishwasher thru a normal cycle. Usually start first thing so completes by end of inspection. Confirm is secured to cabinetry/countertop.

Turn on all "built-In" appliances. Range, Cooktop, Wall Ovens, exhaust fan, disposal, and microwave. If they power up, good to go. Keep a paper towel in tool belt. Wet, throw in m/wave, hit 1 min. Countertop m/waves are not "built in" and not operated.

Fridge, open doors to see if lights on and cool. Check.

Usually disclaim trash compactors, but occasionally have had one actually run.

Washer and Dryer see if they power up. Thats it.

I leave the cooktop fan running while heating ovens. The noise is a reason to come back and turn off oven. Always check inside of ovens and dishwashers before operating. People store all kinds of things in both that dont like heat or water.

So far over on the ASHI discussion board>>>

Do you inspect appliances as part of a normal home inspection?
As part of a normal home inspection do you inspect or do you not inspect appliances in the home. Stoves, disposals, dishwashers, etc.

Refrigerators, washing machines and dryers may or may not convey with a property but in many areas of the country they do.


Yes, I inspect appliances in the home (77.1%)

No, I do not inspect appliances in the home (22.9%)

Total Votes: 48Voting Ends: 3/4/2013

Thanks, Scott. It is a service and it helps instill confidence, but making it mandatory for all might become a hardship in some cases, such as when there are personal items in the way, not a lot but some, pots left on the stove, dishes in the DW, clothes in the washer/dryer, but he could have .... and now we find out it don't work!!!

BTW, to test central vac outlets, just short the terminals with a car key or the blade of an Xacto knife. Builtin appliances should be operated. One condo recently, the only thing wrong was a leaky dishwasher.

Originally Posted by John Kogel

BTW, to test central vac outlets, just short the terminals with a car key or the blade of an Xacto knife.

I'd burn something out or set the house on fire if I did something like that.

Originally Posted by John Kogel

BTW, to test central vac outlets, just short the terminals with a car key or the blade of an Xacto knife. Builtin appliances should be operated. One condo recently, the only thing wrong was a leaky dishwasher.

I use a small scrap of insulated wire to jumper the contacts. I heard a story of someone getting zapped because the system wasn't wired properly, so I stopped jumping with my metal pliers like I used to. Could be an urban legend, but the wire doesn't take up much space in my vest.

I find more women want the central vac tested along with hose and beater bar tested.
However since all suction ports are not tested it is feasible that a line could be clogged.

Originally Posted by Raymond Wand

I find more women want the central vac tested along with hose and beater bar tested.
However since all suction ports are not tested it is feasible that a line could be clogged.

I never check central vacs, and somehow jumping the contacts just sounds like inviting trouble. In a large house, testing every port could take a while and then checking to see if air is getting drawn with adequate flow and volume to the vac; wow, that could take 45 min or more.

Originally Posted by Lon Henderson

I never check central vacs, and somehow jumping the contacts just sounds like inviting trouble. In a large house, testing every port could take a while and then checking to see if air is getting drawn with adequate flow and volume to the vac; wow, that could take 45 min or more.

Once again, are you giving it a quick check or are you doing a formal inspection? Disclaim it, then tell them you tested a couple as a courtesy.

One inspector I know has a leather key fob with the metal medallion on it. That seems to work great on the standard vac outlets. No shock haz with that.

Wait a bit. Somebody wired 120 to the central vac actuators? And it went unnoticed??

Any war stories on disgruntled client calling you about appliances that were checked but failed to operate post move in?

I could not find any case law (Cdn) with such instances.

That doesn't mean a purchaser has not tried to go after the inspector. Since there is no case law this does not mean complaints do not exist.

People complain to inspectors, of course that would not be recorded anywhere.

People complain to BBB that may or may not be recorded if the inspector dealt with it promptly.

People file court claims without pursing it, of course that would not be recorded either.

People complain to the respective associations about the failure of the inspector, that would not be recorded either.

However just because there are no records does not mean someone has not tried to collect from the inspector.

So I ask again, any anecdotal evidence? If so and you care to share? I'd like to hear about it.

Thanks,

Originally Posted by Raymond Wand

Any war stories on disgruntled client calling you about appliances that were checked but failed to operate post move in?

None but kind of the opposite. A seller claimed I ruined $500 worth of clothing by running hot water in her washer with expensive clothing. (She was really angry about my inspection report I do believe.) I thought I had run cold water and then put it on spin. I couldn't remember.

I looked at the damage and it was a sweater, sweatshirt and some old t-shirts. The colors had bled. None of it was expensive clothing, Old Navy and Hanes. I told her no way this was worth anything near $500. She signed a hold harmless agreement and I paid her $200. It was my fault and I paid for it. If you run the washer, take the clothes out.
----

The father of a client followed me around like a dog during an inspection and asked how I could tell if the clothes washer was working good if I didn't wash any clothes in it. "@#@%&**&!!#@/^*!!." That's as close as I have come with a complaint from a client.

Originally Posted by Jim Robinson

I use a small scrap of insulated wire to jumper the contacts. I heard a story of someone getting zapped because the system wasn't wired properly, so I stopped jumping with my metal pliers like I used to. Could be an urban legend, but the wire doesn't take up much space in my vest.

I sand the paint off the tailcap of my flashlight and use that to test central vacs.
If you operate compactors, look inside first. I once jammed one up that they had put a plastic trash can in. House had been vacant for months. Had to pay for a service call on that one.
Brian, we need more emoticons!

I run conveying appliances. I disclaim anything past the fact that it turns on, appears to operate normally, turns off. I use a wet paper towel to see if a microwave heats. I disclaim all timing and temperature controls. The disclaimers are stated more in depth in the inspection contract and again noted in the report. I also disclaim non-connections of dryers and other exhausting equipment specifically beyond the "not visible, covered inside walls" general catch-all statement.

I got a complaint that I had NOT tested the dryer. A mobile home had an antique gold electric dryer and a beat up old washer. I dutifully recorded the details because I always do - inventory. My client complained that when she moved in, the outlet for the dryer was dead.
Now she needed an electrician and who knows what he would find? I had called for an electrician to do some work in the panel, but nevertheless, it was a complaint and I now try to test for power to the dryer, but only if there are no clothes in it.

I will move a clothes basket off the top of the machine, but I ain't touching loose clothes. Junk in the tub or the shower, I go find a bucket, run water into there. That is why it should be a voluntary courtesy but not mandatory. Too many animals out there.

Originally Posted by Raymond Wand

Any war stories on disgruntled client calling you about appliances that were checked but failed to operate post move in?

I could not find any case law (Cdn) with such instances.

That doesn't mean a purchaser has not tried to go after the inspector. Since there is no case law this does not mean complaints do not exist.

People complain to inspectors, of course that would not be recorded anywhere.

People complain to BBB that may or may not be recorded if the inspector dealt with it promptly.

People file court claims without pursing it, of course that would not be recorded either.

People complain to the respective associations about the failure of the inspector, that would not be recorded either.

However just because there are no records does not mean someone has not tried to collect from the inspector.

So I ask again, any anecdotal evidence? If so and you care to share? I'd like to hear about it.

Thanks,

Texas and North Carolina require appliance operating. Both are licensed states. NC has complaints on their website.

I run the dishwasher and I activate all other appliance to see if they turn on and/or water is to them as necessary. I look in the fridge to see that is is working. I would want some one to tell me the compactor does not work if it is installed.

I test the electric garage door opener.

I generally have this statement


Appliances are not tested nor fully inspected due to concealed nature. They are however operated to look for visible defects or lack of operation . No defects were visible unless noted below.
Dishwashers are not operated nor inspected due to concealed plumbing.

Mike Moser

Originally Posted by Rick Cantrell

I test the electric garage door opener.

I use an garage door opener to test the 2x4 block of wood!

Originally Posted by Raymond Wand

I use an garage door opener to test the 2x4 block of wood!

Now that was funny!

Originally Posted by John Kogel

BTW, to test central vac outlets, just short the terminals with a car key or the blade of an Xacto knife. Builtin appliances should be operated. One condo recently, the only thing wrong was a leaky dishwasher.

Most, yes. But, I ran into one that shorted-out and fried some control board that I ended up having to replace.

On operating ovens, I turn-on the range hood/fan to high. I leave it running as an annoying reminder to turn off the oven.

When I first started, I turned on the electric range at very abused house. The oven elements got hot and satisfied, I turned it off. After the closing the buyer called me up to tell me that the oven was not heating up to the correct temperature and I should have caught that. She said the seller knew it!! I said, if the seller had disclosed it, then what was the problem? She hung up on me.

But the worst was on a sub zero day in an old house. The house was a rental and the tenants had the thermostat at 55 when i got there. My buyers had their aged Vietnamese mother with them who didn't speak a word of English as far as I could tell. I turned the heat up, but after checking the furnace and recommending that it be certified safe due to a suspicious looking heat exchanger, ( I didn't get a reading on my CO detector), I turned it back down. About ten minutes later, I noticed the house was warming and I went back and found the thermostat turned to 90! I turned it back down and the mother came running over with a very unhappy scowl and turned it back up while giving me a stink eye look.

Ok, no problem. So, as I am leaving at the completion of the inspection, I turn the thermostat back down. The agent and the buyers stayed to complete the Inspection Notice. That night, the agent called me to tell me that I had left the thermostat maxed out and the tenant's parakeet was dead! I said "Bulls**t to that" and told him what I was sure had happened with the mother. The complaint never went further, but that agent who continues to refer me, still calls me the Parakeet Killer.

For Baked Parakeet on a stick, turn furnace up to 90, then leave the house.

I agree with Scott. First thing I do when I enter the home is turn on the dishwasher. My main focus with its operation is if the soap dispenser opens (sometimes they do not) and if there are any leaks, unusual noises, etc. You can turn it on its quickest wash setting, always select heat dry as well...can't tell you how many times that by running the dishwasher I find that a sink drain is clogged (and then find that the disposal doesn't work so there you have another finding!)

As well, I test all other kitchen appliances. Granted, I'm not gonna bake cookies, but I am going to verify that the oven heats up and that both the bake and broil elements are working. I carry an oven thermometer as well in an effort to verify that the oven temperature matches what I have set the oven on and let my client know that there can still be a variance in what the oven and my thermometer show.

If I know that washer and dryer are staying as part of the sale (and I do ask this) I test them as well, (however, if there are clothes in the washing machine I do not test it and let my client know that I will not test due to occupants clothes being in the machine and do not want to be liable for those clothes...kind of a catch-22 there...). I inspect a ton of homes with crawl spaces and I want to know if there are any leaks going on, that the dryer vent is exiting the crawl space properly and not just vented directly into the crawl space (which I find is occuring on a regular basis!). Also, want to make sure there are no leaks at the water supply lines and connections to the washing machine.

None of these take that much time and I, like Scott, would expect the same from my inspector.

I also test gas fireplaces. Why wouldn't you? I'm sure there are many out there who are just not going to because it requires them to turn on the gas and we all have disclaimers in our agreements that we don't turn on gas appliances wherein the pilot is not lit. I am confident in my abilities to be very careful but I can't tell you how many times I have found defects with the gas supply shut off's in walls (key doesn't reach, everything inside spins, etc.) or that the pilot mechanism is faulty, or that the wall switch, which shows every visible sign that it is connected, is not working.

As for microwaves, I carry a microwave-safe cup that I use to test the heating capabilities ( and a cup of Ramon noodles to snack on-j/k).

I do not test the vac systems, however. They can clean their own house!

Originally Posted by Greg Subick

I also test gas fireplaces. Why wouldn't you? I'm sure there are many out there who are just not going to because it requires them to turn on the gas and we all have disclaimers in our agreements that we don't turn on gas appliances wherein the pilot is not lit. I am confident in my abilities to be very careful but I can't tell you how many times I have found defects with the gas supply shut off's in walls (key doesn't reach, everything inside spins, etc.) or that the pilot mechanism is faulty, or that the wall switch, which shows every visible sign that it is connected, is not working.

Regarding gas fireplaces and conversions, it's surprising how often I find a functioning damper. I run my CO detector around the fireplace and once in a blue moon find one leaking.