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  1. #1
    Peter B's Avatar
    Peter B Guest

    Default Joist inside foundation? how to anchor sill.

    What type of foundation they used pre1964? The joist is buried 4" deep into an 8" thick concrete foundation. The question I have is how do you anchor the sill plates to brace the wall if the sill is above the joist? Appreciate any inputs.

    Thanks
    Peter

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  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
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    Charlotte NC
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    2,303

    Default Re: Joist inside foundation? how to anchor sill.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter B View Post
    What type of foundation they used pre1964? The joist is buried 4" deep into an 8" thick concrete foundation. The question I have is how do you anchor the sill plates to brace the wall if the sill is above the joist? Appreciate any inputs.

    Thanks
    Peter
    Anchors were not required in my part of NC prior to Hurricane Hugo in 1989. Many of the homes I inspect do not have anchor bolts or straps. You will need to check what was required in your area for the time period.

    The beatings will continue until morale has improved. mgt.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Orlando, FL
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    1,340

    Default Re: Joist inside foundation? how to anchor sill.

    Simpson StrongTie makes a retrofit strap or foundation strap for virtually any application.


  4. #4
    Peter B's Avatar
    Peter B Guest

    Default Re: Joist inside foundation? how to anchor sill.

    Dom, Vern

    Thank your for replying. The puzzle I have is, on the photo I uploaded the floor joist is higher than the foundation by about 2inches. Foundation is 8" thick concrete with a cavity of 4" where the joist sits. It seems that the sill plate is floating above the foundation? What type of foundation this house have? and also do you think I can use Simpson Titen HD Anchor to Retrofit this house?

    Thanks again
    Peter


  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
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    Southern Vancouver Island
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    4,549

    Default Re: Joist inside foundation? how to anchor sill.

    There is usually a rim joist, band joist, may have other names, nailed across the ends of the joists. The joists are cut so that this rim joist is flush with the outer wall above. The sill plate for the wall is spiked to that after the subfloor is laid. If the rim joist is missing, can you see the exposed ends of the joists from the ouside? Blocking needs to be installed between the joists to keep them from rotating. Then the blocking gives you something to nail to, although you want to hit joists where ever possible.

    Blocking will also fill the 2" gap which is pretty inviting for rodents.

    John Kogel, RHI, BC HI Lic #47455
    www.allsafehome.ca

  6. #6
    chris mcintyre's Avatar
    chris mcintyre Guest

    Default Re: Joist inside foundation? how to anchor sill.

    Is the steel 'bracket' around the joist original, and how is it attached?

    Is the concrete in direct contact with the untreated lumber?

    Do you have anymore pictures?


  7. #7
    Peter B's Avatar
    Peter B Guest

    Default Re: Joist inside foundation? how to anchor sill.

    John,

    I did not see any rim attaching the joist. It appears (without removing the outer sheathing and siding) that the joist is only 4inches inside the 8" foundation. The top portion of the foundation looks like an L shape form where the sill sits on top ( not sure due to limited access to it).

    Chris,

    The black stuff between the joist and foundation is felt paper and is the only thing separating the joist to the concrete.

    Here are more photos and some assumption sketch.

    Thanks again guys.
    Peter

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  8. #8
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    ventura, ca
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    63

    Cool Re: Joist inside foundation? how to anchor sill.

    From what can be seen - the sole plate for this system is on top of the
    sub floor sheeting - and may have anchor bolts which you cannot see.

    This system presents a whole list of short comings.
    I have a section of my service area where this type of flooring exists.

    Concerns.
    1. Are there cross vents - are they below grade.
    2. Is the exterior grade - at the same level as the top of concrete stem wall.
    3. Are the ends of the pocket beams showing any moisture deterioration.
    4. Any obvious deflection of beams.
    5. Any improper notching of beams.
    6. Is interior floor bouncy.
    7. beams do not look like treated lumber.
    8. Are beams/joist or what ever you want to call them - over spanned by
    today's standards.

    mf.

    Matt Faust
    Real Estate Inspector

  9. #9
    Peter B's Avatar
    Peter B Guest

    Default Re: Joist inside foundation? how to anchor sill.

    Concerns.
    1. NO
    2. No, its about 8" above grade
    3. some water marks
    4. No
    5. what is notching?
    6. subfloor is 1 1/2" x 8" plank
    7. No treated lumber.
    8. 2 piers between 22" span.

    If sill needed an anchor, can simpson wedge anchor do the job?


  10. #10
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    ventura, ca
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    63

    Default Re: Joist inside foundation? how to anchor sill.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter B View Post
    Concerns.
    1. NO - I hope there is ventilation.
    2. No, its about 8" above grade - That's good.
    3. some water marks
    4. No
    5. what is notching? - Cutting into the beams/joist
    6. subfloor is 1 1/2" x 8" plank - That's ok for the time of construction.
    7. No treated lumber. - Not good - but may have been applicable at the time of construction.
    8. 2 piers between 22" span.- Same as 7 above.

    If sill needed an anchor, can simpson wedge anchor do the job?
    ?

    It sounds to me like there is a wood sill - then a subfloor - then the wall.
    If that is the case - there are probably anchor bolts - in the sill - under the sub
    flooring - that you can't verify.

    I would Describe it and Defer it.
    Discover - Describe - Defer.

    None of the framing seen in these photos is allowable today.

    mf

    Matt Faust
    Real Estate Inspector

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