I've been investigating Infrared for more than a year. I understand the additional liability etc, etc. What I would like to know is if anyone is actually making money with these cameras. I'm considering purchasing one of the cameras to separate myself from the pack and provide additional services. Not just home inspections. Stucco, EIFS, structural, moisture, mold , energy evaluations, and all the other uses the camera offers. Is there any one out there who was in my shoes at one
time (seriously considering getting into it), and is now in a position where they have increased their income , expanded their services, etc. Has it helped at all. Or , is it just an expensive gimmick. I would like to hear both sides.
Thanks, Herb Scott

Owning a camera as such may set you apart from your competition.

If the thing comes out from behind the seat of your truck and makes you a dollar is another story.

I personally think for the associated cost, I'd put my money into marketing myself instead of the bragging rights of owning one.

JMHO

rick

Even the use of a moisture meter puts you far ahead of what the contractors use and they therefore can't confirm what you have pointed out. An IR camera is only going to separate you even more from what the contractor can verify. This is not to say that these cameras are not useful but I question whether they can actually benefit us.

As for now, I already bust butt to get through a home in a reasonable amount of time and that seems to be more and more difficult as the experience and continuing ed piles up over the years. Another point, an IR camera would take me far beyond a visual inspection, you know, the type that our contract says we're doing. Just how much would a client expect of us with such equipment?

I tend to think that IR cameras are better suited for inspections outside of the home inspection parameters.

__________________
Eric Barker
Moraine Woods Consulting, Inc.
Barrington, IL

I was at a seminar recently with a presentation by an inspector who had been using IR for 5 years. In essence he said that he was not making any money on residential only on commercial surveys. The last camera he purchased was $30K and most of the cheaper >$10K did not have the features that are needed for a comprehensive survey.

He spent quite a bit of time on how the 'camera companies are really pushing these cameras into the hands of inspectors with minimal training and the really expertise was reading the images. Reminds of a doctor reading the shadows on an X-ray. Not all shadows are bad....

At some point I will get a camera but with the low production rates it may be awhile before these cameras get below $3K and small enough to go into my bag.

//Rick

__________________
Rick Bunzel
WWW.PacCrestInspections.com
360-588-6956

That alone makes money for you indirectly from having the IR camera. My IR probably made an additional $40K simply because I had it and used it, without that camera I would not have gotten those inspections.

It should come out of your truck on *every* inspection, otherwise it is just a waste.

In "direct" income earned from doing IR surveys, I made about half the price of my camera back - it was the consistent use of it on regular inspections which lead to all the referrals *because* I had it and used it.

If you are not going to use it, don't bother with it. If you are going to use it - use it consistently, that alone will produce more than that same $$ spent on your marketing will produce. At least until 'everyone' has one.

__________________
Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
EastWestData (www.EastWestData.com )

For a typical home inspection, its questionable if you would be able to make enough additional money to pay for the camera. Sure people like the "gosh" aspect of it, but the reality is you are competing with other individuals, and as much as we all hate to say so, price.

If you have a real burning desire to get an IR camera, I would try to market energy surveys. Even then, its questionable if you will get enough work to justify the cost. It all depends where you are using it and how educated the consumer is about the benefits.

Its just another tool we can put on our belts. A great tool for sure, but so are sewer pipe borescopes, blower doors, moisture meters, HVAC gauges, electricians tools, etc......
You have to get return on investment to justify the cost.

As far as commercial applications. In my neck of the woods, that business is already pretty much been staked out.

Recently I attended a seminar put on by FLIR, a manufacturer of infrared cameras. The seminar was specifically for home inspectors and building inspectors, and focused (no pun intended) on how to market additional services utilizing the IR camera. Steve Ramos of The House Detective, a TV show, was the presenter.
Steve claimed to have increased his average inspection fee by $125. He said that after some trial and error, he settled on a menu of choices:
Mold inspection $250
IR moisture scan $100
IR electrical scan $100
IR energy audit $250
IR structural scan $300
The approach to selling the services that he suggested was to ask the client if they have done a walk through, and ask them what they like about the home, and what are their areas of concern. Then he can hopefully sell an additional service or two.
The other two approaches he talked about were integrating the IR camera into every home inspection, or offering packaged deals, i.e., a general home inspection for around $350, a general home inspection plus an IR moisture scan for $500, or a general home inspection plus an energy audit or mold inspection for $750.
The cheapest camera can be leased for $99/month, but it takes more than a bit of training to learn how to use it properly and interpret the results. FLIR offers courses, but they are not cheap.
I think they have great potential, and at some point they will be part of our standard toolkit, but I know I'm not ready to spend that kind of money just yet.

Reference to the cheapest camera is similar to all other things cheap. It may work, but it wont do what you really want or need it to do, and it will likely be obsolete very quick. I know from personal experience that things I have bought cheap turned out to be more expensive. I once bought some hand tools (china) that either broke, or rounded off bolts and nuts.

I bought a Palm several years ago. It wasnt their best model, but at the time I thought it did what I wanted it to. After 2 years, it was pretty much toast.
So I then bought an IPAQ (in 2004). It was the absolute most expensive one they made. I am still using it, and it does more than I ever hoped for. I have GPS moving map installed on it, it has blue tooth, WiFi, slot for SD card,plays MP3s and movies, easily removable batter pack, etc. It is a fantastic tool, that as the years go by, the price of it seems like even more of a bargain.

Part of business is knowing what tools to buy and how to make money with them.

Of course, the TV home inspector is going to do nothing but praise his IR equipment when FLIR is paying him to speak at one of their sales seminars.
The seasoned guys on this list that have tried them are your best resource. Surely Jerry can explain his thoughts. I recall he was trying to sell one a while back.

Jerry,

I am surprised at your comment that "you should pull out your IR camera at every inspection". That flies in the face of doing a visual inspection. Even though I live in one of the wettest parts of the country, I rarely get clients asking for moisture intrusion inspections. My inspection fees are already at the high end of the market and doubt that customers would pay an extra fee for a IR scan. In fact I only know of one inspector doing IR which I mentioned above.

I am on the outlook for leaks but only pull out my moisture meter to verify leaks. This is done to manage our liability as using advance tools could raise the bar and expose us to liability from latent issues. The tools only come out to verify a visual finding.

//Rick

__________________
Rick Bunzel
WWW.PacCrestInspections.com
360-588-6956

"Cheap" as in less costly. They are not "cheap" as in poorly made. At least not the ones I've seen.

Depends. It did what I wanted it to and what I expected it to.

Well, I would not say "obsolete", they are not that much different now than a few years ago, except in ... the cost. (See below.)

I paid about $13,000 for mine, and sold it for $3,500. That was a big loss, but, being as I am retired and basically the only thing I've used it for the last 2 years was as a "stud finder" in the house were we are now. A rather *EXPENSIVE* "stud finder" - so I sold it to someone who will be able to make use of it. It should help his inspections and his business, and his up front investment cost was 1/4 what mine was.

__________________
Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
EastWestData (www.EastWestData.com )

This "visual inspection" things rears its ugly head whenever something new comes up.

Let me see, don't you ...
- use a moisture meter?
- a voltmeter?
- a receptacle/circuit tester?
- a tic tracer for finding ungrounded things?
- and the list could go on and on.

I'm not saying to do a "moisture intrusion inspection", I'm saying to use it to scan the exterior and interior of the structure for anything which "looks out of place or not normal".

Then do it for the same fee, and watch your business pick up and your client's interest pick up. Then you will see, you can raise you prices, and still get the business, you might even be able to raise your fee and get to do fewer inspections, making the same (or more) money, and have less liability (because you are doing fewer inspections) ... of keep doing more inspections and stay busier.

See, there is what I am talking about - you are not really doing a "visual inspection" even now.

__________________
Jerry Peck, Construction / Litigation Consultant
Construction Litigation Consultants, LLC ( www.ConstructionLitigationConsultants.com )
EastWestData (www.EastWestData.com )

I've said this before and got blasted but here I go again. I am a HI who does a visual inspection per the NCHILB SOP.

I get out of my truck with a 4x1 screwdriver, circuit tester, and a flashlight. This is all I use unless I make a mess and need to get a towel out of the truck. Jerry I do have a ladder...you asked last time!

When I want to provide a IR service I will change the name of my company. I have been a CEM for over 20 years so I have the background to use the IR technology when it becomes affordable.

Home inspections are simple unless you are not sure what you are doing.

.

NO MATCHES TO CHECK FOR GAS LEAKS ?
,

Attached Images

Homer Hell.gif (9.0 KB, 564 views)

__________________
It Might have Choked Artie But it ain't gone'a choke Stymie!
Billy J. Stephens HI Service
Memphis TN.

If I am hired for a HVAC service call I will use a flame to test for leaks if it is appropriate. What do you use when you check for leaks on a HVAC service call?

James,

I don't do HVAC Service calls only Home Inspection.

In the 2 States I'm Licensed in we must check HVAC unless it will damage the equipment or can't operate/access.

I uses a TIFF 8800 to check for a gas leak. It has a flexible neck for those hard to get to places. And a carbon monoxide tester if I suspect it's present.

No matches! .

In a pinch I have used Soapy Water in a Spray Bottle.


James ,

Is the attachment what you work from? Are you a Home Inspector? I don't see you as licensed or associate.Welcome to NC Office of State Fire Marshal

Attached Images

North Carolina SOP & Check List.pdf (185.6 KB, 15 views)

__________________
It Might have Choked Artie But it ain't gone'a choke Stymie!
Billy J. Stephens HI Service
Memphis TN.

James?

Attached Images

Nc Check & Sop.pdf (185.6 KB, 18 views)

__________________
It Might have Choked Artie But it ain't gone'a choke Stymie!
Billy J. Stephens HI Service
Memphis TN.

I personally invite anyone who can prove to me that spending $10-15K on another gimmick tool is a wise business decision.

My tack is to let the unwashed, who bear no credentials, experience or credibility, purchase these wonderful little things until the price goes down to the point that they are worth the expense.

Aaron

Like Ken Meyer, I attended a similar seminar earlier this year that was put on by FLIR and the presenter was Steve Ramos.

He gives a very interesting and somewhat compelling presentation but he admits that he is in