A/C Condensers next to the pool - InspectionNews

Mike Pearson · #1 (**permalink**) 07-22-2007, 04:27 PM

Hi Guys

Can anyone tell me if the condensers are allowed to be this close to the pool? Is the wall the exception? 2007 house in Ft Lauderdale. Yes, that is a waterfall right at the top of the wall. No, they are not bonded and there is some underground wiring for these units and the pool timer within five feet.

PS
Jerry, I know we talked about a few items but I cannot remember this one.

Mike Pearson
Lighthouse Building Inspections

Jim Luttrall · #2 (**permalink**) 07-22-2007, 04:47 PM

2003 IRC
E4103.6 Underground wiring. 5' horizontal unless space is limited and uses a specified type of conduit and minimum burial depth. Wiring serving the pool and equipment are excepted.

The wall is permitted to except the 5' requirement for the pool equipment, but I am still working on the A/C units.

Mike Pearson · #3 (**permalink**) 07-22-2007, 05:04 PM

Thanks Jim,

Some wiring for the A/C units (underground) is to close but the condensers are still in question. Is the pool timer and box wiring allowed within the five feet?

Mike Pearson
S. FLA

Jim Luttrall · #4 (**permalink**) 07-22-2007, 05:23 PM

The way I read it, the clearance is allowed to be reduced by a permanent wall between the pool and the switching devices. E4103.2 Switching devices... would include timers in my opinion. Perhaps someone with the NEC will comment.

Jerry Peck · #5 (**permalink**) 07-22-2007, 08:00 PM

From the NEC.

680.10 Underground Wiring Location.
Underground wiring shall not be permitted under the pool or within the area extending 1.5 m (5 ft) horizontally from the inside wall of the pool unless this wiring is necessary to supply pool equipment permitted by this article. Where space limitations prevent wiring from being routed a distance 1.5 m (5 ft) or more from the pool, such wiring shall be permitted where installed in rigid metal conduit, intermediate metal conduit, or a nonmetallic raceway system. All metal conduit shall be corrosion resistant and suitable for the location. The minimum burial depth shall be as given in Table 680.10.
- Table 680.10 Minimum Burial Depths
- Wiring Method________Minimum Burial inches
- Rigid metal conduit__________6
- Intermediate metal conduit____6
- Nonmetallic raceways listed___18
- - for direct burial without concrete encasement 450
- Other approved raceways*___18

Yes, the a/c condenser units need to be bonded, and no they 'should not' be that close to the pool - for safety reasons, not because the code prohibits them being located there provided the wiring is not underground (makes no sense to me, but I know of no restriction on that location), and, by the way I would also recommend the a/c condenser units be on GFCI protected circuits too - so the surviving spouse ... does not call you.

Code addresses minimum safety, but cannot address every potential way which contractors and builders could ever screw things up - and that is one which (I am sure) was not considered.

Mike, call Tarry Baker at the Broward County Rules and Appeals, ask him, then let me know back here - thanks. 954-765-4500, ext 231 (I think 231 is his extension). Tarry will be glad you called, the last time I met Tarry (last April) he was disappointed that local home inspectors had quit calling him. If you are still involved with the local association, invite Tarry out to a meeting - everyone will be better off for it.

Jim Luttrall · #6 (**permalink**) 07-22-2007, 09:20 PM

Jerry, from the IRC, there is the exception for switching devices if there is a wall separating the pool and switching device.
Can you comment on what this covers? I am sure the NEC must go into a little more detail than the IRC.
I am guessing the pool equipment must have been placed there under that Wall thinking...
Your thoughts?

Mike Pearson · #7 (**permalink**) 07-22-2007, 09:29 PM

Thanks Jim and Jerry,

Sometimes builders can be quite thought provoking and they do not even know it.

This helps a lot. I do not like to call something as Code wrong even though it is just plain STUPID wrong

. I will call Tarry Baker tomorrow. I will also see if he will come to a meeting as I am now the Gulfstream ASHI Pres. Imagine that Jerry. You never know who you meet years earlier where they are going to end up

.

Little ol Mike
S. FLA

Jerry Peck · #8 (**permalink**) 07-23-2007, 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Luttrall

Jerry, from the IRC, there is the exception for switching devices if there is a wall separating the pool and switching device.

Jim, the IRC does not apply in Florida, it's the Florida Building Code, based on the International Codes (including the IRC) with changes. Here (in Florida) the NEC rules over the Electrical sections of the IRC have been removed and reserved, with the first one making reference to the NEC.

Quote:

Can you comment on what this covers? I am sure the NEC must go into a little more detail than the IRC.

The NEC does not give that exception.

'I would think' (dangerous) that "switching devices" would mean time clocks, automatic controllers, and the like.

wayne soper · #9 (**permalink**) 07-23-2007, 09:09 AM

I,m interested in the net. Is that to keep you out or in?
Seriously, If you fell into that net, you would have a very hard time getting out.

BARRY ADAIR · #10 (**permalink**) 07-23-2007, 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wayne soper

I,m interested in the net. Is that to keep you out or in?
Seriously, If you fell into that net, you would have a very hard time getting out.

Wayne,

Here ya go Pool Covers, Swimming Pool Covers & Safety Nets

Jerry Peck · #11 (**permalink**) 07-23-2007, 11:48 AM

The net is designed to allow you to not have to install a barrier around the pool, which, after inspection, you discard the net.

Really, I'm not kidding, that's what people do.

I've also seen the net installed only a couple of times, and neither time was it installed such that it met all of its requirements.

Jim Luttrall · #12 (**permalink**) 07-23-2007, 12:20 PM

Jerry, is there any limitation in the NEC to prevent or limit electrical equipment with in the pool area that is not part of the pool utilization equipment? I see some limits for existing luminaries and then receptacle outlets, but nothing say for the electrical service equipment, A/C, etc.
Of course common sense says not to mount your pool cleaning pole on the wall below the meter base, but can you find any kind of limits at all?
Thanks, Jim

Jerry Peck · #13 (**permalink**) 07-23-2007, 04:07 PM

Jim,

Underground services would fall within the "underground wiring" section, overhead services would fall within the "overhead service clearance" section back at 230.24 Clearances.