Results 1 to 61 of 61
  1. #1
    Paul Friesen's Avatar
    Paul Friesen Guest

    Default Do you walk on roofs?

    Hi Guys,

    Looking for your opinion and practice regarding walking on 2 story semi steep roofs. I know that we aren't supposed to risk our lives and common sense should always prevail but I do a lot of large homes with these huge tile and wood shingle roofs. Some of them I can't even get my 24' ladder to reach and they are like ice when wet. I inspect from the ground with binoculars and then the attic. (I included a couple from the last week)

    Does anyone feel comfortable walking on these types of roofs?

    Thanks,

    ***IMPORTANT*** You Need To Register To View Images ***IMPORTANT*** You Need To Register To View Images
    2018 ASHI InspectionWorld

  2. #2
    cory nystul's Avatar
    cory nystul Guest

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Wet tile can be a recipe for potential disaster. I know i am newer but i would not do it due to safety.


  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Succasunna NJ
    Posts
    574

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Walk as many roofs as you feel you can.
    Otherwise, put the ladder up and view them from the roofs edge!

    Darren www.aboutthehouseinspections.com
    'Whizzing & pasting & pooting through the day (Ronnie helping Kenny helping burn his poots away!) (FZ)

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Caledon, Ontario
    Posts
    5,005

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    I would not walk these roofs.

    Polecam?


  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Spring Hill (Nashville), TN
    Posts
    5,847

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    I would not walk any of those in the pictures.

    Scott Patterson, ACI
    Spring Hill, TN
    www.traceinspections.com

  6. #6

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    I try to walk most roofs but if they are wet or i cannot safely get on and off of them i either view them from a ladder )least favorite method due to poor visibility) or use a drone. If i can climb out on a porch roof and walk up to the main roof, this is my preferred method. I change my shoes on a drop cloth at the window. I use the valley areas when possible (i stay at least 12 inches away for the center but have on foot on each side of the valley when they exist and can still walk most roofs even those that are steep.
    For anyone walking roofs i highly recommend the Cougar-paws.
    However i do not walk slate or other brittle materials!

    Jeff Zehnder - Home Inspector, Raleigh, NC
    http://www.jjeffzehnder.com/
    http://carolinahomeinspections.com/

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Lake Barrington, IL
    Posts
    1,363

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Those are beyond what I walk on. Certainly I miss some things but that's life in the safe lane.

    Eric Barker, ACI
    Lake Barrington, IL

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Southern Vancouver Island
    Posts
    4,546

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    If tiles are cracked or broken, from people stepping on them you'll find a few from the top of the ladder. Check in the troughs for tile chunks. But I check the ridge caps anywhere I can get at them. Nails too short on the last cappers is a common thing to find.

    John Kogel, RHI, BC HI Lic #47455
    www.allsafehome.ca

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    New Mexico
    Posts
    1,258

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    # 1 and # 3 I would probably walk, but hard to know for sure. I don't think I would on # 2 unless the back was easier to get onto and off of. Looks like concrete tile shingles. I don't think I would walk on any of those roofs if it was wet. That can be a little slippy. If there are a lot of them in your area a drone would be very helpful, and would set you apart from your competition. Not to mention potentially keeping you out of the hospital.

    Jim Robinson
    New Mexico, USA

  10. #10
    Paul Friesen's Avatar
    Paul Friesen Guest

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Thanks guys, that confirms my thought as well.


  11. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Lansdale, PA
    Posts
    876

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    We have few tile roofs around here and the few that are around are from the 1920s. I do not walk tile, wood, or slate roofs. If the houses in the photos had asphalt shingles I would walk them.

    Personally, I thin a 24-foot ladder is too short. I use a 28-foot ladder, which reaches just about everything I inspect, or else I use a 17-foot Little Giant and go from lower roofs to upper roofs.


  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Spring Hill (Nashville), TN
    Posts
    5,847

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Friesen View Post
    Thanks guys, that confirms my thought as well.
    Always listen to that little inner voice and never, never feel you must put your life at risk simply because somebody else does. Life is too short and prescious as it is!

    Scott Patterson, ACI
    Spring Hill, TN
    www.traceinspections.com

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
    Posts
    26,248

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Patterson View Post
    Always listen to that little inner voice and never, never feel you must put your life at risk simply because somebody else does. Life is too short and prescious as it is!
    Been there, done that, and you really feel foolish when you realize that you may just be stuck on the roof and have to call the fire department to get you down ...

    ... because getting "down" unsafely is no where near is comfortable a feeling as getting "up" unsafely (as uncomfortable a feeling as that is). Did that a few times and I was finally able to force myself to attempt to get down - and I am here typing about it ... don't do it. Not worth it. Someone may be typing about you as "Did you hear about that inspector who fell off a roof trying to get down? Memorial services are set for ... " Could be a real bummer.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    rockport texas
    Posts
    132

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    I bought a 50' towable boom lift for houses like those. I have a lot of tile and metal roofs in my area and was never comfortable inspecting them with binoculars or from the eves. I got the lift in Aug. and have used it on 50% of my inspections. It's not for everyone but when I use it I feel that I am doing a better inspection and safer. Clients love it.


  15. #15
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Orlando, FL
    Posts
    1,340

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by stanley frost View Post
    I bought a 50' towable boom lift for houses like those.
    Well don't keep it a secret, share some photos of you and the lift in action....


  16. #16
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Caledon, Ontario
    Posts
    5,005

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    New or used and what was the cost for something like that?

    I have known inspectors who have rented units and had them delivered to the site.


  17. #17
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Southern Vancouver Island
    Posts
    4,546

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Towable Lift | eBay

    That'll be a good tax writeoff, Raymond.

    John Kogel, RHI, BC HI Lic #47455
    www.allsafehome.ca

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Caledon, Ontario
    Posts
    5,005

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Thanks John. I think if I bought one I would look for a good used one.
    Now if an inspection is to take place in winter, I would need a flame thrower to clear the snow on the roof.


  19. #19
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    rockport texas
    Posts
    132

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    I bought the lift new. The problem with the used lifts was they didn't have the traction drive which allows you to drive the lift under it's own power to position it where you need it. I wouldn't get one without it. $43,000 and yes it will be a good tax write off. The pictures I have are high resolution and takes for ever to download, I'll try to get some today at the inspection I'm using it on and post later. Every inspector I show it to has the same reaction, to much over the top, then a few days later they call to get info on where to get one , how much it cost, etc. etc.


  20. #20
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Bennett (Denver metro), Colorado
    Posts
    1,394

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by stanley frost View Post
    I bought the lift new. The problem with the used lifts was they didn't have the traction drive which allows you to drive the lift under it's own power to position it where you need it. I wouldn't get one without it. $43,000 and yes it will be a good tax write off. The pictures I have are high resolution and takes for ever to download, I'll try to get some today at the inspection I'm using it on and post later. Every inspector I show it to has the same reaction, to much over the top, then a few days later they call to get info on where to get one , how much it cost, etc. etc.
    Holy shmoly! I don't need a $43K writeoff......
    I admire you for going the extra yard, and maybe if I inspected a lot of difficult to access roofs, I might do something similar, but a pair of Cougar Paws is a lot cheaper and I have a 40' ladder if really need one.

    If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Spring City/Surrounding Philadelphia area
    Posts
    3,473

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Depends on the roof covering material. If all three of the roofs in those pics above were asphalt shingles, I wouldn't hesitate to walk any of them. Wet wood shingles, no. Clay tiles, no. I have walked some slate roofs but most of what we see around here are asphalt shingles.

    Like was said earlier, walk whatever roofs you feel comfortable walking.

    "It takes a big man to cry. It takes an even bigger man to laugh at that man". - Jack Handey

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Bennett (Denver metro), Colorado
    Posts
    1,394

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    As I think about it now, how well can you survey a large roof with that lift. Do you look on all sides of dormas, backs of chimneys, backs of roofs, all rakes, etc.? Do you have to reposition the lift? And how long does it take to inspect a typical roof with that lift from unhooking it from the hitch to back on the hitch?

    If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.

  23. #23
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Washington State
    Posts
    358

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by stanley frost View Post
    I bought the lift new. The problem with the used lifts was they didn't have the traction drive which allows you to drive the lift under it's own power to position it where you need it. I wouldn't get one without it. $43,000 and yes it will be a good tax write off. The pictures I have are high resolution and takes for ever to download, I'll try to get some today at the inspection I'm using it on and post later. Every inspector I show it to has the same reaction, to much over the top, then a few days later they call to get info on where to get one , how much it cost, etc. etc.
    - I'll stick with my $150 Werner and $40 binoculars - unless of course I went into the Christmas Light Stringin' Business in a well to do neighborhood.


  24. #24
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Spring City/Surrounding Philadelphia area
    Posts
    3,473

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Each area is different but around here, if I don't walk roofs and inspect with binoculars, I'm not going to get much repeat business and I'll get calls about things I missed.

    "It takes a big man to cry. It takes an even bigger man to laugh at that man". - Jack Handey

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Spring Hill (Nashville), TN
    Posts
    5,847

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Lifts are nice, I have used them on commercial and a couple residential EIFS and water intrusion inspections numerous times over the years. I require the client to rent the boom lift with an operator for it. I actually supply the operator and bill for their time accordingly. They have it on site when I arrive and have it picked up when I'm gone... They typically rent for around $400 to $600 a day with delivery and pick-up.

    The problem I see by using such a tool or piece of equipment for a normal inspection is that it is going to increase the inspection time by almost double, simply by the time that will be spent setting it up and moving it around. The next problem is that you have now shown that you have a special piece of equipment and if you do not see something you have opened yourself up more so than if you just used binoculars. If the lift allows you to access areas that you normally could not see then the excuse of the inspection being only visual is going to be tossed out the door.

    Ladder, binoculars and a camera is all an inspector needs for basic home inspections.

    Scott Patterson, ACI
    Spring Hill, TN
    www.traceinspections.com

  26. #26
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
    Posts
    26,248

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Patterson View Post
    The next problem is that you have now shown that you have a special piece of equipment and if you do not see something you have opened yourself up more so than if you just used binoculars. If the lift allows you to access areas that you normally could not see then the excuse of the inspection being only visual is going to be tossed out the door.
    I completely disagree with "the excuse of the inspection being only visual is going to be tossed out the door" as the lift is only providing "access", nothing else, it is still up to the inspector to "see" (visual) what is there to be seen.

    What you say could be applied to putting on a suit to enter a crawlspace - it is now beyond a visual inspection in the same sense.

    Of course, though, home inspections are not, and have not been, "visual" inspections for decades not.

    The "visual" inspection went out when inspectors started carrying tissue paper to check for wet walls, screw drivers to remove access panel covers, thermometers, etc.

    All that lift is ... is a fancy ladder - the rest is up to the inspector.

    Instead of towing around a towable lift, I would use a large bucket truck with the same reach, that way there is only one vehicle to worry about ... sure, that one vehicle takes up the whole street, but you can set traffic cones out for that.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  27. #27
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Lansdale, PA
    Posts
    876

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    An inspector in my area has a lift. A Realtor told my one seller was upset with him because it sunk into the ground.

    I think its a lot of money to spend to avoid using a ladder. Inspecting roofs is part of the job. If an inspector only inspects from the ground, maybe this is not the right business for them.


  28. #28
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Caledon, Ontario
    Posts
    5,005

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Well Mark, I have for many, many years been inspecting roofs from the ground and only go where my 10' folding ladder takes me. Recently I made my own pole cam. I have never had a problem or complaint.

    According to you I should not be in the business which is pure nonsense.


  29. #29
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    rockport texas
    Posts
    132

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Lon
    it does add time to the inspection but not that much. The reason I went with the 50' is that I can get up over the roof and see everything. Sometimes I do have to reposition the lift but I get a much better view than from the ground with binoculars. I don't keep track of how long it takes, it is what it is, having the traction assist makes it very easy to move around. I think a lot of the objections I'm hearing are the same objections I heard about infrared cameras when they were first started being used in the inspection industry. It will be interesting to see how many inspectors have a lift in 5 years.


  30. #30
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Bennett (Denver metro), Colorado
    Posts
    1,394

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by stanley frost View Post
    It will be interesting to see how many inspectors have a lift in 5 years.
    My guess is very few. It's one thing to buy an IR camera for a few grand and a whole 'nuther thing to drop $10-45K for a tool that you only need 5% of the time.

    My Little Giant is 15' extended. I often pull it up to position it on a lower roof section to access the upper roof as I'm sure most of you guys do. Maybe my market is very different than yours, but I see few houses that I can't reach the roof.

    I've found binoculars to be inadequate and I have an $800 binocular. I tried my spotting scope and had a similar issue. The problem is angle. Too often you need to be perpendicular to the shingles, particularly composition, to see their condition. And to do that, you need to be directly over them. I've found that tile roofs are fairly easy to see from the ground, but the other issue, is that you simply can't always see the entire roof from the ground. In another thread, we discussed walking/crawling/crab walking on tile roofs, but I've found that tile roofs are fairly easy to see from the ground or the eave off a ladder.

    If I'm wrong about inspectors utilizing lifts in the future, then I'll revisit the math on them, but right now, I simply don't have enough need for one to justify the cost. Denver is a big city and there may be an inspector here that uses one, but this is the first time that I've ever heard of it.

    If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.

  31. #31
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Windsor Ontario
    Posts
    363

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    My POV - safety. Look into mandatory safety requirements. Even as a home inspector (worker) your state or province may have occupational health and safety requirements that could impact you.

    As an example in Ontario (Canada) - workers are required to be tied off (adequately supported) and have slip and fall training for any roof over 3 metres.

    Sample guidelines - http://www.uottawa.ca/services/ehss/...elines2011.pdf

    How many homes or properties provide for such safe access to inspect a roof?


  32. #32
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
    Posts
    26,248

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Claude Lawrenson View Post
    My POV - safety. Look into mandatory safety requirements. Even as a home inspector (worker) your state or province may have occupational health and safety requirements that could impact you.

    As an example in Ontario (Canada) - workers are required to be tied off (adequately supported) and have slip and fall training for any roof over 3 metres.

    Sample guidelines - http://www.uottawa.ca/services/ehss/...elines2011.pdf

    How many homes or properties provide for such safe access to inspect a roof?
    "Inspectors" are generally excluded from tie-off requirements.

    The reason is that "workers" are on the roof (or other places) for longer periods of time than "inspectors" are, and "workers" are more sidetracked into paying attention to their work than their location while "inspectors" are more aware of their location while looking at the the work - completely different mind set and concentration aspect.

    I skimmed through your linked document and it keeps referring to "worker" - I didn't see any definitions in there. Here in the states, with OSHA, "workers" are covered while "inspectors" are exempt.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  33. #33
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Lansdale, PA
    Posts
    876

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Raymond Wand View Post
    Well Mark, I have for many, many years been inspecting roofs from the ground and only go where my 10' folding ladder takes me. Recently I made my own pole cam. I have never had a problem or complaint.

    According to you I should not be in the business which is pure nonsense.
    I suspect that because your clients realize the limitations of your inspection (and I assume there are disclaimers) you may not get complaints. However, there is no way that you are doing a proper inspection of roofs or chimneys from the ground.


  34. #34
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Caledon, Ontario
    Posts
    5,005

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    That may be true, but your statement that one should not be in the business is absolute rubbish, just because they don't walk a roof. All roofs are not walkable and thus there will always be limitations of which an astute client will understand.


  35. #35
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Bennett (Denver metro), Colorado
    Posts
    1,394

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Raymond Wand View Post
    That may be true, but your statement that one should not be in the business is absolute rubbish, just because they don't walk a roof. All roofs are not walkable and thus there will always be limitations of which an astute client will understand.
    Mark's original statement was about HIs who only view roofs from the ground, and I agree with his statement. I'm constantly amazed by the things that I hear some inspectors say they don't inspect, but roofs are one of the major components of a house and require our best efforts to inspect. A 16' Little Giant is a reasonable ladder for all inspectors to carry and walking a composition roof up to a 6/12 pitch is reasonable, in my estimation. I walk 8/12s but even in my old age, I've remain fairly nimble. I know some of you guys walk/crawl any roof, but as we often say, you have to know your limitations. But if you draw the line in front of walking a pitched roof, then get ready to pony up the big bucks for one of those lifts or maybe link up with a roofer.

    If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.

  36. #36
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
    Posts
    26,248

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    I think being lowered from a helicopter and being able to inspect everything, even look down tall chimneys is the way of the future.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  37. #37
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Caledon, Ontario
    Posts
    5,005

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Good for you Lon. I know my limitations. I can state that in 23 years of inspecting I have not had one complaint about a problem with a roof that I did not walk. So I guess you can make blanket statements like Mark, but I have not ponied up any monies, another blanket statement.

    Again to reiterate I only go where my 10 ladder takes me. I could argue that your 16' ladder is going to get you in trouble because it has limitations too, so I guess you shouldn't be in the biz either.


  38. #38
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Spring Hill (Nashville), TN
    Posts
    5,847

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Raymond Wand View Post
    Good for you Lon. I know my limitations. I can state that in 23 years of inspecting I have not had one complaint about a problem with a roof that I did not walk. So I guess you can make blanket statements like Mark, but I have not ponied up any monies, another blanket statement.

    Again to reiterate I only go where my 10 ladder takes me. I could argue that your 16' ladder is going to get you in trouble because it has limitations too, so I guess you shouldn't be in the biz either.
    The advantage of a few extra feet on a ladder are many but the largest advantage is that with most single floor homes a LG 17 will allow the ladder to stick a couple of feet above the roof line. This just adds a little more safety aspect to getting on and off the roof when you have the top of the ladder to grab hold of.

    Scott Patterson, ACI
    Spring Hill, TN
    www.traceinspections.com

  39. #39
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
    Posts
    26,248

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Patterson View Post
    The advantage of a few extra feet on a ladder are many but the largest advantage is that with most single floor homes a LG 17 will allow the ladder to stick a couple of feet above the roof line. This just adds a little more safety aspect to getting on and off the roof when you have the top of the ladder to grab hold of.
    Depends - I had many roofs on single story homes where the 17 foot Little Giant would just miss the fascia and go under the soffit.

    Thus the reason I carried a 26 foot Little Giant too.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  40. #40
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    FL, TX
    Posts
    137

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Having been a roofer in a previous life and worked 12 pitch roofs back then…walking cat walks and working without harness, one 12 pitch was even on the edge of a cliff!

    1. Concrete and spanish tile is brittle in my opinion, try and inspect without walking on brittle materials. Repair is more than your fee. You can see the broken tiles easily (most of the time) from other workers on those roofs, you can't see underlayment from the roof. When the underlayment fails the roof fails. You really dont want to find that "soft sheathing" by walking it anyway, you may wind up with your feet in the living room (I did once).
    2. Don't walk an icy/slippery roof without safety harness properly tied off, ever. I dont care if you are an inspector or a "worker".
    3. up to a 7 pitch if you are in shape and move easily, comp shingle roofs and metal shingle with heavy texture like imbedded sand in the finish can be readily walked even when wet (not icy).
    4. Go up and check how much friction there is and if the roof "feels safe", then decide.
    5. Make sure your ladder has one step at least above the eaves or at least 24 inches of ladder above eaves
    5. if in doubt, there is no doubt. Don't go on the roof. Your heart beat is telling you the truth.

    In the old days I remember standing on the edge of the eaves of a three story apartment with a 6 pitch and no harness..pulling up supplies and materials by rope. I could even lean over the eaves anytime I wanted to while standing up. Heart beat normal, no fear, not an issue. I could still do that, but today I am just wiser.


  41. #41
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Bennett (Denver metro), Colorado
    Posts
    1,394

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    For any newbie reading this thread, while we're discussing limitations......stay off Woodruff and Permatek roofs. The only ride on a roof I ever took was on a Woodruff. Fortunately, there aren't too many left, but I still see two a year. And about composition; if you reach the eave and find the aggregate is very loose, walking can be like treading on little ball bearings. Write it up as older shingles at the end of their useful life and move on with your inspection......on the ground.

    And when we talk about what we used to do when we were younger........the list is long. I have walked a top plate 30' off the ground carrying 4X8 sheathing in a wind and never thinking twice about it.

    If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.

  42. #42
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Plano, Texas
    Posts
    4,170

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    Depends - I had many roofs on single story homes where the 17 foot Little Giant would just miss the fascia and go under the soffit.

    Thus the reason I carried a 26 foot Little Giant too.
    I always do a little recon on Bing or Zillow and decide at home the day before as to which ladder I will need. The big one stays at home 90% of the time.

    Jim Luttrall
    www.MrInspector.net
    Plano, Texas

  43. #43
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    Alberta
    Posts
    9

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    I think being lowered from a helicopter and being able to inspect everything, even look down tall chimneys is the way of the future.
    Nah, the future is drones with high resolution cameras.

    Phantom 2 Vision - Your Flying Camera, Quadcopter Drone


  44. #44
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Western Montana
    Posts
    261

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Jerry is right, getting up is easy, it is that first step getting down that is the most dangerous.
    - I hate walking on wood shake roofs, but do it on occasion
    - I hate walking on metal roofing because of the invisible oxidation, but do it on occasion.
    - I carry a ladder that makes it hard to get up on a 2nd story roof, FOR a reason
    - try to at least get up and inspect it from the edge of the roof - at least I can touch the material
    - get a good camera with a GREAT zoom lens so you can inspect from the ground (Canon)

    **Best idea**. I hear one inspector in California is using a remote control drone with a camera so he can inspect all his roofs from the air. A friend of mind recently bought a fairly expensive drone for aerial surveys and has offered to rent it to me for roof inspections. Good idea. Dollar for dollar, sounds more useful than a thermal imaging camera.


  45. #45
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
    Posts
    26,248

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Powlesland View Post
    Nah, the future is drones with high resolution cameras.

    Phantom 2 Vision - Your Flying Camera, Quadcopter Drone
    Nah, using a drone and marketing it will never surpass that helicopter up there hovering over the roof with "ABC-XYZ HOME INSPECTIONS" on the side of it ...

    ***IMPORTANT*** You Need To Register To View Images ***IMPORTANT*** You Need To Register To View Images
    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  46. #46

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Jerry, I love that bird! I could see hanging out the door and lighting things up and .........

    Seriously, if you are following your standard of practice to perform the inspection then you should feel comfortable recommending further evaluation if you think it's warranted.

    You may remember that OSHA rules require restraints for accessing roofs. The physics of the situation don't differentiate between owners and employees even if the rules do.

    Gravity will get you down!


  47. #47
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Lansdale, PA
    Posts
    876

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Marshall Brown View Post
    Jerry, I love that bird! I could see hanging out the door and lighting things up and .........

    Seriously, if you are following your standard of practice to perform the inspection then you should feel comfortable recommending further evaluation if you think it's warranted.

    You may remember that OSHA rules require restraints for accessing roofs. The physics of the situation don't differentiate between owners and employees even if the rules do.

    Gravity will get you down!
    Please quote that OSHA rule, because I have read the rules a number of times and found nothing requiring restraints for inspecting roofs.


  48. #48
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
    Posts
    26,248

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Reinmiller View Post
    Please quote that OSHA rule, because I have read the rules a number of times and found nothing requiring restraints for inspecting roofs.
    There are OSHA rules for fall restraints when one is above 6 feet higher than the surface below ... and most roofs are higher than that.

    Inspectors, however, are exempt from the requirement for wearing fall protection.

    OSHA is serious about fall protection and used to exempt residential roofs, no longer are residential roof exempted, and the first fine is (as best I recall) something like $7,500 per person on the roof without fall protection, the second fine is (as I recall) 3 times that ... consider that a residential roofer likely has 3-5 workers on the roof, that is $22,500 to $37,500 - the first offence.

    I know a couple of roofers who got hit with those fines, one was for a second offense - that roofer went out of business as a result of the fines as he had 12 workers on the roof when he was caught.

    - - - Updated - - -

    https://www.osha.gov/pls/oshaweb/owadisp.show_document?p_table=DIRECTIVES&p_id=4755

    https://www.osha.gov/doc/topics/residentialprotection/index.html

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  49. #49
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Spring Hill (Nashville), TN
    Posts
    5,847

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    You could not see this from the ground. This is why it is important to get on the roof if you can.

    It was leaking into a faux beam along a cathedral ceiling. The wood was stained dark so nothing was visible from the inside. However my thermal camera did show an anomaly.

    ***IMPORTANT*** You Need To Register To View Images ***IMPORTANT*** You Need To Register To View Images
    Scott Patterson, ACI
    Spring Hill, TN
    www.traceinspections.com

  50. #50
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    2,777

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    ..............
    Inspectors, however, are exempt from the requirement for wearing fall protection.
    ....
    Jerry, Where does it say that Inspectors are "exempt" ? Granted the rules are directed to construction and construction is described and defined. Would it not be better to say that Inspectors work are not defined within the OSHA reg. and therefore not covered???


  51. #51
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
    Posts
    26,248

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Garry Sorrells View Post
    Jerry, Where does it say that Inspectors are "exempt" ? Granted the rules are directed to construction and construction is described and defined. Would it not be better to say that Inspectors work are not defined within the OSHA reg. and therefore not covered???
    I will have to look for where it says inspectors are exempt - every OSHA inspector I've talked with has told me that inspectors are exempt, even the two OSHA inspectors who said that inspectors were not ... then made a special trip back to the projects a few days later to say that I was correct - inspectors are exempt.

    I took their word for (hey, it was to my benefit to take their word for it ).

    https://www.osha.gov/pls/oshaweb/owa...ONS&p_id=27314

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  52. #52
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Bennett (Denver metro), Colorado
    Posts
    1,394

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Every builder around here insists that I stay off the roof. If one is rude about it, I'll ask him what he's hiding up there.....they are never amused.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Patterson View Post
    You could not see this from the ground. This is why it is important to get on the roof if you can.

    It was leaking into a faux beam along a cathedral ceiling. The wood was stained dark so nothing was visible from the inside. However my thermal camera did show an anomaly.
    Just curious. Do you have the thermal image to post?

    If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.

  53. #53
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Spring Hill (Nashville), TN
    Posts
    5,847

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lon Henderson View Post
    Every builder around here insists that I stay off the roof. If one is rude about it, I'll ask him what he's hiding up there.....they are never amused.

    - - - Updated - - -


    Just curious. Do you have the thermal image to post?
    Maybe, think I captured a picture... I'll need to get it off the cameras SD card and it's in the truck and it is 27f outside and I'm in my PJ's with a nice warm cat sitting across my lap! In other words, not to night... I'll try to post it this week end.

    Scott Patterson, ACI
    Spring Hill, TN
    www.traceinspections.com

  54. #54
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Lansdale, PA
    Posts
    876

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    OSHA keeps changing regulations and they are subject to interpretation. Over the years I have looked this up after numerous inspectors have said that OSHA requires far protection. None of the inspectors has ever quoted where the requirement is in the standards relating to inspectors. Below is part of the fall protection standards that I looked up today.

    Paragraph (a)(1), which is essentially the same as proposed Sec. 1926.500(a)(1), also states that the provisions of subpart M do not apply when the employer establishes that employees are only inspecting, investigating, or assessing workplace conditions prior to the actual start of the work or after work has been completed. OSHA has set this exception because employees engaged in inspecting, investigating and assessing workplace conditions before the actual work begins or after work has been completed are exposed to fall hazards for very short durations, if at all, since they most likely would be able to accomplish their work without going near the danger zone. Also, the Agency's experience is that such individuals who are not continually or routinely exposed to fall hazards tend to be very focused on their footing, ever alert and aware of the hazards associated with falling. These practical considerations would make it unreasonable, the Agency believes, to require the installation of fall protection systems either prior to the start of construction work or after such work has been completed. Such requirements would impose an unreasonable burden on employers without demonstrable benefits.


  55. #55
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
    Posts
    26,248

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Reinmiller View Post
    OSHA keeps changing regulations and they are subject to interpretation. Over the years I have looked this up after numerous inspectors have said that OSHA requires far protection. None of the inspectors has ever quoted where the requirement is in the standards relating to inspectors. Below is part of the fall protection standards that I looked up today.
    Mark,

    Did you go to the document with the link I provided? Provides some good information on inspectors, fall protection, when required, and when not required.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  56. #56
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Lansdale, PA
    Posts
    876

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Peck View Post
    Mark,

    Did you go to the document with the link I provided? Provides some good information on inspectors, fall protection, when required, and when not required.
    Jerry, No. I Googled OSHA fall protection rules and exemptions.


  57. #57
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
    Posts
    26,248

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Reinmiller View Post
    Jerry, No. I Googled OSHA fall protection rules and exemptions.
    What I noticed in the link I posted was that inspectors are not completely exempt of using fall protection, there are some restrictions (which I did not know about, but which make sense).

    Such as fall protection is not required before work starts, or after work is finished, but is required for inspections while work is in progress - never knew that and I've done a ton of inspections while work was in progress without using fall protection. I'm glad this topic came up because now I know when fall protection is required for inspectors (after roof sheathing installed - not required; after dry-in installed - not required; after roof covering installed - not required; during dry-in installation - required; during roof covering installation - required; etc.).

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  58. #58

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Reinmiller View Post
    Please quote that OSHA rule, because I have read the rules a number of times and found nothing requiring restraints for inspecting roofs.
    Sorry if I wasn't clear, OSHA has rules for employees working in elevated places. The catch is apparently the rules don't require you as an individual to wear restraints.

    What I was attempting to point out, obviously not too well, is that gravity doesn't care if you are an employee, employer, or individual it will still get you down. Don't depend on this exemption to protect you, the laws of physics will overrule it.

    Safety first!


  59. #59
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ormond Beach, Florida
    Posts
    26,248

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Marshall Brown View Post
    Sorry if I wasn't clear, OSHA has rules for employees working in elevated places. The catch is apparently the rules don't require you as an individual to wear restraints.
    Most everyone is an employee of some company, even their own company.

    What I was attempting to point out, obviously not too well, is that gravity doesn't care if you are an employee, employer, or individual it will still get you down. Don't depend on this exemption to protect you, the laws of physics will overrule it.

    Safety first!
    I agree, but consider the risk of wearing fall protection too - when you are wearing fall protection and you fall, you are hanging there ... quite possibly with no one else around ... and hanging there more than a few minutes can lead to the loss of blood flow, and within 30 minutes - death could be the final result.

    https://www.osha.gov/dts/shib/shib032404.html
    - "Prolonged suspension from fall arrest systems can cause orthostatic intolerance, which, in turn, can result in serious physical injury, or potentially, death. Research indicates that suspension in a fall arrest device can result in unconsciousness, followed by death, in less than 30 minutes [4]."

    A couple of years ago a worker at one of the amusement parks in Orlando was working from a great height, proper harness, properly adjusted (most wear the harness loose and that can be a killer right there), and he fell from where he was working, about 60 feet up as I recall.

    Took the rescue people 45 minutes to get a high lift over there and get him down - he had been dead about 15 minutes by the time they got to him.

    So, for an individual working by themselves, one must consider whether the fall or the fall protection is the greater risk. Just food for thought.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  60. #60
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    so so, California
    Posts
    1,769

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    We walk on roofs and the ones we cant we use a drone.

    The MAZZA INSPECTION GROUP
    www.mazzainspections.com
    Level III Thermo-picture-taker-er...er

  61. #61
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Lansdale, PA
    Posts
    876

    Default Re: Do you walk on roofs?

    The photos below are some good reasons to walk on roofs, and none of the photos are roof issues.

    PC164725 (512x341).jpgPC164727 (512x341).jpgPC164740 (512x341).jpgPC164718 (512x341).jpgPC164720 (512x341).jpg


Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •