Deck support - InspectionNews

mathew stouffer · #1 (**permalink**) 10-08-2009, 06:23 PM

I found this in a garage with a flat deck above it. It looks like a piece of angle iron bolted to the glue lam and foundatoin. Any thoughts on the installation.

wayne soper · #2 (**permalink**) 10-08-2009, 06:54 PM

Dosen't look good. Why? A solid post installed in the same place would have taken up 2 more inches and no problem. Thats alot of work to end up with what I would call an improper application even though it may last a long time with no problems.
That is non pro, or mabey semi pro, yeah, semi pro

Billy Stephens · #3 (**permalink**) 10-08-2009, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mathew stouffer

I

Any thoughts on the installation.

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Home Made.

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mathew stouffer · #4 (**permalink**) 10-08-2009, 07:27 PM

It was crazy, the whole house was home made. I was getting overwhelmed, around each corner was some crazy configuration. Check some of these out. It is the first time I have seen a trap door installed on the return plenum

Billy Stephens · #5 (**permalink**) 10-08-2009, 08:05 PM

Unapproved ( Galvanized ) Connectors.

Not Properly Supported Ect.
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mathew stouffer · #6 (**permalink**) 10-08-2009, 08:14 PM

Billy,
Check out the valves, I have never seen those on a manifold before.

Matt Fellman · #7 (**permalink**) 10-08-2009, 11:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mathew stouffer

It was crazy, the whole house was home made. I was getting overwhelmed, around each corner was some crazy configuration. Check some of these out. It is the first time I have seen a trap door installed on the return plenum

All I can say is I'm glad it was you and not me

I hate houses like this. Everything is uncommon.... some of it works, some doesn't. Of course the first question when you call something out as incorrect is "How long until I need to replace it?" - followed closely by "how much is it going to cost?" - followed by "do you have the name of a contractor that can do it for me?"

This is really one of the biggest quandrys I run into in this job... something that is unconventional but is for the most part working. All the SOPs say I've done my job if it's working as inteneded. Every contractor that comes behind me will have a different idea of what MUST be done. The seller will sue me for saying it's wrong. The buyer will sue me for not saying it's wrong.

Sorry for the rant.... it's been a long week.

mathew stouffer · #8 (**permalink**) 10-09-2009, 08:30 AM

I hear you, it's a pain in the ass. All the systems worked well, BUT.

Wayne Carlisle · #9 (**permalink**) 10-09-2009, 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billy Stephens

Unapproved ( Galvanized ) Connectors.

Why are they unapproved? Galvanized fittings are allowed for water lines.

Also this looks like an approved header for PEX.

Scott Patterson · #10 (**permalink**) 10-09-2009, 08:44 AM

PEX is not all that bad, those valves are common on that type of manifold. Yes, it could be supported a little more but.....

Is that trap door so that the air filter can be changed?

The untreated wood used for a support needs to go and looks like one of the bigger issues.

As for the deck support? I would note that it is an unconventional method of support and unconventional things tend to act in unconventional ways! I would then put in the typical engineer recommendation. But, my gut feeling is that it is fine...

Billy Stephens · #11 (**permalink**) 10-09-2009, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wayne Carlisle

Why are they unapproved? Galvanized fittings are allowed for water lines.

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Are they Approved Connectors for Pex ?
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mathew stouffer · #12 (**permalink**) 10-09-2009, 09:54 AM

Yep the door is for the air filter.

Robert Dalga · #13 (**permalink**) 10-09-2009, 12:32 PM

Actually the angle iron post looks pretty good and appears to be well installed (i.e. well bolted to poured wall and beam). (A bit unusual for residential framing though). Looks like an engineering spec. Did you happen to see any deflection, sagging, etc. associated with it? I wouldn't have a problem with it if I didn't see any related issues (might just want to tell the clients to have it further evaluated by a specialist (i.e. engineer).

ben jacks · #14 (**permalink**) 10-09-2009, 01:22 PM

Hi Matt,

I agree with Scott and Robert's comments and would also ask if this is a two-car garage deck supported span using those three 2x10's. It looks like they additionally have floor joists with metal hangers teed into that 'header beam'. (Referring to Robert's note on possible unsupported mid-span deflection) rbj

mathew stouffer · #15 (**permalink**) 10-09-2009, 02:57 PM

There is a flat deck surface above the entire garage, yes it is a two car. The problem I have with it, is the area is North facing and the deck is flat. Very little sun in the winter and this area gets 400 to 500 inchs of snow a year. Moreover, all the snow from the metal roof slides onto the deck. So will it be able to handle the additional load. Doubt it, but is will be interesting to see

ben jacks · #16 (**permalink**) 10-09-2009, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mathew stouffer

There is a flat deck surface above the entire garage, yes it is a two car. The problem I have with it, is the area is North facing and the deck is flat. Very little sun in the winter and this area gets 400 to 500 inchs of snow a year. Moreover, all the snow from the metal roof slides onto the deck. So will it be able to handle the additional load. Doubt it, but is will be interesting to see

In Lake Tahoe that scenario would be questionable. There are snow-loading requirements for high country structures above a sunshine load that may need to be addressed in your area. I would check the AHJ snow loading requirements at that elevation and then compare the midspan support needed....for instance, a 16' standard garage door header in the flat lands minimum would be a 4x16 DF 2 or better.

An equivalent to that would be a 6x12 DF 2 or better. In high country, a 250 lb. sf load would be realistic for using at least a 6x14 DF minimum. Of course there are modern I-Joist and laminate trade-offs that are not evident here that would be worth checking out. rbj

Rod Butler · #17 (**permalink**) 10-09-2009, 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mathew stouffer

It was crazy, the whole house was home made. I was getting overwhelmed, around each corner was some crazy configuration. Check some of these out. It is the first time I have seen a trap door installed on the return plenum

A plywood return plenum next to the furnace? I assume it is a furnace. You may want to check for mfr's recommendation for combustible surfaces that close to the furnace.

Steve Frederickson · #18 (**permalink**) 10-09-2009, 03:57 PM

The steel angle is obviously there to support the end of the beam, but the steel "post" might have been an attempt at bracing the foundation against lateral load. (see: PowerBrace.net - Foundation Wall Bracing Systems)
It looks like they might have cut a new opening in the wall and thought, for some reason, that the wall then needed bracing.
Also, looks like somebody took a chisel or jackhammer to the top corner of the foundation and the corner of the opening, maybe to make room for the LVL, which suggest they might have been repairing some rot damage to the sill?
We may never know...probably a homeowner with too much time on his hands

ben jacks · #19 (**permalink**) 10-09-2009, 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rod Butler

A plywood return plenum next to the furnace? I assume it is a furnace. You may want to check for mfr's recommendation for combustible surfaces that close to the furnace.

Not to get too far off course as the can of worms opens further, this is an newer home and the energy requirements may still come into play...so there may be a minimum insulation required around the HVAC heat ducting that needs mention. rbj

Michael Schirmer · #20 (**permalink**) 10-09-2009, 04:32 PM

Though it doesn't qualify as a column, I would say it's OK in that it's secured to the concrete wall.

Tom Rees · #21 (**permalink**) 10-09-2009, 07:59 PM

We got off the subject of the deck support but here's a real beauty. All materials in one app. and yes that is polybutylene.

John Kogel · #22 (**permalink**) 10-10-2009, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Schirmer

Though it doesn't qualify as a column, I would say it's OK in that it's secured to the concrete wall.

I would not say that or put that in writing, only a structural engineer can do that. Better to play it safe in this case. Recommend having it checked out.

Jeff Zehnder · #23 (**permalink**) 10-15-2009, 01:51 PM

Just a general Deck Question for the group??
What year (if any) were bolts required for the deck band joist against the home. Or asked another way when were lag bolts allowed instead of actual bolts and nuts to hold the deck band to the home???