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Thread: End bearing

  1. #1
    mathew stouffer's Avatar
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    Default End bearing

    This is a sfh built in 1993. The three 2x12 joists are nailed together , supported by the 4x4 columns resting on spot footings. There is a 2 inch overhang along the load points. The overhang is resting on a clip, is this acceptable. There is also a joint in several of the joists at the load point with inadequate end bearing. If the joists are nailed together does this limit the need for the 1.5 inches of bearing.

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  2. #2
    Garry Blankenship's Avatar
    Garry Blankenship Guest

    Default Re: End bearing

    Maybe someone here can give you a definitive answer. Since that beam is custom built / a one of, it may take a structural eng to give you a technical yes or no. Seems that 4x6 or 6x6 posts would have eliminated the guess work.


  3. #3
    mathew stouffer's Avatar
    mathew stouffer Guest

    Default Re: End bearing

    That would be way to easy and or simple.


  4. #4
    Join Date
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    Default Re: End bearing

    It isn't likely to cause any major problems, unless the footing is crappy. How about if they add a 2X4 up the side of that post? Tell them I said so.

    John Kogel, RHI, BC HI Lic #47455
    www.allsafehome.ca

  5. #5
    Darrel Hood's Avatar
    Darrel Hood Guest

    Default Re: End bearing

    The beam should be supported across its full width. Nuff said.


  6. #6
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    Thumbs down Re: End bearing

    Not 'nuff said - NG beam - bad nailing pattern were present, non-existant elsewhere, improper repair.

    That post cap bracket is USELESS as it has been installed.

    The pre-formed Beam flanges have been inappropriately opened and then re-bent in the field above the fastener holes which are not filled, and cannot be correctly filled and the center fastener hole has been filled into splice too close to end center of incorrectly made beam with failed lumber.

    It is unacceptable quack work repair, beyond prescriptive use of materials, definately not an engineered solution, and is essentially useless as the BCS has NO integrity to function in any reliable capacity.

    Unbent (un broken) flat stock would have had more strength - now we have the added burden of incorrectly formed stock with fatigue stress from prior forming and field bent at weak point. Provides no restraint, fails regarding connection method.

    There is a reason that a BC type bracket is not to be used upside down, made to be used in its correct post to beam orientation and you won't find one for a larger lateral (beam) width (W1) than a supporting post (W2)The made-in place beam (sistering pounded in-failed) selection, split, and neither engineered nor prescribed nailing pattern.

    The beam flanges pictured have lost any prescribed integrity - no connection other than a single fastener into a seam end, metal fatigue and insufficent height of the flange (H1).

    The older ply I-joist system has been compromised with a non-engineered non-prescribed system correction under point load. Not squashed flanges nor proper header-off above nor hangers. Difficult to tell if that's fire/char damage or water damage above floor left second inserted pic, suspect water/rot and floor system failure.

    Entirety gets an F. Suspect DIYer or Plumber/bathroom (toilet, shower, or bath longterm leak) remodel/repair no plan, no permit

    Requires calculated, designed, engineered, stamped correction plan, which includes procedure-plan for providing interim support without further compromises floor truss system under load during same.

    BC-BCS Post Caps





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  7. #7
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    Default Re: End bearing

    Mathew,

    After 19 years and no visible problems I wouldn't make a big issue of it, just note what you see and move on.

    Randy Mayo, P.E.
    Residential Engineering & Inspection Services
    http://www.rlmengineers.com

  8. #8
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    Default Re: End bearing

    Quote Originally Posted by Randy Mayo View Post
    Mathew,

    After 19 years and no visible problems I wouldn't make a big issue of it, just note what you see and move on.
    Randy,

    It's wrong and you wouldn't make a big issue of it ... would you make an issue of it (i.e., write it up in your report)?

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  9. #9
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    Default Re: End bearing

    Jerry,

    All houses have defects some big, some small, some visible and some hidden. These defects can be further broken down into cosmetic, structural, non-structural, safety concerns both immediate (exposed live wire) and long term (radon). I take into account the age and overall condition of the house when deciding how high to elevate an issue. In this example if the house was new under construction, I would call out the support issue. If this house was 60 years old with no visible issues associated with this support, I may not even mention it in the report.
    If there was a 1-inch steel plate between the 4x4 post and the beam would you say anything? What about the 4x4 post is it sized correctly for the load? Is the pier spacing correct for the beam size and loading? Is the nailing pattern in the laminated beam correct? You can nitpick a house to death and become one of the 1-percent club running around saying the sky is falling or you can use common since, good judgement tempered with years of experience to make the right decision.

    Randy Mayo, P.E.
    Residential Engineering & Inspection Services
    http://www.rlmengineers.com

  10. #10
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    Default Re: End bearing

    Quote Originally Posted by Randy Mayo View Post
    Jerry,

    All houses have defects some big, some small, some visible and some hidden. These defects can be further broken down into cosmetic, structural, non-structural, safety concerns both immediate (exposed live wire) and long term (radon). I take into account the age and overall condition of the house when deciding how high to elevate an issue. In this example if the house was new under construction, I would call out the support issue. If this house was 60 years old with no visible issues associated with this support, I may not even mention it in the report.
    If there was a 1-inch steel plate between the 4x4 post and the beam would you say anything? What about the 4x4 post is it sized correctly for the load? Is the pier spacing correct for the beam size and loading? Is the nailing pattern in the laminated beam correct? You can nitpick a house to death and become one of the 1-percent club running around saying the sky is falling or you can use common since, good judgement tempered with years of experience to make the right decision.
    There is also good judgement in calling it out.

    Besides, you have a special ability to sign it off as being okay: Randy Mayo, P.E ... you have P.E. behind your name.

    Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
    Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
    www.AskCodeMan.com

  11. #11
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    Default Re: End bearing

    It is tremendously obvious this condition is not original construction.


  12. #12
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    Default Re: End bearing

    Randy,

    I gotta say that is the most refreshing to the point post I have read in a long time.

    I like the way you think.

    Thank you, thank you, thank you.


  13. #13
    Darrel Hood's Avatar
    Darrel Hood Guest

    Default Re: End bearing

    H.G.,
    Like I said, nuff said. All that other stuff in your rant may be correct, but it was of no value to a layman client.


  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
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    Marietta, Georgia
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    Default Re: End bearing

    As I tell all my clients when they ask me about something akin to this, I say: ''The leaning tower of Pisa has not fallen over.....yet. It is clearly out-of-plumb but stable and was only because of intervention that it has not fallen over''. If it is wrong, fix it, regardless of how long it has been wrong. Wrong is wrong. And if you don't mention it in your report..someday you may be called to task on it. I, like all of you I am sure, do not want to ever get that late night call saying,\: Hey, this is Bob, remember that house you inspected for me, well....


  15. #15
    Join Date
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    Hercules, CA
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    Default Re: End bearing

    The post cap is the wrong connector and has been field modified which violates its listing. There is however an appropriate post cap that could be used. Simpson carries heavy gage "CC" caps that would make this connection acceptable, although the post will need to be moved/adjusted slightly. In my opinion it would be irresponsible to not write this up in your report.

    CC/ECC/ECCU Column Caps

    Thom Huggett, PE, SE, CBO

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Edmonton, AB
    Posts
    33

    Default Re: End bearing

    In this instance our standard report would say, “Structural repairs inconsistent with standard practices observed; recommend further evaluation by a qualified structural engineer and correction as required to reduce the potential for structural degradation and improved safety.”

    As a HI we don’t have to explain every engineering nuance, just point out that there is a potential issue and continue on with the inspection.

    OTHO hand to dismiss something, anything, and not mention it due to age, history, etc. would be negligent.


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