Thread: Mr. HandyMan strikes again

I just installed a dishwasher for the first time.
Fired it up, and everything was fine UNTIL...

a very slow drip develops from the right front corner a minute or two after washing noises start. This is nowhere near the water supply or drain lines. Looked with flashlight and mirror, of course, but didn't really see anything. When I stick my hand up there I feel wet insulation. I've run it about 4 times and every time it starts to drip, so I cancel the cycle.
The door seal looks fine, the door opens and closes with no problems.

Any ideas for the Clueless Wonder here?

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How does the tub interior look John? Any seams or cracks in the area where the insulation is getting wet or above it?

Make sure you follow the installation directions regarding leveling the unit. The doors are not completely water tight and rely on proper installation to prevent leaks. Also, soap helps to seal the door. Don't run it without soap or it will leak.

Originally Posted by Ken Rowe

Make sure you follow the installation directions regarding leveling the unit. The doors are not completely water tight and rely on proper installation to prevent leaks. Also, soap helps to seal the door. Don't run it without soap or it will leak.

Ken - Thanks. I had no idea soap had this function.

Originally Posted by Nick Ostrowski

How does the tub interior look John? Any seams or cracks in the area where the insulation is getting wet or above it?

Nick - Looked good to me, but what the heck, I'm just a home inspector.

as we state in our reports--recommend having a licensed qualified plumber repair

cvf

Originally Posted by CHARLIE VAN FLEET

as we state in our reports--recommend having a licensed qualified plumber repair

cvf

Charlie - That's at other people's houses! Not my house!

Originally Posted by Ken Rowe

...Don't run it without soap or it will leak.

Taking off my Mr. HandyMan hat and putting back on my Mr. Home Inspector hat, what you're telling me is that if I run a dishwasher at a home inspection and there's no soap, I shouldn't get too excited about certain types of leaks.

Interesting. I've never used soap, and run a lot of dishwashers. A few leaked at the door, but not very many. Maybe 10 out of about 1,000. The ones that leaked were all pretty old, and I just figured the seal was shot around the door.

Hey, This isn't a DIY forum. Take it elsewhere.

rick

My Brother recently bought and installed a new Fridigaire D/W and it leaked as well. He wasn't too happy. Back to the store for a "new", new dishwasher. The second one worked fine.

Luck of the draw, I guess.

I just had my dishwasher repaired. It was leaking from the soap dispenser. I thought it was the door seal but the repairman said the clip for the soap dispenser wares out and starts to leak. But this shouldn't be your case since its a new dishwasher.

Originally Posted by John Arnold

Taking off my Mr. HandyMan hat and putting back on my Mr. Home Inspector hat, what you're telling me is that if I run a dishwasher at a home inspection and there's no soap, I shouldn't get too excited about certain types of leaks.

I'm talking about a new dishwasher, as you were in your original post. I always open the sample packs of soap left in the new dishwashers. It has reduced my reporting of leaking "new" dishwashers by 75%.

Have been installing dishwashers for 32 years and have never seen one leak due to lack of soap. If your d/w has a spray arm on the very top you may want to pull it out and be sure the tube that goes up the side hasn't become disconnected on the top. See it all the time when tile floors have been installed and the clearance from floor to countertop is barely enough. Tube gets knocked loose when sliding d/w in. Otherwise be sure the lower spray arm is moving freely (all shipping blocks have been removed), all screws in door and in top counter brackets are flush and that no one has added anything that is causing excessive suds ( usually comes out the bottom of the door).
Good Luck 'cause I'm guessing Momma ain't gonna be happy til it's fixed.

Originally Posted by Barney Bienz

... If your d/w has a spray arm on the very top you may want to pull it out and be sure the tube that goes up the side hasn't become disconnected on the top...

Barney - Thanks.

It appears that the tube you mention is internal. Does this sound possible? I see a kind of flattened channel running up the back interior of the DW to the spray arm at the top. Can't see anything like this outside on top when I peak under the counter.

Sometimes the nut that holds the water supply that runs to the top of the tub is loose. this can be tightened from the inside. It is the part that sits in the top center inside. try tightening this from the inside to see if it is loose. The gasket holding this may be damaged. this will require the dishwasher to be removed to fix.

Originally Posted by John Arnold

I just installed a dishwasher for the first time.
Fired it up, and everything was fine UNTIL...

a very slow drip develops from the right front corner a minute or two after washing noises start. This is nowhere near the water supply or drain lines. Looked with flashlight and mirror, of course, but didn't really see anything. When I stick my hand up there I feel wet insulation. I've run it about 4 times and every time it starts to drip, so I cancel the cycle.
The door seal looks fine, the door opens and closes with no problems.

Any ideas for the Clueless Wonder here?

Just call MacGyver out of retirement.

Originally Posted by Rick Hurst

.
Just call MacGyver out of retirement.

.
Or The Maytag Repairman. .
.

Obviously if the DW leaks only when in operation, it's not the fill hot water line, which is under pressure and would leak all the time. Check the discharge line - you will have to pull the DW out of the cabinet. It may be looped upward with a small pin-hole leak. In my experience it's not unusual for the line to kink up as the DW is pushed into the cabinet. Once the DW is outside the cabinet, run it again to locate the leak. You might also try pulling on the discharge hose from the 'other' side of the cabinet it is fed through, to see if it will straighten out. Typically DWs will discharge residue/water inside the machine before actually starting to cycle - some machines, particularly Bosch - can hold quite a lot of water. It's a design thing and helps keep seals lubricated.

A couple of months ago I examined a faulty DW on behalf of an Ins. Co. and claim. A small plastic elbow had cracked at the pump where the discharge line is connected and the machine cycled overnight, spewing water onto/under the hardwood kitchen floor instead of being discharged in the normal manner. Actually the homeowner didn't realize what had happened - most of the water was behind base cabinets and under the flooring - and inadvertently re-cycled it again the next morning before leaving for work. The floor got a double dose. Cost of the replacement part $1.98. Cost of the damage and insurance claim, which included weeks of dry-out, removal and replace (almost 1000 sq.ft) new HW floor, replace 2' of perimeter drywall, remove and replace base cabinets, replace baseboards, molding and paint - over $23K.

Tough to say since you didn't indicate the mfg or model.

When all else looks fine (leveling, connections, pump, water level float switch, door square and although latching, not "caught" on adjacent cabinet, etc.,

Often it can be one of the following (1 & 2 are usual culprits esp. if drip on front right and door insulation is wet):

1. Rinse aid dispenser fill "cap" not fully seated in place, o-ring on same not set properly, gasket for same not seated properly (often a plastic retention nut seats same may also be loose), etc. see attached gif.

2. gasket for detergent dispenser or dispenser cup itself not seated properly, cap and release arm not seated properly - gasket/grommet for cup latch not seated properly, or ripped, torn, missing, etc.



3. door itself or hinge slightly bent (prone if DIY one-man install and cabinet lifted or set in place with door open instead of using sliders with door closed and locked to set in place) sometimes this can be determined by checking level and square of door frame and hinges with door open, sometimes not.

4. Unit itself not truly plumb on face - check plumb of compartment with door open and at back of compartment - NOT plumb of the face of the door from outside, also check level at top of compartment from inside.

5. GE's are prone to have seating issues with compartment door gasket, de-install, re-set and requires heat cycles usually a few to seat. (GE covers this on their website regarding FAQs on new DWs.

6. Failure to remove packing/shipping material/thin plastic film or coating on gasket contact points during shipping/etc. or door corner gaskets or other misidentified as packing materials and inadvertantly removed.

7. Failure to have drain opening knocked out, air gap clogged with debris, or drain hose loop not elevated or hose kinked.

8. Crack or issue with the spray arm or pop-up assembly.

"Some leaking around-under-from the door on dishwashers can be traced back to a split in the spray arm. If the lower spray arm develops a split in it, the spray arm can turn too fast, and shoot water directly at things that it is not suppose to spray water at....sprays water at the door vents or edges and can create water leaks."

What's the mfg DATE of the DW? Perhaps you have "old" stock. Hundreds of thousands of DWs were recalled several years ago, at least 3 major mfg's due to leaks which could cause fires.

IIRC Maytag (several over the years), frigidare, GE, Kenmore, and several others. Have you contacted the mfg?Are you advancing the cycle to pump/drain the compartment and pump before attempting to run again in wash cycle?

Assume the leaking is during the wash or pre-wash/rinse cycle is that correct?

Originally Posted by John Arnold

I just installed a dishwasher for the first time.
Fired it up, and everything was fine UNTIL...

a very slow drip develops from the right front corner a minute or two after washing noises start. This is nowhere near the water supply or drain lines. Looked with flashlight and mirror, of course, but didn't really see anything. When I stick my hand up there I feel wet insulation. I've run it about 4 times and every time it starts to drip, so I cancel the cycle.
The door seal looks fine, the door opens and closes with no problems.

Any ideas for the Clueless Wonder here?

Is it possible that the water supply or drain line is loose and water is traveling to the right front corner

Did I mention that I was running it empty?

According to the KitchenAid website, I can expect it to leak around the door seal if I run it without any dishes in the bottom rack, because the sprayer(s) will be spraying directly on the seal.

This, again, gives me pause regarding running dishwashers at home inspections. On the other hand, I've run an awful lot of them empty and they usually don't leak.

Time to load it up and try again, I reckon.

Thanks for all the replies.

DW leaking at corner. Check that the DW is level, fill water coming from corner would suggest that it is tilted low at leaking corner. Get a level and check. If the water level float is incorrect the DW will fill with excess water causing a leak. Door seal are not intended to be water tight if water in tub is to high.

[quote=Dom D'Agostino;155826]My Brother recently bought and installed a new Fridigaire D/W and it leaked as well. He wasn't too happy. Back to the store for a "new", new dishwasher. The second one worked fine.



When inspecting. I have had two dishwashers within the last two years leaking at the heating unit during an inspection. The nut securing the heating unit was cracked on both dishwashers. One on a new home and one in a home about four years old. Both of them Frigidaire. Had three Frigidaire units leaking at the soap dish all in new homes.

Hi, ALL (again) &

Have to agree with Jim R. (with all due respect to James R.); always run 'em & rarely find a LEAKER, then would 'call' such...


CHEERS !

Well, we ran it with a load of dishes yesterday for the first time, and no leaks, so I'm inclined the believe what the KitchenAid website said about running it empty.

Thanks for the responses.

Originally Posted by John Arnold

Well, we ran it with a load of dishes yesterday for the first time, and no leaks, so I'm inclined the believe what the KitchenAid website said about running it empty.

Thanks for the responses.

The Handyman's Motto - "If it's not broken, don't try to fix it". Good to hear there was a happy ending. We went without a DW in this new-to-us home for 3 years. Ain't it a joy to finally load 'er up and push the button?

Originally Posted by John Kogel

The Handyman's Motto - "If it's not broken, don't try to fix it". ...

And the corollary - "If I can't fix it, it ain't broke!"

Originally Posted by John Arnold

And the corollary - "If I can't fix it, it ain't broke!"

John,
Actually, " If you can't fix it, get a bigger hammer".

Originally Posted by John Arnold

It appears that the tube you mention is internal. Does this sound possible? I see a kind of flattened channel running up the back interior of the DW to the spray arm at the top. Can't see anything like this outside on top when I peak under the counter.

Present on some units, ex:

Upper Spray Arm Water Feed Tube, External Top View | Flickr - Photo Sharing!
Upper Spray Arm Water Feed Tube Removed | Flickr - Photo Sharing!